FD please fix the piracy issue. It is now ridiculous

[Vingtetun]

Hello Commanders!

We're looking at updating fines to reduce the extreme amounts you can get nailed for. The concept that we're going for is to allow authority vessels to "mark" cargo if they successfully detect it, effectively ruining your ability to sell it. At the same time, we'll be able to significantly soften and better control fines issued for smuggling.

On a related note, this also leaves the door open later on for services that can "clean" marked cargo, which I think is pretty cool.

Usual caveats: no guarantee or ETA, but we're pretty solidly behind this one.

Excellent news, and thankyou for publishing your thinking on this.

Are NPC ships carrying illicit cargoes going to have increased fines to assist bounty hunters in earning money? At the moment, the npc fines appear to be only in relation to their other infractions, not their cargo ones.

For that matter - are we going to see increased drops from hatch killing/our own cargo spilling into the void from pirate interdictions (at which point the pirate might back off and let us live, but nick our stuff)??

 

[CMDR Osgiliath]

What can I say ... I was able to repeat the fine thing. Coming out of the station (TEWI'XILAK System - Zholobov Station) with 452 Imperial Slaves bought there. Before I hypejump I got scanned and fined ... 7M CR. I dont't get the point ...
This time i will not pay that fine ... And I do not go back to that station... What will happen?

 

[Celeste]

Dear FD.

The fines issues by system authority vessels are now completely over the top and need to be fixed. Read on....

1. I disengage super cruise in a USS.

I learned very quickly never to do this while smuggling. I had been playing for a few days and build up around 300k, all of which went into the ship. I only had enough to cover insurance and some to invest in for trading. I ended up just restarting the game. I figured trying to pay it off wasn't worth the effort.

 

[PotatoOverdose]

I agree with the OP. The fine for murder should be much higher ... It needs increasing to at least the rebuy of the victim's ship.

It's a bigger crime to murder a rich person than it is to murder a poor person! You heard it here first, folks!

 

[Firebeard]

Dropping into a USS with shed loads of illegal cargo and got a fine... How is this Frontier's fault?

 

[BrewerGeorge]

I just realized something else about the cargo marking. It is effectively a fine you can't avoid. You can build bounty levels forever by choosing NOT to pay your fines. But as soon as some cargo is 'marked' as unsellable, you're instantly out its cost.

 

[Yokai]

Dear FD.

The fines issues by system authority vessels are now completely over the top and need to be fixed. Read on....

1. I disengage super cruise in a USS.
2. A system authority vessel is right in front of me and scans me straight away.
3. I try and boost away and super cruise out as I have slaves on board.
4. I have got no chance and I am given a 200,000cr fine.

Its just impossible to get away and the fines issued are ridiculously over the top compared to what I have in my cargo hold.
I was so miffed by this that I murdered the system authority vessel for giving me the fine. I then got another fine for 6,000 (which was worth it)

Where is the logic when you murder someone and only get a fine of 6,000cr and yet I get a 200,000cr fine for just carrying illegal cargo?

At the moment, pirating npc's in USS's are simply not an option for a way of life which is a real shame because I love
pirating npc's and find it the most enjoyable part of the game.

Trading and mining is just so boring (I'd rather watch paint dry) which leaves bounty hunting and I've done that to death already.
So at the moment, I am sorry to say, that I am not enjoying the game at all.

The different penalties shown here for smuggling goods versus outright murder of a police authority is ROFL-worthy bass-ackwards.

The sad part is that all these values aren't _mechanically_ hard to balance because they are (based on) numbers in a database table. Easiest level in the world to pull on until the machine is running right. I'm frankly boggled that so many 800-pound gorilla imbalanced numbers like this have persisted for so long. Even if you don't get it right on the first pull of the lever, you just iterate every few releases until the machine stops clunking and wheezing so much. It's not like there's any significant coding changes or regression testing involved.

 

[Oddball]

Hello Commanders!

We're looking at updating fines to reduce the extreme amounts you can get nailed for. The concept that we're going for is to allow authority vessels to "mark" cargo if they successfully detect it, effectively ruining your ability to sell it. At the same time, we'll be able to significantly soften and better control fines issued for smuggling.

On a related note, this also leaves the door open later on for services that can "clean" marked cargo, which I think is pretty cool.

Usual caveats: no guarantee or ETA, but we're pretty solidly behind this one.

Thanks for your reply Sandro. Its nice to know that you are listening to us (well, me anyway). The new mechanics sound interesting.

 

[CMDR Osgiliath]

Dropping into a USS with shed loads of illegal cargo and got a fine... How is this Frontier's fault?

Maybe it is not. I don't know. I am just surprised that I had no problem for days and now I am fined for the same thing twice ...

 

[kurush]

If murdering would be fined for 400k, I would be able to get YOU fined for 400k just by flying through your mining laser. On the other hand, no one smuggles illegal cargo by accident.

