Simple insurance solution

I know it's easy to avoid losing your ship by simply ensuring you don't launch without at least the insurance cost in your account.

But the way this mechanic is implemented I think has made a few less careful people unnecessarily unhappy.

What I propose is done that on death, insurance is automatic. As in you just get the excess taken out of your account and get your ship back without asking.

BUT, if your resulting account balance is negative, and you attempt to launch, a warning will be displayed pointing out you need to sell parts/yourship to make your balance positive. At that screen, you can choose to click a button to sell the lot and purchase a basic sidewinder.

In this case, the biggest loss from dying is whatever the excess is. If you get caught short you just pay the excess using the equity in your ship.

I know people just should be more careful, but I don't see how the current mechanic is beneficial. It doesn't affect careful people, and non-careful people it just annoys them to the extreme. My proposed solution isn't exploitable, it doesn't make death easier, it just makes it less dramatic for new players who didn't read every line of the manual carefully. I think that's a net positive for the game.

Example:

10 mil Asp crashes. Excess is 500k. Player has 100k in the bank.

Players balance is now -400k. This has to be resolved before launching. If the player can not manage get back positive before launch (or doesn't want to), they can instead opt to sell their current ship.

The player will be left with:

-400k + 9000k (sale price of ASP) - 32k (purchase price of Sidewinder) = 8568k.

So the player, being forced to sell, has lost around 15% of their assets, which is a significant penalty. But they haven't lost 100%, so they hopefully won't just rage quit the game.
 
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This forum spends an awful lot of time trying to come up with solutions for non existent problems. I know everybody needs a hobby, but this is getting out of hand.

There are 1000s of games without consequences, how about we just let Elite be dangerous.
 
However "stupid" it is, to be honest, it makes me real sad to hear all those horror stories of disappointed folks that lost everything. I think that I see one of those once every 2 days.

It's very easy to get carried away, so in my humble opinion FD should add a red light like WANTED -- UNINSURED, so that folks have no excuse for doing something they would regret a lot, and probably make them quit the game.
 
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Please don't reply:

"Just don't do it".

It's a bit like saying is okay leaving a loaded gun next to a child just because you told the kid not to pick it up.

I'm trying to have a discussion about how to make a game better, not a shouting contest about who's more responsible. Sure, you read the manual and have been to the forums and know how to avoid this pitfall? Great. That doesn't mean you're the perfect person and everyone should be exactly like you or go play something else. There are other opinions.
 

daan2002

Banned
This forum spends an awful lot of time trying to come up with solutions for non existent problems. I know everybody needs a hobby, but this is getting out of hand.

There are 1000s of games without consequences, how about we just let Elite be dangerous.

yes they do i mean not that hard to hit numer 4 key and see REBUY cost to you ppl that cant do that stop trying to turn this game in to a hello kitty in space aka star trek online !!!!!!!
 
It's incredibly easy, do not fly with less liquid funds than it costs to cover insurance OR you buy a second ship you can make money in to quickly get back on track. I'm getting really tired of butthurt players that treat their space ship like it's irreplaceable. Oh wait. It is, you just can't afford it and therefore you wine on the forums or try to suggest something so it won't happen again to you in the future... Start managing your risks instead.
 
It's very easy to get carried away, so in my humble opinion FD should add a red light like WANTED -- UNINSURED, so that folks have no excuse for doing something they would regret a lot, and probably make them quit the game.

By simply replacing the ship and using the equity in the ship to pay the excess, there is no need for red lights. This mechanic adds nothing to the game aside annoying people.

It's simple for ED to just do insurance like real life, you pay the excess out of the payment you're about to receive. IE if your house is insured for $200k and the excess is $10k, they don't withhold payment til you get together the $10k, they just give you $190k.

ED should be the same. I haven't seen a good reason why it shouldn't be that way.
 
It's not like that at all, because your child won't come back to life.

It's a lot more like taking shields off your ship so that you can carry more cargo, and complaining that you died too fast because you didn't carry shields.

