Let us remember what we lost so far

[Quineloe]

As you all know, the game came out 8 months and a week and maybe a day or two ago.

Let us use this anniversary to think back to what we had and is gone now


1. Rare trade piracy.
With the sales price nerf for stolen rares, rare piracy is pretty much gone for good. Many argued that it's "realistic" this way, but on the other hand we can look at any random BB and find missions to steal regular commodities worth maybe 10-20k and get paid a quarter of a million for doing so.

2. High bounty player pirates
Some of the more successful pirates who went weeks without being shot down managed to accumulate multiple millions worth of bounties. When players started showing up with 10 millions on them on the wanted boards, other players actually bothered organizing and hunting them because the money was actually worth the effort.
Today we have no roaming on bounties, so player pirates accumulate a few thousand credits only before they move system, and after a week those bounties disappear anyways. There are no pirates anymore that would be worth millions if killed.

3. Pirates actually in it for the money.
There was a good chance when you were interdicted in your trader that the pirate would actually let you go after dropping him some cargo. Now it's just open fire to kill, because they're already rich beyond need. The game has become a whole lot more hostile, especially since the crime updates in which Frontier made it clear that piling up hundreds upon hundreds of player kills is no big deal.

4. Rare trading
Nerfed and then forgotten, rare trading after the mission update is no longer a good way to make money. Maybe it's time FD rethink their massive nerfs on rare trading again, because it is one of the most fun ways to trade. I really liked doing rare trading even in a Clipper because it was an activity that actually took over an hour to complete, there are by far not enough activities like this in the game right now. Everything else is so instant gratification


Can anyone think of any other emergent gameplay that has been shot down since launch? Don't say seeking luxuries.

 

[X-Terminator]

3. Yesterday I seen on the GlaNet local bounties on players top 5 there was 3.5mil on number 1. I wish he was around when I was!
4. I've gone off rares after having done the CG Diso Corn 50limit rush. Going back seems way too long of a grind to do again and prefer to combat and rank up. It pays ok too.

 

[CMDR Starschulz]

They nerfed rares trading because it was making too much money, but later buffed all professions money income. might as well undo those changes to rares, right?

 

[askavir]

From time to time I still do the rares circuit, but indeed I miss the chance to run into the old pirates of the lave cluster.

I'd like to add another "lost" item, which is the thrill of an interdiction. Before, interdictions were somewhat rare, and one could get caught by suprise with that "oh shyt" feeling. Now interdictions are so frequent that one actualy expects them, they feel scripted, and become more of a nuisance than an exciting game event, even with the improved AI. Interditions should be rare, but very dangerous, like wings of fearsome blood-thirsty pirates demanding loads of cargo. Now they are annoyingly frequent, and its like squashing harmless but annoying flies than just won't leave alone for a second.

As for bounties I totally agree, there is absolutely no deterrant nor meaningful risk for murder. Bounties are tiny, local only, quickly expire. No point in actually hunting dow murderers, as the gains are irrelevant, and the target will probably not be wanted whenever one actually finds it.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

Errrr...good riddance I say?

Besides piracy which still needed to flesh out, but expecting piracy to be very lucrative...

 

[COOPER TTE]

Where have the Voyager probes gone?

 

[_Flin_]

Rare trading is still a very good way for Beginners to come around, see the galaxy (inhabited part) and get into their first Asp.

Rare trading is a staple in our training program for our new members and they happily do it.

 

[Stealth Gamer92]

They nerfed rares trading because it was making too much money, but later buffed all professions money income. might as well undo those changes to rares, right?

Buffed all? Smugling pay is still poor unless you do it in bulk in a non-smuggling ship which kill's those who want to smuggle realistically's chances of making a career of it. Well I guess there's the board mission's, but that was a quick fix that should be temporary.

 

[Quineloe]

Errrr...good riddance I say?

Besides piracy which still needed to flesh out, but expecting piracy to be very lucrative...

yes... I think that's the last straw... good riddance to you, too.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

Buffed all? Smugling pay is still poor unless you do it in bulk in a non-smuggling ship which kill's those who want to smuggle realistically's chances of making a career of it. Well I guess there's the board mission's, but that was a quick fix that should be temporary.

