xbox optimisation for pc.

[Barking_Mad]

God forbid that people should listen to this person...............Its NOT the people who are complaining that are the issue here, its the ones with attitudes like this that insist everyone else conform to their point of view. What state do you think ED would be in if everyone who is unhappy with the current state of play up and left? DONT be so short sighted and narcissistic.

As a forum regular I've got to avoid thread after thread about what people don't like about the game - the same ones people have made several times before in the same day/week/month. Many of them are even in the right forum! It's not as if FDev aren't aware people are unhappy, but still people bang on, knowing nothing about game development cycles and the fact time and money are finite. Do you think they aren't aware by now that people have criticisms? In between them there are other threads that are not negative, but get dragged in that direction by people moaning about the game. Then there's the ones where people think they are entitled to know what FDev are up to and moan about xbox, GamesCom, E3 getting the reveal before their own sense of entitlement. Then there's the ones about them 'only caring about the money'.....As someone of a reasonably sunny disposition, it's tiresome.

So you'll forgive my frustration when I wonder why people who slag the game and FDev off in a passive aggressive fashion just dont take time off and go play something else.

 

[Barking_Mad]

When people talk about the XBox port all they hear is <white noise> "the bad".

Hey we're moving "the bad" from "the bad" and putting it into the PC version.

Think about what they are actually saying. What they have to date. Logical reasonable arguments before you do this.

I have worked in the game industry. I've worked on ports.

You do not need to move anything that would be considered a "downgrade" from a port back to a base version. This is not what a port is.

Michael did indeed pour petrol onto the situation with his comments. In his mind, he's thinking about game engine optimisation that probably make certain situations smoother, maybe improvements on peoples hardware like the stuttering issues or low frame rates for some players.

It's improbable that he's talking about optimisations around the XBox specific GPU. That makes zero sense. Why would he announce that given the recent discussions on the forum? Think about it just for a moment. Also, what possible benefit does it bring to the PC port?

Some people are saying that the XBox version is now the target version. Logically that must mean Frontier are the very best at porting games to the PC, they essentially somehow upgrade the game to support 4k and more peripherals than any other PC game I have. Somebody call Rocksteady, these are the guys that should do your Batman ports!

Ok now rant aimlessly about "the bad".

A close relative of mine worked on the XBox, PS4 and PC version of *that* game that was released earlier this year and sold a gazillion copies in 5 minutes. Needless to say he knows his stuff. I've put some comments to him that have been made on here and he just shook his head. That's why he doesn't read fan forums.

 

[M Pat]

The look of the game won't be downgraded to XBoxOne abilities, no.


Some forum members have their knickers in a twist right now about consoles crashing their private Elite party, and seize on any render bug as "evidence" that Frontier are "dumbing down" the game for console release... but this strikes me rather disingenuous.


There have been some gfx changes, for sure. What we do know about graphics evolution of Elite...

- The early versions of ED (alpha, beta) had a higher definition version of the Sidewinder cockpit than we have today. This occurred at or slightly before official game release (December 2014). It's easy to spot by looking at some vents on the left/right of the cockpit - they are no longer perfectly round, but are straight-line approximations. Presumably, this was done for a reason... Sidewinder cockpit rendering was probably chewing resources, and they got changed because it was deemed non-essential for a starter ship at the time. Personally, I don't agree with such things, but hey... I haven't flown a Sidewinder much since 2014, so they might have a point.

- I've just submitted a version 1.3.06 bug report about the "Shadow Quality" options not doing anything at all, when sitting in an asteroid belt. From OFF through LOW to ULTRA, the changes don't have any effect. This is a bug, pure and simple. So you can disregard any conspiracy theories that involve asteroids and shadows, lol. It's a bug introduced at the upgrade from 1.2 to 1.3... end of story.


The latest version changed things like "space station interior" rendering (ie. how far from the station you have to be before you see the inside) and such.

To someone who is pretty new to the game, this seems like a sudden big Thing. To those of us who were playing through most of 2014, however, it might be viewed differently... because stuff like this (and, in fact, exactly this) have come and gone, been raised and lowered, many times as versions changed.


I think it was from "Beta 2" to "Beta 3" where the station interior was no longer drawn until you were almost inside. It had been better before, and was put back to its former setting shortly thereafter. Revisiting the same issue? As easy as before to fix? Great... then it's not worth shouting "console conspiracy!".


It's also worth noting that the pre-release 2014 versions weren't perfect either. We saw some detours into Ugly Town along the way. Does anyone remember...

