Game is too CRUEL

[rootsrat]

Easy. E.g. you are just allowed to save once in an hour or so.
B.T.W
This Dangerous in E : D is just a rank and says nothing about the game. This has been posted more than once.

Well no, because the universe progresses and your actions matter.

Take the following scenario:

You save at 12:00. You have an hour before you can save again.

Between 12:00 and 12:50 you fly around and do missions for a faction that has 49% influence in the system. Because of your actions the faction gets 51% and a civil war is triggered, the Federation and Empire fleets are sent to the system, warzones are created etc.

At 12:59 you crash into the station. Instead of taking the insurance you choose to load the game you saved at 12:00.

What happens to all your actions and their consequences? Is the civil war magically ended for all the other players, because you loaded your saved game and effectively wiped your progress?

As you see, it's technically impossible to implement the save feature.

 

[nostram]

Something similar happened to me a few days back with my newly acquired type 6. I buy it, I make the neccesary modifications, buy out a full cargo to start trading. This thing left me with around 80k Cr (at least it was barely covering the insurance, thank God!)

So, I attempt to get out of the station and while I was within the "narrow bluish foggy thing" at the exit, I got hit by an other ship out of nowhere. I lost control crushing around and left with 20% hull (no shields equiped) and at the same time the station began count down. Long story short, I didn't make it alive.

I got back the ship via the insurance but lost all of my cargo and my money with it. So I sold the type 6 and bought back the cobra to save some cash for my cargo purchase.

There are risks which can take you back to zero, sure. But you can proactively deal with them (most of them) and personally I think these types of misfortunes make the game more addicted.

 

[Aircool]

I've been playing for one week.
*
I've made slow but easy money by exploring in my sidewinder - First thing I bought (once I'd discovered how) was a fuel scoop. I love free space petrol.
*
I tried trading and mining in an Adder, but I found it a bit boring, even though it was making me more money.
*
I've now got a Viper with a few minor upgrades and Cr 60K. Not that much really for a weeks worth of play (only a few hours a day though, well, maybe three or four, or more).
*
I'm making my way to Empire space, hoping to sell exploration data along the way.
*
I've always kept enough cash to cover my insurance, any lost goods and at least Cr 20K on top of that. I haven't died yet, although I've been close a few times. However, I've always had that spare cash, just in case.
*
You've got to balance risk versus reward, and greed versus sense. However, it's up to you, and not the game to make those decisions for you.

 

[apraksis]

Well no, because the universe progresses and your actions matter.

Take the following scenario:

You save at 12:00. You have an hour before you can save again.

Between 12:00 and 12:50 you fly around and do missions for a faction that has 49% influence in the system. Because of your actions the faction gets 51% and a civil war is triggered, the Federation and Empire fleets are sent to the system, warzones are created etc.

At 12:59 you crash into the station. Instead of taking the insurance you choose to load the game you saved at 12:00.

What happens to all your actions and their consequences? Is the civil war magically ended for all the other players, because you loaded your saved game and effectively wiped your progress?

As you see, it's technically impossible to implement the save feature.

Well, this game is fiction. There is just a little physical correctness in it. E.G. time is everywhere the same. But nevermind, I'm pretty sure that it is possible to prevent getting back to zero loosing all the progress you made.

 

[rootsrat]

Well, this game is fiction. There is just a little physical correctness in it. E.G. time is everywhere the same. But nevermind, I'm pretty sure that it is possible to prevent getting back to zero loosing all the progress you made.

Maybe there is, I was just merely pointing out that save game feature is not technically possible due to the active/reactive nature of the universe mechanics.

 

[edguy]

Agrees with Mike's statement, The game isn't cruel it's just realistic unlike the die and revive at graveyard games some people are accustomed to.

The game isn't cruel...

If you'd driven somewhere and run out of fuel, is it the car's fault?

 

[Iskariot]

Just got my Type 7. Filled with cargo and I get interdicted for the first time on my trade route, EVER! Master Viper, destroys my modules, I'm stuck and ******. Yes I had shields.

Not enough credits for insurance. Back to Sidewinder with 2900 cr.

