Why is the Eagle so slow compared to other small ships? And general ship speeds...

[scorpyon]

I'm just curious about this. It's not a complaint or request for change. More a sort of slight bafflement.

The Eagle seems like an interesting (yet small) step up from the Sidewinder at present, though to be honest I chose to completely ignore it and took the leap to Viper instead. The reason being that I looked into the Eagle as a combat ship and although it has a reasonably good turning circle, it somehow gets outrun by Vipers and Cobras.
This to me is rather odd. It's a slightly smaller and much lighter ship, so it makes sense to me that it would be one of the fastest ships to keep it out of harm's way. Especially since it is effectively made of paper and tears and will not survive a single volley from a Viper or Cobra directly.

It could effectively be a great combat machine given the ability to get away when it draws attention on itself. I know NPC AI is generally terrible, but seeing an Elite Eagle often raises a smirk for me, because I know it's going to be dead in about 3 seconds flat.

Now, please understand me, I'm not saying it needs an "overhaul" or a super-buff to make it the new number one combat ship. No, that's silly. Nobody wants that. I'm not even saying it SHOULD be changed. But I wonder why it's not faster? Is there a lore reason perhaps?
Does anyone see a point in getting an Eagle over a free Sidewinder other than the one extra hardpoint? (Why cripples the ship if you fit too many lasers anyway! Heh!)

On the subject of speed, I know it's been mentioned before, but how come the Viper is now slower than the Cobra? (At least, that's what I have heard) I've not bothered getting a Cobra because I always wanted a dedicated Combat machine, hence buying the Viper. But now I hear that the Cobra is suddenly a much better choice for combat. How come that's happened? I thought the Cobra was meant to be a sort of jack of all trades, master of none? It's only a fraction more expensive than the Viper, yet suddenly seems to be streaks ahead of it. What happened there?

AAAAAnd finally....

How on earth is a Clipper now the fastest ship in the game? It's a lumbering great beast with an imported Ferrari engine! Heh! Aside from looking like a Klingon War Vessel, it is very odd how this medium sized ship can somehow outrace the small speedy fighter crafts.
Again, not asking for change, but more clarification as to why this should be. It's a reaaaaally odd decision.

I'm not even going to mention the fact that the Federation alternative (because I have no rep with the Empire) is the dropship.... ahem!

 

[Cathalo]

I'm just curious about this. It's not a complaint or request for change. More a sort of slight bafflement.

The Eagle seems like an interesting (yet small) step up from the Sidewinder at present, though to be honest I chose to completely ignore it and took the leap to Viper instead. The reason being that I looked into the Eagle as a combat ship and although it has a reasonably good turning circle, it somehow gets outrun by Vipers and Cobras.
This to me is rather odd. It's a slightly smaller and much lighter ship, so it makes sense to me that it would be one of the fastest ships to keep it out of harm's way. Especially since it is effectively made of paper and tears and will not survive a single volley from a Viper or Cobra directly.

It could effectively be a great combat machine given the ability to get away when it draws attention on itself. I know NPC AI is generally terrible, but seeing an Elite Eagle often raises a smirk for me, because I know it's going to be dead in about 3 seconds flat.

Now, please understand me, I'm not saying it needs an "overhaul" or a super-buff to make it the new number one combat ship. No, that's silly. Nobody wants that. I'm not even saying it SHOULD be changed. But I wonder why it's not faster? Is there a lore reason perhaps?
Does anyone see a point in getting an Eagle over a free Sidewinder other than the one extra hardpoint? (Why cripples the ship if you fit too many lasers anyway! Heh!)

On the subject of speed, I know it's been mentioned before, but how come the Viper is now slower than the Cobra? (At least, that's what I have heard) I've not bothered getting a Cobra because I always wanted a dedicated Combat machine, hence buying the Viper. But now I hear that the Cobra is suddenly a much better choice for combat. How come that's happened? I thought the Cobra was meant to be a sort of jack of all trades, master of none? It's only a fraction more expensive than the Viper, yet suddenly seems to be streaks ahead of it. What happened there?

AAAAAnd finally....

How on earth is a Clipper now the fastest ship in the game? It's a lumbering great beast with an imported Ferrari engine! Heh! Aside from looking like a Klingon War Vessel, it is very odd how this medium sized ship can somehow outrace the small speedy fighter crafts.
Again, not asking for change, but more clarification as to why this should be. It's a reaaaaally odd decision.

I'm not even going to mention the fact that the Federation alternative (because I have no rep with the Empire) is the dropship.... ahem!

From a gameplay standpoint it doesn't make sense, but from a lore standpoint the Eagle is ancient technology. Just take a look at it, it looks like a current day fighter jet that should be unable to fly in space but overtime was made to do so. I think the price of this craft is fair and it is to be feared in combat depending on pilot and how it has been equipped, which is ample. It only costs like 47k creds. If you want to fly a spaceship you need to spend more money.

 

[scorpyon]

From a gameplay standpoint it doesn't make sense, but from a lore standpoint the Eagle is ancient technology. Just take a look at it, it looks like a current day fighter jet that should be unable to fly in space but overtime was made to do so. I think the price of this craft is fair and it is to be feared in combat depending on pilot and how it has been equipped, which is ample. It only costs like 47k creds.

