I disagree that you can't defend a lakoon trader. As a trader you are fighting infrequently and have more money, so you can invest in weapons that are very expensive to fire. A T9 with 5 missile racks (3 of them medium) can make a pirate think twice, especially if you have some shield cells as well. I didn't take it to that extreme yet cause most of the pirates interdicting me are NPCs. The NPCs i can usually kill or scare away with turrets. I wish more traders would really arm their ships, for me it's much more enjoyable now.
PVP Pirating in Yembo
- Thread starter Space Pirate
- Start date
In a hundred interdictions of Types 6 7 and 9 I have not once seen one of them escaping through self defense.
Missile racks? You know what happens when you unload all those missile racks into a pirate? He says "nice, shields down to 80%" now. Missile racks are useless on their own now.
And that actually requires you to be facing the pirate, which is gonna be hard in a Type 9 to begin with.
Now now you cannot be arguing against players banding together to fight pirates. It is the natural response to pirating, the posse.
Question is, what is the next step for pirating? Currently it's a lone affair. But with players grouping to oppose pirates then maybe it's time pirates grouped to counter the bounty hunters
this is all player development of the player dynamics and economics of the game
I like the mode swapping. I think it is valuable. I vary where I play based on how I feel like playing. For mostly undisturbed credit grinding, I'm trading in group or solo. There's times I'm up for getting the risks, and times I'm not. The modes offer that. To a certain extent I like the idea of a hardcore open only mode, but I don't have the time to grind multiple characters up. I'd give up playing in frustration.
When I'm feeling more daring, I'm trading in open. If interdicted, I'm not defending--I'm running. That's the challenge--can I survive trading and be profitable in a pure open environment. Even when I'm not in open, NPCs can still interdict me on every stinking run, but they usually pose virtually 0 threat.
To the MMO guys, I get it, but if you're going to play in open, play in open. If you want a chance to see another player, but avoid PVP, join Mobius and play in group like the rest of us.
For the PvP guys, I never liked you much anyway--bunch of freaking psychos. (Who I will probably join, when I figure out how to keep my credit balance and rep positive while engaging in less than positive social behaviors.)
The biggest issue I have with open is playability. I get long lags on system jumps and run into being unable to dock at stations. Those issues push me back to group/solo when I'm trading. I've never been interdicted by a player yet, in fact I rarely see any. Most of the galaxy is pretty empty of commanders, I don't see many even in open. The comms are confusing too. I chased down a friend, and after several minutes trying to open comms with him, I opened fire on him and drained his shields. A few minutes later, he noticed the comms.
To the ideas of suspending or banning players for combat logging--go away. Eve made more sense with this--if you combat log or lose connection (which is terribly frustrating), you're probably dead when you reconnect as your ship suddenly stopped doing anything. That risk is something you just accept it and move on with. I'd be okay with that play mechanic for combat logging or the rare disconnect. It's a trade-off, and one if favor of immersive game play.
The whole pirate, bounty hunting thing feels not quite fleshed out enough yet. I don't see a viable way to profit as a pirate. Trading is far more lucrative. Even after a score, scooping cargo is terribly annoying.
When I'm feeling more daring, I'm trading in open. If interdicted, I'm not defending--I'm running. That's the challenge--can I survive trading and be profitable in a pure open environment. Even when I'm not in open, NPCs can still interdict me on every stinking run, but they usually pose virtually 0 threat.
To the MMO guys, I get it, but if you're going to play in open, play in open. If you want a chance to see another player, but avoid PVP, join Mobius and play in group like the rest of us.
For the PvP guys, I never liked you much anyway--bunch of freaking psychos. (Who I will probably join, when I figure out how to keep my credit balance and rep positive while engaging in less than positive social behaviors.)
The biggest issue I have with open is playability. I get long lags on system jumps and run into being unable to dock at stations. Those issues push me back to group/solo when I'm trading. I've never been interdicted by a player yet, in fact I rarely see any. Most of the galaxy is pretty empty of commanders, I don't see many even in open. The comms are confusing too. I chased down a friend, and after several minutes trying to open comms with him, I opened fire on him and drained his shields. A few minutes later, he noticed the comms.
