FDL > Python? (for combat)

[telperion]

I've been flying a FDL for quite a while now. It's an amazing ship and I've utterly fallen in love with the thing. But I've been doing PP so bought a Python so I could do combat in between the 30 minute gaps between getting the PP things.

With the FDL I flew it exclusively with one pip to systems, one pip to engines and four pips to weapons and it was awesome. Rarely ever had to bug out and stripped shields off even Anacondas in no time with two class 2 beam lasers.

So I thought, mostly A class (couple of B) fitted Python should be better but what I found was that the two class 2 beam lasers, with 4 pips to weapons, seem to take a lot longer to strip shields and I need 4 pips in shields otherwise they drop really quickly. I've found combat in a Python is much more harrowing and prone to having to bug out than I did with the FDL.

Could someone explain to me what I'm doing wrong with the Python and whether anyone has had similar experiences with class 2 beam lasers on both these ships please?

 

[LeetNoob]

A lot depends on your exact load out.

The FDL has better base shield modifier meaning it can get a stronger shield from a 5A (475MJ) than a Python can on a 6A (403MJ). Not only that but the FDL has 6 utility slots compared to 4 on the Python, this allows more shield boosters (if you have the power).
However, the Python has more fire power overall, with 3 large hard points. The big advantage to the Python is it take a huge (and really expensive) power plant and larger power distributor (which should allow for longer firing of beam weapons). It also has more internal space and spare power for shield cell banks.
If you are taking longer to strip shields with the same amount of class 2 beams, it is because you have less pips to weapons, or a low grade distributor.
If you had the same pips and a class A distributor, the Python would be better. Try mounting Beams or even pulse laser on the large hard points and see what it does to shields.

It would help more if I knew your exact load outs, but the FDL is a typical combat dedicated ship, fast and strong shields, with less power and internal space. The Python is a big multi-purpose. Loads of power and space, but the shields aren’t as strong. Use the Pythons spare power to load a lot of shield boosters and a few shield banks, and the better firepower will come into play.

For a question which is the best combat ship it’s hard to tell, different styles will get the best out of different ships.

 

[telperion]

Thanks a lot for the response. That all makes sense and I wasn't aware about the shield multiplier.

I'm at work at the moment so I can't give you the exact loadouts but from what you've explained I'll do some testing when I get home and probably alter the Python's weapon loadout. I like your idea of putting lasers on the class 3 points.

 

[Majinvash]

Hi

Depends a lot on your set-up and who you are fighting.

Lets assume you are talking PVE.

You need to spend around 150million to build a decent combat spec python ( Yeah it can be done cheaper )
You are going to need the 6A shields, 2-3 boosters, chaff and probably a couple of 6A Shieldcells.

A good PVE Build for you will be triple class 3 gimbled pulses and gimbled multicannons.

After that you shouldn't have any issues running a conda into dust.

If you are talking PVP, the setup comes into it a lot but then skill takes over.

Most Python players run as a shield tank and win through attrition.

The FDL is a little more nimble in the right hands and it can beat a Python because even with its shields down its a lot harder to kill.
A Python with its shields down will usually high wake out, because its an easy kill due to how easy the power core it to hit.

Majinvash

 

[LeetNoob]

Thanks a lot for the response. That all makes sense and I wasn't aware about the shield multiplier.

I'm at work at the moment so I can't give you the exact loadouts but from what you've explained I'll do some testing when I get home and probably alter the Python's weapon loadout. I like your idea of putting lasers on the class 3 points.

Yup, 3 class 3 hardpoints are fun. I use 3 class 3 beams and 2 class 2 muti-cannons of cannons.
If you want to play around with ship load outs, use this website.

http://www.edshipyard.com/#/L=701,5QG5QG,2-3w3w3w2M2M2M22,7Og03w2Uc

It gives you things like shield strength and power consumption and distributor output. Much easier than figuring it out in game where it doens't tell you anything.

 

[Renegade Roach]

Weapon damage does not vary from ship to ship and is not increased by putting more pips into weapons. Unless you are running out of cap and allowing your fire to be interrupted there should be no difference.

Like the others say, it's the tank and straight up firepower which really make the Python. You can easily run dual 6A SCB with a full weapon loadout and as many shield boosters as you like.

 

[LeetNoob]

Weapon damage does not vary from ship to ship and is not increased by putting more pips into weapons. Unless you are running out of cap and allowing your fire to be interrupted there should be no difference.

Like the others say, it's the tank and straight up firepower which really make the Python. You can easily run dual 6A SCB with a full weapon loadout and as many shield boosters as you like.

But (energy) weapon damage over time is very dependent on energy in your capacitor, which is dependent on both the amount of pips to weapons and the power distributor size and rating.
I find that my capacitor tends to run dry long before I'm done shooting in most cases. Although I use a very energy dependent load out.

 

[Rowander]

Each ship has its strenghts, but I find the Python with 5 gimballed pulse lasers absolutely devastating in PvE. Always aim for the powerplant, and you're done. With A-distributor, it almost feels like cheating. I hope they "fix" the powerplant issue, because it's too easy to kill anything right now. You're also out of heat and ammo problems with this setup, and it allows you to carry many SCB and shield boosters. I'm currently sporting a 726MJ shield with 2 6B SCBs, and that means you can tank any NPC or even groups of them quite easily.

 

[Renegade Roach]

But (energy) weapon damage over time is very dependent on energy in your capacitor, which is dependent on both the amount of pips to weapons and the power distributor size and rating.
I find that my capacitor tends to run dry long before I'm done shooting in most cases. Although I use a very energy dependent load out.