It's because in future smuggling - ir most profitable part - will be done trough web of contacts, trough persistent NPCs which will offer you a deal aka mission.

 

[Schmack]

Good luck ever shooting a top bounty. You have to think of all the ways you could possibly get a bounty on your head and why you would want to. If you're in a wing, your buddy can just join up and pop your sidewinder on command and collect that money. Not saying some aren't legit, but the illegal cargo scan spamming and other tricks of the trade aren't filtered out, so you'll likely never collect one of those. I recall seeing close to 300 million on some folks before the limit was established. That's more bounty on your head than you've collected from others. You pop that ship, you're set. So I don't think the timeout for bounties changed anything in that regard, it just lowered the numbers but they are all the same relatively. I have close to a million on me, but spread out over different systems.

The game is about making and spending Cr. What doesn't do one of those isn't going to last. Spending time to do cool stuff is fun, but the game has a tailwind pushing players forward, amassing wealth as inflation sets in. I'm still confused as to what I am supposed to be doing for the one I am pledged to. Am I to haul pamphlets like a Jehovah's Witness? Am I to defend a system, attack a system? What? It seems the regular non-PP game is interwoven with the PP game and i find myself in the middle quite often, unsure of my goal. I'll be headed to one system to complete something and I'll see something during a turn (always check the nav screen) and that will cause me to stick around, or some random NPC will interdict me and sit there and do nothing but stare at me, and if I kill it I get nothing for it, nothing.

There's a lot more lost on this game than the things you mentioned. I found one RES site today that allowed me to collect over 7m in one hour. That's very odd. I couldn't turn around in my Python wtihout having another Clipper scanning me. All of them were 200k+ reward ships. This could have gone on all day but I got tired and left. Went back later, nothing but sideys, 20 consecutive instances of sideys then 5 Pythons and a dropship then dead silence for 10 minutes before I left. RES sites are odd characters now and I really miss the anaconda there.

 

[atlas974]

They nerfed rares trading because it was making too much money, but later buffed all professions money income. might as well undo those changes to rares, right?

I think it's time! But like all changes that need number tweaking, FD seems to be too slow, if they tweaked some numbers (weapons, trade goods value, armor value, profession income, missions number spawn) every week or 2, we would have some good changes right now, but reality is that they seems to be overwhelmed by other things. (hope that collossal announce is PL)

 

[Schmack]

I think it's time! But like all changes that need number tweaking, FD seems to be too slow, if they tweaked some numbers (weapons, trade goods value, armor value, profession income, missions number spawn) every week or 2, we would have some good changes right now, but reality is that they seems to be overwhelmed by other things. (hope that collossal announce is PL)

A few weeks ago there was an instance where imperial slaves were going for 8K+ profit per ton to the black market. That was a mistake, and it got corrected overnight. It's odd that those things get corrected so fast but other things take months. I did make a tidy profit on the imperial slaves though.

 

[7x5]

We lose the anacondas in the high intensity resource xtraction site

 

[Agony_Aunt]

1. Rare trade piracy.
With the sales price nerf for stolen rares, rare piracy is pretty much gone for good. Many argued that it's "realistic" this way, but on the other hand we can look at any random BB and find missions to steal regular commodities worth maybe 10-20k and get paid a quarter of a million for doing so.

2. High bounty player pirates
Some of the more successful pirates who went weeks without being shot down managed to accumulate multiple millions worth of bounties. When players started showing up with 10 millions on them on the wanted boards, other players actually bothered organizing and hunting them because the money was actually worth the effort.
Today we have no roaming on bounties, so player pirates accumulate a few thousand credits only before they move system, and after a week those bounties disappear anyways. There are no pirates anymore that would be worth millions if killed.

3. Pirates actually in it for the money.
There was a good chance when you were interdicted in your trader that the pirate would actually let you go after dropping him some cargo. Now it's just open fire to kill, because they're already rich beyond need. The game has become a whole lot more hostile, especially since the crime updates in which Frontier made it clear that piling up hundreds upon hundreds of player kills is no big deal.

