The New Guilds and Player Owned Stations Discussion Thread.

[Fire70]

What an innovative and totally out of the box idea. So surprised that not one post out of the 3,081 posts in this thread so far hasn't suggested this. Maybe we need an entire thread just about Player owned stations and Guilds!

Seriously, every fifth post in this thread has been a variation of the one you posted, unfortunately for you the other four of those five posts have given sensible, legitimate reasons why your scenario won't work in Elite.

Maybe because it is a idea many share because they see how the game could be so much more than the grind fest we have now.. I would more go with 4 out of 5 (although I would dispute that ratio if I could be bothered) have given their opinions to why they do not want it in game. It just so happens you don't want it in game..

Going by this thread more than half of those who voted want both guilds and player owned stations. Hopefully FD will look past the "special" forum posters we have on this forum and start to cater for the wider market...

Maybe if they do that they wouldn't have to milk those on here so much...

 

[Asp Explorer]

That's part of the problem. Certain people want to be "special" by owning stations and declaring themselves as guilds.

 

[Fire70]

That's part of the problem. Certain people want to be "special" by owning stations and declaring themselves as guilds.

So what, if it happened it most likely happen outside the bubble of populated space, how big is the galaxy again? You could have hundreds of guilds owning stations everywhere and the average solo player wouldn't even know their existence...

A bigger issue to why it will never happen is I'm not sure how it would work as a peer 2 peer game...

 

[Asp Explorer]

Exactly - with instancing people looking at their lovely new guild-outpost will never see others in the same location if the matchmaker cannot link their islands.

 

[Julissa Silver]

Hopefully FD will look past the "special" forum posters we have on this forum and start to cater for the wider market...

Hopefully, FD will continue to stand by the evidenced belief that catering to the p3w-p3w-0wnzj00 gang would be a cretinous and self-destructive thing to do.

 

[Fire70]

Exactly - with instancing people looking at their lovely new guild-outpost will never see others in the same location if the matchmaker cannot link their islands.

Well im not totally sure how it would work given peer2peer. I'm sure it could be done but I don't think it would be as good as a persistent universe on one server.

Hopefully, FD will continue to stand by the evidenced belief that catering to the p3w-p3w-0wnzj00 gang would be a cretinous and self-destructive thing to do.

LOL, the evidenced belief, does that even mean anything? Cretinous and destructive, did you quote that from a press release? I would have thought FD wouldn't use that sort of terminology (especially since in this poll more that half of the respondents want bases and guilds!!).

Again if something like this was introduced I am pretty sure it wouldn't be in downtown Sol, or Lave but it would be in the boonies outside the current populated areas. If you wanted to have nothing to do with either the guilds of guild owned stations then you wouldn't have to..

So I have no idea why a minority of players are so against this...

 

[Asp Explorer]

So I have no idea why a minority of players are so against this...

You just need to have a quick look at the Groups thread in this forum, or have a peek on reddit to see why.

 

[Mohrgan]

Why is this stuff still going on? We already know what FD's approach to player groups is going to be. Associating/Adopting minor factions. It is all happening through Zac on the Dangerous Groups forum. That is where the focus should be.

 

[Fire70]

You just need to have a quick look at the Groups thread in this forum, or have a peek on reddit to see why.

I see the arguments (well not Reddit) but given IF this was to happen does anybody really think that it would affect anybody who doesn't want it to? The galaxy is huge in the game and how may stations would actually be constructed? Not enough to make a big difference but it make make a big difference to how decides to buy the game.

Re Guilds the big benefit there would be it would tell you who belongs to what i.e. Code as opposed to having no real idea now. The current "no guilds" police hasn't actually stopped guilds it has just made it harder to see them.

 

[Julissa Silver]

So I have no idea why a minority of players are so against this...

To summarise everybody would be unfair and arguably an impossible task. However, that those most ardently pro this 'feature' repeatedly and willfully disregard any point that proves inconvenient to what they're trying to say, and universally display a total lack of respect for other players' freedom to choose their own playing style speaks volumes as to why players as a collective, me included, could not ever be trusted to let this in.

