Please, adjustments to PvP (and no CQC)

[Crimson Kaim]

Yes we will probably get CQC but that's not what I am talking about.

I want to talk about PvP and why it is so damn boring.


So there are a couple of things that need changes so that PvP can be improved.

First, the problems. The FSD. If interdicted, accept and jump out again. works every time.
Secondly, mass lock. The values are not mass dependent and if you have a mass lock value of 17, you are not affected by a ship of 16 but it works the other way round.
Third, running away. What are you going to do if a cobra is continously boosting in a straight line? Nothing, give up and save time.


These are (my) three problems I think should be adressed. PvP is boring if I only encounter one out of ten palyers who are actually even willing to fight. Like every Python I interdict will attack me but after he realizes "Oh, he might be dangerous for me." He is charging his FSD and jumps away. There is really nothing I can do. With like 10 SCBs in his pocket and no mass lock I can't even hit his thrusters or FSD to prevent him from running away.

The only case a players dies because of another player is when he wants to and this should not be possible.


Another example: Bought a fresh FDL. Had no shields. Was interdicted by another FDL and two Pythons. usually I doesn't stand a chance but hey, boost, boost, boost, boost, charge FSD, gone. Way too easy. This is boring and pathetic.



So to keep palyers in combat I suggest some kind of control systems. Either passively (by increasing mass to be able to mass lock pythons in vultures or whatever -> make masslock MASS dependent and no flat values.) or actively methods (Module that launches a limpet to temporarily disables thrusters/FSD/whatever), atleast ANYTHING that prevents players to do the three things mentioned above.


I mean really, I shouldn't be able to escape three medium ships in a non-shielded FDL with E thrusters.

 

[Daffan]

mass lock does not even work in pvp due to high waking

stupid oversight by Frontier, or really bad game design. Pick one.

 

[Crimson Kaim]

Update: Just got interticted by an ASP, clipper, Conda and a FDL. Escapted with boost boost boost boost.
How boring.

There is nothing what these poor pirates could do.

 

[CMDR Zadian Lichtfrost]

mass lock does not even work in pvp due to high waking

stupid oversight by Frontier, or really bad game design. Pick one.

Mass lock doesn't work at all - NPCs always high wake out if they run. It's only purpose is to give experienced players a way to kill noobs and to prevent ships jumping inside a station.

To the OP: Just accept that this game is PvE with the option to kill other players. SCBs, speed, mass-lock, Empire bias - all things that are cool in PvE but completely ruin this game for PvP. To get a usable PvP game a lot of balancing and changes to the game mechanics would be needed.

 

[LittleJP]

If you make it dependent on mass, Orca will become king pirate, and I have no problem over that.


I agree on almost all your points, except that of the Cobra. The Cobra should remain as a smuggler/blockade runner. Nothing like doing 460 away from pirates with my buttocks waving out the airlock.

 

[CMDR Zantiry Kaine]

I would agree that it would add some more fun to the game if pirates and bounty hunters had ways to stop their targets from running so easily. And unlike alot of people, even though I dislike PvP I dont have any problems with PvP pirates or BHs, they make the game more exciting and fun and they should get some goodies to help them out with their game. The only problem I could see is that it will also find its way into the hands of the pew pew crowd that will kill you "for the lulz" as they say even if you have no cargo or bounties. But I'm hoping that the CQC addition will give that particular bunch a place to go play away from me lol. And if not I always have Mobius.

Either way those players that choose to play as PvP pirates could use some FDev love to make that profession a bit more profitable and fun.

 

[Badben]

I do agree with some of what you are saying, however I want to note that the lakons are an exception, in my fully loaded Lakon 7, cmdr's are very very scary, boost boost boost doesn't work, and neither does accepting and quickly fsd back out, it's just too slow and weak. And not only do I have to pay insurance, loosing 200t of superconductors will put you back quite a bit, it's almost enough to make me play solo, but not quite.

 

[Deleted member 38366]

--- Deleted ---

 

[Crimson Kaim]

I do agree with some of what you are saying, however I want to note that the lakons are an exception, in my fully loaded Lakon 7, cmdr's are very very scary, boost boost boost doesn't work, and neither does accepting and quickly fsd back out, it's just too slow and weak. And not only do I have to pay insurance, loosing 200t of superconductors will put you back quite a bit, it's almost enough to make me play solo, but not quite.

That's why a 1000 tonnes heavy T9 should mass lock two condas at once. Plus 400 tonnes of cargo and some tonnes of equipment can add up to 1500-1800 tonnes. That should be a mass lock.

However, to adress that problem of traders I suggest to add more and bigger hardpoints. Plus defensive weapons like a thermal minelayer that bursts down shields. Atleast some defensive abilities for traders. Even a sidewinder can be dangerous to a T9 if piloted by a player.

Back in history, trader ships were well armed ships, usually many cannons but no high speed nor good manouverbility.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't quite get that...

You said it is boring. So why did you boost and made your getaway it that bores you in the first place?
Deploy Hardpoints, turn around and fight until you either win or you see your Insurance screen. That'll cure your bordom of surviving Interdictions when in a faster Ship.