- An entire Beta phase in which most nVidia cards' rendering got badly broken. And it was broken for weeks and weeks. Oh, the wailing, lol.
- An entire Beta phase in which nearby stars in the skybox got drawn as "Pretty Christmas Stars", with a cross shaped chromatic travesty of ugliness assaulting our eyeballs. More wailing!
- Lens flare that would have made JJ's head explode with excitement. Insanely over-the-top lens flare. You couldn't actually see out of the canopy if you were facing a local star!

But now, all we hear is how perfect it all was then, and how bad it is now.


ED ain't perfect... that's for sure... but I don't think there is an Evil Conspiracy of XBox Inspired Degradation. Sorry to anyone who has purchased an expensive tinfoil hat.


As a final word, if anyone has complaints about 1.3.06 graphics quality in asteroid rings, please head on over to this thread, perform the same sort of test as the one in my vid, and add your results to the thread. That will help FD a lot. Cheers!

Nice post CaptainK !

 

[Globusdiablo]

...The latest version changed things like "space station interior" rendering (ie. how far from the station you have to be before you see the inside) and such.

To someone who is pretty new to the game, this seems like a sudden big Thing. To those of us who were playing through most of 2014, however, it might be viewed differently... because stuff like this (and, in fact, exactly this) have come and gone, been raised and lowered, many times as versions changed.


I think it was from "Beta 2" to "Beta 3" where the station interior was no longer drawn until you were almost inside. It had been better before, and was put back to its former setting shortly thereafter. Revisiting the same issue? As easy as before to fix? Great... then it's not worth shouting "console conspiracy!". ....

Mumble, grumble, snuffle... If you're arguing that the draw distance of station interiors upon approach has been dialed back to the optimum distance seen in early beta, I disagree. In my opinion it's not even close, and still not long enough. The draw distance slider in settings is practically useless... (set at max).

 

[nexxo]

Why are some of you still here?

To inform others and enjoy the car crash.........

What can I say? Some people just want to watch the world burn.

 

[Arjin]

I'm amused by the combination of current most recent threads in this forum.

"The graphics are stuttering on my ultra-fancy PC. Can't the devs optimise them?"
versus
"The graphics look worse than before. Make them shinier so we can get the benefits of owning an ultra-fancy PC!"

I don't really jump on anyone here, but you sir are willfully ignorant of the details.

 

[Crank Larson]

Because I think ED is a great game but currently FD just does random things without community input. Where did we say that we want arena combat.

Without arena combat, an Xbox or other console version would probably not work at all. It's going to be difficult enough to get E: D working well on the Xbox anyway (it's got to have everything accessible from the controller). Console gamers tend to like games that they can pick up, have a few sessions against their mates, and then play another game. Without arena combat, I doubt E: D would have any appeal to the majority of console gamers.

I've bought and am playing the Xbox version of E: D. I really can't get to grips with it in the same way I can on the PC (with full HOTAS). But when arena mode is introduced, then it will make some kind of sense. I'm never going to go on a long exploration mission on the Xbox version (which seems to be my preferred pastime on the PC). But I'll happily load it up to have a few arena jousts.

 

[CaptainKremmen]

Mumble, grumble, snuffle... If you're arguing that the draw distance of station interiors upon approach has been dialed back to the optimum distance seen in early beta, I disagree. In my opinion it's not even close, and still not long enough. The draw distance slider in settings is practically useless... (set at max).

Hell no, not arguing that at all. I'm just saying that this particular problem has reared its ugly head before, and has been fixed before.


Here's the history I can find, compared to today...


Draw Threshold on Station Approach - June 2014 (from here)

Draw Threshold on Station Approach - March 2015 (from here)

Draw Threshold Today

[video=youtube;jyL75OmxZ7Y]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyL75OmxZ7Y[/video]


I can't test Orbis or Ocellus stations from where I am (13kly away from the nearest one - rather inconvenient), so if those act differently to the video above, please post it.



To me, it looks like the Coriolis Station "pop-up LOD" distance today is the same as it was in March... not good, but better that the "two inches from station" LOD switching distance of Premium Beta 2!



GD, I see you reported this during the 1.3 beta phase, here.

Perhaps strike while the iron is hot, and report this as something to be addressed in 1.3. Specifically, that the "draw distance" slider does not allow this distance to be extended. It certainly should.