Maybe my own fault but still... too painful. Leaving the game. Be a warning to others - time sink and every minute can be wiped in the blink of an eye. Was playing since Beta... and I refuse to waste more time. FD, you have a problem here... not that you care and probably wont see the post. I've done nothing but praise this game, I still love it, but not with this in the back of my mind. I would have rather spent some quality time with my wife. Not going back to the Sidewinder which is now starring me in the face!

Simply not worth playing anymore. Good bye CMDR's

FD does not have a problem.
The problem is your careless play style.
I always take care I have enough insurance money. I never bought a ship that I could not buy back with insurance and every time I upgrade my ships I take care that I can pay the increased insurance.
This simply is a basic rule in the Elite universe. And it truly is a very, very simple rule.
If you purposely take the risk, then you should not blame FD or the game.
Perhaps after you cooled down a bit you will realize you only have yourself to blame.

There are harsh moments in the game, but most of the time they can be prevented.
Just yesterday I got destroyed in combat because I felt invincible and became careless. I lost my fully upgraded Viper and at least 400k in bounty money.
For a moment I felt sick, but then realized that this is not the game to become careless.
And of course I had enough money set aside to buy back my Viper.

 

[Blake_Dragon]

It makes no sense that you insure yourself after a disaster, never pay a fee before.

oh really? look at it this way, you are insured trough the pilots federation, the one all commanders are part of, they pay for the bulk of your splattered ship. what you have left, the re-buy cost you can look at like your co-pay. they are kind enough to offer you a new sidewinder at least if you don't have enough to re-buy your ship which lets you keep your reputation and rankings v/s a whole new game.

what you think happens if you go out and wrap your car around the next utilitypole you find (btw, please don't try that, it might hurt) and you don't have enough money for the co-pay on your insurance? do you think they going to fix the car then?

its not like its hidden. its right there on the right hand side on the first page. how much you have, how much you need as your co-pay. you don't need to be hit over the head any more then that. anyone that visits the forum on occasion SHOULD know this by now, its not like its been said, over and over ad nausium.

i really starting to see my friends point.. he once told me "i don't advocate killing stupid people. I just say lets remove all warning labels and let the problem fix itself."

yes, i don't like to see another player getting frustrated and leave. but do we really need more coodeling and handholding in gaming? the harshness of this one for me is part of the draw. its not a nanny simulator 2015. you have (at least right now) 1 commander, 1 slot. for better or worse, you are stuck with the consequences of your action, you tick off a mayor faction like the federation, you aren't elcome in their space unless you work yourself into the good graces. you don't keep the cash for your co-pay in your account, you take the gamble, here comes Mr Murphy and hits you over the head with his law. (by the way, if someone sees the guy, do please escort him to the nearest airlock, he ain't nothing but trouble)

this is my opinion, i don't expect everyone to agree with me on this, not by a long shot, but if you need hand holding, you can always move to New York as example, i mean they even try to regulate how big a cup of soda you can have

and yes, i been there, i splattered 3 asps during Beta, twice back to a sidewinder due to my own hubris. i came close to walk then, (https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=85141 if you want to read that story) and then back to scrap once again when gamma came out. i played throughout it, reporting bugs despite the possibility of a launch wipe hanging over the head. i think its just that i don't see this as a grind, as a need to have the biggest and baddest ship out there. I simply enjoy playing it. if it gets to a point where i grow tired of what i'm doing, i do something else, all you have to do is put different equipment in your ship or switch to another one. *shrug* aight, i'm done rambling, i'll go back enjoying the game i have so far. be safe out there commanders and keep an weather eye on your right hand panel for your co-payment

 

[rootsrat]

Agrees with Mike's statement, The game isn't cruel it's just realistic unlike the die and revive at graveyard games some people are accustomed to.

ED actually IS die and revive at graveyard game if you look at it. The difference is that you can revive with all your gear for a price of the insurance or loose it all and revive with your starting gear.

 

[anikaiful]

Yay, the first thread where I give +1 to the mod (can't give + to closed threads... so).

 

[apraksis]

Maybe there is, I was just merely pointing out that save game feature is not technically possible due to the active/reactive nature of the universe mechanics.

Actually it is. They could leave the effects of my actions and get me back to the state i have been one hour ago.
It leads to the question how much my influence within one hour could be? Never tried to start a civil war within an hour ;-) .

 

[Ogidch]

Just got my Type 7. Filled with cargo and I get interdicted for the first time on my trade route, EVER! Master Viper, destroys my modules, I'm stuck and ******. Yes I had shields.

