Cost of Horizon vs Star Citizen Price Model

[hunvagy]

Uh... Which ship costs that much? The only packages that I've seen that cost anywhere near that much are multi-ship packages.
And as far as I've seen the game's been in development for not nearly as long as some people seem to think and I can't imagine anyone expecting it sooner than a year from now... Christmas? Can I have some of what you're having?

Why, yes, I do believe you'd have to 'play to win'. Can't hope to win if you don't participate, after all. Not sure I've ever heard of an Idle to Win game.
Yes, I realize what you meant, but your ranting is getting a bit silly at this point so can you blame me for poking fun? Anyway, I've played games that people tried to call Pay To Win, when, in fact, they were Pay to Advance games. War Thunder, for instance, has many problems... the fact people can pay real money for premium currency and then spend it on vehicles in-game isn't really one of them. Again, plenty of 'wallet warriors' die because they just don't have any skill jumping straight into a high-tier aircraft and getting shot down by people who have been playing for months. The games that are Pay to Win have things like Golden Ammo in World of Tanks that you can only get by paying real money, and guarantee more effective shots or some such nonsense. Buying vehicles everyone else can get just doesn't cut it. Too many Fw 190 D-13 newbie pilots that get themselves thrashed in War Thunder are evidence of that.

Let alone the fact most of those massive, expensive ships require other players to operate well, to my knowledge. I can't see a single player in a Javelin Destroyer doing very well against a coordinated group of Mustangs or other small craft.

Honestly, the only problem I have with the assault of the ship packs is that RSI is starting to look like the Zen store in STO. 5 million variants for every ship. Kinda puts a damper on the possibility of modifying the ships, doesn't it? Why would I buy another model of the Freelancer, just to get more cargo space? Can't I just rejiggle the internal components? If this really goes into the live game, you'll be running out of hangar space quick if you need 3 ships just to have 3 different configs for your one ship.

 

[sun_tzu]

Different games & different models so not much point in comparing directy
I would say that although elite is not p4w as an original elite player I have had to buy a new gaming PC, and a HOTAS plus I was a beta backer and have now brought a lifetime pass so overall I have spend a couple thousand pounds to play elite.

As such I'm probably not going to be put off by paying $500 or more for a ship if I like the look of star citizen.

 

[Kazacy]

You are a pirate ?

Pirate when i am in the mood; most of the time i am just a killer/assassin/hired gun.

 

[Cmdr Ultra]

See you in the 'verse, the 100 hand-crafted star system SC Universe that is. Where all your dreams come true.

Be a peaceful trader, hijacking pirate, run a drug empire, galactic cop, crafter of hats - all things to all people; it will be a new era in gaming. Plus no griefing.

 

[Agrar Therenus]

I am just curious why there are so many complainers about Horizons Season 2 cost. When Star Citizen releases 1 ship for 900$ USD that you cannot even fly yet!

This not a Elite is better than Star Citizen tread or the other way around.. I am not comparing game differences but price models.

Frontier says hey we have Season 2 where you will be able to:
· Land on planet, with all the varied game play (SRV, etc)
· Have Co-Pilots / Multi Crew ships
· Loot and crafting
· Character Creator (Which is looking sweet and a surprise)
· Ships count going to 30+ with more to come and more SRV types as well.

So many people are hey that is ......it costs too much! I will agree that is not cheap, but I think Frontier is giving us our moneys worth when all these features are implemented.

Here is Star Citizen releasing ships for 900$, I have paid 60$ USD for the game. Started on 1.1 right before wings came out. I like this game enough that I bought the Life Time Expansion pass for around 180$ USD with the exchange rate. So right around 240$ USD I have the game, and every expansion that will every come out for this game until Frontier decides they are done and the game is complete as is.

I will still need to pay Star Citizen another 660$ before I would "own" this ship, which seems crazy too me... compared to Elite, $ to value I think it wins hands down.

I wonder why Star Citizen fans will gladly pay 900$ for a ship that is a concept, Frontier says 60 for the expansion and people on Elite forums blow up and say that it is too much, when you are getting way more than just a ship, but a ton of content.

