It is designed to give a chance to new players, not to counter the problem of not having enough credits to rebuy. When your rebuy cost is more than a loan, it means you're not a new player at all.
8.5m Cr ship loss - 30+ hours wasted - discuss!
- Thread starter alex4501
- Start date
It is designed to give a chance to new players, not to counter the problem of not having enough credits to rebuy. When your rebuy cost is more than a loan, it means you're not a new player at all.
I dont know if anyone has mentioned it or not, but I have found that instead of trading in my current ship as a p/x on the new, its really not that much more to buy the new one outright, so I am stockpiling my ships as I go. Thusly, if I were to lose one ship (the current one), I could always jump back into my last one, which I know can be a significant loss, but not total.
In general the tricking out of a new ship is quite an expensive affair, so its nice to keep the last fully tricked one available.
In general the tricking out of a new ship is quite an expensive affair, so its nice to keep the last fully tricked one available.
Its okay I gave rep for you
. Back to topic, if I want to upgrade a module or to a bigger ship I make sure I have at minimum double the credits of what it is going to cost me and I have at least one ship in storage, because you never know when a bad day can get worse. The system is fine as it is, all the info for re-buy is there for everyone at all times.
The insurance you pay is more like an excess so should not be changed, that would be like totaling my car and demanding that I can buy a new one in a few months from my insurance company because I cannot afford my excess.
I admit arcade gaming was not the best example, but in New Zealand, most of the arcade game were set to game over, with no continue options - we didn't really have arcades in most towns, just a game by the fish in chip shop to keep the kids busy. We still played them, and the vast majority of our gaming revolved arround the C64 - we played Elite, Gunship, Ultima and the Bards Tale.
Appart from Minecraft, all those games use the same reward progression mechanics to keep you playing to feed the micotransactions and DLC, even the Sims is built arround microtransation these days. Even Elite Dangerous has some of these same feedback loops in place - it's all to comman in modern games. How many games used earnable multiplayer ranks in them before Modern Warfare?
Minecraft is probably an example that things can be differant. But until recently Diablo III was the best selling PC game of all time, offspring of the orginal loot addict game.
Also the most popular game in the world today isn't actaully Minecraft, it's Candy Crush.
Well that and Tetris, that old hold out.
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Lets get back on topic, for all those who either didn't read or misread my points:
1) I dont want reduced insurance costs, id be happy to pay more if you could pay the re buy cost in advance!
2) I think the order and way insurance is handled could be done better, you are only informed of short funding after death by which point you cant do anything about it!
3) a simple warning when trying to launch if you don't have the funds to cover re buy would solve ALL of these threads (at least those with validity)
1) I dont want reduced insurance costs, id be happy to pay more if you could pay the re buy cost in advance!
2) I think the order and way insurance is handled could be done better, you are only informed of short funding after death by which point you cant do anything about it!
3) a simple warning when trying to launch if you don't have the funds to cover re buy would solve ALL of these threads (at least those with validity)
Valid point. A simple warning would be a good compromise. However I thought that the insurance cost displayed on the right pannel was a pretty clear indication of the risk you are taking.
Worse luck on the loss of the ship.
Can't say I have an issue with the current system, fortunately for me, when I have taken the risk it hasn't come back to bite me. That said the OPTION to warn when you can't cover the excess is not a bad idea. Or chance to get some of your capital back, again not so bad - since it still means you would have to re source your ship and upgrades...
G
It is, but if your doing run after run trading there is no way your going to check it every single run, trading is boring enough already!
That's part of the problem, do some reading on operatant conditioning - it's a large part of the mainstream gaming industries business model these days. And in my opinion the main reason gaming has gone from a niche hobby to being a mainsteam entertainment meduim over the last decade.
How many gamers did you know prior to World of Warcraft?
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I barely have half of what you own, well owned, and I know about rebuy cost....
I do have to agree, the loan shouldn't cap out at all, but there should be interest on it. That would actually be realistic. Bank takes 15% of every transaction, and 10% of that goes towards paying back the loan. That way you penalize people who go below rebuy cost in assets, but you don't create rage-permaquit situations.
I do have to agree, the loan shouldn't cap out at all, but there should be interest on it. That would actually be realistic. Bank takes 15% of every transaction, and 10% of that goes towards paying back the loan. That way you penalize people who go below rebuy cost in assets, but you don't create rage-permaquit situations.
Why would you need to check every run? You know how much your ship's insurance rebuy cost is unelss you change your modules, and you clearly know how much cash you have.
Is it that hard to remember 'don't spend below xxx,xxx,xxx credits'?
You knew that you were under the rebuy limit, you knew the risks and yet YOU still made the decision to chance it and unfortunately lost out. The game doesn't need to change, YOU need to think about what you did wrong to end up without a replacement ship and learn from it. I know you bought an upgrade you didn't mean to, did you even think to sell it back and whatever else you needed to, in order to protect your 30 hour investment? How was it that you actually died? I'm guessing that chances are, you made a number of bad decisions that resulted in your loss and the only place to lay the blame is yourself having full knowledge of the risks and consequences...