The game does offer you several ways to come back to life, with or without the possessions you had before. Players are simply choosing not to make use of the options available to them, and then getting angry when their own actions ensure those consequences.
 
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Derp this is a video game, leaving a loaded gun next to a child is a horrible analogy. Nobody is dying here, its a video game. Don't be absurd.

Fine, you want my list of things they can do to make the game better, you got it.

1.) Social tools. Fix the comms, add some ability to communicate with NPCs ala X3R/X3TC
2.) Some love for bounty hunters and non traders. Bring the various professions earnings more into balance. Increase difficulty of AI enemies. Make ship progression more attainable, more sustainable, and more necessary for non traders.
3.) Smuggling needs a total overhaul. Make Anarchy zones far more dangerous. Make a pirate faction like there are factions for Alliance, Federation, and Empire. Make smuggling make sense. 250% sell prices for illicit goods in high security stations where they are illegal.

4.) Keep Elite dangerous. Make it more dangerous. Any time you see someone make suggestions on the forums to make it easier or remove consequences, ignore them.
 
yes they do i mean not that hard to hit numer 4 key and see REBUY cost to you ppl that cant do that stop trying to turn this game in to a hello kitty in space aka star trek online !!!!!!!

Ummm, if you blow up your ship an insurance company will pay 95% of the cost repeatedly without asking for a cent. If that's not hello kitty then I'm not sure what is.

I personally think excess should increase (to maybe 20%), but all I'm asking that it's payable out of the payout, LIKE EVERY OTHER KIND OF INSURANCE.

Also sale prices should decrease, to perhaps 60-80% of cost.

I don't see the point of punishing people for not correctly understanding a bizarre gameplay mechanic that is nothing like real life. You can still have a serious death penalty without making it stupid.
 
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What if I have a second ship stored, and decide that I don't want to be negative and paying off a debt, but would rather just get the free sidey, and move across to my stored ship, and NOT get the insurance. I don't want it automatically deducted, sending me into the red. I want a choice.

Thing is with choice, you can then make bad choices - but that's better than having choice taken away from you. I don't mind the concept of a reminder that highlights it to people, though I find it quite easy to check already myself, but sure, add a reminder. I don't think the mechanic needs changing in any way though.
 
However "stupid" it is, to be honest, it makes me real sad to hear all those horror stories of disappointed folks that lost everything. I think that I see one of those once every 2 days.

It's very easy to get carried away, so in my humble opinion FD should add a red light like WANTED -- UNINSURED, so that folks have no excuse for doing something they would regret a lot, and probably make them quit the game.

A very good point there, however the original game was very unforgiving....you could get killed very easily ie when docking for example, slightest mistake and you were dead (this time around its a little more forgiving) ....however at least you did have a chance to save at each star port, so if you did get killed you could at least go back to your last saved star port.

I feel for people in this new version as there is no way to go back to a 'last saved point'.....just makes it more challenging in this new version (which i love).

Im not looking forward to getting killed with a full load though...lol
 
4.) Keep Elite dangerous. Make it more dangerous. Any time you see someone make suggestions on the forums to make it easier or remove consequences, ignore them.

The problem isn't that it's dangerous, it's that it's dumb. I could suggest a mechanic that just randomly makes ships explode. It would make it more dangerous, but it's dumb.

Like I said, there's better ways to make it more dangerous. Increase excess, reduce equipment sale prices. But the current mechanic where you can't pay excess out of equity is dumb.
 
Please don't reply:

"Just don't do it".

It's a bit like saying is okay leaving a loaded gun next to a child just because you told the kid not to pick it up.

I'm trying to have a discussion about how to make a game better, not a shouting contest about who's more responsible. Sure, you read the manual and have been to the forums and know how to avoid this pitfall? Great. That doesn't mean you're the perfect person and everyone should be exactly like you or go play something else. There are other opinions.

This game is good because there is risk involved. When i PvP in my expensive ship, I get excitement because I know the stakes are high. When I go on a four day expedition to explore unknown systems thousands of light years away, I get real excitement because I know that four days of gaming and my ship can go away in less than a minute with no progress to show for it. No one plays poker because you always win. Stop trying to come up with ways to make the game boring.
 
