New answers from Devs, I quit Powerplay

With "Answer from the Devs #2," I quit Powerplay.

In every post I make I try to be courteous and respectful, but the FD theory about balancing Powerplay simply sucks. And it kills me because I was looking forward to Powerplay more than anything else in this game. I am so disappointed. It makes for terrible role play, and I'll tell you why.

I quote:

"Currently it's more "profitable" from a merit-earning perspective to commit hostile actions in the territory of other Powers than to support your own Power's growth - unless you're willing to spend substantial credits on non-combat Powerplay actions. Are there any plans to change this, or is this working as intended?

Powerplay allows the background simulation to dynamically change on a much larger scale than interactions with minor factions. These changes are generally at their most interesting when they involve conflict – that’s partly why the premise of Powerplay is about territorial control; conflict is a great way of generating drama. With this in mind, we’re happy that hostile actions are incentivised."--- FD


I did not join Senator Petraeus because I want to shoot at Hudson or Winters. I JOINED SENATOR PETRAEUS BECAUSE I'M FOR SENATOR PETRAEUS! I want to BE for somebody--that's the HEART of roleplay. I don't want to simply be AGAINST someone and that's what dominates my roleplay. Why do I only get 1 merit for shooting down an enemy ship in an invasion area that is valuable FOR Petraeus.

Please take a step back and think about this proposition for a minute.

You get 15 merits for shooting down an enemy Adder in a random hostile system. You get 1 merit for killing an Anaconda in an invasion area that's highly valuable to the expansion of your power.

You get the same reward for killing 15 Anaconda's in the service of your Power that you do for merit farming in a random system. Who could POSSIBLY think that even enters into the realm of common sense?!

Are you SERIOUSLY going to argue to me that the adder I killed in the random hostile system was 15 times more important to destroy than the Anaconda in the system we are taking over? And you're going to argue that this balance system is an INCENTIVE for meaningful combat experience?

But let's be fair--the reason FD cited this balance choice was "we are happy that hostile actions are incentivized." In other words, who cares that it's senseless? It's more fun with hostile combat incentives. I'm sorry but Roleplay is more than PEW PEW. Frontier, if you want Powerplay to be fun without it making sense, it will be neither. You have to BELIEVE IN WHAT YOU'RE DOING to make roleplay fun. And how could someone believe in something so senseless?

Besides, please do tell me how getting 1 merit for killing an Anaconda in an invasion area incentivizes combat?

*sits back with popcorn and waits*

No? Oh, maybe you mean PVP combat? So what about the overwhelming majority of undermining farmers that are sitting in "Solo" mode to make bank off the system? Have you ever spent time trying to "catch" the underminers in the act? I invite you to try.

*sits back again*

Still nothing?

Maybe you mean conflict between the Powers? That's gotta be it. FD wants the drama of the Powers fighting over the same turf.

Turf that can't be invaded? Turf that can't be "warred" over because of the fictional cold war? Turf that players simply use to stage hit run run attacks on NPC eagles and haulers? That's the FD concept of a dramatic struggle between powers? Newsflash: 80% of the undermining being done is not to benefit a power--its for merit farming.

Weak. And also not roleplay. And the worst part of all? Working as intended.
 
Given this situation, and I've given it a good crack, my intention with PP is to do the rounds and get some weapons I want.. After that I am out too. I cannot continue my involvement when it turns out we are having a grind competition with people we can never see.
 
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The reason that adder was worth more is he is in the political zone and not just a grunt like the anaconda.
I dont undermine for profit I do it to help my faction
 
Given this situation, and I've given it a good crack, my intention with PP is to do the rounds and get some weapons I want.. After that I am out too. I cannot continue my involvement when it turns out we are having a grind competition with people we can never see.

once you realize this PP isn't that bad either. faction modules are actually fun and 750 merits is really easy cake, plus you may be lucky and get some PVP while earning them. if not interested, then you simply move on. what's the big deal?

what did fdev actually in mind with pp? dunno, but it obviously didn't work out, and i really don't care. the sooner they stop messing with it and focus on other much wanted features the better for all. so this whole debate about PP ... we should really get that behind us. as for the OP ... dude, you take this WAY too seriously.
 