- Hyp3rion
Okay, off the top of my head, how about a mechanic wherein there are higher tier loans for the more careless or mistake-making players, allowing technically any player to get a loan to pay off their ship, HOWEVER, the bigger the loan, the higher the interest rate, meaning if you end up needing a loan for, say, a million credits to get your ship back, be prepared to pay back an extra third of a million in credits. If you need a loan for five million, be prepared to pay back that plus an additional two million for interest. If you need a ten million loan, that's an extra five million credit premium slapped on there! With the multimillion loans, the percentage of income taxed increases, making it harder to profit, until you might essentially spend all your time just trying to pay off the sodding loan. It would reach the point that if your Anaconda gets blown up and you don't have the monies for the insurance, bright news is you still get your Anaconda, bad news is good luck making any profit whatsoever until you've paid off the loan plus an extra twenty million, stagnating player progress until it's been repaid.
Now, before anyone protests at the lack of a Sidewinder-esque punishment, there IS a limit to how long one can screw around with this. If you end up getting a loan because your Type 7 eshploded, and then going roaring right off again without insurance and blow up a SECOND time, prepare to take out a second loan! Doubled amount to pay back, and doubled percentage taken from your income until it is repaid. Wait, you went off without insurance a THIRD time? THIRD loan, three times the amount, three times the percentage taken from your income! (Maybe for traders, the first two loans should be capped on one's profit margin, meaning you won't be trading at a substantial lost until the third loan hits.) Eventually, of course the time will come where making much profit at all borders on impossible while the loans are in effect, so there are two solutions. One, a 'pay towards your loan' option that might see you strip down your ship's modules, sell your first born, etc, and try to pay back the premium. However, if you royally screwed up, and find you can't make ends meet, you can 'Declare Bankruptcy.' Bright side! Your debts go away! However, you lose your ship, and end up back in a Sidewinder with 1000 credits. And with all the second chances you've already been given, literally nobody to blame but yourself.
This way, one careless mistake doesn't necessarily spell doom, BUT it still spells a pretty costly penalty, to the point where you'd still be unhappy, but at least still have the tools to make things right.
As for the insurance mechanic itself, I'm pretty much of the opinion that yada yada, rebuy cost, easy to check, etc, meaning I don't think a system should be, literally, 'Fool Proof.' You screw up, you get careless, bing, consequences, pay more attention next time. The only thing I'm really open to budge on is the nature of the consequences, thus my above suggestion, but having the responsibility to manage one's finances SHOULD still be something the player is motivated to do.
I think the only thing I would want changed in the game is to have the insurance / re-buy cost displayed underneath the price of the ship so you can easily see that amount before buying a ship. It could even be displayed in red if it calculates that you don't have enough credit to buy and insure the ship. Apart from that I don't want the current game mechanic changed as I think it's great.
I had the similar situation and it helped me realize that there is no one to blame, but only myself. Get better in Elite.
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insurance amount is actually displayed.
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insurance amount is actually displayed.
Learn to read posts before you post rhetoric rubbish, i didn't know I was under because I accidentally bought a C instead of D class upgrade
If i had noticed I would have sold it back... Note the organization of the purchasing system is rubbish ordered by cost rather then by grade, it should 1A 1B 1C 1D 2A 2B 2C etc etc
I died because when leaving the station i reorientated towards a jump point and got smacked by a pylon jutting from the station that I couldn't see till it hit me, a problem I hadn't had for hundreds of other runs
I ADMIT part of the blame, I'm just simply trying to find a fair solution to help other people from ending up in the same potentially game breaking/ending position.
Say you were 60 hours / 100 hours in and just bought the latest leased ship released, died by accident or bug and lost everything a position people will be in in months to come.Are you really saying people should just suck it up and replay 100's of hours just because you want to make the game fit to the play style of 5-10% of the players who enjoy hardcore/perma death style game play??
Hell make it so that anyone of these systems that you don't like can be turned off, that way the hardcore/elite players can do what the hell they like, without spoiling the game from the casual gamer.
I do think you should have checked the re-buy value before leaving the station, but having said that, the above does not sound like an unreasonable request. Loans should be available for the full re-buy cost - albeit at an extortionate interest rate
I agree. The game should be harsh and unforgiving, but also allow you 'interesting' options. You want to go over the 200,000cr loan limit? Fine. You get to deal with very shady people, who charge extortionate interest, that if you don't make prompt payment on, they send heavily armed hombres your way. Additionally, you get forced into taking missions that aren't necessarily in your best interests or strictly legal, until the debt is repaid (and possibly leading to a spiralling life of crime). Interesting gameplay 'twist', no?