You must empty your cargo hold first...

[andy_3_913]

...before changing ship.

Why?

If the cargo is stored internally (and we can't attach external cargo modules because they don't exist) then what is the problem?

<sigh>

 

[Jan Eppendorf]

For lore reasons it would be great if you could store cargo internally and/or rent storage space. But I guess the background database to validate player possessions would explode if FD would implement this. Plus, you might find a way to exploit the rare goods limitations this way.

 

[andy_3_913]

For lore reasons it would be great if you could store cargo internally and/or rent storage space. But I guess the background database to validate player possessions would explode if FD would implement this. Plus, you might find a way to exploit the rare goods limitations this way.

I get what you mean, but I was thinking cargo I have in my ship.

It's already in there when I dock, so why must I get rid of it when I want to change ship?

For instance, if I have 200 tons of, say gold, and I decide I want to try combat, if the station I have my Cobra in doesn't do a good deal on gold, then I either have to sell it for little to no profit or waste time finding somewhere I can make a profit.
And then go back to where the Cobra is stored.

I can load up on cargo, and then exit the game.
I'm not told to empty my cargo hold first before I can do that.

 

[Wartface]

I'm not so fussed that to store a ship it must first be clear of cargo; but I would really like the ability to swap ships AND transfer the cargo. This is particularly relevant when you get mission to haul goods and the receiving station doesn't have a landing pad for your size of ship. At least if I could swap ships and transfer the goods I wouldn't have to abandon missions, gets fines and lose rep...

 

[andy_3_913]

I'm not so fussed that to store a ship it must first be clear of cargo; but I would really like the ability to swap ships AND transfer the cargo. This is particularly relevant when you get mission to haul goods and the receiving station doesn't have a landing pad for your size of ship. At least if I could swap ships and transfer the goods I wouldn't have to abandon missions, gets fines and lose rep...

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Lol.
Got caught by that the other day

 

[Robert Maynard]

I get what you mean, but I was thinking cargo I have in my ship.

It's already in there when I dock, so why must I get rid of it when I want to change ship?

For instance, if I have 200 tons of, say gold, and I decide I want to try combat, if the station I have my Cobra in doesn't do a good deal on gold, then I either have to sell it for little to no profit or waste time finding somewhere I can make a profit.
And then go back to where the Cobra is stored.

I can load up on cargo, and then exit the game.
I'm not told to empty my cargo hold first before I can do that.

The need to empty a ship before storing it seems to be in place to stop players stockpiling commodities and undertaking long term speculation on prices - a player could have a number of cargo-maxed Type-9s squirrelled away full of various commodities just waiting for the price to rise or a particular mission to be offered.

 

[andy_3_913]

The need to empty a ship before storing it seems to be in place to stop players stockpiling commodities and undertaking long term speculation on prices - a player could have a number of cargo-maxed Type-9s squirrelled away full of various commodities just waiting for the price to rise or a particular mission to be offered.

Ah. I see.
Thanks for that

 

[jacozilla]

I get what you mean, but I was thinking cargo I have in my ship.

It's already in there when I dock, so why must I get rid of it when I want to change ship?

For instance, if I have 200 tons of, say gold, and I decide I want to try combat, if the station I have my Cobra in doesn't do a good deal on gold, then I either have to sell it for little to no profit or waste time finding somewhere I can make a profit.
And then go back to where the Cobra is stored.

I can load up on cargo, and then exit the game.
I'm not told to empty my cargo hold first before I can do that.

Not totally good answer because real world does not equal FD world, or has to be bear resemblance - but that said, two concepts from real world port authority - docking slips and transit storage.

When a panamax or even larger gigantic ULCV with 14,000+ containers docks at a port, the port makes money primarily on the transit storage and logistics, and secondarily a decent but relatively minor amount on the docking fees. Transit storage logistics for even 1 ship in port, 14k containers is a lot - add the usual half dozen ULCV, equal number of new panamax, etc and the constant stream of inbound trucking and rail flatbeds to move all that tonnage doesn't happen instantly.