To the ideas of suspending or banning players for combat logging--go away. Eve made more sense with this--if you combat log or lose connection (which is terribly frustrating), you're probably dead when you reconnect as your ship suddenly stopped doing anything. That risk is something you just accept it and move on with. I'd be okay with that play mechanic for combat logging or the rare disconnect. It's a trade-off, and one if favor of immersive game play.
The whole pirate, bounty hunting thing feels not quite fleshed out enough yet. I don't see a viable way to profit as a pirate. Trading is far more lucrative. Even after a score, scooping cargo is terribly annoying.
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This is the main problem. The grind is to big and because of this players act the way they do....
It's time for FD to have some 'real' alternatives as opposed to just grinding.
And indeed comms need to be better / solution for combat logging etc...
The 'danger' element in solo mode needs to be bigger in a way that it can't funcion as a safe heaven or easy mode.
Income of professions needs to be balanced better. Exploring/Mining/Bounty hunting/Piracy should gain some in comparison to trading.
Better tutorials /trainign missions /explenation of features and items etc...
Mission design that makes use of multiplayer.
But all those things need to be implemented in order to keep the open mode interesting and 'fair' and people will automaticly join open more and not flee to solo...
A lot of the things mentioned will be coming but we are far away from a balanced game.
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Well, does anyone want to form a Pirate Posse then? Or Gang of Pirates? Probably going to be easier when Wings comes out. But if anyone is interested let me know.
Or people who call troll anyone who enjoys different aspect of playing the game and says so.
I once encountered a pirate that killed me for absolutely nothing in Anarchy space, after I lost a fight against an Anaconda assassination target, so I couldn't fight back, losing hundreds of thousands of credits, with him earning nothing. Since that time I play solo, since I can't stand this type of player pirates that hurt people just for fun.
You, OP, seem like a decent pirate at least, I'm sorry for your troubles.
You, OP, seem like a decent pirate at least, I'm sorry for your troubles.
You are using an exploit to make your own rules, which are outside of the game rules.
It is called cheating in any kind of sports, like using your hand in soccer or going on dope in cycling.
Those kind of people are everything but respectable.
I think it's appropriate to call someone who had a thread locked for trolling and a warning for trolling a troll.
What do you think? At what point can one call someone a troll?
You're trolling with troll accusations.
I think it is reasonable to expect that any trader who chooses to trade in Yembo in Open mode ought to be aware of the risks they face (if they don't, they'll find out pretty quickly when they visit it for the first time). Traders have the option of contributing to the community goal in Solo if they so wish, and there's nothing wrong with that: if you enjoy the challenge of trading with just NPCs for company, that's totally fine. It is also quite a big galaxy, and there are loads of profitable routes where you hardly ever encounter another player, and that's another valid choice.
Community goals encourage players to visit a particular location; I'm pretty sure that at least part of the idea is to increase the opportunity for PVP interaction. Interaction of all types: good and bad.
Personally, I find interaction with other players is by far the most rewarding aspect of the game, and the risk of being interdicted by a pirate gunship, or even a homicidal maniac, is what gets my pulse racing. That's why I go to Yembo - its by far the best fun you can have as a trader. As with all game mechanics, there needs to be balance - I need a chance of escaping, and the pirate needs to be able to get a reasonable return on their chosen career.
And a sensible trader will balance risk. They know there's a chance of being interdicted; they won't risk more than they can afford to lose, and they will be willing to negotiate. Even a Type 6 is an expensive ship: I will do whatever I can to avoid losing it, and dropping cargo is a perfectly reasonable outcome if it saves me from huge repair bills or even ship loss.
Properly-prepared pirates have the upper hand in interdictions: they have chosen the target, they have chosen to start the negotiation. And if they are properly prepared, the pirate will make the trader believe that dropping cargo is the best outcome.
I'll do everything I can to avoid being interdicted, but a player lying a reasonably nimble gunship won't have too much trouble bringing me to a halt. So I need to decide how best to protect myself. Fighting isn't an option, so I have a choice of negotiating or running away. And the pirate can help me make that decision.
