Shield Cell Bank Limit

[charognard]

Well, if you feel the need to explain yourself... I don't mind listening a little more.



War fitted Python is not a Twingo, yet it becomes one versus a similar Python with equal amount of skill on the table and double the amount of cells for the latter ship. Some people happen to disagree with the notion (such is life) and propose to broaden the array of available tools and to re-adjust existing ones.

For the record, a Twingo with RPG has a fairly good chance against a tank.

Against an humvy yes, a tank no

The war fitted python is the tank... And against an another well fitted python or fdl, it'll be a great fight. You and all supporters of change, you'd better stop dreaming, and begin to learn playing with actual mecanics and aviable stuff.

Don't forget weapons are importants too ! Weapons fitt and usage make a lot of differences in a battle too.

 

[Moriarte]

Against an humvy yes, a tank no

The war fitted python is the tank... And against an another well fitted python or fdl, it'll be a great fight. You and all supporters of change, you'd better stop dreaming, and begin to learn playing with actual mecanics and aviable stuff.

Don't forget weapons are importants too ! Weapons fitt and usage make a lot of differences in a battle too.

Available stuff is the past, man. Future is coming.

 

[lonewarrior]

Against an humvy yes, a tank no

The war fitted python is the tank... And against an another well fitted python or fdl, it'll be a great fight. You and all supporters of change, you'd better stop dreaming, and begin to learn playing with actual mecanics and aviable stuff.

Don't forget weapons are importants too ! Weapons fitt and usage make a lot of differences in a battle too.

Thats why I've suggested weapon over chargers as a utility item, if they did:
20% increase In energy weapon damage (at A grade weapon booster), 10% increases heat generation
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Now imagine someone in a python with 4 of those, or maybe 3 and heat sinks,
Thats the opposite end of the spectrum and It would be able to deal so much damage that it would easily best normal shields but against a ship with SCB and shield boosters it would even the playing field but at a great cost to your own shields,
Thats just an example of how to balance it, it has nothing to do with my ability or anyone's to take down shields, it's solely so that people can have a vastly different choice of loadout, something completely different to spamming shield cells (although they still can, without boosters their overall shields are weaker anyway)

 

[persephonius]

But there I'd suggest you highlight another issue.... "Re-consider your load-out if you are having trouble stripping shields".

So let's take your point and assume you adjust your layout to specifically deal as much damage to shields as possible to overcome our CMDR with five SCBs in his ship... Can you not see the problem with that? You're basically saying, unless you happen to have brought the right tool(s) to the fight, hard luck! So rather than combat being a test/demonstration of skill, it comes more down to, did you happen to bring the right tools to the fight, mostly by chance.

Now of course this is somewhat true of many factors of combat in ED, ie: did you stock a Point Defense if someone else has missiles etc etc, BUT, given most ships have say 2-4 hard points, equipping them in one fashion or another, has a huge factor on the combat viability of your ship.

In short, are you suggesting we should all fit weapons based upon we come across Mr Belly Full Of SCBs? And instead not equip our ships in a more traditional manner based on our fighting style/preference?



So I'll make my SCB suggestion again, as I think its fitting in this topic. If SCBs permitted just 1-3(?) uses (depending on SCB module size) within several minutes, with for example small ships only having one use, and large ships have a max of 3(?), this then means people are less tool dependent because SCBs become less effective (ie: you can't use them over and over, minute after minute). In short, you're less likely to come to a fight and simply find out, doh, I need to go back to the station and re-equip because this guy has setup (A) rather than (B).