That's exactly what I was saying It's also why I use 3x C3 Pulse on my Python for pve since it gives better sustained dps and better armour penetration. That said, a Python has a larger distributor than the FDL so should be sustaining fire for longer whatever you use.

 

[AveMe]

FDL is best PvP ship in game ( good weapons placement, shields, and speed ). He can easily kill python.
But python is better for PvE ( bigger MJ potential, more firepower ).

 

[LeetNoob]

Another thing about the Python is, that if you max it’s Power plant, it is one of the few ships that can reasonably handle the prismatic shield without dropping a size, giving you the equivalent of the Class 7A shield on the Python for a max of 726 + 145.2 for a 871.2MJ of shields. Now that’s a tank. You just can’t really squeeze many beam lasers out of that setup.

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That's exactly what I was saying It's also why I use 3x C3 Pulse on my Python for pve since it gives better sustained dps and better armour penetration. That said, a Python has a larger distributor than the FDL so should be sustaining fire for longer whatever you use.

Agreed, it's a matter of flying style.

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FDL is best PvP ship in game ( good weapons placement, shields, and speed ). He can easily kill python.
But python is better for PvE ( bigger MJ potential, more firepower ).

Completely subjective, I see more CMDR's in PVE in Pythons than FDL's.
FDL's run out of shield cell banks quick and have poor armor once the shields go down.
Also Python can mass lock an FDL preventing escape, but an FDL cant mass lock a Python.

 

[Renegade Roach]

FDL is best PvP ship in game ( good weapons placement, shields, and speed ). He can easily kill python.
But python is better for PvE ( bigger MJ potential, more firepower ).

Again, there is no 'best' ship. Agreed that the FDL is a great pvp ship, but it can't 'easily' kill a Python. Python can easily tank an FDL's damage and if it decides the FDL is well set up and has a good pilot it can easily jump away. Only a stupid or inexperienced Python pilot dies to, well, anything... unless they decide to go balls to the wall and fight to the death for the hell of it.

 

[Synther]

Both ships have great potential. I might plan on getting an FDL again but together with my Python instead of replacing it.

 

[telperion]

Thanks guys. This is some great information and advice. I'm going to have some fun respeccing when I get home after work today

I think I'm more excited about playing ED after reading all this than I have been for weeks.

 

[tetra]

Having had two pythons (sold the first to buy my Anaconda in order to buy back my python lol) I will say it isn't really until you finish nailing down your final loadout that the Python suddenly goes from "pretty good" to "wow" in terms of a pure combat vessel. As everybody else has said, the python is the best multi-role ship in the game and it can do most things brilliantly. However, while it can be competent as a heavy fighter with a lower spec outfitting (and you can get away with it for PvE at least), it's not until you sink about 150 million into it that it becomes an absolute and literal tank. I can run 3 class A shield boosters, a 6A shield, pop off dual 6A SCB's at a time, have a large plasma accelerator, run two fixed class 2 beam lasers that hardly even scatch the capacitor with 4 pips and two more large pulses all running at the same time with more than enough power for them all. Long story short, upgrade the python to pretty much all A-spec and it will be your buddy, I would never sell mine again.

 

[Majinvash]

Again, there is no 'best' ship. Agreed that the FDL is a great pvp ship, but it can't 'easily' kill a Python. Python can easily tank an FDL's damage and if it decides the FDL is well set up and has a good pilot it can easily jump away. Only a stupid or inexperienced Python pilot dies to, well, anything... unless they decide to go balls to the wall and fight to the death for the hell of it.

In equal hands the Python will beat an FDL every time in a current meta PVP build. ( Cell tank )
Simply because in the time it would take to get the shields down, the fdl would have lost shields and been smashed to bits.

If the python was only running a couple of cells, I actually think the FDL would win in a fight to the death.

 

[Dwardeen]

As anyone has a good FDL PVP Build?

I'm currently running with this one since yesterday, but i've not been able to test it

http://coriolis.io/outfit/fer_de_la...0m05025i456o2o-.AwRj4tQ6WI==.MwBhrSoJgRnyxRA=

 

[Renegade Roach]

In equal hands the Python will beat an FDL every time in a current meta PVP build. ( Cell tank )
Simply because in the time it would take to get the shields down, the fdl would have lost shields and been smashed to bits.

If the python was only running a couple of cells, I actually think the FDL would win in a fight to the death.

True enough, although it's all largely moot since both ships are more than capable of disengaging whenever they feel like it. That's an 'issue' with the whole pvp meta game though, I still change my mind regularly as to whether it bothers me or not.

 

[h347h]

FDL is best PvP ship in game ( good weapons placement, shields, and speed ). He can easily kill python.
But python is better for PvE ( bigger MJ potential, more firepower ).

The FDL is only good in wings from my experience. But then it is great, however it is not the "best pvp ship in game" by a long shot.

 

[Majinvash]

I would argue it is the best PVP ship all round.
Anything bigger is stronger but chases the fighting and can only fight what wants to fight it.
Anything small is an easier kill and bar the Cobra and Scout cannot out run it or the mass lock.
That leaves the Ocra and Clipper. Both would usually loose in a 1v1.
Weaker shields and even with a shield tanking clipper will find a good fdl hard to hit:
Best PVP ship is technically a battle conda but it's to slow to keep engaged the moment it's opponent starts to loose and run.