And if you're really bored - try the same in a Sidewinder, Eagle, Hauler, Adder, Type-6, Type-7 or Type-9. You'll be in for a big surprise...

There is a difference being a hero or extremely suicidal. I am always using the most efficient way, fighting in a 1v4 isn't quite efficient for my balance. And I'd still be bored. Why? Because the outcome of the fight is crystal clear. Nothing unexpected happens.

 

[Lord_Crazy]

I understand your points but I disagree. I like the fact that players not willing to PvP can actually escape. So your problem does not seem to lie in PvP as such, but in the fact that players around you are actually not willing to take part in it.

 

[Windscreen Smudge]

I understand your points but I disagree. I like the fact that players not willing to PvP can actually escape. So your problem does not seem to lie in PvP as such, but in the fact that players around you are actually not willing to take part in it.

The opportunity to escape is given during interdiction. Easy escapes after interdiction defeat the purpose of being able to catch anyone to begin with.

 

[Bunkerkind Anni]

doesn't it just mean you have the wrong PP weapon?

can someone still run unter fire from the EMPulse laser aiming at the thrusters?

 

[whipdiddywhip]

Yes we will probably get CQC but that's not what I am talking about.

I want to talk about PvP and why it is so damn boring.


So there are a couple of things that need changes so that PvP can be improved.

First, the problems. The FSD. If interdicted, accept and jump out again. works every time.
Secondly, mass lock. The values are not mass dependent and if you have a mass lock value of 17, you are not affected by a ship of 16 but it works the other way round.
Third, running away. What are you going to do if a cobra is continously boosting in a straight line? Nothing, give up and save time.


These are (my) three problems I think should be adressed. PvP is boring if I only encounter one out of ten palyers who are actually even willing to fight. Like every Python I interdict will attack me but after he realizes "Oh, he might be dangerous for me." He is charging his FSD and jumps away. There is really nothing I can do. With like 10 SCBs in his pocket and no mass lock I can't even hit his thrusters or FSD to prevent him from running away.

The only case a players dies because of another player is when he wants to and this should not be possible.


Another example: Bought a fresh FDL. Had no shields. Was interdicted by another FDL and two Pythons. usually I doesn't stand a chance but hey, boost, boost, boost, boost, charge FSD, gone. Way too easy. This is boring and pathetic.



So to keep palyers in combat I suggest some kind of control systems. Either passively (by increasing mass to be able to mass lock pythons in vultures or whatever -> make masslock MASS dependent and no flat values.) or actively methods (Module that launches a limpet to temporarily disables thrusters/FSD/whatever), atleast ANYTHING that prevents players to do the three things mentioned above.


I mean really, I shouldn't be able to escape three medium ships in a non-shielded FDL with E thrusters.

you mean like a point and web from EVE .... oh did i just say eve???

 

[Windscreen Smudge]

you mean like a point and web from EVE .... oh did i just say eve???

They just need to fix interdiction so that it actually works. Players are rewarded for submitting and then running after submitting, not trying to escape the interdiction in the first place. It's completely backwards. Players should submit because they are looking to interact, not because they're trying to flee. Current mechanics are a waste of everyone's time, hunter and prey.

 

[Ghostickles]

you mean like a point and web from EVE .... oh did i just say eve???

+1 jammers too please.

 

[Mohrgan]

I would suggest that the quickest way to alienate players in this game would be to balance any portion of the game around PvP. My view of your trouble is just that not enough players enjoy open-world PvP. This has become apparent over my many years of online gaming. Trying to appease the PvP crowd only serves to doom everyone to the never ending Buff/Nerf cycles that happen in games that succumb to that point of view.

I don't see many players being pleased at offering what you're asking for. It would only be mana from the sky for grievers, and the PK'ers in the game.

 

[Ghostickles]

I would suggest that the quickest way to alienate players in this game would be to balance any portion of the game around PvP. My view of your trouble is just that not enough players enjoy open-world PvP. This has become apparent over my many years of online gaming. Trying to appease the PvP crowd only serves to doom everyone to the never ending Buff/Nerf cycles that happen in games that succumb to that point of view.

I don't see many players being pleased at offering what you're asking for. It would only be mana from the sky for grievers, and the PK'ers in the game.

Those 'EvE' modules are quite effective at PvE, just some fyi.

 

[whipdiddywhip]

My view of your trouble is just that not enough players enjoy open-world PvP. This has become apparent over my many years of online gaming.

your joking right? most games don't survive for long without a multiplayer side nowadays, the demand for pvp in gaming is higher than it ever has been, simplay because AI = predictable where as player = challenge

 

[Mohrgan]

your joking right? most games don't survive for long without a multiplayer side nowadays, the demand for pvp in gaming is higher than it ever has been, simplay because AI = predictable where as player = challenge

I guess if you are talking about games like World of Tanks, or Mechwarrior online, but in games that offer more than maps as content, open world PvP has gone the way of the Dodo.

 

[Ghostickles]

yeah, nobody even plays Age of Camelot anymore. /end sarcasm
EDIT: Isnt GTAV5 open world, record shattering? Doesn't it even have SvGvO?
Mind exploding.