No it is not hard luck. Picking your correct load-out for what you want to achieve is half the battle. Why would you pick a fight with an anaconda with lots of SCB(s) when you are in a viper with multi-cannons? You are not equipped for that, pick another target. Another important point here is you are not forced to engage a particular ship, unless they engage you. If you are engaged by a python or an Anaconda and you can determine that you are not equipped for this fight, it is very easy to flee from these two ships.
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So, no, my point is, if it is your intention to take out a mr-belly full of SCB(s), equip yourself appropriately. If you are not equipped for this, why are you attempting to fight them? Most of this discussion is centred on the weird idea that you must fight one of these ships?
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Again, this game is not a call of duty clone. If you have no experience in MMO's, that is also not my problem. Meta gaming that consists of theory-crafting and rigorous in game testing of mechanics and modules is very much apart of elite dangerous, and this is a skill of its own.
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My conclusion is, know what targets you are aiming for, equip appropriately for those targets, and pick on those guys. If a target engages you that outclasses you in whatever way... run!
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Edit* I spent a lot of time compiling my thoughts in that other thread of yours Neilf after you asked me to a few days ago, and yet you have not responded to that yet? Did I just waste my time?

 

[Dkiki]

To spice it up, here is the latest from the SCB master, Z4Mafia:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rNx2-HOfEQ[/QUOTE]


now, now.... rly ? no offence but that vulture it's a joke, i could have draw circles around him, this is the first time that i saw a vulture charging straight ahead like this... you'r not in an phyton dude!!!
back to topic :why you guys are so afraid of the scb ? i use multiple and is not really nice but one fix to that will be to put some recharge time after you activated before using it... i think...

 

[NeilF]

No it is not hard luck. Picking your correct load-out for what you want to achieve is half the battle. Why would pick a fight with an anaconda with lots of SCB(s) when you are in a viper with multi-cannons? You are not equipped for that, pick another target. Another important point here is you are not forced to engage a particular ship, unless they engage you. If you are engaged by a python or an Anaconda and you can determine that you are not equipped for this fight, it is very easy to flee from these two ships.
.
So, no, my point is, if it is your intention to take out a mr-belly full of SCB(s), equip yourself appropriately. If you are not equipped for this, why are you attempting to fight them? Most of this discussion is centred on the weird idea that you must fight one of these ships?
.
Again, this game is not a call of duty clone. If you have no experience in MMO's, that is also not my problem. Meta gaming that consists of theory-crafting and rigorous in game testing of mechanics and modules is very much apart of elite dangerous, and this is a skill of its own.
.
My conclusion is, know what targets you are aiming for, equip appropriately for those targets, and pick on those guys. If a target engages you that outclasses you in whatever way... run!

Sorry, simply cannot agree. I see clear issues with the current mechanic...

So with the risk of repeating myself let's take some examples:-
1) A CMDR in a Python fights a CMDR in another similar Python. One has 5 SCBs the other 2. Which one immediate has a big advantage? Why should this mindless approach be a good thing? Surely piling SCBS into your ships shouldn't ideally be a defacto standard?
2) A CMDR in a Python fights a CMDR in another Python. Both have 5 SCBs. However one hasn't been to a station today so only has 1 ammo left. Which one immediate has a big advantage? Why should a possibly interesting encounter be "spoiled" because of pointless ammo?


Now let's take those scenarios reworked with my SCB proposal - https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=150794
1) A CMDR in a Python fights a CMDR in another similar Python:-

- They both have Large SCB modules so both have identical 3 charges to shields. How is this a bad thing? Now other factors are more important. SCBs are now a tactical tool, rather than possibly a outcome decider.
- One has a Large SCB module, but the other has decided to use a Small SCB module. The CMDR with the Small SCB module selected that module so he has more energy availble to other modules. Surely this (intelligence/variety in outfitting) is a good thing?​

2) As my proposal does not use ammo, both CMDRs come to the battlefield on even terms (ie: 3 charges). Surely this is a good thing?


So I'm just having problems seeing how there's any good point to the current mechanics, that either isn't the same, or better in my proposal. I'm more than happy for it to be pointed out as I certainly do not pretend to be an expert

 

[charognard]

Sorry, simply cannot agree. I see clear issues with the current mechanic...

