Sarah moved from current project, update no longer coming?

Status
Thread Closed: Not open for further replies.
This whole 'Thou shall not communicate' thing is very bizarre.

I sort of get it from the dev/publishing perspective where you want to keep your cards hidden much of the time, secrets you prefer to keep in house etc, but for a project that started out as a crowdfunded thing, meant to 'involve' that community that backed it, it does feel off doesn't it?

I used to get an insight into a AAA games company, that developed a very toxic working style, part of which was to kill communication, even within it's own departments, and that was all down to a number of influencial middle managers and their particular personality disorders (a couple of classic cases of sociopath) and the way that ended up shaping whole departments.

I was on the outside looking in, so avoided all the real 'grind' it became for many of the people working there, but i was close to a number of people and the stories they would tell, of bullying, stress, wasted working days etc were legend. In the end they did a big review after i contacted the CEO in person about it, and after about 9 months one of the people that had been causing a lot of issues left, but in general the others closed ranks and over the next six months it became obvious nothing was really going to change, so slowly people started to leave.

They lost a lot of good people, hard workers, those that cared to do a good job etc, and ultimately that big AAA is now on the verge of bowing out of AAA completely. All of that probably down to the simple fact they were 'anti communication', so much so it became a non-functioning company as they could not even communicate properly between themselves to make sure they were doing their jobs properly.

I offer this cautionary tale in the hope that it is not the case for Frontier, but just in case it is, that someone senior enough can maybe see the problem and do something about it before the wheels fall off, if they are indeed in that process.

Talking about your work is not a negative, properly involving your passionate and loyal (for the most part) fan base is not a negative, but stopping your employees that are good at communicating IS a negative and will have wider repurcussions within your organisation. You can hire some professional work coaches if you need to, if this is all part of a deeper seated problem?

Communication is King in any media business, and most companies spend fortunes on promotion and generating buzz and all that, so please don't kill natural communication, you have a player base chomping at the bit to help you promote the game and improve it, it is an assest of the highest quality, use it, embrace it, talk to us (we only bite sometimes!) :)

My exact feelings.....great post Zak :) +1 rep to you
 
Last edited:
Such a shame, all you 'minions' will have to put your gimp masks back in the cupboard
 
Last edited:
This whole 'Thou shall not communicate' thing is very bizarre.

I sort of get it from the dev/publishing perspective where you want to keep your cards hidden much of the time, secrets you prefer to keep in house etc, but for a project that started out as a crowdfunded thing, meant to 'involve' that community that backed it, it does feel off doesn't it?

I used to get an insight into a AAA games company, that developed a very toxic working style, part of which was to kill communication, even within it's own departments, and that was all down to a number of influencial middle managers and their particular personality disorders (a couple of classic cases of sociopath) and the way that ended up shaping whole departments.

I was on the outside looking in, so avoided all the real 'grind' it became for many of the people working there, but i was close to a number of people and the stories they would tell, of bullying, stress, wasted working days etc were legend. In the end they did a big review after i contacted the CEO in person about it, and after about 9 months one of the people that had been causing a lot of issues left, but in general the others closed ranks and over the next six months it became obvious nothing was really going to change, so slowly people started to leave.

They lost a lot of good people, hard workers, those that cared to do a good job etc, and ultimately that big AAA is now on the verge of bowing out of AAA completely. All of that probably down to the simple fact they were 'anti communication', so much so it became a non-functioning company as they could not even communicate properly between themselves to make sure they were doing their jobs properly.

I offer this cautionary tale in the hope that it is not the case for Frontier, but just in case it is, that someone senior enough can maybe see the problem and do something about it before the wheels fall off, if they are indeed in that process.

Talking about your work is not a negative, properly involving your passionate and loyal (for the most part) fan base is not a negative, but stopping your employees that are good at communicating IS a negative and will have wider repurcussions within your organisation. You can hire some professional work coaches if you need to, if this is all part of a deeper seated problem?

Communication is King in any media business, and most companies spend fortunes on promotion and generating buzz and all that, so please don't kill natural communication, you have a player base chomping at the bit to help you promote the game and improve it, it is an assest of the highest quality, use it, embrace it, talk to us (we only bite sometimes!) :)

Welcome to government, defense industries, academia, media... :(
 
Best of luck to SJA, whatever she is working on now and in the future...

I see no point in attacking FD, the community managers, moderators, or other forum members on this. People have to stop this attitude of being entitled to answers to every question they can dream up.

Have a good weekend! x
 
Even from an economic POV, this looks like a panic decision, 2 month of work put on hold? they could have let her wrap it up and include it into the next patch, It can't be worse compare to what we got now, can it? or let someone else polish it and then release. The best PR comes from the ground up, if people are happy you don't need to spend huge amounts of money selling your product.

If this has been known for sometime, the execution was poorly made for sure.

Stop. Being. Rational. :)
 
Let business folk talk to devs...people get fired.
I have to admit I don't have clue who 'business folk' are?
I've met many labelled as 'business' people employed by companies but I still don't get their insularity and business geekiness.
I know plenty of self-employed people who are carpenters, electricians, plumbers etc. By definition they are business people but they don't seem the same as above.
Anyway good luck, I hope you find your software gap.:)
 

Harbinger

Volunteer Moderator
2exngz1.png
https://twitter.com/Cruel_Coppinger/status/624570054148030464
 
Last edited:
I have to admit I don't have clue who 'business folk' are?
I've met many labelled as 'business' people employed by companies but I still don't get their insularity and business geekiness.
I know plenty of self-employed people who are carpenters, electricians, plumbers etc. By definition they are business people but they don't seem the same as above.
Anyway good luck, I hope you find your software gap.:)

:D Heh, yeah, I'm talking in software development.

