1.4: The Piracy Update!

[CMDR Hagglebeard]

Imagine an update completely devoted to polishing what we have now, with very little or nothing new added. I think the advantages of this, the potential outcome, is better than anything else that could come, whether it be passenger missions, more ships, planetary landing, walking in ships, you name it.

Piracy and exploration both need to be looked at. The exploration community is very quiet, and thus hasn't had much attention, and I think they're beginning to become agitated. I hear the galaxy map is nigh-unusable within 1,500 Ly of Sagittarius A*, among other things. As for piracy, myself and others have suggested many things, and although FD have looked at these and implemented some (see: cargo drones), we're going to need more, for this piracy to be feasible.

I have a few threads with ideas for piracy, and I'll post those here with some extra ideas tacked on. Please, tell me of any relevant threads, or add your opinions here!

-Declaration of piracy. (Hyperlink)

-Hatch Breaker overhaul. (Hyperlink)

-Perhaps self-destruction could void the insurance of your ship? This would be a problem when getting trapped in uninhabited systems without fuel, though...

EDIT: 12:11 AM, 10/6/15. Goodnight everybody, see you in 12 hours minimum!

 

[Connatic]

I believe all future patches should be adding game mechanics to make the game more complex. I think we have plenty of reasons to play, especially with Power Play. Every update going forward (besdies paid expansions), should be concentrating on making all the roles in this game deeper. From giving explorers something to do, to letting CMDRs themselves issue bounties on other CMDRs.

...which two new ships each update of course ;D

 

[CMDR Hagglebeard]

I believe all future patches should be adding game mechanics to make the game more complex. I think we have plenty of reasons to play, especially with Power Play. Every update going forward (besdies paid expansions), should be concentrating on making all the roles in this game deeper. From giving explorers something to do, to letting CMDRs themselves issue bounties on other CMDRs.

...which two new ships each update of course ;D

Well, I think the developers should spend less time spread out over all of the roles and spend more time on each role, fleshing it out and breathing new life into it. At this point, NPCs are worthless to pirate unless they don't have shields, and cargo drones are inoperable. Piracy of CMDRs seemed to have been improved until a hard limit of 20t of cargo in an instance was put in.

 

[rightsideupsidedown]

I read both the links and I have not tried pirating yet so the only issues I see with some of the suggestions is that there are players that believe that they should be able to pirate with a single ship instead of pirating with a wing. Pirates traditionally were groups upon a ship(s) not necessarily a single person in a dingy. I think that should be taken into account if a revamp is made to the limpets/hatch breakers/ or new pirating modules/utilities. The difference between three pirates descending on a T9 versus a single player in say a FDL should be taken into account. The trader needs a means for defense also which means looking at turrets/shields/Hull Reinforcement function versus Module Protection/hiring NPC protection/calling for NPC assistance/Temporarily blocking FSD/Discharging an incoming Interdiction, etc. it's tied into other aspects so it's not necessarily a pirate patch per se but depth related.

Ah yes the obvious difference between PvE/PvP Pirating.

 

[CMDR Hagglebeard]

I read both the links and I have not tried pirating yet so the only issues I see with some of the suggestions is that there are players that believe that they should be able to pirate with a single ship instead of pirating with a wing. Pirates traditionally were groups upon a ship(s) not necessarily a single person in a dingy. I think that should be taken into account if a revamp is made to the limpets/hatch breakers/ or new pirating modules/utilities. The difference between three pirates descending on a T9 versus a single player in say a FDL should be taken into account. The trader needs a means for defense also which means looking at turrets/shields/Hull Reinforcement function versus Module Protection/hiring NPC protection/calling for NPC assistance/Temporarily blocking FSD/Discharging an incoming Interdiction, etc. it's tied into other aspects so it's not necessarily a pirate patch per se but depth related.

Ah yes the obvious difference between PvE/PvP Pirating.

For this, NPC wings would need to be implemented. It cannot be expected that a player must get friends in order to enjoy one of the basic professions.

 

[CMDR Hagglebeard]

I find piracy annoying. Be glad I'm not in FD; I wouldn't do a thing to cater to you. I'd make it as hard for you as I could short of actually making PvP piracy against the TOS, and laugh at your raging.

Now, that's just harsh, but why'd you post here?

 

[Derthek]

[redacted]

 

[[HJ]-RedRaven]

Now, that's just harsh, but why'd you post here?

Nice, Hagglebeard - love the quote for truth. Repped.

 

[Ben Ryder]

Imagine an update completely devoted to polishing what we have now, with very little or nothing new added.

Yes please

 

[CMDR Hagglebeard]

pirates are very important to the player economy.

Hunters >kill> Pirates >rob> Traders

If there were no pirates, we would have no hunters.

