Modes The Solo vs Open vs Groups Thread [See new thread]

[Dave1235]

If you think it's cheating you're very welcome to report it. The game is managed and curated by FD and they take a strong line against cheats. I make no secret of what I'm doing, but as far as I can tell from the TOS, it's all entirely within the rules and in the spirit of the game.
I don't know why so many people seem to think they have a right to tell others how to enjoy the game, just because it doesn't fit with their own ideas of how it should be played.

I'm not trying to stop those people who enjoy running a blockade, I'm just saying that under the mechanics of the game... it's not going to work as it will persuade people into Solo mode, much as I have done.

"I don't know why so many people seem to think they have a right to tell others how to enjoy the game".

Yeah I still don't get that either, I have invited a few of them to paypal me the £760 (inc pc etc) I invested. I did say I would always play in open if someone would reimburse me & I would play by their rules, maybe they are still looking at the bridge, or beach front property I have for sale in central London, its still for sale , both are really cheap.

That's the funny part, how can you be accused of cheating by playing the game in the manner it has been designed, the ability to switch modes was in the game when I bought it a few weeks before PB1 started, I believe it was an option from the start (happy to be corrected if I am wrong), it is not just "entirely within the rules and in the spirit of the game", its part of the core FD built into the game from the start for reasons.

I didn't even know twitch existed before I bought ED, I certainly managed to type "elite dangerous videos" & "elite dangerous this/that/theother" in to google or youtube, the game I got in PB1 was pretty much what I was expecting, you have to love this new fangled interweb thingy.

Some people didn't bother, or did but still bought the game anyway, continue to call people cheaters etc even after senior Devs have stated that it is not going to change, it was there from the start, recently confirmed no changes happening, the Mod Robert Maynard (hope I spelt correctly) has linked the devs answers on this all together a few times in this thread so it is crystal clear you are not cheating but playing the game as it is meant to be played.

Not researching before you buy a game is a problem with the buyer, not the game!.

An open question here, I have asked it before but I don't recall it ever being answered, can anyone tell me why they feel the need to change the game, the game that I have been playing & enjoying for 6+ months, the game I researched before I bought, the game I bought on the basis of a decent research, because they failed to research what they were buying?

How does the ability for me to play in solo if I had a bad / long day, group if I feel like it, open if I am am happy to share my cargo , impact your game (did we ever meet in the ~ 6 months I played in open, even in beta with a tiny bubble, I doubt it.

Please email answers to: i-am-sorry-you-think-the-game-is-broken-please-come-back-when-it-is-fixed-but-I-doubt-it-will-be-soon-for-you@thanks-for-your-donation-to-our-great-game.com

 

[Deleted member 38366]

Am I the only one who remembers that traders can equip weapons and shields and survive these interdictions? When I was running cargo, I put a PDF and mine dropper and did my thing. If I got interdicted, I rolled and picked up boost and dropped a mine. They have to pause a second to get around it or fire through it which opens up the lead. Seriously, it's not difficult to negate a pirate's craft if you're smart and actually remember you have hard points for a reason and, instead of putting that extra cargo shelf in, you equip a shield and chaff.

You go ahead and try that against PvP optimized ASPs or Pythons looking for another screenshot of a Player blowing up for their collection
You can toss as many useless mines you want - you'd simply die in any trade Ship. Very fast. No matter what weapons you fit, they are virtually irrelevant against someone filled to the gills with Cell Banks.

Good luck with getting "lead" in a Trade ship against a Mass lock Factor 16 or 24 that's easily faster than you.
Your only chance is to evade the Interdiction - and that is physically impossible in several Trade Ships, as maneuverability of their normal space Thrusters translates directly into their SuperCruise maneuverability.
I've yet to see anyone that won an Interdiction Evasion in a Type-9 in a PvP environment

 

[jpaulwilson1982]

I don't like dealing with the vast segment of the gaming population that are basically sociopaths (a few have popped up in this thread so far). I haven't tried open play in this game but i've played just enough mmo's to know that i do not care for it. The potential for aggravation outweighs the possible reward. I thought mmo's sounded like a terrific idea in 1995. Then they happened and i was faced with reality and the reality is that...if i don't care to socalize with 90% of the population irl..why would i want them to interact with me in virtual world?

If i want to interact with other people, there's real life. Gaming is escapism time. I want nothing of the real world in it. Certainly not people. Having to deal with people breaks that immersion and in fact frequently aggravates.

