Open world adventure? Cutthroat galaxy?

[__triumph__]

I'm a bit confused by the game. Is it trying to be a theme park on the Serengeti? Or is it to be a universe?

In theme park games, we all know the ones with the title of MMO this or that, there is the concept of end game content but here there isn't any of that which I can see. But in a game like this isn't what is typically thought of as end game content to be just game content because of it being a full fledged sim experience rather than an off rails pioneer-town, state park or pirate ship get away.

To my experience with Elite:
Tried it early on, liked the sweet core flight play and waited for release. Jumped into the game recently because I don't need the day 1 bugs and issues frustrations in my life.
I like to explore the developers vision and not the UI of my preferred browser of the day and a support ticket system.

I've learned the game with a couple of friends and after doing that there was no point to play with friends anymore. After the intial wow factor of the games impressive visuals, off the rail learning curve and fun flight/combat model is gone there's nothing to do but more of the same in what feels like gamings biggest themepark instead of a full on universe. I don't understand why the potential for greater depth, risk, and reward is shattered for online, open play when the current game play standard is fine for offline play and perfect for people who are risk adverse or in need of more relaxing, possibly co-op and lan game play.

Here is an excerpt from a bullet point review I wrote for clan mates who have been playing space, mmo, and some sim titles for at least 15 years now:

Feels like I am grinding mini games forever instead of interacting with a persistent universe just to obtain new ships, gear, and maybe a rank with a faction to gain a ship.

Lack of content for ships and end game – I understand that this is WIP and I appreciate what is coming down the line but after a couple of weeks playing about 3-4 hours a day and grabbing X million credits worth of ship and items I am feeling like I’ve done a huge chunk of the game.

Online play feels like an after thought, there is not a great reason play. Attempts at profit are easily foiled unless one considers profiting the chance to feel like prey or to scare the cluessless.

Open PvP feels like a poorly thought out RPG style random chance to find a battle meets death match.

Piracy is not yet viable. Even if the player does drop the cargo it’s not even worth the time it takes to scoop it up. Yar; this be disheartening to have not a reason to disheart, yarrr.

Basically, after two weeks of play and trying everything I can get my hands on I can't find anything to do after playing some minigames.
After about 12 hours I had no reason to be in a group or do anything with people.
I don't see why a something-for-everyone approach to making money for this game isn't being used. It's like there's only a chunk of game here and HUGE potential for more.
I thought with this scale there would be a significant level of economic simulation there would be some aspect of sim farm, sim trucker to grow sim farm or take the farm to market, some sim giant space ant to be destroyed on sim farm, then more sim trucker to take sim farm to sim factory with angry pirates along the way because my farm sim is doing something not so positive to them. Then this would plug into propelling possible adventure even for people who want nothing to do with the farm. But right now there is only sim trucker, a man vs environment adventure experience with many ways to negate the environment and a very disconnected defend the farm aspect. There is nothing to grow, I don't know of any natives to fear so it seems there isn't pioneering in the going to the great american west sense nor a search for the indies due to, again, a lack of natives, there are no real strategic objectives. And because of this there is nothing on the smaller, tactical scale that is well defined like being hired to throw torpedoes at a place of front line assembly in a war torn system. There just isn't a universe here, just an infinite sphere safari and a couple of mini games involving lasers and/or rail guns.

I'm not 100 percent on what the developers vision is but I have to tell my friends to wait and see for another year before purchase because they can get a similar experience from an X steam sale less for than 5 dollars.
Wait and see; That's not exactly something I want to say about a modern game that has gone into full release.

In short I am bummed; The games many high points fade quickly as the joy of learning expires and I find an incomplete title.

 

[iLOVEwindmills]

Yep pretty much.

Aside from needing content pretty badly, it's clear that after that we need deeper lategame mechanics to keep things interesting in the long run.

 

[RuleV]

I agree with much of what you say (endless mini games, for example), but I do think that there's enough people doing things with other people, in groups or open to suggest that there are reasons to fly with friends either regularly or on a more casual bases.

Flipping factions is a good example of that.

I don't do it, you may not do it either, but there is one example of a reason to do it.

I still want to see more, I hope to see more and I still believe that there will be more, which is why I'm still playing.

Your mileage may vary.

 

[CMDR AKIRA MASAKARI]

Elite is a sandbox game. I agree that it needs more content in general but the dev are adding it quite steady. Then, in a sandbox, it all depends if you can immerse into it or not. If you can immerse and roleplay, you don't need to find motivations, you are inside the Virtual Reality and your character lives there. If you can't immerse, then it looks like grind.

Not saying that what you say is absurd, i just think there's a huge personal taste component involved.

I remeber few years ago people lamenting Skyrim was souless grind feast "You just fast travel between two markers, kill a bunch of enemies, rinse and repeat", while many other players were spending dozen hours just hunting deers and collecting flowers. Wich was right? Neither and both.

Usually when i start to seek activities to do in a videogame and they don't come out themselves, it means that game is not for me or i am burned with it.