Hence the Port will charge Maersk or other major shipping line a pro rata cost based on number of TEU that they have to transit store. So for the example of why can't I just store ship with cargo inside, don't have good answer. The mass to two that ship to where ever space yard they store ships long term probably costs a bit more but we could pay that and seems logical to store things in ship while stored.

But as far as why can't you store ship A with cargo, while that cargo is moved to Ship B that you had in storage - because of transit storage logistics.

If that port had to unload your stored ship cargo, then reload it on your new ship empty cargo space - that is transit logistics they are providing to you that cuts into their ability to provide that same logistics to actual inbound ships with prior agreements for time/payment on limited transit storage.

Every port in the world (well, any port that shipping wants to go to at least), there is always more ships than transit storage logistics. Take a look next time you are near a major port - ever wonder why you see some panamax or ULCV just sitting out in harbor even though you clearly see at least a few docking slips open?

Because they have docking slips but at the moment lack transit logistics.

Like I said, not great answer but seems plausible the star ports are saying no way, unloading you means I lose major money on my inbound transit business.

 

[ChaosCloud]

...before changing ship.

Why?

If the cargo is stored internally (and we can't attach external cargo modules because they don't exist) then what is the problem?

<sigh>

I think it's a safety measure, ever noticed how you CAN'T check your loadout while not docked at the station holding the ship?
Probably because they don't actually store your ship in the first place, the moment you undock they throw it into the recycling center and the moment you request docking they start assembling a new one
If you'd now also want them to have your cargo ready that'd be just unreasonable.

Honestly, I don't know, maybe they're afraid of someone hoarding artefacts in a station, then camping the BB to get missions to sell them? <.<
Woohoo, so hard to do without that already, just use a Cobra, T6 or Asp for collecting them. 40-100t are a lot of room for things like these.
Only difference would be that you can't bug off before selling all or throwing them away and do something else.

 

[Spider95]

I didn't realise this was the case until i tried to swap out my clipper for my cobra only to find i couldn't with a belly full of garrison supplies.

It's quite annoying. But at least now I know about it.

(\(\;;/)/)

 

[Quineloe]

I'm not so fussed that to store a ship it must first be clear of cargo; but I would really like the ability to swap ships AND transfer the cargo. This is particularly relevant when you get mission to haul goods and the receiving station doesn't have a landing pad for your size of ship. At least if I could swap ships and transfer the goods I wouldn't have to abandon missions, gets fines and lose rep...

You can buy the cargo you need. They removed the Haulage tag.

I've repeatedly bought cargo I lost while running missions lately when my cargo hatch was shot out and completed the missions.

- - - Updated - - -

The need to empty a ship before storing it seems to be in place to stop players stockpiling commodities and undertaking long term speculation on prices - a player could have a number of cargo-maxed Type-9s squirrelled away full of various commodities just waiting for the price to rise or a particular mission to be offered.

Yeah that seems to be so much more effective than trading.

Especially since market prices haven't changed a bit since december.

 

[jacozilla]

Yeah that seems to be so much more effective than trading.

Especially since market prices haven't changed a bit since december.

In the just over 3 weeks been playing Elite, I've seen some of my trade routes drop by ~10%, some mostly stayed the same but I suspect I am only trader on that route, and a few I came back to after seeing the small drop, went back to normal CR/ton profit after few days of me not doing that route.

So in spirit I would agree that as a whole, haven't seen what I'd consider material background simulation price changes. But can't say market prices haven't changed a bit - a few percent to 10% seems more than not a bit.

 

[Quineloe]

The galactic average price for not a single commodity has changed by even 1 credit since launch.

Consumer technology for example was never cheaper than around 6200 and sold never for more than 7600 The prices fluctuate, but only within these very limited parameters. That's why stocking anything makes no sense. You can always buy that stuff somewhere for the lowest price possible, and you can always sell anything you find for the highest price possible. There are no peaks and no price crashes.