To each their own, but solo player for life here.

Lots of gamers play online to interact with other gamers who share common interests. Even people who could be labeled as hermits are often into MMOs. In fact, when you usually see a news piece talking about so called "game addiction" it features someone who lives a social life in a certain game only. Remember, just because a person doesn't like the more traditional ways of socializing doesn't mean the person wants to be absolutely lonely in all aspects of life. There have been friendships and even romances kindled within games and their communities. So I have to say your statement is just not true. Online games provide social introverts a way to socialize, a way to have some type of social life, even if its simulated. This is a reason why WoW has been so big, and even The Sims, and throw in dating web sites just for good measure.

I do understand not all gamers want to socialize, but I couldn't say that most gamers seek no human interaction at all in their games.

The closest thing he blamed was the buggy as all get out interdiction system. I see plenty of NPC Eagles (It's always Eagles for some reason so far that can do this...) both military and pirate where even when you are lined up on the escape vector the whole time, you just lose bars. Then when you submit, it says you submitted, but gives you the max cooldown and hull damage. As he said, he was on the ball with plenty of blue bar when it pulled him out of supercruise against that player.

Open or Solo, there is no running from buggy mechanics.

Interdictions do get buggy too often in my experiences. This is a mechanic that needs to be fixed desperately.

At a rate of one expansion a year, and 60 dollars an expansion ED is subscription based -- 5 dollars a month. A reasonable amount considering their bandwidth costs are a fraction of those of a traditional MMO. It's dollars in and dollars out, the model is just different.

And no, many of the early MMO type games were not subscription based. Some were P2p, some were volunteer or privately funded.

Anyways, I've said my piece. Done here.

Has it been confirmed that Elite's expansions will cost $60 a pop? If not, then I see no reason to believe they'll get that high. I got Elite at a deal at $50 for the Mercenary Edition, and haven't had to pay another penny yet. And, especially given that Elite will be going to the XBone I couldn't possibly see $60 expansions. I think they'll likely be $30 a piece, if Frontier follows the patterns of other XBone games, and they may even be cheaper than that.

With today's announcement of ED (The definitive massively multiplayer space epic) coming to Mac and XBox One their money stream may be better than anyone on here anticipated.

If Elite is a success on XBone, then I imagine their income stream will be through the roof. But if the article I read was correct, Elite will be dropping for the Xbox this summer, and at this point the game still isn't ready for PC. Either Frontier plans on making some huge headway in the coming months, or they're overestimating the progress they'll make in that time. So, this whole Xbox deal could either really light a fire under FD's collective butts and we'll get a lot of the bugs ironed out quickly, or the Xbox launch will be a disaster. We'll have to wait and see.

I know this, though; I definitely would not get Elite on the XBox given all the problems the system has given me thus far. They can't even get their party system functioning on even an acceptable level.

Bump+ this is well said and why I only play solo on almost all my pc titles, years ago i learned my lesson about people being jerks and messing up a good game online, so if a game is multiplayer only I do not purchase it.
That being said, i have been playing ED in solo mode since I bought it and once I learned how it works have been having a great time. The NPC interdict me enough and the AI is plenty good for me.

Yeah, there's no way I'd get Elite for XBox Live. I don't doubt there are some Live communities who aren't bigoted, team killing, griefing, thoughtless gangs who more resemble something out of Lord Of The Flies, but I've rarely seen such a community on Live. My experiences on Elite for PC have been stellar compared to any launch or in-game community I've ever encountered on Live.

 

[Dave1235]

Oh, FWIW I do think solo and multiplayer should be completely separate modes. And solo shouldn't affect online.

FWIW I think you are wrong.

What do you think about the fact it has been a part of the game from the start, any opinions on the recent dev quotes stating it's not going to change?

How is your game experience any better or worse if I am in open, groups, solo or not playing?

Please explain how it ruins your game if I am in bed asleep, or right next to you in another instance, you can't see me & will never know I am there.

Did you spend any time researching the game before you bought it? I am genuinely interested, I have seen a few people that share your opinion, not lots but it would be interesting to hear how you bought a game that you don't like, might save me a few £ in future, at least we will understand where this oversight occurred.

Pretty sure the early dev videos covered this subject of everyone being in the same galaxy, but with the ability to play on you own if you want.

Separating solo (what about groups?) would double the server costs etc to the detriment of the improvements we are all waiting for, would you rather split the game in two than work on the current stuff (will you pay for the additional infrastructure ?)

Be careful what you wish for, Mobius has ~ 5k I believe out of ~ 300k total sales, no one knows how many are in solo or open, if people were ever forced to pick, open would be short on traders IMHO, how big is the largest PVP group?.......... anyone?......

 

[Dave1235]

SOLO play should be eliminated altogether since wings makes the idea of it mute. theres no offline play and now solo is being exploited as an avoidance to the interactivity of what the blockades by ppl and the wings system in 1.2 bring to the enviroment of the game

Yes that would work, lets remove part of the game that some people bought it for exclusively, some people bought this game to play it in solo 100% of the time, no bait & switch here. lol. /S

What gives you the right to remove the game they bought, really, people have been playing in solo for months if not longer, bought the game on the basis that solo exists and that's how they want to play IN SOLO, please explain why you think they should not be able to play the game they paid for any more how they want to ?

 

[Genus]

I don't like dealing with the vast segment of the gaming population that are basically sociopaths (a few have popped up in this thread so far). I haven't tried open play in this game but i've played just enough mmo's to know that i do not care for it. The potential for aggravation outweighs the possible reward. I thought mmo's sounded like a terrific idea in 1995. Then they happened and i was faced with reality and the reality is that...if i don't care to socalize with 90% of the population irl..why would i want them to interact with me in virtual world?

If i want to interact with other people, there's real life. Gaming is escapism time. I want nothing of the real world in it. Certainly not people. Having to deal with people breaks that immersion and in fact frequently aggravates.

To each their own, but solo player for life here.

All of that. We should team up in Open and kill some less egoists. Oh hang on...no..

 

[Genus]

So would we both be happy if the game modes were separated?

We would, but FD wouldnt be. You see there's a basic and simple concept that everyone has been missing thus far:

NPC = HUMAN

As far as the background sim is concerned. It matters not. It's through crunching the data and extropolating the patterns across all 3 environments that Frontier can exploit opportunities for monetization and harvest the real revenues.

All the categorisations and sorting into easily understood boxes is just noise. And it is easy, its just humans are inherently stupid.

Fact.

 

[Glock_N_Load]

It's very simple, play solo if you don't want to be killed by people like me or play online if you want to be killed by people like me. But, make no mistake in that hiding in solo mode and buying a more expensive ship will not help you in PvP. You will fail hard and you will lose a lot of money if you think you can fit out an Anaconda or Python and come after my Viper. I will own you even if you fly the most expensive and best equipped ship on the market, because ships don't win PvP. Pilots win PvP.

Frontier has made a big mistake here because they think PvPer's won't go after the big player ships. We will, and we will make space dust out of every single one of you.

Until this belief, that ALL solo players are just wanting a safe place(Hiding) to get the easy money so they can go to open with a big kitted ship, is dispelled then there is not a whole lot to talk about. It's the open players doing this not the solo players. Never played in open and never will (unless forced to). I paid as much as anyone to play this game and I was cheated from the start. I'm just trying to make something good of a bad situation. If we are not a threat then why all the crying. Looks like we make good targets, should be thanking us. And don't tell me to quit if I don't like it because I'm not complaining, u are.

 

[Glock_N_Load]

My system still has trading. I've done deep space runs in a sidewinder and netted 200k. I'm talking about independent/fed/anarchy etc systems, just not in the center of the empire. Solo play sounds like a huge waste.

A lot of big games just have solo play. Most of the people who quit and rant about it on the forum are from open play. They thought open play was a waste. Most of the complaints are from open play cmdrs.

 

[NewYears1978]

I play on Solo because I have lots of interruptions..and am usually multi tasking. I have three daughters (teenagers) and usually have some cats jumping all over me and also sometimes have a TV show going..so it just works for me right now while I write my little companion app, until I decide to go more full time.

I do play in Mobius though - so semi solo.

 

[Stewart_]

So give us an open mode that is not connected to the existing open/solo/group mode -- one that is truly open only.

Problem solvedd == everybody is happy.

You may actually find less Open players. Solo / group players will stick to these two modes.

I wouldn't want to start from scratch in order to play Open.

Open players will demand that Group and Solo modes be removed to force everyone on to Open... Oh wait ... That's already happening!

Players are not in competiton with each other. There is no benefit in stopping people freely moving around the play modes and sharing the same universe.