Just for the record, I hope Star Citizen is successful there are not enough good space games out there and I hope it proves to AAA publishers that there is a market for space sims and we will get more than just the next COD and BF going forward in the future.

Shout out to Frontier for making this awesome additive game!


http://www.bluesnews.com/s/165536/star-citizen_s-usd-900-ship

The Roberts Space Industries website is now selling another virtual ship for Star Citizen with an eye-popping price tag. The new ship for Cloud Imperium's upcoming space combat game is the Endeavor-class research vessel, described as "a fully modular space platform designed to be adapted for a variety of scientific and medical tasks." The outlay for this is $900.00 USD, which is 15 times the price of the typical AAA game, and more than enough to buy a gaming PC. Here's more on the Endeavor: "Initially developed as a floating laboratory, the MISC Endeavor can be outfitted for everything from spatial telescopy to use as mobile hospital."

You're argument is extremely flawed. You don't need to buy any of those ships, they are just extras.

Horizons is not an 'extra' optional boost, it is part of the core game-- not to buy it means you are seriously missing out. One isn't missing out on the core game if one chooses not to buy any of the ships-- indeed you can buy the base game with Arena Commander for less than £30, and it includes a Mustang or the other starter ship who's name escapes me. In fact that is exactly what I did-- and I bought the other ship for about £15. So that's £45 spent on SC with two ships in the hangar and full beta access.

However, I am not really bothered that much about paying another £40 for Horizons, because I realise that this isn't a subscription based game with regular content patches, that has to be funded somehow. As The Mighty Jingles said - being a totally British-based affair - this was always destined to have nothing like the following and budget of Star Citizen, that game has hugely more money to spend on stuff.

I don't think it's unreasonable to consider that after Star Citizen launches, there will be paid expansions down the line.

 

[Badben]

Uh... Which ship costs that much? The only packages that I've seen that cost anywhere near that much are multi-ship packages.
And as far as I've seen the game's been in development for not nearly as long as some people seem to think and I can't imagine anyone expecting it sooner than a year from now... Christmas? Can I have some of what you're having?

Why, yes, I do believe you'd have to 'play to win'. Can't hope to win if you don't participate, after all. Not sure I've ever heard of an Idle to Win game.
Yes, I realize what you meant, but your ranting is getting a bit silly at this point so can you blame me for poking fun? Anyway, I've played games that people tried to call Pay To Win, when, in fact, they were Pay to Advance games. War Thunder, for instance, has many problems... the fact people can pay real money for premium currency and then spend it on vehicles in-game isn't really one of them. Again, plenty of 'wallet warriors' die because they just don't have any skill jumping straight into a high-tier aircraft and getting shot down by people who have been playing for months. The games that are Pay to Win have things like Golden Ammo in World of Tanks that you can only get by paying real money, and guarantee more effective shots or some such nonsense. Buying vehicles everyone else can get just doesn't cut it. Too many Fw 190 D-13 newbie pilots that get themselves thrashed in War Thunder are evidence of that.

Let alone the fact most of those massive, expensive ships require other players to operate well, to my knowledge. I can't see a single player in a Javelin Destroyer doing very well against a coordinated group of Mustangs or other small craft.

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pledge/Combos/The-Completionist-Digital

This is the package that costs $17,850. yes it includes every ship, but seriously? I can buy an actual car for that price. Sorry if you think my ranting is silly, I thought this was a forum where people can express their opinions. don't read it if you think it's silly, and don't quote me if you want me to stop. As for pay to win or advance to win, it's irrelevant, I don't like games that feature wallet warriors of any kind, it ruins immersion and creates a bad dynamic between players. and lets just say someone pays $900 for a ship, and is toast on day 1 to some mustangs because they're not skilled enough. If that was me, I'd throw my controller through my screen! Or some dudes in mustangs steal your $900 ship because they're more skilled, now they have a ship I paid $900 bucks for, while they only paid $35? That would leave me feeling totally scammed!