I mean VPs, Directors and client stakeholders. The people that want stuff built by people who know what they are doing.

You know, pigs and chickens, ever heard of that?

Your pigs are the devs, QAs, PMs and analysts. Getting down in the dirt, getting the work done, but you better keep them fed and happy or they will squeal to no end.

The chickens are the "business folk" situated up on their perch, judging the pig pen, constantly pecking at the pigs' work, squaking at even the slightest hint of delay and..tiny brains
 
Last edited:
Well Sarah, I have to apologise to you as I have participated in this thread.
On reflection I've come to realise that it has done you no favours.
I do hope that it is has not soured your working and professional relationships.
I wish you all the best in this my last post in this thread.
Good luck!
 
But don't confuse my previous statements with what is, on the face of it, an unprofessional use of social media to call out what is an internal employment situation/dispute.

Therefore, you have no right to complain about anything that happens to you. You have never complained publicly about anything, right? (Just wait until the sound recordings of all the Brit surveillance cams are played back)

Something Blew Up. It happens. And, it is silly to think that we are not human, and would not vent, ever. Now, it is obvious that there is more than the usual biological byproduct going on.

- - - Updated - - -

I would like to point out that almost no company discusses their internal stuff with public or their clients.

I would like to point out that Richard Nixon always claimed innocence... :)

Leaks Happen.
 
Therefore, you have no right to complain about anything that happens to you. You have never complained publicly about anything, right? (Just wait until the sound recordings of all the Brit surveillance cams are played back)

Something Blew Up. It happens. And, it is silly to think that we are not human, and would not vent, ever. Now, it is obvious that there is more than the usual biological byproduct going on.

- - - Updated - - -



I would like to point out that Richard Nixon always claimed innocence... :)

Leaks Happen.

This thread is going well.
 
And, it is silly to think that we are not human, and would not vent, ever.

It's also silly to think that one would decide to tell the whole world about internal business decisions. The whole world. Think about it. That'd be a very poor choice, completely inappropriate, and a guaranteed drama bomb.
 
Therefore, you have no right to complain about anything that happens to you. You have never complained publicly about anything, right?

Thats not what he is saying. You can say and do whatever you want, but the consequences are for you as well. From a certain professional level you can expect people to act accordingly. If you don't like something your boss does, fine, pick up your stuff and leave. If you gripe about it in public, also great, your choice, but it does not come across as very professional, on that I agree with Titus.
 
Therefore, you have no right to complain about anything that happens to you. You have never complained publicly about anything, right? (Just wait until the sound recordings of all the Brit surveillance cams are played back)

Something Blew Up. It happens. And, it is silly to think that we are not human, and would not vent, ever. Now, it is obvious that there is more than the usual biological byproduct going on.

Quite the opposite, you are more than welcome to check my twitter feed (if you can find the real me :p) and find that I do complain and vent in public, and quite openly F and C on their - but I also work for a company with a very open and forward policy on social media use.

But I still wouldn't complain ABOUT them or anything in such a way that might be construed as an attack on clients.

In the past I have worked for a company where I was at an event where Bill Clinton was speaking. I publicly claimed he was boring, I also "booed" about another politician that was up, using some choice words. My employer wasn't happy and asked me to take them down. I obliged. So I am aware of what may be considered professional and what isn't.

Also I'm not under the microscope of a 1000 fans wanting to hear my next insight into what I'm doing.
 
Last edited:
I have to admit I don't have clue who 'business folk' are?
I've met many labelled as 'business' people employed by companies but I still don't get their insularity and business geekiness.
I know plenty of self-employed people who are carpenters, electricians, plumbers etc. By definition they are business people but they don't seem the same as above.
Anyway good luck, I hope you find your software gap.:)

Some one explained this to me when I was similarly confused.

There is a distinction between what a single person / a tradseman can do, and business. Yes a tradesman has a business, but business itself is meta. It's the processes, procedures and methodology's for enhancing the product or service in a scale-able way. In a business the tradesman is a replaceable part of the organisation. A modular component that can be duplicated to expand the business.

That's not a perfect explanation, but you should be see workers\tradesmen are alienated, as Marx said in his criticism's of Capitalism. I find it apt because in ED, FD seems to alienate it's own players, because they are making the game they want to make (the most profitable for the least effort).
 
Of course customers are stakeholders.

Arguably the most important ones at that.

Sincerely,

Strategic management consultant.

100% true, but as they\we have no voice in 'Strategy Meetings' easily ignored... apparently a common fatal mistake in organisations who have become too self important to listen.
 
Best thing they all could do is sit together and talk it all out.
Maybe then SJA herself could write a final post about the state of her AI work, which part of it might be release soon(tm) and what will be delayed for a long (or even longer) period.
Then we could all move on and either play the game or work on improving it ;)

I want to join the choir and say that I will miss Sarah's posts on the forums - they were alwas fun and informative.
I can't see where she might have "revealed too much" - but then again I don't know what FD does consider a business secret...
I'd love see more devs on the forums - And I believe there is in fact an increasing "dev presence" here lately.
 
Status
Thread Closed: Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom