You are joking right? I can trade over 350 tonne of cargo without fear, fight almost constantly in high intensity combat zones, explore with over 18ly jumps all in the same ship but its an Anaconda that cost me almost half a billion. There's a lot more you can do with 1 billion over 100 million. in fact 100 million is a paltry sum once you get into high volume trading.
FD just Nuked loads of trade routes!
- Thread starter tim74uk
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You are joking right? I can trade over 350 tonne of cargo without fear, fight almost constantly in high intensity combat zones, explore with over 18ly jumps all in the same ship but its an Anaconda that cost me almost half a billion. There's a lot more you can do with 1 billion over 100 million. in fact 100 million is a paltry sum once you get into high volume trading.
Slopey's et al. will now be relegated to the "side trades." That is, I'm going somewhere anyway what do I schlepp along to pay for the fuel? Food cartridges for 90 Cr/ton profit? Sure, load 'em up.
They will probably never again be useful for high credit primary trading.
They will probably never again be useful for high credit primary trading.
CMDR's Log isn't crowd source. But otherwise does the same things as the other crowd sourced tools and works with EliteOCR so you don't have to spend more than minute adding all the data for a system.
Ok, this actually looks like fantastic news. I gather that now trade routes become less valuable the more traffic they get?
If so, yay! Hopefully that will put an end to all the "I looked up the best trade route online and now I'm soooo rich, trading needs to be nurfed!" posts. You people made me sick, so disrespectful to not just the people that avoided such spoilers, but the main wealth mechanic of the entire Elite series including ED. Lets watch how many of those people start complaining now. Exploring for trade routes is one major buzz of trading. How did these people think that the data got in EDDN in the first place? Someone had to be doing the hard work so you could all ruin your game play experience. I don't mind if people want to cheat, just don't campaign to spoil my game because of it.
I'll now stop sharing my data with EDDN. I had no problem sharing my data just to say thanks to the OCR and related tools developers. I just figured if other players wanted to resort to cheating, that's there business.
I'd actually like to see Frontier implement better support for detailed collection and comparison of trade data in game, and possibly implement black market trading of such data (trading exact commodity prices outside a system should be risky and carry heavy penalties if you are caught). OCR is a workaround for a missing feature in my opinion. You shouldn't have to jot down market prices for every station in a 30Ly radius just to find an epic trade route. But EDDN was totally over the top, and this fix sounds like it'll go a long way to kill it.
If so, yay! Hopefully that will put an end to all the "I looked up the best trade route online and now I'm soooo rich, trading needs to be nurfed!" posts. You people made me sick, so disrespectful to not just the people that avoided such spoilers, but the main wealth mechanic of the entire Elite series including ED. Lets watch how many of those people start complaining now. Exploring for trade routes is one major buzz of trading. How did these people think that the data got in EDDN in the first place? Someone had to be doing the hard work so you could all ruin your game play experience. I don't mind if people want to cheat, just don't campaign to spoil my game because of it.
I'll now stop sharing my data with EDDN. I had no problem sharing my data just to say thanks to the OCR and related tools developers. I just figured if other players wanted to resort to cheating, that's there business.
I'd actually like to see Frontier implement better support for detailed collection and comparison of trade data in game, and possibly implement black market trading of such data (trading exact commodity prices outside a system should be risky and carry heavy penalties if you are caught). OCR is a workaround for a missing feature in my opinion. You shouldn't have to jot down market prices for every station in a 30Ly radius just to find an epic trade route. But EDDN was totally over the top, and this fix sounds like it'll go a long way to kill it.
Pretty big PITA to use pen and paper with an Oculus. Slopeys was almost as bad.
There should be some more in game help for traders (like an automated notebook), but if the in game tools will become as good as some of the third party tools, you will have an even bigger problem. Suddenly nobody will be able to find a "great" route, because everybody will know it instantly and rush towards it, drying it. There would be no incentive to scout your own routes (as it has been until now). Easy mode for all, great for none. So i would like the following:
1) An onboard trade computer storing all prices of all stations that i visit, not automatically updated
2) Based on that data, a simple tool to find a station that sells/buys my stuff at the best price in a given range (of course prices may have changed since i logged them, so its still risky).