So with the risk of repeating myself let's take some examples:-
1) A CMDR in a Python fights a CMDR in another similar Python. One has 5 SCBs the other 2. Which one immediate has a big advantage? Why should this mindless approach be a good thing? Surely piling SCBS into your ships shouldn't ideally be a defacto standard?
2) A CMDR in a Python fights a CMDR in another Python. Both have 5 SCBs. However one hasn't been to a station today so only has 1 ammo left. Which one immediate has a big advantage? Why should a possibly interesting encounter be "spoiled" because of pointless ammo?


Now let's take those scenarios reworked with my SCB proposal - https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=150794
1) A CMDR in a Python fights a CMDR in another similar Python:-

- They both have Large SCB modules so both have identical 3 charges to shields. How is this a bad thing? Now other factors are more important. SCBs are now a tactical tool, rather than possibly a outcome decider.
- One has a Large SCB module, but the other has decided to use a Small SCB module. The CMDR with the Small SCB module selected that module so he has more energy availble to other modules. Surely this (intelligence/variety in outfitting) is a good thing?​

2) As my proposal does not use ammo, both CMDRs come to the battlefield on even terms (ie: 3 charges). Surely this is a good thing?


So I'm just having problems seeing how there's any good point to the current mechanics, that either isn't the same, or better in my proposal. I'm more than happy for it to be pointed out as I certainly do not pretend to be an expert

Neilf have u ever go in pvp yourself ???
Really man, 1 at 3 scb charges wont make the difference on the most skilled pilot. WTH a guys will fly with empty SCB module ???
In your second exemple, running with 2 SCB is a choice of the pilot, a wrong choice if he's here in order to pvp. With great skill, he can win, but yes it'd be difficult... And ????
The game design allowing you to break the battle WHEN YOU WANT / NEED, well really no problems...

 

[persephonius]

Sorry, simply cannot agree. I see clear issues with the current mechanic...

So with the risk of repeating myself let's take some examples:-
1) A CMDR in a Python fights a CMDR in another similar Python. One has 5 SCBs the other 2. Which one immediate has a big advantage? Why should this mindless approach be a good thing? Surely piling SCBS into your ships shouldn't ideally be a defacto standard?
2) A CMDR in a Python fights a CMDR in another Python. Both have 5 SCBs. However one hasn't been to a station today so only has 1 ammo left. Which one immediate has a big advantage? Why should a possibly interesting encounter be "spoiled" because of pointless ammo?


Now let's take those scenarios reworked with my SCB proposal - https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=150794
1) A CMDR in a Python fights a CMDR in another similar Python:-

- They both have Large SCB modules so both have identical 3 charges to shields. How is this a bad thing? Now other factors are more important. SCBs are now a tactical tool, rather than possibly a outcome decider.
- One has a Large SCB module, but the other has decided to use a Small SCB module. The CMDR with the Small SCB module selected that module so he has more energy availble to other modules. Surely this (intelligence/variety in outfitting) is a good thing?​

2) As my proposal does not use ammo, both CMDRs come to the battlefield on even terms (ie: 3 charges). Surely this is a good thing?


So I'm just having problems seeing how there's any good point to the current mechanics, that either isn't the same, or better in my proposal. I'm more than happy for it to be pointed out as I certainly do not pretend to be an expert

To be honest, the python with the fewer shield cell banks will have the edge. I am not saying this for the sake of my argument either. The python is a very effective gunboat as well, taking fewer shield cell banks and only have one active at a time frees up a lot of energy for higher damage weapons. But equipped as a gunboat, it is most suitable against larger targets, like other pythons. A python equipped for maximum burst dps will chew through another python that has best shields, 4 shield boosters and lots of shield cell banks.
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Edit* Bursting through shield cell banks is also a trick in itself and it not just, tunnel vision max dps! If you are equipped for max burst damage, you will not sustain your weapons for long. The trick is to bring the shields down of your target slowly at first, and not waste all your energy. When you see that the target has initiated a SCB, this is when you put the hammer down and give it all you have. Bursting through the SCB recharge time is key. I think some people make the mistake of attempting to burst through shields right of the bat, then have little energy left when a SCB charge is used.