 

[Agrar Therenus]

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/pledge/Combos/The-Completionist-Digital

This is the package that costs $17,850. yes it includes every ship, but seriously? I can buy an actual car for that price. Sorry if you think my ranting is silly, I thought this was a forum where people can express their opinions. don't read it if you think it's silly, and don't quote me if you want me to stop. As for pay to win or advance to win, it's irrelevant, I don't like games that feature wallet warriors of any kind, it ruins immersion and creates a bad dynamic between players. and lets just say someone pays $900 for a ship, and is toast on day 1 to some mustangs because they're not skilled enough. If that was me, I'd throw my controller through my screen! Or some dudes in mustangs steal your $900 ship because they're more skilled, now they have a ship I paid $900 bucks for, while they only paid $35? That would leave me feeling totally scammed!

That's why it's a paid-for OPTIONAL EXTRA, you absolutely do not need to spend money like that to get the actual full game.

That's up to people if they are willing to spend that much on fluff, like ED there is an insurance system to it isn't as simple as losing a ship once, lose it forever.

If you are going to post opinions in PUBLIC FORUMS, expect them to be challenged. If you don't like people doing this, then why post it?

You are entitled to an opinion; you are not entitled to not have it questioned by those with differing opinions.

 

[Kazacy]

That's why it's a paid-for OPTIONAL EXTRA, you absolutely do not need to spend money like that to get the actual full game.

That's up to people if they are willing to spend that much on fluff.

If you are going to post opinions in PUBLIC FORUMS, expect them to be challenged. If you don't like people doing this, then why post it?

My opinion about this: it's a scam and they try to get max from gullible idiots.

 

[Stormhawk]

Well i cant help myself in seeing a ripoff or scam in SC. You dont even have a game there still.

I see a very shiny tech demo, so far, that shows much promise- don't know what you've been looking at. And I hear they'll be showing off S42 at an expo or something soon.

ED however is already running a good year and got several updates. Some expanson and the price is fair.

It's been running for a year and I still don't think I got my Beta pay-in's worth. I was hoping for more improvement and iteration on the game by now than has actually come to pass, and then there's the CQC to satisfy the Xboners when that effort could have been put towards improving the core game more readily.

Look at Starcraft 2, the game did cost 50€ and zerg and protoss mission where not included. Then they asked another 40€ for the Zerg missions and now another 40€ for the Protos.
Same wirth Diabolo 3 expansion costs extra.

Look at the Season passes of other games or DLC.

And I still think all of those things are a bit too pricy for what they are, as well. Diablo 2's expansion was more reasonably-priced. DLC and 'season passes' that I've gotten in the past have been decidedly more reasonably-priced than an expansion costing as much as a full new game- said season passes usually didn't cost more than half the price of the main game and gave expansion-level content, generally, with all those DLC combined (especially when including new campaigns).

Complaining about Horizons price seem pretty much stupid to me.

Otherwise paying big amounts of money for ships in some unfinished game looks even more stupid.

I agree that paying big amounts of money for ships in some unfinished game looks even more stupid. I wouldn't spend $300USD just to get a multi-crew ship when I could have a quite capable single-man vessel for $50 or so along with the game itself, or just a starter setup and the game for even less than that and work that little ways up to a more capable vessel. The only reason to spend ridiculous amounts on 'pledge' ship sets is if you just really want to back the game that much and get a 'gift' for your contribution, and for those who feel like doing that, it's their money. Doesn't really bother me.

And as I already implied, I feel expansions should have more reasonable prices in general. Blizzard is a poor example of late- their expansions have gone up in relative price over the years.

Honestly, the only problem I have with the assault of the ship packs is that RSI is starting to look like the Zen store in STO. 5 million variants for every ship. Kinda puts a damper on the possibility of modifying the ships, doesn't it? Why would I buy another model of the Freelancer, just to get more cargo space? Can't I just rejiggle the internal components? If this really goes into the live game, you'll be running out of hangar space quick if you need 3 ships just to have 3 different configs for your one ship.

