Scrap or redesign shield cell modules, they are too overpowered and trivialize PvP.

[Adept]

The NPCs actually spent much of the video attacking the Cobra player anyway.

I actually agree with others that SCBs aren't a great mechanic, but I also feel that right now they are the only thing that makes flying the larger, expensive ships viable in multi-person combat for the costs involved. I'd be happy to see them removed, but then something else likely needs to be done to improve durability of the larger ships. Which is fine, as I think they could come up with more interesting possibilities for that than SCBs.

Hull strength actually scaling with hull mass, and removing reactor kills. Hitting the reactor should reduce available power, not blow the ship up at 80% hull.

 

[dioogio]

I think anyone that denies the need to balance this module is delusional.

I shouldn't go from one moment fighting tooth and nail against an elite anaconda to complete ownage because of ONE shield mod. The difference virtually slaps you in the face. Like many games after release, items at times do need some revising based on their effectiveness. Problem is some players latch on to its existing characteristics like a lifeline versus trying to be truly objective for game balance sake.

Delusional because they don't see it the way you do..... got a mirror in your house?

 

[Adept]

I think anyone that denies the need to balance this module is delusional.

I shouldn't go from one moment fighting tooth and nail against an elite anaconda to complete ownage because of ONE shield mod. The difference virtually slaps you in the face. Like many games after release, items at times do need some revising based on their effectiveness. Problem is some players latch on to its existing characteristics like a lifeline versus trying to be truly objective for game balance sake.

There are always lovers of cheese in any game, specially if it involves PvP. Were you around when the original railguns were the gankers choice no. 1?

 

[NeilF]

Hello Commander NeilF!

It's fair to say that more internal modules may end up appearing.

I believe the good thing about this issue is that there are lots of potential levers to pull. In addition to the various suggestions stated (all of which are appreciated by the way), we could, for example: introduced significant heat gain when using a cell (Commander Suprez, you read my mind!), increase the delay before the recharge kicks in, cause some nasty penalty if you use a cell and it over charges your shields by some amount, make activation require a charge instead of use a delay, and so on.

So, yes, we're aware that there are issues (hence the initial steps we're taking), we will be looking into options as required.

Fair enough... And will NPCs be getting Shield Cells? They certainly need a bit of help at the moment. I met a wanted Federal Drop ship last night who couldn't even be bothered to fit shields to his ship :/

 

[Adept]

How about just getting better at PVP and quit crying about this AGAIN......
If someone looses a fight, they cheated and used a shield cell, why don't you just use one?

I swear the more you guys dumb down the mechanics of this game the more they will do things and screw it up instead of just working on whats truly broken.

I bet you all $1 if they listen to you and fix this..you will complain about something else.

/deadhorse

I don't even use shield cells, but I cant say ive lost to a shield cell either, ive lost to a better opponent thought.

Read the quote in my sig.

The combat balance was fine. Shield cells are the thing that dumbed it down. That and the removal of weapon grades and attributes :/

 

[NeilF]

How about just getting better at PVP and quit crying about this AGAIN......
If someone looses a fight, they cheated and used a shield cell, why don't you just use one?

I swear the more you guys dumb down the mechanics of this game the more they will do things and screw it up instead of just working on whats truly broken.

I bet you all $1 if they listen to you and fix this..you will complain about something else.

/deadhorse

I don't even use shield cells, but I cant say ive lost to a shield cell either, ive lost to a better opponent thought.

Read the quote in my sig.

Why simply pile in basically with personal jibes/comments? Wouldn't it be more constructive to actually explain the reason for your stance?

To answer your point, "why don't you just use one?" - Many people are now using multiple units because they can simply sit there repeatedly returning their shields to full, over and over and over and over and... guess what.... over and over and over and over... and over and over...

So the problem IMHO seems two fold:-
1) The use of multiple units without any delay/penalty just means people try bringing more than their opponents to the battle field to simply win. If people were limited to one, or there was some significant delay required to move from one to the next, that would help a lot IMHO.
2) The units are too powerful - Multiple full replenishment of your shields? The fact a Viper can simply sit there and replenish its shields six times over numerous minutes sitting 1km or so away from an Anaconda and just out tank it seems to demonstrate the issue perfectly. One of the cheapest ships, outlasting the most expensive basically due to a single device which means the Anaconda can't even get through its shield, yet alone hurt it.

Finally, why aren't NPCs allowed to use these units. Indeed multiples of them?

 

[vjek]

... My first line of thought runs to some additional negative effect that triggers if a cell is used and the shield is not badly damaged, coupled with a longer delay between triggering a cell and receiving its benefits. In theory, this would mean that you would need to use a cell within a window of opportunity or risk A) leaving it too late and having the shield break or B) using it too soon and having something bad happen (like damage to your shield generator, or no benefit of the cell, etc.) ...

The "negative effect" is you have to return to a station to recharge them, and there's a cost associated with that. They're a money sink and a time sink, already, today, right now.

If you make them all negatives and there's no positive, and/or the benefit is so small it's a knife-edge use case, no-one will use them and you'll have another pointless broken mechanic.

Here's a tip: Don't do that. There's nothing "wrong" with them right now. At worst, they prolong PvP battles. Think long and hard before you throw the baby out with the bath water.

 

[DaveB]

This entire thread is bogus.. several pages until it dies for the first time, then it gets necro'd and acquires a dozen or so more in a single day.... The bottom line is if I'm a better pilot than my opponent it won't matter who is packing more shield cells than the other, because he'll be using his and I won't be using mine. If I can tag him with a high enough alpha then they are just ballast anyway.

Shield cells are good for tanking against NPCs or escaping a situation where you've bitten off more than you can chew and need to tuck your tail between your legs and run. Against a player who is better armed and can actually shoot better than you can, not so much.