Inversely... If Hunting was more profitable than trading we would have no traders, which means no pirates, which means no hunters.

I agree that Pirating does need a serious buff. But we dont want to scare all the traders into Solo/Private. Perhaps making PVE pirating MUCH more viable would be a simple fix.

PvE doesn't just need to be made much more viable, it needs to be actually made viable. I wouldn't even pirate in a Sidewinder unless smuggling and bounty hunting weren't viable in that location. It's not just about how easy it is to get the cargo, or the profits, but the actual activity of pirating. It's so bland right now. Shoot a defenseless trade ship who believes himself to be a fighter pilot, and either get a few measly tonnes of cargo, or accidentally kill the trade ship trying to get to the hatch. If you get even a few tonnes, you have to kill the trade ship, or else he'll drive you insane with his single class 1 laser.

I'd like much more complex chat strings, for the AI to calculate risk, probability of escape and fear, and even missions that put you in a wing of pirates ready to attack a trade ship.

 

[jpaulwilson1982]

Now, that's just harsh, but why'd you post here?

He's probably desperate for attention or bored and thought it would be funny to see people react negatively to his post. Best to ignore such behavior if you can resist.

Concerning updates: I can see your point about FD focusing on one role per update and adding more depth to them. While Frontier has seemed to focus most on combat and the in-game politics, each major update seems to at least do a little something for each role. One increased astronomical object payout, and Wings was supposed to be beneficial to practically all roles. I actually don't mind Frontier giving a little something to each role in each update, but they need to start showing more attention to other aspects of the game (after they get Powerplay running smooth, that is). Combat oriented pilots seem to have plenty to keep them engaged for a little while. Now it's time to show more attention to other roles. Piracy is in desperate need of tweaks and added content, and exploration could use some more mystery and Easter eggs out there. The community's reaction to the Unknown Artifact is proof the community is ready and willing to eat up every tid-bit of information as Frontier gradually introduces such elements to the game. We crave mysteries and legendary stories and events that aren't always focused on war and the political powers in-game.

 

[[HJ]-RedRaven]

Problem is in the uncertainty - real life is somewhat uncertain (depending on where you live, income level etc) and piracy might affect you at any moment. Its something many folks live with on a daily basis.

I'd be willing to bet most ED players don't have the actual real-life threat of violence or piracy hanging over them every day - and thus they view it as not only an inconvenience, nay, a blight, a blot on their very enjoyment of the ED fanatasy.

I don't like being pirated, but I think it should be possible as a 'lifestyle choice' inside the game.

The crux is being able to encourage it and the conflict/excitement it brings without players rage-quitting when they have their internet pixels stolen that took them hours/days/weeks to collect.

 

[CMDR Hagglebeard]

He's probably desperate for attention or bored and thought it would be funny to see people react negatively to his post. Best to ignore such behavior if you can resist.

Concerning updates: I can see your point about FD focusing on one role per update and adding more depth to them. While Frontier has seemed to focus most on combat and the in-game politics, each major update seems to at least do a little something for each role. One increased astronomical object payout, and Wings was supposed to be beneficial to practically all roles. I actually don't mind Frontier giving a little something to each role in each update, but they need to start showing more attention to other aspects of the game (after they get Powerplay running smooth, that is). Combat oriented pilots seem to have plenty to keep them engaged for a little while. Now it's time to show more attention to other roles. Piracy is in desperate need of tweaks and added content, and exploration could use some more mystery and Easter eggs out there. The community's reaction to the Unknown Artifact is proof the community is ready and willing to eat up every tid-bit of information as Frontier gradually introduces such elements to the game. We crave mysteries and legendary stories and events that aren't always focused on war and the political powers in-game.

Don't be so harsh on the guy, he fixed the post.

And yep, nail on the head. Just know that piracy is classified as combat, as your combat rank increases by assaulting/killing ships regardless of legal status, and you use your lasers on targets a lot.

 

[Derthek]

[redacted]

 

[CMDR Hagglebeard]

Problem is in the uncertainty - real life is somewhat uncertain (depending on where you live, income level etc) and piracy might affect you at any moment. Its something many folks live with on a daily basis.

I'd be willing to bet most ED players don't have the actual real-life threat of violence or piracy hanging over them every day - and thus they view it as not only an inconvenience, nay, a blight, a blot on their very enjoyment of the ED fanatasy.

I don't like being pirated, but I think it should be possible as a 'lifestyle choice' inside the game.

The crux is being able to encourage it and the conflict/excitement it brings without players rage-quitting when they have their internet pixels stolen that took them hours/days/weeks to collect.