 

[Wellington]

You got it in a nutshell.....
.
Wake up people......this game...Elite Dangerous....is "it"......this IS the game.......there will be no drop of new core code and a new direction......it is a boring empty game with no more variety than it's 30 year old original........they will fix the bugs and all, sure.....but this IS the game......they will port it to Xbox, PlayStation, THEN they will move on to planetary landings.....maybe FPS views, but those will be PAID for "expansions", that bolt on to the side of Elite D....... As for Elite D....this really is it........hence the rush to get it sold before word gets around.......

THIS RIGHT HERE!!!!!! Have some rep I dont know what some people are expecting, but there will be NO drastic direction change for ED........maybe some polish but what you got already is it. Anything else will bolt onto existing features or be paid expansions.

 

[Arindor]

The bottom line is, IMO, FD doesn't care.

I am a Premium Beta backer. I paid for the game, and the expansion pass. Listen up. My confidence with FD has waned. ED's development has become so bad that consoles now have priority. Those who pledged at alpha, premium beta, and beyond have been sorely ignored ... betrayed even: CQC should have been a PC/Mac first. I seriously doubt FD's honour regarding ED and its future, and I seriously doubt the expansion pass being honoured too. IMO, PP and CQC appear to be nails in the coffin of ED, and console optimisiation is redundant.

Sorry folks, but I truly despair. I had the faith, but truly doubt ED's future. You may argue that it's only v1.3 (even I emphasised that). But I say that XBOne is the start of ED's decline. Please help me believe, because I have lost hope.

 

[CaptainKremmen]

THIS RIGHT HERE!!!!!! Have some rep I dont know what some people are expecting, but there will be NO drastic direction change for ED........maybe some polish but what you got already is it. Anything else will bolt onto existing features or be paid expansions.

The bottom line is, IMO, FD doesn't care.

I am a Premium Beta backer. I paid for the game, and the expansion pass. Listen up. My confidence with FD has waned. ED's development has become so bad that consoles now have priority. Those who pledged at alpha, premium beta, and beyond have been sorely ignored ... betrayed even: CQC should have been a PC/Mac first. I seriously doubt FD's honour regarding ED and its future, and I seriously doubt the expansion pass being honoured too. IMO, PP and CQC appear to be nails in the coffin of ED, and console optimisiation is redundant.

Sorry folks, but I truly despair. I had the faith, but truly doubt ED's future. You may argue that it's only v1.3 (even I emphasised that). But I say that XBOne is the start of ED's decline. Please help me believe, because I have lost hope.

Thank you, Captain Constructive and Doctor Apocalypse.

 

[DjordjeDtW]

Does this include graphics? Will the look of the game downgraded/locked to xbone abilities?

When you notice downgradation you know - it's for consoles.

Consoles stop's a PC Games to evolve.

 

[possessed]

I'm not against Xbox let it be, bat live alone ED to be real game for PC with huge potential what we saw in early Beta in 1.2, and go from there through https://forums.frontier.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?f=36, bat if don't want, your heads are tied by MS, or background politic, just please do not pretend that you FD do not have a some problems out there...

Thank you

 

[Wellington]

Thank you, Captain Constructive and Doctor Apocalypse.

The narcissism is strong with this one

 

[Wellington]

I'm not against Xbox let it be, bat live alone ED to be real game for PC with huge potential what we saw in early Beta in 1.2, and go from there through https://forums.frontier.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?f=36, bat if don't want, your heads are tied by MS, or background politic, just please do not pretend that you FD do not have a some problems out there...

Thank you

I'm sorry mate, not being funny but what?

 

[Ginrikuzuma]

When people talk about the XBox port all they hear is <white noise> "the bad".

Hey we're moving "the bad" from "the bad" and putting it into the PC version.

Think about what they are actually saying. What they have to date. Logical reasonable arguments before you do this.

I have worked in the game industry. I've worked on ports.

You do not need to move anything that would be considered a "downgrade" from a port back to a base version. This is not what a port is.

Michael did indeed pour petrol onto the situation with his comments. In his mind, he's thinking about game engine optimisation that probably make certain situations smoother, maybe improvements on peoples hardware like the stuttering issues or low frame rates for some players.

It's improbable that he's talking about optimisations around the XBox specific GPU. That makes zero sense. Why would he announce that given the recent discussions on the forum? Think about it just for a moment. Also, what possible benefit does it bring to the PC port?

Some people are saying that the XBox version is now the target version. Logically that must mean Frontier are the very best at porting games to the PC, they essentially somehow upgrade the game to support 4k and more peripherals than any other PC game I have. Somebody call Rocksteady, these are the guys that should do your Batman ports!