That's all. Anything more and you basically destroy all good opportunities.
1) An onboard trade computer storing all prices of all stations that i visit, not automatically updated
2) Based on that data, a simple tool to find a station that sells/buys my stuff at the best price in a given range (of course prices may have changed since i logged them, so its still risky).
That's all. Anything more and you basically destroy all good opportunities.
That's pretty much it
Yup. But apperantly we're just crybabies and this is how its suppost to be played (I wonder how many of those saying that also posted in the million of Python treads out there, decrying the change
).Totally, just replace the need for a pen and paper (or OCR tools, etc).
At the end of the day though, there's nothing to stop people sharing some data outside of the game that they have scraped or recorded somehow. Previously I figured it might be worth introducing an in-game facility for that so at least you can put some controls and caveats on it. If there's an in-game feature that makes sense, people will likely just accept it and not go looking for something outside the game. Just a thought though, my care factor for supporting trade data sharing is pretty low. Even more so now that they've added some realistic consequences for it.
Yep. A good idea. I've said it before, but I'll say it again, NPC's should be limited to trading low value goods ( < 500CR/T) AND only taking them very short distances, relative to players. That keeps the 'background simulation' alive, but allows players to trade high value goods. (>=500CR/T)
And as always, cue my sig!
I agree with you. After all the game is set in the fourth millenium - should have figured out how to store trade info by then. I'm perfectly fine with no automatic update to the trade info and only the one you get personally being available. Will promote exploration and visiting the locations personally. As a side note will promote taking on the missions if those take to the places unknown.
The supply side of the economy has now been "turned on". Supply levels update based on actual player activity which is good!
Supply also replenishes at a steady rate (this is always something that can be adjusted and balanced to an appropriate level)
The next question is.... will the demand side of the economy be activated in the same way?
Has anyone noticed any change in demand levels?
From my limited trading today I've noticed no changes, or at the very least demand levels don't update in realtime like supply levels.
If there's been no change in demand we can simply find multiple suppliers for a single station to fill unlimited demand.
Yes my route was deteriorating quite fast on each run on both supply and demand (of Slaves, only though). Palladium prices did not change very much in the 3-4 runs I made before I had to get to work. I'm also pretty sure I was the only one running it, since the traffic report showed only a handful of ships in the last 24 hours. I like that they have made the markets more dynamic, but I wonder if maybe they've made it update a little too quickly. In a game where thousands of people are running trade routes, it seems like one person ought not to be able to 'break' a route by themselves in a couple of hours. I am curious how fast the wealthy, huge population routes are drying up.
Yup. But apperantly we're just crybabies and this is how its suppost to be played (I wonder how many of those saying that also posted in the million of Python treads out there, decrying the change
The little kids squealed about losing their 'I win button', and all now want Anacondas, but cannot afford them - Ergo venting at the Traders that can afford them... so wish to remove our credit circuits in a bid to make our cash machine feel the pain in much the same way as their 'win at everything' Pythons got the baseball bat!
So mean!
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How is this a bad thing?
If there's one thing this game desperately needs, especially in open play, it's competition and danger involved with stuff you do.
When you have higher visibility to trades you create exactly that.
Traders will have to compete for good routes and cooperate to gain an edge. They will also have to deal with pirates who can now coordinate much better. And bounty hunters will know where to look to find those pirates.
This is a win for everybody.
Profits not lining up with the added risk is simply a matter of adjusting supply and margins.
Wrong. You create them.
The truth is you're simply not going to create a well functioning trade system that is fun to play when you stick to these arbitrary limitations which really have no argumentative basis in the game world.
It simply doesn't make sense that all of the civilizations in this galaxy apparently have no problem communicating trade data across systems while you, the elite pilot in his multimillion credit ship, are barred from that information. It creates a completely fake scenario with outcomes that are as fake and unfun as we've seen until now.
Blindly SCing and docking at each and every station in hopes to find something worthwhile is neither fun nor interactive and it accomplishes nothing when you look at it in a multiplayer context. It's a dull, useless time sink.