 

[Satanski]

Fair enough... And will NPCs be getting Shield Cells? They certainly need a bit of help at the moment. I met a wanted Federal Drop ship last night who couldn't even be bothered to fit shields to his ship :/

Giving cell banks to npcs wont improve anything. They will still be dumb but the fight will become more tedious.

I wonder, is it even possible to kill someone who dont want to fight and just fires SCBs while charging FSD?

 

[Johnny Spaceboots]

Giving cell banks to npcs wont improve anything. They will still be dumb but the fight will become more tedious.

I wonder, is it even possible to kill someone who dont want to fight and just fires SCBs while charging FSD?

Depends on what kind of ship it is and if you're using dumbfires all the time for this express purpose. But for the most part? No. It isn't possible. They wouldn't even have to dodge your fire.

 

[Shathis]

hmmm what we need to do is add something that neutralizes these modules..
maybe like energy neuts or something that drains shield energy?.

or even.. giving us the ability to alter shields alot more such as recharge rate/shield cap and resistances with additional modules?.

 

[Defacto]

The "negative effect" is you have to return to a station to recharge them, and there's a cost associated with that. They're a money sink and a time sink, already, today, right now.

If you make them all negatives and there's no positive, and/or the benefit is so small it's a knife-edge use case, no-one will use them and you'll have another pointless broken mechanic.

Here's a tip: Don't do that. There's nothing "wrong" with them right now. At worst, they prolong PvP battles. Think long and hard before you throw the baby out with the bath water.

The cost is what, 200 Cr?

You have to return to the station to repair your hull too, which I would have to do a lot if I would fight without my shield potions.

At worst, they completely break the way in which combat is conducted in this game.
And do we really need to start discussing about what it is that is ''wrong'' with them, again? Youtube will, at this pace, soon be flooded with example videos showing why SCB's in their current implementation have, well, horrible effects on combat.

Giving cell banks to npcs wont improve anything. They will still be dumb but the fight will become more tedious.

I wonder, is it even possible to kill someone who dont want to fight and just fires SCBs while charging FSD?

If the one using SCB's is extremely inferior in pure strength, possibly.
As for a Python, nope, and their FSD charge doesn't even get slowed down by things with lesser mass than themselves.

 

[vonvonbraun]

Hello Commanders!

Just a quick heads up: we've been looking at the stats for shield cell banks and have made some tweaks, which should filter out in a near future update. Basically, cell capacities have been reduced, cost per cell has been increased, and the passive power draw for having a cell bank active has increased.

We're not totally convinced this is the end of tweaking shield cell banks, but we think it will be a move in the right direction.

Please lets not make this a nerf fest for the few moaners on these boards that have more time to type than to play

 

[Defacto]

Please lets not make this a nerf fest for the few moaners on these boards that have more time to type than to play

While I wouldn't be against a nerf, I don't think this will solve the problem. SCB's need to be reworked completely, not just have their power reduced.
Hopefully, that kind of change is coming.

 

[vonvonbraun]

This entire thread is bogus.. several pages until it dies for the first time, then it gets necro'd and acquires a dozen or so more in a single day.... The bottom line is if I'm a better pilot than my opponent it won't matter who is packing more shield cells than the other, because he'll be using his and I won't be using mine. If I can tag him with a high enough alpha then they are just ballast anyway.

Shield cells are good for tanking against NPCs or escaping a situation where you've bitten off more than you can chew and need to tuck your tail between your legs and run. Against a player who is better armed and can actually shoot better than you can, not so much.

Ex
actly this

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While I wouldn't be against a nerf, I don't think this will solve the problem. SCB's need to be reworked completely, not just have their power reduced.
Hopefully, that kind of change is coming.

shut u
p already

 

[Defacto]

This entire thread is bogus.. several pages until it dies for the first time, then it gets necro'd and acquires a dozen or so more in a single day.... The bottom line is if I'm a better pilot than my opponent it won't matter who is packing more shield cells than the other, because he'll be using his and I won't be using mine. If I can tag him with a high enough alpha then they are just ballast anyway.

Shield cells are good for tanking against NPCs or escaping a situation where you've bitten off more than you can chew and need to tuck your tail between your legs and run. Against a player who is better armed and can actually shoot better than you can, not so much.

So with that in mind, and considering the horrible effect on the combat experience (as demonstrated several times), you support a complete removal of shield cells? I think it would be better to have it reworked.

 

[vonvonbraun]

So with that in mind, and considering the horrible effect on the combat experience (as demonstrated several times), you support a complete removal of shield cells? I think it would be better to have it reworked.

I think it would be better to stop swinging the nerf bat and enjoy the game

 

[Johnny Spaceboots]

Ex
actly this

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shut u
p already

Very civil and convincing post you have there. Thanks for contributing!

I think it would be better to stop swinging the nerf bat and enjoy the game

Maybe we could enjoy the game better if it wasn't horribly unbalanced and reduced to a skill-less numbers game all due to one module.

 

[Defacto]

I think it would be better to stop swinging the nerf bat and enjoy the game

So it would be better to remove them? I think that would be a bit too extreme.
Still, I think most of us here have played this since before SCB's were in, and we survived... but at the same time SCB's were a part of the design document, they're an old idea, and I think they can be made to work well with how the combat works.

 

[vonvonbraun]

So it would be better to remove them? I think that would be a bit too extreme.
Still, I think most of us here have played this since before SCB's were in, and we survived... but at the same time SCB's were a part of the design document, they're an old idea, and I think they can be made to work well with how the combat works.

I am not for the removal

i am for leaving the situation as is, it is perfectly fine.

dont fix if aint broken