 

[NeilF]

To be honest, the python with the fewer shield cell banks will have the edge. I am not saying this for the sake of my argument either. The python is a very effective gunboat as well, taking fewer shield cell banks and only have one active at a time frees up a lot of energy for higher damage weapons. But equipped as a gunboat, it is most suitable against larger targets, like other pythons. A python equipped for maximum burst dps will chew through another python that has best shields, 4 shield boosters and lots of shield cell banks.

I'd suggest your statement/example is actually wrong. In your statement, both players actually have the same SCB unit to hand/powered really. They are both using the same energy too really. It's just that one CMDR has additional SCB units to hand which he can bring online to continue (mindlessly) charging his shields up over and over and over long after the opponent's SCB has run out. So no, one does not have an energy advantage for having less SCBs IMHO. The clear advantage IMHO is with the CMDR who simply throws as many SCBs in his ship as possible. And bizarely there is really little disavantage for even doing so.


And note your comment requires someone happening to turn up to a fight with just the right tools for the job (again) - "equipped for maximum burst dps". As someone else pointed out/suggested, SCBs should not be a game decider, they should just be a tool. In your scenario you seem to be suggesting (yet again) we need to turn up to fight people with a belly full of SCBs with the right tools. That is just wrong IMHO. It limits the game rather than opening it up.



Anyway, I've tried using some specific examples to try and work out what your problem is with my proposal... If you won't comment on their pro's / con's there's not really a lot I can do/say

If you're happy a CMDR mindlessly bringing a dozen SBC charges to combat should have such a notable effect/advantage on combat, fine. IMHO, if CMDRs instead had a limited more technically challenging/intelligent use of SBCs, it would be a step in the right direction. SBCs should augment combat, not decide it.

 

[Moriarte]

Neilf have u ever go in pvp yourself ???
Really man, 1 at 3 scb charges wont make the difference on the most skilled pilot. WTH a guys will fly with empty SCB module ???
In your second exemple, running with 2 SCB is a choice of the pilot, a wrong choice if he's here in order to pvp. With great skill, he can win, but yes it'd be difficult... And ????
The game design allowing you to break the battle WHEN YOU WANT / NEED, well really no problems...

Drop the condescension. I am playing since May last year, while Neil has been around even longer than that. While you look like you joined this place last October... I've flown all ships, took part in 10+ people PvP battles and personally killed 100 'ish players. Never died to another commander, though was close a few times.

Lets talk about ideas, not your perceptions of us, please.

 

[charognard]

Neilf, in all situation, you need the right tool to make the right job, in elite, in life... If you want put a nail, you need a hammer, not an flat iron... You want figth you need scb... I think we'll never be alright

- - - Updated - - -

Drop the condescension. I am playing since May last year, while Neil has been around even longer than that. While you look like you joined this place last October... I've flown all ships, took part in 10+ people PvP battles and personally killed 100 'ish players. Never died to another commander, though was close a few times.

Lets talk about ideas, not your perceptions of us, please.

Joining beta 2 in july mate i don't need justify myself like you, i think neilf scb redesign is bad and i explain why i think it.

 

[persephonius]

So, basically, you won't comment on my proposed alternatives (to give real world points of reference) under any circumstances then...


And note you're point/example requires someone happening to turn up to a fight with just the right tools for the job (again). As someone else pointed out/suggested, SCBs should not be a game decider, they should just be a tool. In your scenario you seem to be suggesting (yet again) we need to turn up to fight people with a belly full of SCBs with the right tools. That is just wrong IMHO. It limits the game rather than opening it up.

Secondly I'd suggest your statement/example is actually wrong. In your statement, both players actually have the same SCB unit to hand/powered really. They are both using the same energy too really. It's just that one CMDR has additional SCB units to hand which he can bring online to continue (mindlessly) charging his shields up over and over and over long after the opponents SCB has run out. So no, one does not have an energy advantage for having less SCBs IMHO. The clear advantage IMHO is with the CMDR who simply throws as many SCBs in his ship as possible.