 

[DirtGambit]

Cue the fanboys "it is what you make it" "devs are still planning more content" "typical hater" "its the game the devs want us to play" "go try exploring" "go try be a bounty hunter" "its a universe, plenty of stuff to do" "your just annoyed because the game is so big".

I totally understand where the OP is coming from, from my own experience, I thought the game was amazing at first, then I went through a "game has nothing to do phase", now im back and im liking it again, im not loving it but its not bad after the countless grinding I have done I now only do assassination missions, doesn't fill my bank with credits but im having more fun, but even those can get grindy. my friend has just come back from sag A, so we are going to try out wings, I just hope frontier has put some thought into missions with wings as if not then being in a wing will be a bit of a let down, if im in a wing with 3 people I expect 3 condas, not the usual 1 from assassination or 3 from a strong signal source.

Try mixing up what you do in game, but even if you do that you'll still hit a wall at some point, maybe the devs are planning more to do in game, maybe the next update will be the one that does that, maybe not, but for now ill keep playing my own way, not for credits but for fun, it makes this game bearable in the long term.

 

[CMDR AKIRA MASAKARI]

Cue the fanboys "it is what you make it" "devs are still planning more content" "typical hater" "its the game the devs want us to play" "go try exploring" "go try be a bounty hunter" "its a universe, plenty of stuff to do" "your just annoyed because the game is so big". SNIP

Well, there's not yet such a reply to this thread.
Fanboys or people that enjoys the game and have constructive criticism? This forum seems to be composed from pretty polite people that are sick of general mindless internet hate. Fanboy or not, it's a good relaxing place, expecilly if you come from Steam forums.

 

[CMDR Holycow]

ED is a sandbox... but the sandbox is mostly void of sand. There is some... there's a little scooped up in that corner... a little thrown about over there... and a cat took a turd on that sand over there on the side... But all in all, it's a sandbox with very little sand.



On a serious note, even those of us that love this game and can't resist logging in and doing my best to do stuff night after night, will clearly and openly admit that there isn't actually any real content. Right now it's either A) explore to try and see some cool stuff (i.e. black holes), or B) a grind of some kind to get into a better ship, whether it be killing NPCs or Trading (I think some people mine too.. somewhere)

 

[Kancro Vantas]

ED is a sandbox... but the sandbox is mostly void of sand. There is some... there's a little scooped up in that corner... a little thrown about over there... and a cat took a turd on that sand over there on the side... But all in all, it's a sandbox with very little sand.

View attachment 29840

On a serious note, even those of us that love this game and can't resist logging in and doing my best to do stuff night after night, will clearly and openly admit that there isn't actually any real content. Right now it's either A) explore to try and see some cool stuff (i.e. black holes), or B) a grind of some kind to get into a better ship, whether it be killing NPCs or Trading (I think some people mine too.. somewhere)

Hey!! I even try mining!! Watch it!

Don't want to waste the sand around the cat's turd...would you?

Geez..wasting sand...pfft..

 

[Ghanji]

maybe they turn the corner with 1.3, otherwise i´m quite done cause it feels like i´ve already experienced pretty much everything the game has to offer...

 

[theriverlethe]

Pffft... You haven't lived until you've accidentally smacked the dorsal side of a Fer-de-Lance into an asteroid.

 

[Whiterose]

ED is a sandbox... but the sandbox is mostly void of sand. There is some... there's a little scooped up in that corner... a little thrown about over there... and a cat took a turd on that sand over there on the side... But all in all, it's a sandbox with very little sand.

View attachment 29840

On a serious note, even those of us that love this game and can't resist logging in and doing my best to do stuff night after night, will clearly and openly admit that there isn't actually any real content. Right now it's either A) explore to try and see some cool stuff (i.e. black holes), or B) a grind of some kind to get into a better ship, whether it be killing NPCs or Trading (I think some people mine too.. somewhere)

lol, I am going from one end of the sands box to the other to keep me amused, avoiding cat turds, I lost a lot of hull due to a neutron turd, cant see any of those, but there are loads of black holes in your sand box....

 

[__triumph__]

Flipping factions is a good example of that.

One more thing to do in the theme park....
....without the mechanics to bring everything together as a simulation.

If you can immerse and roleplay

Game design has to drive that by allowing the player to be part of a fully fledged simulation. The game is responsible for keeping engagement and suspending disbelief. When a player realizes that they're sitting there, completely unable to obtain flow then the experience is something completely different and it's no longer a game in the game sense rather what I described above, something like a tourist trap or merely a toy. There is a big difference between a toy and a game. Also levels of toy and game within the space.

So far what I see here, in the forum are excuses for a lack of simulation. Simulation which approaches the implicit core goals of game design and virtual reality.
e-honor, meta rules, playing house with imagination, it's all steps backwards and it's fooling oneself trying to remove responsibility, if any, from what is there. That youthful stuff is silly and not remotely relevant in this context.


I'll follow up my original post,

Lets look at the sell and quietly think about a triangle of narrative, game, and simulation:

take control of your own starship in a cutthroat galaxy.