Yeah, I had hoped that maybe it was a lore basis, which would then perhaps explain the decision around it. And as you say, it's very cheap.
I imagine that in a group fight, where people are focusing on the bigger ships, the Eagle will suddenly find it's own, because it can zip in and start unloading.
It just needs that little bit of extra speed to give it an edge, I think.

Maybe the Wings update is missing piece of the puzzle that the Eagle has been waiting for?

 

[Shads]

AAAAAnd finally....

How on earth is a Clipper now the fastest ship in the game? It's a lumbering great beast with an imported Ferrari engine! Heh! Aside from looking like a Klingon War Vessel, it is very odd how this medium sized ship can somehow outrace the small speedy fighter crafts.
Again, not asking for change, but more clarification as to why this should be. It's a reaaaaally odd decision.

I'm not even going to mention the fact that the Federation alternative (because I have no rep with the Empire) is the dropship.... ahem!

The Clipper isn't a medium ship. Its classed as a large ship and cannot land on outposts. Every ship has a downside I suppose and this is the clippers but THB I still consider it one of the best ships in the game if you can get over not landing on outposts and for me was the sole reason I move halfway across the occupied galaxy into Imperial space just so I could level up the rank required for the ship. There are plenty of gaps in the current list of ships. Only 2 are described as combat vessels in the ED ship wiki and they are both small ships.

 

[scorpyon]

The Clipper isn't a medium ship. Its classed as a large ship and cannot land on outposts. Every ship has a downside I suppose and this is the clippers but THB I still consider it one of the best ships in the game if you can get over not landing on outposts and for me was the sole reason I move halfway across the occupied galaxy into Imperial space just so I could level up the rank required for the ship. There are plenty of gaps in the current list of ships. Only 2 are described as combat vessels in the ED ship wiki and they are both small ships.

My bad, I dunnot why I thought it was medium! Heh! As a large ship, I'm even more baffled by the speed!

 

[salad]

The Eagle is a fine ship for its cheap price, and its not all about having one more hardpoint, it handles very well in combat.

The maneuverability makes it worth it.

The Elite Eagles die fast because the AI isn't smart enough to keep moving, If try to hit a player flying an Eagle and you'll have a much harder time.

Although I would like a small speed boost I don't mind having to switch pips mid combat to keep chasing my enemies, it is not THAT slow.


(Imo)

 

[Cathalo]

Yeah, I had hoped that maybe it was a lore basis, which would then perhaps explain the decision around it. And as you say, it's very cheap.
I imagine that in a group fight, where people are focusing on the bigger ships, the Eagle will suddenly find it's own, because it can zip in and start unloading.
It just needs that little bit of extra speed to give it an edge, I think.

Maybe the Wings update is missing piece of the puzzle that the Eagle has been waiting for?

If you outfit the Eagle properly you will still have more speed than pilots who fly Vipers and Cobras. Watching your tonnage is very important. Don't pay attention to the stock speeds given as outfitting is a heavy detriment to these figures. Eagles are simple, you don't need much in the way of outfitting to hit hard, hit fast, and maneuver to escape. If you are an Eagle pilot then you need to plan for your prey and outfit your ship based on the prey you are hunting, other prey you need to let go of. Which is exactly what an Eagle does in real life.

 

[Robert Maynard]

How on earth is a Clipper now the fastest ship in the game? It's a lumbering great beast with an imported Ferrari engine! Heh! Aside from looking like a Klingon War Vessel, it is very odd how this medium sized ship can somehow outrace the small speedy fighter crafts.

The name "Clipper" relates to the Clipper Ships designed to be the fastest cargo ships of their time - optimised for speed rather than cargo capacity. The need for speed was from the desire to be the first ship home with the season's tea, etc..

 

[Zplintz]

The Eagle is cheap. It's a basic manoeuvrable fighter.

 

[firstname_lastname]

The Eagle is still one of my favorite ships, Its a cheap paper thin fighter that in the right hands can out fly any thing else, but its maneuverability comes from its slower speed.

I am sure once they can be flown in groups, said groups of eagles will regularly take down much bigger and less maneuverable ships. That being said in my opinion the viper is a classic air superiority fighter, its faster and more heavily armed, but is less maneuverable (think F-4 E Vs. MIG-17).

The Eagle and Viper are different tools for different jobs, both very good at what they do. I like the fact that Elite doesn't necessarily have the same logical progression as we are perhaps used to. Even a sidewinder in the right hands and the right situation is lethal, because Elite relies on your skill as a pilot and not just "I have have a ship worth X which will beat a cheaper ship worth Y"

 

[Vasious]

From a gameplay standpoint it doesn't make sense, but from a lore standpoint the Eagle is ancient technology. Just take a look at it, it looks like a current day fighter jet that should be unable to fly in space but overtime was made to do so. I think the price of this craft is fair and it is to be feared in combat depending on pilot and how it has been equipped, which is ample. It only costs like 47k creds. If you want to fly a spaceship you need to spend more money.