 

[jacozilla]

The galactic average price for not a single commodity has changed by even 1 credit since launch.

Consumer technology for example was never cheaper than around 6200 and sold never for more than 7600 The prices fluctuate, but only within these very limited parameters. That's why stocking anything makes no sense. You can always buy that stuff somewhere for the lowest price possible, and you can always sell anything you find for the highest price possible. There are no peaks and no price crashes.

I don't think stocking up even if we could makes much sense either. Even if the profit range was larger, and even if we could stock, I'd still rather use my tonnage capacity - because to stock you'd need to move that tonnage first, and since my most limited resource is tonange/hour movement logistics, I'd rather use that capacity to just execute a current trade than stock it up - so you're preaching to the choir re: stocking.

But as I said - I've seen some of my routes go down in commodity price by lot more than 1 credit - still not 'materially significant' as I said - but about 10% on most impacted route I've seen and maybe couple percent on others.

Two specific examples - one one route I buy imperial slaves legally from A, sell them to black market at B. Then buy legal gold at B, and haul them back to sell at A.
In the 3 weeks I've been running that same route, same goods from A-B, I've seen the price on imp slaves and gold drop by up to 10%

No idea about consumer tech, nor if there are 'immune' commodities - but for the commodities I trade, its just fact I've seen prices drop and go back up (in small range)

 

[Wartface]

You can buy the cargo you need. They removed the Haulage tag.

Indeed. Where it's a commodity that I can sell and buy at that station I picked the mission up from it's easy to sell the mission goods, swap ship and then rebuy goods. Where it's a commodity that is...let's say, less than legit...then it's much harder...even more so where the station I pick smuggling mission up from doesn't have a Blackmarket. I end up ejecting the goods in the station, swapping ships, going somewhere to buy new illicit goods then hand in at the mission...for a loss.

It's easy enough to check in advance before taking a mission, I get that, however it seems that when swapping ships you could also swap cargo. This would avoid storing a ship with cargo and ensure mission success.

Just my thoughts, at least.

 

[LeetNoob]

The need to empty a ship before storing it seems to be in place to stop players stockpiling commodities and undertaking long term speculation on prices - a player could have a number of cargo-maxed Type-9s squirrelled away full of various commodities just waiting for the price to rise or a particular mission to be offered.

Long term speculation on prices? Prices don't go over an arbitrary set maximum in this game. There is nothing like a real economy. A Cargo maxed T-9 is about 90 million and each one would be a 7.3 million lost investment.
Please don't try and shoehorn poor game mechanics into a 'clever design decision'

 

[Osbo89]

What they could do is give a 24hr time limit and one ship per player if you leave it after that you would lose say 10-20% of your cargo per 24hr so no stockpiling commodities
that way if you wanted to change ship from say trading to combating you park up your trading ship for 24hr or less get in to your combat ship
to say do another job then back in to trading ship before the 24hr is up.

 

[Quineloe]

What they could do is give a 24hr time limit and one ship per player if you leave it after that you would lose say 10-20% of your cargo per 24hr so no stockpiling commodities
that way if you wanted to change ship from say trading to combating you park up your trading ship for 24hr or less get in to your combat ship
to say do another job then back in to trading ship before the 24hr is up.

Explain first why stockpiling commodities is even an issue to begin with.

 

[bitstorm]

I'm not so fussed that to store a ship it must first be clear of cargo; but I would really like the ability to swap ships AND transfer the cargo.

^^^Aye this.

No issue with not being able to store cargo, I mean those 10 tons of fish stored for 6 months, or slaves, both are going to start smelling a bit funny after a while....

But I see no reason why you should not be able to transfer cargo, even if it's only doable at large stations.

I mean you see 4-wheeled transport running round Coriolis and up non-stop, presumably moving goods around, there's no reason they couldn't be taking goods from one pad to another for a ship transfer.

Feel free to charge me for the service if you want, 500t is quite a bit to shift and the station won't be getting since there's no purchase/sale involved.

 

[Cmdr Noast]

one of the funny things in ED