- - - Updated - - -

Why is this stuff still going on? We already know what FD's approach to player groups is going to be.

Because a hardcore minority will continue to insist and, unless at least a few people speak out to remind everyone why it's not going to happen (and shouldn't happen), it will only embolden those demands. Kinda sucks that we have to keep going through it over and over, but it is what it is.

 

[Asp Explorer]

The current "no guilds" police hasn't actually stopped guilds it has just made it harder to see them.

Not only that - it has given them no recognition beyond some Galnet news fluff, no reputation, no ownership, no backing, no significance, and thus no "power".

I really hope it stays that way. Player run groups can back FD based factions all they like - I think that is a good gameplay mechanic. I'm all up for the Bacon Cats, Drunks of Sol, CODE, EIC, Rangers, everyone take part in that too. I just never want to see player run groups displace FD based factions.

 

[Fire70]

To summarise everybody would be unfair and arguably an impossible task. However, that those most ardently pro this 'feature' repeatedly and willfully disregard any point that proves inconvenient to what they're trying to say, and universally display a total lack of respect for other players' freedom to choose their own playing style speaks volumes as to why players as a collective, me included, could not ever be trusted to let this in.

You could have just spoke simple English instead of trying to sound smart , then I would have just replied in kind.

If a player wants to be a moron they will whether they are in a guild or not. In fact from my experience with other game (not EVE, never played it) guilds actually keep more control on their members as opposed to the rouge morons we have now..

Hate to repeat things BUT do you really think IF they introduced guilds and guild owned stations they would be in the current inhabited space? I could never see that happening for the reasons you say, they shouldn't have to affect those who don't want to be involved.

If it did happen it would be in a separate area well away from inhabited space so only those who want to be apart of that style of game could.

I think people always get scared that it would be a free for all live EVE but it wouldn't have to be..

Given it seem that judging by the poll that the majority are all for guilds and stations, why should a minority be able to stop this?

 

[Asp Explorer]

Given it seem that judging by the poll that the majority are all for guilds and stations, why should a minority be able to stop this?

You live in the US so this should be exceedingly simple.

Executive Order.

 

[M00ka]

I see the arguments (well not Reddit) but given IF this was to happen does anybody really think that it would affect anybody who doesn't want it to? The galaxy is huge in the game and how may stations would actually be constructed? Not enough to make a big difference but it make make a big difference to how decides to buy the game.

Re Guilds the big benefit there would be it would tell you who belongs to what i.e. Code as opposed to having no real idea now. The current "no guilds" police hasn't actually stopped guilds it has just made it harder to see them.

I had to kind of pick which post of yours I would reply to, seems ASP and co had done a pretty good job on them.

But to throw my 2c worth in on your post: the problem is very few guilds would want their bright, shiny station out in deep space. They will want it, at minimum, inside the edge of the population bubble, if not right smack bang in the middle of it all. Why you ask, because they need the other guilds/groups/players/NPC. If they were out by themselves they defeat their own purpose of existence. Who are they going to gang up on, who are they going to fight, who are they going to protect their station from if their nearest populated system is 2,000 light years away. They won't fight each other, that is a given. No, they will want their bubble of space as close to centre of the action as possible.

 

[Fire70]

I had to kind of pick which post of yours I would reply to, seems ASP and co had done a pretty good job on them.

But to throw my 2c worth in on your post: the problem is very few guilds would want their bright, shiny station out in deep space. They will want it, at minimum, inside the edge of the population bubble, if not right smack bang in the middle of it all. Why you ask, because they need the other guilds/groups/players/NPC. If they were out by themselves they defeat their own purpose of existence. Who are they going to gang up on, who are they going to fight, who are they going to protect their station from if their nearest populated system is 2,000 light years away. They won't fight each other, that is a given. No, they will want their bubble of space as close to centre of the action as possible.