If murdering would be fined 400k, I'd make billions with two account in several days Smuggling is kinda lame with the current rules though, I tend to agree. I know how to avoid positive scans (chaff helps for example) but it is not worth the hassle. It would be different if you can get double-pay for your haul when you finally manage to smuggle it in as it was the case in previous Elite.

 

[Tarman]

The different penalties shown here for smuggling goods versus outright murder of a police authority is ROFL-worthy bass-ackwards.

The sad part is that all these values aren't _mechanically_ hard to balance because they are (based on) numbers in a database table. Easiest level in the world to pull on until the machine is running right. I'm frankly boggled that so many 800-pound gorilla imbalanced numbers like this have persisted for so long. Even if you don't get it right on the first pull of the lever, you just iterate every few releases until the machine stops clunking and wheezing so much. It's not like there's any significant coding changes or regression testing involved.

It is a bit silly that it's thirty times cheaper in this case for the killing of the SysAuth who handed out the original fine. Who also I just realized, has a much better data transfer system than we do for bounties or scans. Maybe the fines should be zero if you ace the ticketer. Let the police have to get back with bounties and reports too.

 

[wstephenson]

On a related note, this also leaves the door open later on for services that can "clean" marked cargo, which I think is pretty cool.

Hi Sandro

I put together a brainfart on expanding smuggling a few months ago, which also introduced a "third" (legal) state for cargo - 'contraband', which was between the current 'stolen' and 'legal' states. Your proposal would place the current 'stolen' in-between 'legal' and 'stolen-marked'. The idea was to create a value chain for smugglers between the pirates and the sunlit world. There might be something useful in there for you: See 'The underworld economy' in "It was supposed to be so easy" - Life as an outlaw in Elite Dangerous

 

[Sandro Sammarco]

Hello Commander wstephenson!

Yes, I definitely see similarities between our marked cargo concept and your contraband. Obviously there are differences as well, but the long term idea would be to create additional interesting choices for smugglers, which looks like what you were aiming for.

Hello Commanders!

Oops just wanted to add, there's a subtle difference between having a huge fine and having a very small fine with marked cargo (in addition to the concept of getting the cargo "un-marked"). Even though you still lose the value more or less in both systems, the very small fine is probably more likely to be paid off by senible smugglers.

 

[Thorn Black]

Im falling asleep when i trade legal stuff, even when im interdicted i fall aslep, if they kill me it just leaves bad taste in my mouth ... yeah ... would be nice for more smuggling pirating interaction, along with hidden pirate heaven bases ... cmooooon.
With the great risk the great reward should come, and i see NOTHING on the horizon atm ... zzzzzz ...

 

[Oddball]

Hi Sandro.

Couldn't we make more use of the Type-9's that keep hanging around in USS's doing nothing? All they seem to want at the moment is computer components.
Maybe we could stumble across one now and then that will buy your slaves etc.

Just a thought....

 

[Mr. Woof]

Hello Commander Dr. Dave Bowman!

If the police catch you smuggling and mark your cargo, you won't be able to sell it full stop, except perhaps for a nominal fee to a starport service. However, yes, we want to leave the door open for "cleaning" services.

Cargo laundering service. Sweet.

 

[BrewerGeorge]

...
Hello Commanders!

Oops just wanted to add, there's a subtle difference between having a huge fine and having a very small fine with marked cargo (in addition to the concept of getting the cargo "un-marked"). Even though you still lose the value more or less in both systems, the very small fine is probably more likely to be paid off by senible smugglers.

With the option to un-mark cargo and make it sell-able, the mechanic makes some sense. Without that mechanic, we might as well immediately jettison marked cargo into space. They have to go together, if at all.

A couple of points:
What's the lore rationale for a SysAuthority vessel half a km away being able to actively change cargo in MY ship?
Why would a Black Marketeer care? By definition, they should be buying stolen and illegal goods.

 

[Thorn Black]

Let me ask about this slimy shady different "proffesion" of scavenging cargo and rescuing those slaves ... You cannot do it it gets immediatelly marked as stolen but perhaps a PERSMISSION for s system from authorities for a certain credit amount to be able to scooop it and rescue those poor slaves ??? Cmon ... DDF ... ehhh

 

[Jordan Cobalt]

It is pretty ridiculous, getting caught with 1 ton of stolen consumer technology has the same cost as killing a cop. That seems a little off to me.

 

[FlyingWreck]

Maybe it is not. I don't know. I am just surprised that I had no problem for days and now I am fined for the same thing twice ...

This also happend to me today. On my daily route with 488t imperial Slaves to Brooks station in Tawilo i suddenly get fined for 8.8 mil. tested it again with just 1 t and i got fined again. I had no problem getting scanned before (flying a T9, there is no hope avoiding a scan ).
I have flown this route for more than a week and imperial slaves is not marked as illegal and is sold on normal market on that station.
I think patch 1.05 changed something with imperial slaves?