4. Rare trading
Nerfed and then forgotten, rare trading after the mission update is no longer a good way to make money. Maybe it's time FD rethink their massive nerfs on rare trading again, because it is one of the most fun ways to trade. I really liked doing rare trading even in a Clipper because it was an activity that actually took over an hour to complete, there are by far not enough activities like this in the game right now. Everything else is so instant gratification


Can anyone think of any other emergent gameplay that has been shot down since launch? Don't say seeking luxuries.

Seeking.... ok, just kidding. Actually, if you drop into USS about 1 in 5 times its a Type 9 that will pay top credit for stuff, usually stuff you can buy at the local station. Just do it a few times in a system to see what they are wanting. For me today it was Tech Goods.

Anyway, on with the dissection:

1) Didn't know they did that. Shame, should just be the usual cut of the black market.

2) It was getting very silly (bounties in the billions) and totally being exploited. Until they get a way to fix "get a friend to kill you" exploit i say good riddance. Even then, i'd say it would also have to be the bigger the bounty the more you get interdicted by NPCs, so someone with a mega million bounty should barely be able to travel in a civilized high sec system.

3) Credit decay? More credit sinks? But this isn't a problem of FD, this is a player problem. If players are bored and find the only way they can enjoy themselves is to blow up weak traders, then they are pretty sad people.

4) Still a very good way to make money early on as far as i know. Still see it highly recommended for new players.

 

[Spook]

Let us remember what we have lost so far?

Err okay - Offline.

Okay, okay I'll get my coat.

 

[SMcA]

Let us use this anniversary to think back to what we had and is gone now

Bobblehead

Spoiler

And don't forget the Christmas tree.

Spoiler

 

[Quineloe]

2) It was getting very silly (bounties in the billions) and totally being exploited. Until they get a way to fix "get a friend to kill you" exploit i say good riddance. Even then, i'd say it would also have to be the bigger the bounty the more you get interdicted by NPCs, so someone with a mega million bounty should barely be able to travel in a civilized high sec system.

because it's so hard to ban players for exploiting. There was a lot of legit gameplay regarding high bounties, and the whole "get a friend to pop your sidewinder" thing is also highly theoretical. Most pirates did not just give their bounties away. People saw the *possibility* of this taking place, and jumped straight to the conclusion that this was actually happening without *any proof whatsoever*

4) Still a very good way to make money early on as far as i know. Still see it highly recommended for new players.

New players just accept these fancy missions now and make more money in much shorter intervals. Missions outperform rare trading.

 

[Stealth Gamer92]

It's because in future smuggling - ir most profitable part - will be done trough web of contacts, trough persistent NPCs which will offer you a deal aka mission.

I know but the current way mission's are there regardless of my effort to gaine rep or trust it just feel's like cheating, especially so since they fill my cargo rack's for free no collateral deposit or haveing to find the illegal good's myself and bring them back.

 

[Max Magic]

As you all know, the game came out 8 months and a week and maybe a day or two ago.

Let us use this anniversary to think back to what we had and is gone now


1. Rare trade piracy.
With the sales price nerf for stolen rares, rare piracy is pretty much gone for good. Many argued that it's "realistic" this way, but on the other hand we can look at any random BB and find missions to steal regular commodities worth maybe 10-20k and get paid a quarter of a million for doing so.

2. High bounty player pirates
Some of the more successful pirates who went weeks without being shot down managed to accumulate multiple millions worth of bounties. When players started showing up with 10 millions on them on the wanted boards, other players actually bothered organizing and hunting them because the money was actually worth the effort.
Today we have no roaming on bounties, so player pirates accumulate a few thousand credits only before they move system, and after a week those bounties disappear anyways. There are no pirates anymore that would be worth millions if killed.

3. Pirates actually in it for the money.
There was a good chance when you were interdicted in your trader that the pirate would actually let you go after dropping him some cargo. Now it's just open fire to kill, because they're already rich beyond need. The game has become a whole lot more hostile, especially since the crime updates in which Frontier made it clear that piling up hundreds upon hundreds of player kills is no big deal.

4. Rare trading
Nerfed and then forgotten, rare trading after the mission update is no longer a good way to make money. Maybe it's time FD rethink their massive nerfs on rare trading again, because it is one of the most fun ways to trade. I really liked doing rare trading even in a Clipper because it was an activity that actually took over an hour to complete, there are by far not enough activities like this in the game right now. Everything else is so instant gratification


Can anyone think of any other emergent gameplay that has been shot down since launch? Don't say seeking luxuries.