Core Dynamics Eagle MkII at that, in the Lore a Failed design/reengineering of the MkI
No longer in production; superceeded by the F63

 

[Philip Coutts]

The Eagle is a great ship but for me would work better as a pack hunter. One lonely Eagle isn't much of a threat but 2 or 3 of them would be interesting.

 

[scorpyon]

The Eagle is a great ship but for me would work better as a pack hunter. One lonely Eagle isn't much of a threat but 2 or 3 of them would be interesting.

This. Absolutely!
I'm becoming ever more sure that Wings will revolutionize the Eagle's usefulness as a hunting vessel. Imagine a squadron of 5 Eagles dropping out of SC on an unsuspecting Anaconda or Pie-rat!
Imagine the film footage, too! :-D

 

[salad]

The Eagle is a great ship but for me would work better as a pack hunter. One lonely Eagle isn't much of a threat but 2 or 3 of them would be interesting.

More like terrifying!

 

[Zanten]

This. Absolutely!
I'm becoming ever more sure that Wings will revolutionize the Eagle's usefulness as a hunting vessel. Imagine a squadron of 5 Eagles dropping out of SC on an unsuspecting Anaconda or Pie-rat!
Imagine the film footage, too! :-D

I dunno, given an Anaconda doesn't, as far as I know, get Mass Disrupted by anything short of another Anaconda (maaaaybe a T9, but I've yet to see if happen,) nothing to really keep the Anaconda from jumping right back into SC. x3 And since the Eagles WOULD be Mass Disrupted by the Anaconda, they wouldn't be able to finish charging their jump drives until the Anaconda left, unless they were suitably far away. =D Definitely something I'm thankful for, given the Pack-Of-Disposable-Ships-Versus-The-Super-Expensive-Bigger-Ship would likely be a frustrating bloodbath if the Anaconda can't even exercise the better part of valor and retreat. Speaking from experience, those tiny Eagles are an absolute pain in the butt to nail with fixed weapons, and chaff obviously buggers gimballed, so not sure how a battle with five Eagles would fair. x3 Even if victorious, I suspect the hull damage on my Anaconda would be... costly. =P

 

[scorpyon]

I dunno, given an Anaconda doesn't, as far as I know, get Mass Disrupted by anything short of another Anaconda (maaaaybe a T9, but I've yet to see if happen,) nothing to really keep the Anaconda from jumping right back into SC. x3 And since the Eagles WOULD be Mass Disrupted by the Anaconda, they wouldn't be able to finish charging their jump drives until the Anaconda left, unless they were suitably far away. =D Definitely something I'm thankful for, given the Pack-Of-Disposable-Ships-Versus-The-Super-Expensive-Bigger-Ship would likely be a frustrating bloodbath if the Anaconda can't even exercise the better part of valor and retreat. Speaking from experience, those tiny Eagles are an absolute pain in the butt to nail with fixed weapons, and chaff obviously buggers gimballed, so not sure how a battle with five Eagles would fair. x3 Even if victorious, I suspect the hull damage on my Anaconda would be... costly. =P

From what someone pointed out to me yesterday, dropping out of interdiction / submitting will soon cause a massive FSD recharge delay.
It's incredibly unfair (mostly on traders) but what can you do... FD have shown by their comments that they want traders to be outmatched / killed / murdered by any means necessary because #reasons.
But that's another discussion there... heh!

 

[Zanten]

From what someone pointed out to me yesterday, dropping out of interdiction / submitting will soon cause a massive FSD recharge delay.
It's incredibly unfair (mostly on traders) but what can you do... FD have shown by their comments that they want traders to be outmatched / killed / murdered by any means necessary because #reasons.
But that's another discussion there... heh!

Eh, the delay doesn't bother me overmuch, unless they make it REALLY onerous, like 'Hey, you get to spend FIVE MINUTES waiting for your drive to charge while the pirates get, essentially, all the time in the world to blow you up. =D ' I can understand wanting to give pirates a chance to actually do their job, but there's a pretty fine line between giving the pirates a fair chance, and pretty much leaving the trader utterly screwed and praying the pirate is incredibly incompetent. The only thing I ever found a pain was Mass Disruption, where your charge up rate just tanks when you're close to other ships; the only way around it was jumping to another system, which had its own somewhat slower charge up rate. Without worrying about mass disruption, once my recharge delay expires, I can charge and get back to SC in roughly seven or eight seconds, tops, counting the "4... 3... 2... 1... Engage' bit. In the meantime, full pips to shields, boost engines to maximize speed, turn off flight assist, and become a rotating turret armed with eight forward firing weapon placements, shield cells, and chaff. =D Sure, I might not be able to blow up any of the Eagles, but by God I can keep them scurrying away from a Finger Of God worth of weapons fire until I can escape!

 

[Mephane]

The Eagle is a great ship but for me would work better as a pack hunter. One lonely Eagle isn't much of a threat but 2 or 3 of them would be interesting.

That is true, but that logic does not change when you replace the Eagle with something else. What is more terrifying? A wing of 4 Eagles, or a wing of 4 Vipers?

I personally believe the Eagle needs to be as fast as a Viper, if not the fastest ship at all.