 

[Stewart_]

Duplicate

 

[Distance]

The current system works fine and whether you like it or not it's not going to change. This debate (and many others) can be summed up in one picture :

 

[danieleveman]

when we start putting gameplays alternatively, things just get out of hand, players tend to think certain changes to the game are intended to interfere with their current gameplay, and the whole thing comes into play about but i could earn more money doing this, what kind of reimbursement or change will we get to accommodate that change, like people complaining about wings making their solo play more difficult or less enjoyable like as if they actually play in open play? lol.

Another thing is with the earning credits side of things, i see everyone, everywhere, worried about their wallets more than they are the enjoyability of the game at current, why is such a game only pointed towards profit, cause i know for a fact that standings mean nothing right now, i know that the discovered by in exploration doesn't mean anything either, why isn't the game built in such a way that people aren't earning just credits to purchase stuff or make the game more fun, the thing i see holding back the fun of this game is the level of simplicity it holds right now, and the original elite games are to blame for this as this game is pretty closely following the previous games from what i've heard, there needs to be a much more varied way to play, not just in terms of actual gameplay modes or anything like that, but in the way battles are won, what weapons you use, what tactics you use and how helpful the ai are, you shouldn't have to go only to a station to accept missions, USS's should hold secret missions too.

Right now, the game is very limited in terms of what you can do, there's only combat exploration and trading, all 3 are pretty boring if done for more than a day to most people, 90% of the time i see people running around with multicannons and lasers in combat, traders are usually trading slaves. berillium and gold, and explorers seem to have to travel more than 3000 ly to get to somewhere that hasn't been tagged or seen before. it's very hard to say, but i could go play x rebirth and have more fun, and that game is terrible.

We should stop looking into the specifics of why we can't earn more money fast enough to get a "decent" ship, and whether we're playing in solo or open, and start looking at how we can improve the game itself with more content and more ways players can interact, than having sitting at a nav point all day being the most fun you've had, this patch is putting a lot of that stuff in the game, but i'm looking through forums and looking through the patch notes for the beta and it's still not putting any alternative gameplay into the game to make people who get bored of doing the same thing all the time, not get as bored so quickly.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

So give us an open mode that is not connected to the existing open/solo/group mode -- one that is truly open only.

Problem solvedd == everybody is happy.

Maybe you will get it after iron man is implemented. Surely you would not demand that new not promised game modes should take priority over the ones which were advertised?

I really hope all the anti switching people have learned a lesson from all this...... Do your homework before buying a product to make sure it actually is something you want before handing over money .

If you think this thread is full of whiners now I promise it would be worse if FD blocked Möbius players from playing with their mates in ALL from time to time.

Or stopped ALL players from playing full stop when they were not at home on good internet

 

[CMDR Croup]

Here's a new player's perspective. I joined less than a week ago, and have been doing some basic trading to start my career as a CMDR. When I first logged in I didn't really realize what the difference was between open and solo, or that you could freely switch between the two.

After grinding trades for about 4 days, I had enough credits together for a Lakon Type-6. Loaded her with cargo and went on the maiden voyage, only to be interdicted and destroyed by another CMDR. His interdiction module must have been a high level, because he pulled me out of supercruise in about 3-4 seconds, and then proceeded to fire on me immediately. I lasted 2 or 3 volleys, it was over in less than 10 seconds. I never even managed to see what ship he was flying, or try to bargain with him. He was only the 3rd human CMDR I've met so far in the game.

The loss of the cargo meant I was back to around 150k credits, and after that experience I got pretty frustrated and logged off for the night. Today I researched the difference between open and solo play, and I think I'll be sticking to solo for the foreseeable future. It's not that I mind PvP, or that I want to be cuddled (I've played EVE for several years and enjoyed PVP there quite a bit), but I'd like a chance to learn and build my way up to some nice hardware without being blown up by far more experienced pilots in much bigger ships.

[Edit]: Thinking about it, the way EVE has security rated systems, with safe(ish), not so safe, and free-for-all areas seems like a great approach. It seems weird for me that you can open fire on another player in a system that has security patrols, etc, without any real consequence to your reputation, ship or wallet. It's like every system is the E: D equivalent of null-sec, and there's no place to go and be safe and learn, unless you isolate yourself in solo mode. I like the MMO aspect of the game, I like interacting with other players, but it's a little brutal that there's no "beginner" area or safe harbor of any kind in E: D.

TL;DR: Solo mode is nice for newbies, and I wish I'd figured that out before being set back so severely.