Give players the tools and information they need to quickly find trade routes in their vincinity. Holding them back with artificial roadblocks has never worked and never will. They will either leave in frustration or resort to external tools and workarounds.
Simply put, you should simply be able to query all trade data, missions and similar in a certain lightyear radius. The rest will be sorted out by players. Any arising exploits or imbalances can and will be fixed.
It will also put FD on the spot and force them to improve their game in terms of UI, NPC AI and background sim.
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Yep me too, down to 1059 credits a ton, carrying 228 tons the python is now defunct as a trading ship unless you wish to spend 35 to 55 percent of your capitol maintaining and fueling it. Like many here, they need to decide on a trading concept and make sure the game sticks with it, because this is now enough for me to decide there really is nothing left for me in the game at the moment now.
Making credits for a forthcoming ship or two was the Only saving grace left in the game now chap's, adjusting the infinite supply I can understand, but nukeing the prices just makes no sense at all to me, I only played as a trader, now that direction is so monotonous I really have to leave and play Far Cry 4 to actually have FUN playing a game. Sort it out Frontier ! If you are loosing new players this quick after six weeks of launching the game, and bearing in mind I am an original 1984 player, so I am slightly biased towards the game which I still love but no longer wish to play, Frontier you may wish to give players incentives for playing......not take them away......just an idea though.
Making credits for a forthcoming ship or two was the Only saving grace left in the game now chap's, adjusting the infinite supply I can understand, but nukeing the prices just makes no sense at all to me, I only played as a trader, now that direction is so monotonous I really have to leave and play Far Cry 4 to actually have FUN playing a game. Sort it out Frontier ! If you are loosing new players this quick after six weeks of launching the game, and bearing in mind I am an original 1984 player, so I am slightly biased towards the game which I still love but no longer wish to play, Frontier you may wish to give players incentives for playing......not take them away......just an idea though.
I don't share your optimism.
That is why I have quit playing for a while.
Yep. A good idea. I've said it before, but I'll say it again, NPC's should be limited to trading low value goods ( < 500CR/T) AND only taking them very short distances, relative to players. That keeps the 'background simulation' alive, but allows players to trade high value goods. (>=500CR/T)
And as always, cue my sig!
I think a better idea would be making low value goods worth trading. Taking a load of beer to a remote mining station should pay you better than taking palladium one jump.
Should NPCs also be limited to flying sidewinders and using pulse lasers?
Sorry, I completely disagree - and I trade high-value goods almost exclusively. You should be competing with NPCs along with Cmdrs for trading routes. It was when people were doing that Perf Enhc $4Mil/hr run last week for days upon days, and if recent FD changes completely obliterate the value of crowd-sourced trade data - that's outstanding news. It should take more effort to earn money, than just drive from A to B delivering the same 3 canisters for the rest of your ED gaming life... because at the moment, about the only risky part of trading (other than Tigga) has been turning on a docking computer and going to the bathroom.
I'll offer a counter-opinion: earning money, for me presently, has become nearly a pointless task. I've got a T6 and a Viper (both upgraded to my desired specs) and $6 Mil in the bank. What's the appeal of earning another $10 Million to me? So I can buy a T7, and then run the same routes another 200 times so that I can get a Python/T9/whatever? So that when I finally get the Python/T9 - i guess... what, I Won? Because that's all credits are good for presently - buying a bigger ship, so that you can trade more to buy a bigger ship.
That's not why I play, though - I enjoy hunting, i'd like more PvP to be honest. I'd like more piracy, more hunting, more traders having to fight each other for a territory. THAT would make the game more interesting.
But a non-changing route that's just a credit farm... seriously, that's not game design, that's a flaw. And if that's really what people want to do all day ... just fly from A to B, 200 times a week - why not just play Farmville? It's about the same experience. Click, watch acreage increase, click, repeat.
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A3 fuel scoop, lose a grand total of 8 cargo for unlimited fuel.
Prices would be nuked by supply and demand.
Yes the system needs tweeking but lets not all get y because a flawed game mechanic was changed.