Good luck ever shooting a top bounty. You have to think of all the ways you could possibly get a bounty on your head and why you would want to. If you're in a wing, your buddy can just join up and pop your sidewinder on command and collect that money. Not saying some aren't legit, but the illegal cargo scan spamming and other tricks of the trade aren't filtered out, so you'll likely never collect one of those. I recall seeing close to 300 million on some folks before the limit was established. That's more bounty on your head than you've collected from others. You pop that ship, you're set. So I don't think the timeout for bounties changed anything in that regard, it just lowered the numbers but they are all the same relatively. I have close to a million on me, but spread out over different systems.

The game is about making and spending Cr. What doesn't do one of those isn't going to last. Spending time to do cool stuff is fun, but the game has a tailwind pushing players forward, amassing wealth as inflation sets in. I'm still confused as to what I am supposed to be doing for the one I am pledged to. Am I to haul pamphlets like a Jehovah's Witness? Am I to defend a system, attack a system? What? It seems the regular non-PP game is interwoven with the PP game and i find myself in the middle quite often, unsure of my goal. I'll be headed to one system to complete something and I'll see something during a turn (always check the nav screen) and that will cause me to stick around, or some random NPC will interdict me and sit there and do nothing but stare at me, and if I kill it I get nothing for it, nothing.

There's a lot more lost on this game than the things you mentioned. I found one RES site today that allowed me to collect over 7m in one hour. That's very odd. I couldn't turn around in my Python wtihout having another Clipper scanning me. All of them were 200k+ reward ships. This could have gone on all day but I got tired and left. Went back later, nothing but sideys, 20 consecutive instances of sideys then 5 Pythons and a dropship then dead silence for 10 minutes before I left. RES sites are odd characters now and I really miss the anaconda there.

Being a realtively new player with barely 2 weeks playtime, i couldnt agree more to both of you


Like everyone else, when i first joined the game, i was excited about the possibilities and immediately the old ELITE feeling from back of the eightys warmed my stomach again:

- doing some small missions
- sweating blood when i found 4 canisters of anything worthless floating around in space, and despite better knowledge, i took them to the nearest station because i thought, ANY money is valuable in this game and i would need it... Hahaha, what a false impression...just lol
- i remember, i was screaming out for exciteness when i dropped my first time into a weak signal source, just out of curiosity whats in this, and found a "wanted" enemy who began shooting me...and after a 10 minutes fight for death or alive, i managed to kill him with help of arriving police ships, giving me the "insane" amount of around 40k credits... I thought, how lucky i was and that i got nearly a fortune at this stage of the game... when on the other hand i was doing with trading or mission running just a few thousand credits

---> ALL of this initial fun were removed during a few days, when i first heard about those RES and CZ and tried them out:
In an instant, insane amounts of money flooding in and despite it was welcome in the first place, because i could fit a Cobra in an hour, it felt completly wrong !!!!!

Because lets be honest:
Those FARMING sites have NOTHING to do with any lore and are just destroying any immersion left in the game !!!

In fact, it makes me head shaking that a company who simulated the ENTIRE milky way just for immersion, destroys all of this with those artificial farming instances well known out of the usual MMOs...and the guy came out with this idea should get fired

When you got used to the money income, why should you do something else anymore ??? No mission running, no REAL bounty hunting for wanted people gives you a comparable income...maybe trading (i didnt tried this out for now) but thats okay, because your risk of losing your cargo woth millions to other people or NPCs is so high...

For me, since i fully recocknized how flawed the whole system is with those low risk, insane high reward farming instances called RES, i can barely motivate me to log into the game !!! And thats not because i am so rich that i dont have goals anymore (i am just fielding a Diamondback Scout)...no because since then, everything feels so wrong


EDIT:
I wanted to add that when starting the game, i was fully prepared for a long long run to become a wealthy pilot, knowing that you first have to make small amounts of money money to get better ships, with thos better ships you make more money,... bringing you finally to a point at which you make millions but with the risk to losing those in an instant...

But lets face the truth, you can make the same MILLIONS with your stock Sidewinder in an RES like the most proficient traders with ships worth hundreds of millions...and thats just wrong