I thought this response was a little odd as well, as I always thought there was an imbalance between undermining and fighting for expansion. 1 merit per kill in expansion zones doesn't really scale well over time compared to interdicting and killing npc's in enemy space, especially when you get lucky with multiple wing interdictions in a row. In the end, it all comes down to your perspective on powerplay, and how you want to use it to benefit your play style.

I can agree and empathize with you, because I've always preferred conflict zone type game play for the constant action, and I wish that the merit reward was a little more. Maybe 5 merits per kill would be better, instead of just 1.
 
Attacking a ship in a hostile system means you commit an unlawful act, have a bounty on your head for murder and are interdicted repeatedly by system defense forces and bounty hunters as well as ships belonging to other powers and pirates. In a cz you have merits on tap, a never ending spawn of targets all in a small volume which requires no travel and no fighting ships which give you 0 merits or credits (and a bounty on your head to boot). Not only that but you are in enemy territory which means you have to travel a greater distance to cash in your merits, which in itself poses a risk and a time sink.

Nothing about this contradicts roleplay, it makes perfect sense for a power to reward commanders who are willing to take the extra risk, brand themselves a criminal and fight behind enemy lines.
 
Attacking a ship in a hostile system means you commit an unlawful act, have a bounty on your head for murder and are interdicted repeatedly by system defense forces and bounty hunters as well as ships belonging to other powers and pirates. In a cz you have merits on tap, a never ending spawn of targets all in a small volume which requires no travel and no fighting ships which give you 0 merits or credits (and a bounty on your head to boot). Not only that but you are in enemy territory which means you have to travel a greater distance to cash in your merits, which in itself poses a risk and a time sink.

Nothing about this contradicts roleplay, it makes perfect sense for a power to reward commanders who are willing to take the extra risk, brand themselves a criminal and fight behind enemy lines.


Come on. It takes like 9 jumps and 5 minutes to cash in your merits. And its 10 times more dangerous in a CZ than interdicting NPCs in a hostile system.
 
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i like Powerplay, i find it a good power struggle system a small thing to do in this ever growing universe.
but i have no reason to do it when i get interdicted 3-4 times doing just trading.
i may get involved in this more along the future
 
Come on. It takes like 9 jumps and 5 minutes to cash in your merits. And its 10 times more dangerous in a CZ than interdicting NPCs in a hostile system.

It's more effort than sitting in a cz blazing away at whatever swims in front of your guns. Anyway, your entire presumption is based on a very narrow personal opinion of what constitutes good rp and what makes sense. Power Play, by its very nature, is not just about expansion but preventing your opponents from expanding. It wouldn't make a lot of sense otherwise from either a roleplay or gameplay perspective. The fact that you do not want to oppose others is your business, but it's an arbitrary line you have drawn in the sand for yourself.
 
I did not join Senator Petraeus because I want to shoot at Hudson or Winters. I JOINED SENATOR PETRAEUS BECAUSE I'M FOR SENATOR PETRAEUS! I want to BE for somebody--that's the HEART of roleplay. I don't want to simply be AGAINST someone and that's what dominates my roleplay. Why do I only get 1 merit for shooting down an enemy ship in an invasion area that is valuable FOR Petraeus.

I agree that it's quite nonsensical to merit undermining over expansion or fortification but that does not mean you have to do it. I undermine the power I hate the most (currently ALD) to get the merits I need to stay at my rating and as soon as that's done I stop and partake in prep / expand / fortify according to the orders of my Sky-Marshal.

Why? Because I don't ask what my power can do for ME but what I can do for my power.

How does it work exactly? Well, I'm a Federation pilot and pledged to Felicia Winters, which means I have to wait 30 minutes between every Powerplay operation or pay 10000cr for every ton of cargo I want to get before the timer runs out. And I don't have that kind of money. So what I do is load up my cargo, go to my target system and then start doing regular missions for the Federation factions there until I can't find any more or can't be bothered. Then I fly back to Rhea and repeat the whole process.

This also has the benefit of strengthening my superpower, as systems controlled by Winters get a significant boost in influence gained by jobs done for Federation factions.

Works fine for me, don't care if FD wanted it to work that way or not...
 
Seems like a fairly decent argument (OP). I have really tried to get some enjoyment out of PP but it just hasnt worked for me. Its both too buggy (Im in Lavigny-face) and just too much of a grindfest and too easy for the rich to get richer faster than everyone else.

tis a shame. It could have been epic!
 