CHeck and this from what i have seen will become better with time. That's well and good.
Then we have the word cutthroat; (of a competitive situation or activity) fierce and intense; involving the use of ruthless measures.
It also implies murder. For this part some game play mechanics that are there need adjustment so the experience is cutthroat and not just somewhat punishing when inexperienced.
But for the previous point there isn't enough simulation to deliver. Just core game.

Elite: Dangerous brings gaming’s original open world adventure into the modern generation with a connected galaxy

I argue this is not a check as it's not fully there and what is there is perhaps not well balanced.

evolving narrative

I'm not sure about this one due to a lack of sim in critical areas to drive deep game play and narrative.

and the entirety of the Milky Way re-created at its full galactic proportions.

Check for sight seeing. My point about the sim aspect leaves the scale devoid of meaning.


This is the steam pitch broken down after moderate play. For a game advertising huge scale I feel like I am putting another pop culture game to bed. That's not the most positive experience.

 

[SteveLaw]

I'm not disagreeing with a lot of your points but it's a sad day when imagination is seen as a step backwards. When the onus is on others to engage your own creativity. Which came first I wonder, the need to have your imagination fed by others or the inability to do it yourself?

 

[__triumph__]

There is imagination and creativity in figuring out the game and the aspects of game within a rich simulation. I shouldn't have to play make believe LARP style when I am buying a computer game that is explicitly being a game rather than a toy or something like an engineering sim such as those bridge building titles. Having to onto X amount of forums to find 8 other people to all jump into an instance and the say none of us will warp out, and so on and so on for a fight means the systems, design, mechanics and so on are an utter failure in some way. Now if I wanted that experience I could crack open a book about battlefleet gothic, use the webcam for something other than spinning right round on a lonely evening, and find a skype willing group RPGs like that.

 

[Cowboy Bats]

First post and so many buzz-words.

Risk vs reward
theme park
risk adverse
sim trucker



I smell the same tired propaganda.

 

[Cosmos]

Elite is a sandbox game. I agree that it needs more content in general but the dev are adding it quite steady. Then, in a sandbox, it all depends if you can immerse into it or not. If you can immerse and roleplay, you don't need to find motivations, you are inside the Virtual Reality and your character lives there. If you can't immerse, then it looks like grind.

Not saying that what you say is absurd, i just think there's a huge personal taste component involved.

I remeber few years ago people lamenting Skyrim was souless grind feast "You just fast travel between two markers, kill a bunch of enemies, rinse and repeat", while many other players were spending dozen hours just hunting deers and collecting flowers. Wich was right? Neither and both.

Usually when i start to seek activities to do in a videogame and they don't come out themselves, it means that game is not for me or i am burned with it.

At best its presently an open world game, I wouldnt call it a sandbox unfortunately.

 

[Blackfoxx]

and yet there are many who can immerse quite nicely into the game, engage is a spot of role playing, have great fun on a weekend flying in various wings, or simply do as I am doing right now and go exploring.

Yes there is much to do with adding new content in, and i'm sure Frontier Developments have many ideas both of their own and from some of the awesome ideas commmonly found on these very forums.. but to add the content takes not just coding time, but coexistence testing with existing code and features too. Sometimes something new does break other things.. or creates exploits that were not spotted during a development phase.

I do agree more content by way of storyline is needed, some nice narrative , some Alien races to contend with and crafting.. oh yes crafting (perhaps once we can walk around on stations or planets). For now though, i'm quite content with what is here now after only a few short months since release.. some games that most people loved were out for 5 years before they became fully rounded titles.. and i'm sure ED will shape up just nicely.

 

[AndyC77]

I'm not disagreeing with a lot of your points but it's a sad day when imagination is seen as a step backwards. When the onus is on others to engage your own creativity. Which came first I wonder, the need to have your imagination fed by others or the inability to do it yourself?

I think imagination is important in all games. Even content rich games like GTA 5. People spend hours just walking around looking at the world and some others won't like it. I think its important to reengage your imagination sometimes.

 

[Smugallo]

I think imagination is important in all games. Even content rich games like GTA 5. People spend hours just walking around looking at the world and some others won't like it. I think its important to reengage your imagination and as a mature gamer I'm glad I can do that.

Are you insinuating that those who can't use their imaginations are immature gamers? C'mon. Please, I'd love to hear an example of how to use your imagination to enhance the game, because I'd love to give it a try. Should i just imagine that RES farming doesn't exists, maybe imagine a few different types of station other than the 5 that we have?

 

[AndyC77]

Are you insinuating that those who can't use their imaginations are immature gamers? C'mon. Please, I'd love to hear an example of how to use your imagination to enhance the game, because I'd love to give it a try. Should i just imagine that RES farming doesn't exists, maybe imagine a few different types of station other than the 5 that we have?

There no need to find things in my post that aren't there. There is no insinuation intended at all just take my post at face value, it is totally inoccent.

Right I see how you came to that conclusion now. It wasn't ment that way just poorly executed.

I have edited it so others don't get the wrong idea.