The problem isn't that it's dangerous, it's that it's dumb. I could suggest a mechanic that just randomly makes ships explode. It would make it more dangerous, but it's dumb.

You're really good at horrible and pointless analogies.

If you leave a station without being able to afford the rebuy, its not the game thats dumb, its the pilot. There might be other opinions, I think theyre horribly off base and I will push back against them with all my ability to keep Elite dangerous. There are tons of games without consequences for you to play if this doesn't work for you.
 
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This game is good because there is risk involved. When i PvP in my expensive ship, I get excitement because I know the stakes are high. When I go on a four day expedition to explore unknown systems thousands of light years away, I get real excitement because I know that four days of gaming and my ship can go away in less than a minute with no progress to show for it. No one plays poker because you always win. Stop trying to come up with ways to make the game boring.

There's not much risk at the moment. As long as there's money in the bank the most you lose is 5%. That's not risky. If you want to increase risk increase that to 20%.

But not allowing that 5% (or 20%, IMHO) to be paid out of ship equity is silly.

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -

If you leave a station without being able to afford the rebuy, its not the game thats dumb, its the pilot.

It's a dumb gameplay mechanic. No-one carries around thousands in cash because their house might burn down. The excess is taken out of the equity. What's the problem?
 
What's the problem?

There is no problem. Don't take off if you can't afford the rebuy or can't take the loss if you get destroyed. There is no equity in a pile of rubble in a vacuum. The mechanic is fine, its the pilots that screw it up or knowingly take the risk and then cry about it when their gamble doesnt pay off that are dumb. Working as intended.
 
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This game is good because there is risk involved. When i PvP in my expensive ship, I get excitement because I know the stakes are high. When I go on a four day expedition to explore unknown systems thousands of light years away, I get real excitement because I know that four days of gaming and my ship can go away in less than a minute with no progress to show for it. No one plays poker because you always win. Stop trying to come up with ways to make the game boring.

Your right, it is a gamble....thats what makes it Elite
 
I know it's easy to avoid losing your ship by simply ensuring you don't launch without at least the insurance cost in your account.

But the way this mechanic is implemented I think has made a few less careful people unnecessarily unhappy.

What I propose is done that on death, insurance is automatic. As in you just get the excess taken out of your account and get your ship back without asking.

BUT, if your resulting account balance is negative, and you attempt to launch, a warning will be displayed pointing out you need to sell parts/yourship to make your balance positive. At that screen, you can choose to click a button to sell the lot and purchase a basic sidewinder.

In this case, the biggest loss from dying is whatever the excess is. If you get caught short you just pay the excess using the equity in your ship.

I know people just should be more careful, but I don't see how the current mechanic is beneficial. It doesn't affect careful people, and non-careful people it just annoys them to the extreme. My proposed solution isn't exploitable, it doesn't make death easier, it just makes it less dramatic for new players who didn't read every line of the manual carefully. I think that's a net positive for the game.

Example:

10 mil Asp crashes. Excess is 500k. Player has 100k in the bank.

Players balance is now -400k. This has to be resolved before launching. If the player can not manage get back positive before launch (or doesn't want to), they can instead opt to sell their current ship.

The player will be left with:

-400k + 9000k (sale price of ASP) - 32k (purchase price of Sidewinder) = 8568k.

So the player, being forced to sell, has lost around 15% of their assets, which is a significant penalty. But they haven't lost 100%, so they hopefully won't just rage quit the game.

No. Just no. You can't fix stupid. If you are too stupid to actually realize that you need the extra money for insurance or that if you lose your ship you lose everything in it (honestly the first time I crashed I figured I would lose the ship with no way to get it back, then was HAPPY to find out theres insurance). Stop trying to come up with solutions only stupid people need. This game is already easy enough with out becoming WoW and catering to dumb people who can't be bothered to do something for themselves.
 
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