Anyway, I've tried using some specific examples to try and work out what your problem is with my proposal... If you won't comment on their pro's / con's there's not really a lot I can do/say

If you're happy a CMDR mindlessly bringing a dozen SBC charges to combat should have such a notable effect/advantage on combat, fine. IMHO. If CMDRs instead had a limited more technically challenging/intelligent use of SBCs, it would be a step in the right direction. SBCs should augment combat, not decide it.

No, in a python, you really need 2 active SCB at the same time to get a full recharge of triple or quadruple boosted shields, which would likely be 1 A6 and 1 A5 SCB. A gunboat python will probably only have 1 A5 SCB active at any time, the power differences of these two configurations is significant.
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This game is an MMO, and every MMO I have played, I have had to consider my gearing very carefully for both PvP and PvE. In PvE 'raids", if you tank, setting up for the correct damage mitigation against the attacks types of a particular boss requires lot of work outside the game for example. Like I said, this isn't some run of the mill first person shooter where you can just jump in mindlessly at any time and have a blast without needing to think about what to wear.

 

[NeilF]

No, in a python, you really need 2 active SCB at the same time to get a full recharge of triple or quadruple boosted shields, which would likely be 1 A6 and 1 A5 SCB. A gunboat python will probably only have 1 A5 SCB active at any time, the power differences of these two configurations is significant.

Consider these two Pythons then:-
A) One A6 and One A5 SCB.
B) One A6 and One A5 SCB + as many other SCBs as will fit in the empty module slots.

Are you suggesing:-
- (A) has some power advantage over (B)? I'd suggest contrary, (B) at worst is running the same power load, or indeed (when bringing smaller SCBs on) less?!
- (B) cannot throw numerous more SCB charges into the shields compared to (A), long after (A) has run out?

Again I fail to see how (B) is at anything other than an advantage for (mindlessly) filling his belly with SCBs? The only difference is weight, which I'd suggest is minor.



And again, are you able to explain how the above combat would not be improved by my proposal?:-
1) (A) & (B) both have 3 charges from their SCB. ie: More SCBs does not come into play so it's the pilots skill/timing hopefully!
2) (A) having less charges than (B) by choosing a smaller SBC module, but doing this so they actually having more energy to use elsewhere. ie: A tactical intelligent decision/choice!
3) No SCB ammo involved anywhere.
4) NPCs will have the same load outs as CMDRs. At the moment you will not see NPC belly filling SBC I suspect because of how lame it is.

 

[persephonius]

Consider these two Pythons then:-
A) One A6 and One A5 SCB.
B) One A6 and One A5 SCB + as many other SCBs as will fit in the empty module slots.

Are you suggesing:-
- (A) has some power advantage over (B)? I'd suggest contrary, (B) at worst is running the same power load, or indeed (when bringing smaller SCBs on) less?!
- (B) cannot throw numerous more SCB charges into the shields compared to (A), long after (A) has run out?

Again I fail to see how (B) is at anything other than an advantage for (mindlessly) filling his belly with SCBs? The only difference is weight, which I'd suggest is minor.



And again, are you able to explain how the above combat would not be improved by my proposal:-
1) (A) & (B) both have 3 charges from their SCB. ie: More SCBs does not come into play so it's the pilots skill/timing hopefully!
2) (A) having less charges than (B) by choosing a small SBC module, but doing this so they actually having more energy to use elsewhere. ie: A tactical decision!
3) No SCB ammo involved anywhere.

That is not what I said at all. In your scenario, A and B both have the same active shield cell banks. What I said is that a triple or quadruple boosted shield Python needs an A6 and A5 SCB active at the same time, and use them at the same time for a full recharge. When these 2 SCB(s) run out of ammo, you would deactivate them, and then activate your next set of banks.

Now a gunboat python, which is equipped for max burst dps against shields, like 5 railguns, or 3 large fixed beams and 2 railguns or some-such. To do this, you would only be able to have 1 A5 SCB active at a time. And the gunboat python probably wouldn't bother with boosters either since it won't be able to refill them with 1 A5 SCB.