 

[Elprez]

Here's a new player's perspective. I joined less than a week ago, and have been doing some basic trading to start my career as a CMDR. When I first logged in I didn't really realize what the difference was between open and solo, or that you could freely switch between the two.

After grinding trades for about 4 days, I had enough credits together for a Lakon Type-6. Loaded her with cargo and went on the maiden voyage, only to be interdicted and destroyed by another CMDR. His interdiction module must have been a high level, because he pulled me out of supercruise in about 3-4 seconds, and then proceeded to fire on me immediately. I lasted 2 or 3 volleys, it was over in less than 10 seconds. I never even managed to see what ship he was flying, or try to bargain with him. He was only the 3rd human CMDR I've met so far in the game.

The loss of the cargo meant I was back to around 150k credits, and after that experience I got pretty frustrated and logged off for the night. Today I researched the difference between open and solo play, and I think I'll be sticking to solo for the foreseeable future. It's not that I mind PvP, or that I want to be cuddled (I've played EVE for several years and enjoyed PVP there quite a bit), but I'd like a chance to learn and build my way up to some nice hardware without being blown up by far more experienced pilots in much bigger ships.

[Edit]: Thinking about it, the way EVE has security rated systems, with safe(ish), not so safe, and free-for-all areas seems like a great approach. It seems weird for me that you can open fire on another player in a system that has security patrols, etc, without any real consequence to your reputation, ship or wallet. It's like every system is the E: D equivalent of null-sec, and there's no place to go and be safe and learn, unless you isolate yourself in solo mode. I like the MMO aspect of the game, I like interacting with other players, but it's a little brutal that there's no "beginner" area or safe harbor of any kind in E: D.

TL;DR: Solo mode is nice for newbies, and I wish I'd figured that out before being set back so severely.

Same thing happened to me. I wasn't as far along as you. Switched to solo once I understood a bit better. Making a player aggressively wanted when that happens should be immediate. They should not be able to remove that status or pay a fine for a long period of time. When I accidentally hit another player during a dog fight I immediately get attacked by the feds and the station if I try to go there.

 

[purf]

[Edit]: Thinking about it, the way EVE has security rated systems, with safe(ish), not so safe, and free-for-all areas seems like a great approach. It seems weird for me that you can open fire on another player in a system that has security patrols, etc, without any real consequence to your reputation, ship or wallet. It's like every system is the E: D equivalent of null-sec, and there's no place to go and be safe and learn, unless you isolate yourself in solo mode. I like the MMO aspect of the game, I like interacting with other players, but it's a little brutal that there's no "beginner" area or safe harbor of any kind in E: D.

My time with EVE is long ago, just being curious: How IS security handled these days? IIRC, attacking another player in 1.0 Hi-Sec (bar some exceptions like being in a war) was a death sentence executed immediately. Has this changed? Anyways, I agree. I wouldn't like Elite's security to become CONCORD but some resemblance between a system's security rating and actions and consequences throughout all modes of playing (PvP, PvE, PvPvE) is def. needed.

 

[ViciousMink]

My time with EVE is long ago, just being curious: How IS security handled these days? IIRC, attacking another player in 1.0 Hi-Sec (bar some exceptions like being in a war) was a death sentence executed immediately. Has this changed? Anyways, I agree. I wouldn't like Elite's security to become CONCORD but some resemblance between a system's security rating and actions and consequences throughout all modes of playing (PvP, PvE, PvPvE) is def. needed.

I played about a year ago, and basically while CONCORD shows up within seconds in high-sec (1.0-0.8 or so) that's ceased to be a concern because the new hotness now is kamikazi destroyers and battlecruisers. Alts funded by bored nullsec players hang out in highsec and buy cheap destroyers and battlecruisers, and gang up on miners, cargo haulers, etc. They get blown up by CONCORD, but their target usually gets blown up as well. Trading a gang of cheap destroyers for an Orca or entire mining op? It's a net gain for the gankers.

 

[Traven Mayhem]

I think that is at the heart of the matter. An anarchy isn't scary for law abiding citizens, and patrolled high security zones aren't scary for outlaws.

If a respectable trader could stick to high security zones and be relatively safe, and pirates could do the same in anarchies this would be less of an issue.

This. The cops are a joke.

I have a 300k bounty and float around alliance space all day without a single care. The only thing I worry about is other players (BH's) who are generally the targets I'm looking for.

Either cops need more teeth, or trading vessels do.