I think the solution is to give traders tools that not only help them win, but make them feel like they're winning. Traders can get robbed, and the pirate might die shortly afterwards from police, be hunted and killed, or lose his cargo in some way, and the trader would never know. Then, the trader would complain that piracy needs to be nerfed, because they never saw it's effects. Granted, they do have no way of knowing, and it's unfair to them. Although instant-gratification isn't good, we need to give them some gratification.

Also note that this thread is not based around PvP piracy, and that PvP piracy plays a very minor role in this discussion. I think a good general rule is that we should build suggestions with only NPCs in mind, and then take those suggestions and adapt them for players.

 

[Dbrn47]

Pirating is ridiculously essential and so many people fail to see that. I'm no pirate but I would love to see them get a serious buff. but alas, who am I.

Derthek
Competent

A trucker from Canadia.

- - - Updated - - -

Imagine an update completely devoted to polishing what we have now, with very little or nothing new added. I think the advantages of this, the potential outcome, is better than anything else that could come, whether it be passenger missions, more ships, planetary landing, walking in ships, you name it.

Piracy and exploration both need to be looked at. The exploration community is very quiet, and thus hasn't had much attention, and I think they're beginning to become agitated. I hear the galaxy map is nigh-unusable within 1,500 Ly of Sagittarius A*, among other things. As for piracy, myself and others have suggested many things, and although FD have looked at these and implemented some (see: cargo drones), we're going to need more, for this piracy to be feasible.

I have a few threads with ideas for piracy, and I'll post those here with some extra ideas tacked on. Please, tell me of any relevant threads, or add your opinions here!

-Declaration of piracy. (Hyperlink)

-Hatch Breaker overhaul. (Hyperlink)

-Perhaps self-destruction could void the insurance of your ship? This would be a problem when getting trapped in uninhabited systems without fuel, though...

EDIT: 12:11 AM, 10/6/15. Goodnight everybody, see you in 12 hours minimum!

Sounds good matey.

 

[CMDR Hagglebeard]

Pirating is ridiculously essential and so many people fail to see that. I'm no pirate but I would love to see them get a serious buff. but alas, who am I.

That's true. Problem is, people don't look at the game as if it was stripped of NPCs, through DB's vision for the game. They look for self-preservation, anything to help them get ahead. The game's mechanics are centered around this idea of survival, and rightly so, but it's sad that it seeps into the forums.

The Dangerous Suggestions section is quite nice, much more quiet than Dangerous Discussion and much constructive criticism, but very few users. It's a shame, I'd like to see a whitelisted forums dedicated to design discussion, and for it dev team would personally hand-pick users to join it, and it would be under an NDA. I certainly wouldn't (and shouldn't) get in, but I bet that forum could change this game for the better.

It's late. I might say a lot of stupid crap.

 

[reverendK]

just having read the first post i have to say something -
an entire update with NO new content and ONLY polishing existing content will never happen. It's just not a good idea - as a developer - to spend that many resources on something that has little to no potential to bring in new customers.
not to say that existing content shouldn't be polished. It should - and is - alongside the new content - but don't expect an update to have no new content.
in a perfect world they'd make what we have shiny as possible before introducing anything new - but the truth of it is that without the update providing MEASURABLE increase in revenue it simply cannot be made.

 

[Dbrn47]

That's true. Problem is, people don't look at the game as if it was stripped of NPCs, through DB's vision for the game. They look for self-preservation, anything to help them get ahead. The game's mechanics are centered around this idea of survival, and rightly so, but it's sad that it seeps into the forums.

The Dangerous Suggestions section is quite nice, much more quiet than Dangerous Discussion and much constructive criticism, but very few users. It's a shame, I'd like to see a whitelisted forums dedicated to design discussion, and for it dev team would personally hand-pick users to join it, and it would be under an NDA. I certainly wouldn't (and shouldn't) get in, but I bet that forum could change this game for the better.

It's late. I might say a lot of stupid crap.

Yea, I wish I was better with the suggestions... I'm just more of a discussion kind of guy, points and counter points. Killing myths and feeding trolls. Or bug repots I suppose. Honestly, I don't feel like there's anything I could do any better, the only suggestion I would have is to have all this stuff in before you release the game. I suppose I always just trust the developers with their vision and just move on if it falls apart somehow or just gets boring.

 

[Troa Barton]

As much as I would like new content. Especially high end ships I would definately like them to polish what we have.
smuggling, mining, piracy, exploration, commodities market, bounty hunting, salvaging all need a lot of work.
trading is fine but it needs to be more dynamic and a two way street, boosting production as well as draining a market.
piracy will benefit from buffing mining and smuggling, npc traders need a cargo buff.
bounty hunters will get a buff if smuggling becomes a bounty offense and there being more pirates to hunt.