The power difference of these two setups is 1 A6 SCB and 3 or 4 boosters that can be diverted to weapons, so potentially 2.48 MJ + 4 x 1.2 MJ, which is 7.28 MJ to use on higher power draw weapons, heat sinks and chaff for example.

 

[persephonius]

NeilF, I have answered your proposals in the other thread already, I don't want to copy paste it here, it is quite long. Here it is:

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=150794&page=2

The big long post.

 

[NeilF]

That is not what I said at all. In your scenario, A and B both have the same active shield cell banks. What I said is that a triple or quadruple boosted shield Python needs an A6 and A5 SCB active at the same time, and use them at the same time for a full recharge. When these 2 SCB(s) run out of ammo, you would deactivate them, and then activate your next set of banks.

Apologies...

But I'd say my point is still extremely valid and demonstrates serious issues?

So again, we consider two evenly machine CMDRs turning up to the battle field with the Pythons (with not just one but already two or more SCBs):-
A) An A6 and A5 SCB
B) an A6 and A5 SCB + more SCBs.

So:-
- Is (B) at anything other than an advantage over (A) on paper? He's certainly not using more power than (A)!
- Is there any reason at all other than CR for (A) not to resort to doing the same, and indeed fitting even more SCBs if he can?


How would this meeting not be anything but better if:-
1) (A) and (B) both had my suggested large 3 charge SCB module, so they were on more of an even footing rather than a mindless more = better?
2) (B) had tactically chosen a medium 2 charge SCB module thus freeing up energy to use elsewhere on other modules?

^^ How is this anything other than an improvement?

Now add:-
1) Player do not have to worry about ammo.
2) NPCs have the identical load out methodology to CMDRs. At the moment I suspect we will not see NPCs resorting to multiple SBCs as it would frustrate CMDRs ironically.

 

[persephonius]

Apologies...

But I'd say my point is still extremely valid and demonstrates serious issues?

So again, we consider two evenly machine CMDRs turning up to the battle field with the Pythons (with not just one but already two or more SCBs):-
A) An A6 and A5 SCB
B) an A6 and A5 SCB + more SCBs.

So:-
- Is (B) at anything other than an advantage over (A) on paper? He's certainly not using more power than (A)!
- Is there any reason at all other than CR for (A) not to resort to doing the same, and indeed fitting even more SCBs if he can?


How would this meeting not be anything but better if:-
1) (A) and (B) both had my suggested large 3 charge SCB module, so they were on more of an even footing rather than a mindless more = better?
2) (B) had tactically chosen a medium 2 charge SCB module thus freeing up energy to use elsewhere on other modules?

^^ How is this anything other than an improvement?

Now add:-
1) Player do not have to worry about ammo.
2) NPCs have the identical load out methodology to CMDRs. At the moment I suspect we will not see NPCs resorting to multiple SBCs as it would frustrate CMDRs ironically.

But why would A not bring extra SCB(s)? I don't get it, not utilising those empty internals is just gimping yourself. Again, I am not avoiding answering your proposals, I have indeed answered them elsewhere, I linked it above.

 

[NeilF]

But why would A not bring extra SCB(s)? I don't get it, not utilising those empty internals is just gimping yourself. Again, I am not avoiding answering your proposals, I have indeed answered them elsewhere, I linked it above.

Exactly... It just highlights the utter crudeness of the mechanic.

So now both Pythons have their cargo area full to the brim of SBCs to get on an even footing. How does that help the game? Why should that mentality be good thing? How do them both having 20 SCB charges help the game over them instead, via a simpler (better) mechanics both have 3 (or 4-5) for example?

And if one of them has simply happened to have used half their ammo in the past few hours? All of a sudden they're no longer on an even footing?



So, we have two proposals, the current mechanic where our two Python CMDRs both filling their ships to the brim with SBCs, because there is basically no disadvantage in not doing so, and infact they mindlessly have to really... or my proposal where:-
- They've both fitted a Large SBC so both have 3 (or so) charges (over X minutes).... Now the SBCs are more of a tool and less of a decider.
- Or one has made a tactical choice to go with a smaller module, with less charges, but is using the saved energy elsewhere. He's used his brain to make a tactical choice!