A plea to pirates: decise what your demands are going to be, and set up some macros to message your target to make your intentions clear. If I get a message along the lines of "I have a very large gunship, and if you try to escape you will die horribly in the emptiness of space. Please wait while I scan your cargo and I will then make my demands", then I know that in all probability the pirate is someone who knows what he is doing, and I will know that my best chance is to cooperate. If I then get a demand for a reasonable percentage of my cargo (up to about 50%) then its an easy decision: drop the cargo and get on my way. If the pirate is polite and professional, so much the better.
There's nothing worse then being pulled out of FSD and left sitting there not knowing what's going on. Sometimes it takes quite a bit of effort to get the pirate to state their demands. If I get a "GIVE GOLD PLEEZ", well, the pirate hasn't thought out their strategy, so there's a much better chance of escaping. I might drop a couple of cargo cannisters as a diversion and then boost away, and I stand a reasonable chance of escaping.
If a pirate doesn't hail me, but just starts shooting at me to get the shields down to attach a hatch breaker, well, I'm already racking up a repair bill, so I might as well try to escape. I might not succeed, but hey, its a game, and I tried.
I don't know how other traders react, but I'd be willing to bet that pirates who have done their homework, prepared properly and are able to make the trader believe that dropping a load of cargo is the closest they're going to get to a "win-win" are the pirates who are the most successful. And treating the traders sustainably (not frightening them off to trade in another system) seems eminently sensible.
Sorry for rambling on. I don't Combat Log, by the way.
Community goals encourage players to visit a particular location; I'm pretty sure that at least part of the idea is to increase the opportunity for PVP interaction. Interaction of all types: good and bad.
Personally, I find interaction with other players is by far the most rewarding aspect of the game, and the risk of being interdicted by a pirate gunship, or even a homicidal maniac, is what gets my pulse racing. That's why I go to Yembo - its by far the best fun you can have as a trader. As with all game mechanics, there needs to be balance - I need a chance of escaping, and the pirate needs to be able to get a reasonable return on their chosen career.
And a sensible trader will balance risk. They know there's a chance of being interdicted; they won't risk more than they can afford to lose, and they will be willing to negotiate. Even a Type 6 is an expensive ship: I will do whatever I can to avoid losing it, and dropping cargo is a perfectly reasonable outcome if it saves me from huge repair bills or even ship loss.
Properly-prepared pirates have the upper hand in interdictions: they have chosen the target, they have chosen to start the negotiation. And if they are properly prepared, the pirate will make the trader believe that dropping cargo is the best outcome.
I'll do everything I can to avoid being interdicted, but a player lying a reasonably nimble gunship won't have too much trouble bringing me to a halt. So I need to decide how best to protect myself. Fighting isn't an option, so I have a choice of negotiating or running away. And the pirate can help me make that decision.
A plea to pirates: decise what your demands are going to be, and set up some macros to message your target to make your intentions clear. If I get a message along the lines of "I have a very large gunship, and if you try to escape you will die horribly in the emptiness of space. Please wait while I scan your cargo and I will then make my demands", then I know that in all probability the pirate is someone who knows what he is doing, and I will know that my best chance is to cooperate. If I then get a demand for a reasonable percentage of my cargo (up to about 50%) then its an easy decision: drop the cargo and get on my way. If the pirate is polite and professional, so much the better.
There's nothing worse then being pulled out of FSD and left sitting there not knowing what's going on. Sometimes it takes quite a bit of effort to get the pirate to state their demands. If I get a "GIVE GOLD PLEEZ", well, the pirate hasn't thought out their strategy, so there's a much better chance of escaping. I might drop a couple of cargo cannisters as a diversion and then boost away, and I stand a reasonable chance of escaping.
If a pirate doesn't hail me, but just starts shooting at me to get the shields down to attach a hatch breaker, well, I'm already racking up a repair bill, so I might as well try to escape. I might not succeed, but hey, its a game, and I tried.
I don't know how other traders react, but I'd be willing to bet that pirates who have done their homework, prepared properly and are able to make the trader believe that dropping a load of cargo is the closest they're going to get to a "win-win" are the pirates who are the most successful. And treating the traders sustainably (not frightening them off to trade in another system) seems eminently sensible.
Sorry for rambling on. I don't Combat Log, by the way.