Ok now rant aimlessly about "the bad".

yes you don't NEED to move anything but that doesn't mean they aren't able to. I'm sure you've heard of the phrase "console parity". I'm not saying its going to happen but the way it was phrased many are fearing this.

 

[Globusdiablo]

Hell no, not arguing that at all. I'm just saying that this particular problem has reared its ugly head before, and has been fixed before.


Here's the history I can find, compared to today...

Cheers Commander. Good job on fact finding.

I've got my fingers crossed that we get there (optimal gorgeous Elite: Dangerous) sooner or later. But honestly, I've given up on ticketing. I'll let others have a go.

Fly safe Kremmen

 

[MrReynolds]

One of the plethora of benefits of PC? OPTIONS.

So if there is NO OPTION to turn something down for a performance gain (with an explanation that it may cause stutter or some other side affect) then either devs missed something or did it on purpose.......

Surely they would want MAX eye candy from people posting pictures on the web. It's not my bag, but people may indeed like taking the time to set up pictures etc on Uber setting, and then play on mid.

Hey ho..........

 

[Herik]

The look of the game won't be downgraded to XBoxOne abilities, no.


Some forum members have their knickers in a twist right now about consoles crashing their private Elite party, and seize on any render bug as "evidence" that Frontier are "dumbing down" the game for console release... but this strikes me rather disingenuous.


There have been some gfx changes, for sure. What we do know about graphics evolution of Elite...

- The early versions of ED (alpha, beta) had a higher definition version of the Sidewinder cockpit than we have today. This occurred at or slightly before official game release (December 2014). It's easy to spot by looking at some vents on the left/right of the cockpit - they are no longer perfectly round, but are straight-line approximations. Presumably, this was done for a reason... Sidewinder cockpit rendering was probably chewing resources, and they got changed because it was deemed non-essential for a starter ship at the time. Personally, I don't agree with such things, but hey... I haven't flown a Sidewinder much since 2014, so they might have a point.

- I've just submitted a version 1.3.06 bug report about the "Shadow Quality" options not doing anything at all, when sitting in an asteroid belt. From OFF through LOW to ULTRA, the changes don't have any effect. This is a bug, pure and simple. So you can disregard any conspiracy theories that involve asteroids and shadows, lol. It's a bug introduced at the upgrade from 1.2 to 1.3... end of story.


The latest version changed things like "space station interior" rendering (ie. how far from the station you have to be before you see the inside) and such.

To someone who is pretty new to the game, this seems like a sudden big Thing. To those of us who were playing through most of 2014, however, it might be viewed differently... because stuff like this (and, in fact, exactly this) have come and gone, been raised and lowered, many times as versions changed.


I think it was from "Beta 2" to "Beta 3" where the station interior was no longer drawn until you were almost inside. It had been better before, and was put back to its former setting shortly thereafter. Revisiting the same issue? As easy as before to fix? Great... then it's not worth shouting "console conspiracy!".


It's also worth noting that the pre-release 2014 versions weren't perfect either. We saw some detours into Ugly Town along the way. Does anyone remember...

- An entire Beta phase in which most nVidia cards' rendering got badly broken. And it was broken for weeks and weeks. Oh, the wailing, lol.
- An entire Beta phase in which nearby stars in the skybox got drawn as "Pretty Christmas Stars", with a cross shaped chromatic travesty of ugliness assaulting our eyeballs. More wailing!
- Lens flare that would have made JJ's head explode with excitement. Insanely over-the-top lens flare. You couldn't actually see out of the canopy if you were facing a local star!

But now, all we hear is how perfect it all was then, and how bad it is now.


ED ain't perfect... that's for sure... but I don't think there is an Evil Conspiracy of XBox Inspired Degradation. Sorry to anyone who has purchased an expensive tinfoil hat.


As a final word, if anyone has complaints about 1.3.06 graphics quality in asteroid rings, please head on over to this thread, perform the same sort of test as the one in my vid, and add your results to the thread. That will help FD a lot. Cheers!

Good thinking Captain K.

 

[xondk]

Not necessarily in a sense of "locked to xbone abilities", however in a sense of "optimizing" and therefor downgrading.

This is not entirely true, that it is downgrades , optimizing for consoles is something they get assistance from the console creator with, and since the xbox one and ps4 are both the same architecture as pc's, any better ways of doing specific stuff on them almost definitely translates to pc as an optimization that will improve something, however yes a lot of games have said they have optimized, but turned out to be downgrades, but I hope this isn't the case here.