^^ How does that not made SBC a more subtle and infact more intelligent tool?


And as I've stated, the added benefits are:-
- No ammo.
- NPC will have the same approach to the module as CMDRs. At the moment I doubt NPCs "spam" SBC modules as CMDRs would ironically complain about it.

 

[persephonius]

Exactly... It just highlights the utter crudeness of the mechanic.

So now both Pythons have their cargo area full to the brim of SBCs to get on an even footing. How does that help the game? Why should that mentality be good thing? How do them both having 20 SCB charges help the game over them instead, via a simpler (better) mechanics both have 3 (or 4-5) for example?

With the current mechanic you're suggesting two Pythons should simply fill their boots with SBCs, as you say, "why wouldn't they?"



So, we have two proposals, the current mechanic where our two Python CMDRs both filling their ships to the brim with SBCs, because there is basically no disadvantage in not doing so... or my proposal where:-
- They've both fitted a Large SBC so both have 3 (or so) charges (over X minutes).... Now the SBCs are more of a tool and less of a decider.
- Or one has made a tactical choice to go with a smaller module, with less charges, but is using the saved energy elsewhere. He's used his brain to make a tactical choice!

^^ How does that not made SBC a more subtle and infact more intelligent tool?


And as I've stated, the added benefits are:-
- No ammo.
- NPC will have the same approach to the module as CMDRs. At the moment I doubt NPCs "spam" SBC modules as CMDRs would ironically complain about it.

See the other thread... ah I will copy paste.. here:
.
Well, my concern for this is not to do with a 1 on 1 situation. It is more to do with group PvP and how long a tank orientated ship can last as a tank in battle. I think at this point, it all comes down to how long do you think is ok. Limiting SCB usages ofcourse reduces this time. It will probably come down to personal taste as to how long a fight should go for and is still considered desirable. Personally a long fight or short fight is all the same to me. But if you reduce this time too much, the usefulness of a support ship is reduced to the point that perhaps no one would consider using it. And so an aspect of PvP is removed.
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Edit* Thinking about this a bit more, it also restricts the choices that you can make when loading out such a ship. If you cannot use more than 1 SCB at the same time, well, all that power will just go to weapons, and these ships will only be gunboats from now on. There isn't much choice anymore with this SCB arrangement.

- - - Updated - - -

1.3 is 30 minutes away and I am stuck out near Saggittarius A*

nvm, useless information

 

[possessed]

Exactly... It just highlights the utter crudeness of the mechanic.

So now both Pythons have their cargo area full to the brim of SBCs to get on an even footing. How does that help the game? Why should that mentality be good thing? How do them both having 20 SCB charges help the game over them instead, via a simpler (better) mechanics both have 3 (or 4-5) for example?

With the current mechanic you're suggesting two Pythons should simply fill their boots with SBCs, as you say, "why wouldn't they?"



So, we have two proposals, the current mechanic where our two Python CMDRs both filling their ships to the brim with SBCs, because there is basically no disadvantage in not doing so... or my proposal where:-
- They've both fitted a Large SBC so both have 3 (or so) charges (over X minutes).... Now the SBCs are more of a tool and less of a decider.
- Or one has made a tactical choice to go with a smaller module, with less charges, but is using the saved energy elsewhere.

^^ How does that not made SBC a more subtle and infact more intelligent tool?


And as I've stated, the added benefits are:-
- No ammo.
- NPC will have the same approach to the module as CMDRs. At the moment I doubt NPCs "spam" SBC modules as CMDRs would ironically complain about it.

I can't support you in any way because I play game in heavy roleplay style, I do not stick myself in just one play style, so SCB and SCB need to stay like they are, and not adjust them on the way to kill others better or faster, I want to be game be relaxed and chill, I like when game give me time to decide what and how will react in some forced situation.

Thank you