To be honest, I read the answers from the Devs, and realized that I basically disagreed with every answer that required them to take a stance on something.

There is a huge disconnect between what I want this game to be, and the way FD is developing it. I can't speak for anyone else on this front, but by reading the forums, the vocal part of the player base seems to agree.

I just posted this in a different thread, but I am of the opinion that nobody at FD has ever worked on an MMO before. The decisions they make are frequently entirely baffling. Like, I literally shake my head and start to pull out my hair while exclaiming "WHAT?!?!?!?!"

Take some advice from a long-time MMO player; hire some people who know what they're doing. I'm not trying to be mean to the people who are there, but what the OP describes is so clearly the WRONG way to implement this game system that I don't even know what the heck FD were thinking.
 
Seems like a fairly decent argument (OP). I have really tried to get some enjoyment out of PP but it just hasnt worked for me. Its both too buggy (Im in Lavigny-face) and just too much of a grindfest and too easy for the rich to get richer faster than everyone else.

tis a shame. It could have been epic!

That's my feeling. It could have been epic! I was holding out for the balance to make sense. Now FD seems to confirm that the absolutely and unequivocally senseless balance scheme is here to stay.

I'm never going to participate in a roleplay in which the most important activities (in combat oriented powers) are the least rewarding.

- - - Updated - - -

New? As in last week new?

New as in "the thread was started today, look at the top of Dangerous Discussion" new
 
Come on. It takes like 9 jumps and 5 minutes to cash in your merits. And its 10 times more dangerous in a CZ than interdicting NPCs in a hostile system.

I'm not sure you understand how bad the expansion system for Patreus is. Its worse than you think
Yes you only get 1 merit per kill for killing military ships.
How do enemy factions oppose Patreus' expansion?

They can also go to the same place and get 1 merit per kill, thats balanced, and thats what the in game PP UI tells the other Powers to do, but right now they can also just interdict the supply ships of Pateus and kill them for 15 merits each.

Not only is 1 merit per kill a poor return on your time, you are competing against players who are getting 15 merits for killing sidewinders and type 6s.
 
Take some advice from a long-time MMO player; hire some people who know what they're doing. I'm not trying to be mean to the people who are there, but what the OP describes is so clearly the WRONG way to implement this game system that I don't even know what the heck FD were thinking.
Im pretty sure that FD wants to make an 'Elite' game more than any MMO you have played 'for a long time'.
 
To be honest, I read the answers from the Devs, and realized that I basically disagreed with every answer that required them to take a stance on something.

There is a huge disconnect between what I want this game to be, and the way FD is developing it. I can't speak for anyone else on this front, but by reading the forums, the vocal part of the player base seems to agree.

I just posted this in a different thread, but I am of the opinion that nobody at FD has ever worked on an MMO before. The decisions they make are frequently entirely baffling. Like, I literally shake my head and start to pull out my hair while exclaiming "WHAT?!?!?!?!"

Take some advice from a long-time MMO player; hire some people who know what they're doing. I'm not trying to be mean to the people who are there, but what the OP describes is so clearly the WRONG way to implement this game system that I don't even know what the heck FD were thinking.


I suspect, like the OP, you are a relatively new player and DBOBE has already stated that he believes that PP is not for newbies


get a grounding in the main game first... ignore forum hocus pocus... much of it is smoke and rubbish

I suspect guys like this


https://community.elitedangerous.com/node/219

and this fella

https://community.elitedangerous.com/node/226

have been hired for a reason and with the combined workforce of 200+ (ish)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontier_Developments

they outshine you in the knowledge market by a fair margin - just saying :)
 
i like Powerplay, i find it a good power struggle system a small thing to do in this ever growing universe.
but i have no reason to do it when i get interdicted 3-4 times doing just trading.
i may get involved in this more along the future

The problem is that it is an illogical steaming turd.

-instead of doing jobs and gaining merits through actions fitting the faction we all do the same thing.

-Li Hong-Rui is exploration based and should reward exploration with merits, what explorer has TIME to explore when reaching rank 5.

-Archon Delaine is the leader of a NOMADIC band of pirates with a stationary hq instead of promoting control of Anarchy systems to function as "tortuga hqs"

-Peaceful trader faction that practice murder and system domination instead of rewarding us merits for. Doing trade missions.

Its crap and not even polished.
 
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