If somebody wants guilds and guild stations do you think that:

- FD would let them ruin the existing game.
- Just be happy about having guild and station that they didn't care about where they are based.

This isn't EVE and is run by another company so you don't have to worry about what happens over there.

I would suspect that those who want a PVP experience will gravitate to the these areas and join up, obviously NPC's would populate these areas as well.

Those who don't can just keep doing what they are doing, unaffected. It would open up a whole new side of the game..

 

[M00ka]

If somebody wants guilds and guild stations do you think that:

- FD would let them ruin the existing game.
- Just be happy about having guild and station that they didn't care about where they are based.

This isn't EVE and is run by another company so you don't have to worry about what happens over there.

I would suspect that those who want a PVP experience will gravitate to the these areas and join up, obviously NPC's would populate these areas as well.

Those who don't can just keep doing what they are doing, unaffected. It would open up a whole new side of the game..

My turn

I certainly hope FD won't let them ruin the game and the easiest way would be to not allow it to begin with!

Going by a lot of the pro Guild respondents on this thread, they want to be in the thick of the action. But using your scenario, just what will this Guild do with their station in the middle of nowhere? Fighting NPCs would get boring for those that crave PVP - which seems to go hand in hand with Guilds as it is all about player interaction. And unless 'thought who want a PVP experience will gravitate to the (sic) these areas and join up', well yes, maybe another guild will fly in formation the 2,000ly distance to attack the other guild but I can't see any non-aligned player flying all that way just to join a Guild and shoot NPCs.

But you are wrong in your last sentence - what you are proposing WILL effect everyone. It has been pounded at us that those who want Guilds etc., only want them in Open. That means that any player who plays in Open will be effected. It could be as simple as having to dodge that Guild owned area. It could be as bad as being denied that bit of space to everyone unless they are Guild members. That is not what Elite is all about.

 

[Fire70]

My turn

I certainly hope FD won't let them ruin the game and the easiest way would be to not allow it to begin with!

Going by a lot of the pro Guild respondents on this thread, they want to be in the thick of the action. But using your scenario, just what will this Guild do with their station in the middle of nowhere? Fighting NPCs would get boring for those that crave PVP - which seems to go hand in hand with Guilds as it is all about player interaction. And unless 'thought who want a PVP experience will gravitate to the (sic) these areas and join up', well yes, maybe another guild will fly in formation the 2,000ly distance to attack the other guild but I can't see any non-aligned player flying all that way just to join a Guild and shoot NPCs.

But you are wrong in your last sentence - what you are proposing WILL effect everyone. It has been pounded at us that those who want Guilds etc., only want them in Open. That means that any player who plays in Open will be effected. It could be as simple as having to dodge that Guild owned area. It could be as bad as being denied that bit of space to everyone unless they are Guild members. That is not what Elite is all about.

I would imagine they would be in the thick of the action but it wouldn't be the same action we have now. FD would never allow that..

If a guild v guild thing is popular you would find that players would gravitate that way and again they would be in the thick of the action. The problem would be for the rest of us having no one around..

We do have 2 form of guilds now:

Unofficial ones like the Code, Nova Fleet (XBox) etc but who would know if a player is in a guild??

Power Play is a guild and players control their destiny some what...

I am not really affected by either type now, I don't think letting a guild or guild run stations would be any different. I would just avoid the area, (or go solo) it is a massive galaxy...

 

[Robert Maynard]

(especially since in this poll more that half of the respondents want bases and guilds!!).

As you correctly say, over half of the *respondents* to this poll want bases and Guilds. However, participation in the poll is not limited to those who own the game, thus rendering the poll meaningless.

 

[Fire70]

However, participation in the poll is not limited to those who own the game, thus rendering the poll meaningless.

Are you saying players created false accounts to vote in it? Pretty pointless really..

 

[Robert Maynard]

Are you saying players created false accounts to vote in it? Pretty pointless really..

Nope - just that there is no link between forum membership and game ownership - therefore no guarantee that all of those who voted actually own the game.