Not enough credits for insurance. Back to Sidewinder with 2900 cr.

Maybe my own fault but still... too painful. Leaving the game. Be a warning to others - time sink and every minute can be wiped in the blink of an eye. Was playing since Beta... and I refuse to waste more time. FD, you have a problem here... not that you care and probably wont see the post. I've done nothing but praise this game, I still love it, but not with this in the back of my mind. I would have rather spent some quality time with my wife. Not going back to the Sidewinder which is now starring me in the face!

Simply not worth playing anymore. Good bye CMDR's

Greed!

I have only been playing since the 16th, put 10 or so hours in and lost everything after an upgrade and gambling all with no shields or insurance. Took me about 5 hours of play to get back to that stage and did the same but a more calculated risk, now I have more invested hours I reduce the risk as more to loose.

My point is you should have known better, but greed made you gamble and you lost.....there's a life lesson there.

Next time make a little less profit on that cargo run, or wait half a day until you have enough cash to cover 2 complete destructions and all will be OK, or don't play again.

 

[rootsrat]

Actually it is. They could leave the effects of my actions and get me back to the state i have been one hour ago.
It leads to the question how much my influence within one hour could be? Never tried to start a civil war within an hour ;-) .

That would open room for exploits.

 

[Fia]

Should of taken a lesson from that whole world economic collapse a few years ago.. don't over extend your finances!

 

[nostram]

Well, this game is fiction. There is just a little physical correctness in it. E.G. time is everywhere the same. But nevermind, I'm pretty sure that it is possible to prevent getting back to zero loosing all the progress you made.

Yes it could be possible I pressume. As it could be with every mmo out there. But it shouldn't. Imho, it takes off the edge on a game like this. It's a sandbox. As well as being rewarding, it should be punishing as well to some extend.

I used to play EVE and Lineage II for lots of years and let me tell you, these are two games which can easily make your life miserable if you make the wrong calls.

This "edge" can actually make tedious tasks more exciting (like trading hours and hours but you'll have to be alert along the way for any kind of troubles eg drunken nut cases at stations, interdictions, etc)

 

[Misterbusy]

Even so, it is a shame to see players leave because they made one mistake. I'd happily drop you a few tons of gold to get you back on your feet if you are anywhere near Cosi.

that !
I would happily drop you some cargo also

I have been there ready to quit several times, with 2 ship crashes and pirates and not to mention having to self destruct due to the cargo bug losing several million.
I would say we have all been there, you come back because you realise its not a race and you play because you enjoy it for the waste of time it can be at times.

 

[apraksis]

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That would open room for exploits.

And you think the current situation is secure? Come on. But that's not the topic. I don't say that it should be like 'click' to win. I just say to go back to zero just because I was too greedy is to harsh. And I think that FD agrees (at least partial) to me. Why else should they have implemented this insurance thingy? It's just a placeholder for a good solution.

 

[rootsrat]

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And you think the current situation is secure? Come on. But that's not the topic. I don't say that it should be like 'click' to win. I just say to go back to zero just because I was too greedy is to harsh. And I think that FD agrees (at least partial) to me. Why else should they have implemented this insurance thingy? It's just a placeholder for a good solution.

Why add yet another exploit option if there already are some then? Better focus on preventing the existing ones and leave the insurance as it is, it works perfectly fine.

As for punishing. It's a matter of personal taste. If you play long enough to be able to afford the ship that has insurance so high it won't let you take a loan for it, you should really know better. If you don't then you're either lucky, careless or got the money via exploits. In the last 2 cases the game is perfectly correct to issue the highest punishment

 

[apraksis]

.... it works perfectly fine....

Obviously it doesn't. As so many others said in this thread: This is not the only complain about this anti-feature.
But this is till a game. This is just about fun. For me it's not fun going back to zero doing all the stuff over and over again.
I'm sure there are people out there enjoying doing things again and again .

 

[rootsrat]

Obviously it doesn't. As so many others said in this thread: This is not the only complain about this anti-feature.
But this is till a game. This is just about fun. For me it's not fun going back to zero doing all the stuff over and over again.
I'm sure there are people out there enjoying doing things again and again .

Not when you are careful and stick to rule #1: Fly what you can afford