5 million variants seems like a bit of an exaggeration... but I understand your concern. As I hear, you can, in fact, adjust these ships to suit your needs. Certainly weapons and propulsion seem modular. And I'm not sure how they're handling hangar space, if it's even being limited at all or not. As far as I saw with a little test-run on the game when they were giving people access codes for a week or so in the past month or so, there seemed to be modular, infinitely expanding hangar space dependent on the ships available.

 

[Cmdr Ultra]

My opinion about this: it's a scam and they try to get max from gullible idiots.

QFT..........

 

[AnnuverScotinExile]

Remember the 'near godlike powers' promised to some backers? Equally terrible, and thank the Maker it didnt came through...

Wrong. Again. The near god-like powers were to help FD in adminstering the galaxy. Nothing to do with in-game advantage, which the DDF rejected out of hand multiple times.

The fact that FD have failed to deliver on a clear promise that encourage over 100 people to spend a lot more money is a disgrace.

 

[Bran Tse Mallory]

Pirate when i am in the mood; most of the time i am just a killer/assassin/hired gun.

+Rep for some refreshing honesty!

Back on topic.

Cost is set by the supplier while value is decided by the buyer.

Both games are offering products which we as the consumer can judge the value of to us as individuals. Some people are fine with paying $900+ for a virtual object while others see this as madness. The uproar when FD announced the price for Horizons was a prime example.

If FD had announced a new game which allowed you to pilot a space ship in orbit around a lifeless world and land on it, drive a buggy, explore and that through the year they would add more free content we would all be lapping it up and boarding the hype train without a care in the world about the cost of £40. However as it is an expansion a lot of people are not used to paying this price for what they see as just more content but will still drop £40+ on this years version of CoD or BF along with premium membership, all of which are just slight re-skins of last years offerings.

Not got a lot of money for games? Well at less than a £1 a week you can save for the game - You do not need to own everything on day one of release! This is true for both games as well as the various options available to those who wish to buy the game.

I remember playing the WC series of games and always feeling a little empty inside as they did not fill the gap left by Elite. I will get SC but as I don't value the IP I can wait until it is less than £20 on Steam. Elite however means a lot more to me, holds a lot of memories and so I value playing it much more. Hence I am prepared to pay the full price per year without question.

 

[Katie Byrne]

I've preordered Horizons. The price didnt bother me, its basically a years worth of extra content. I'll buy all future Seasons too at the same pricing level. I would much rather they do this every year than introduce a subscription.

 

[hunvagy]

5 million variants seems like a bit of an exaggeration... but I understand your concern. As I hear, you can, in fact, adjust these ships to suit your needs. Certainly weapons and propulsion seem modular. And I'm not sure how they're handling hangar space, if it's even being limited at all or not. As far as I saw with a little test-run on the game when they were giving people access codes for a week or so in the past month or so, there seemed to be modular, infinitely expanding hangar space dependent on the ships available.

Yeah I understand, just leaves a bad taste in my mouth. It's like the rollout of a new store only ship in STO. "Here you go, the new MVAE, just now in 9 different models. 120 Euros pl0x." There was a time I was ready to buy the oddball new ship if it aligned with my tastes. Nowadays I just laugh at it. And yeah, I know these ships are all in-game in the case of SC, but still, the precedent is there. To be honest I was on the fence last march which game to get on board with, and it was almost Star Citizen, I was almost ready to dish out the cash for the Freelancer. But then I saw Scott Manley land an eagle and show off the model in outfitting. And I had a change of heart

On a sidenote, many imaginary muffins for your Signature featuring an awesome WC: Privateer ship

 

[Fost]

Taking this much money off people for something that isn't even complete (til at least 2017) really worries me. Feels like the same approach of people who sell MLM schemes.

I really hope for the sake of everyone who's paid already that is pans out.


It's actually this fact that stopped me backing. I'll wait until it's released and make a decision then.

 

[Stormhawk]

I remember playing the WC series of games and always feeling a little empty inside as they did not fill the gap left by Elite. I will get SC but as I don't value the IP I can wait until it is less than £20 on Steam. Elite however means a lot more to me, holds a lot of memories and so I value playing it much more. Hence I am prepared to pay the full price per year without question.

But isn't it already that much right now? Last I checked the basic package for the game costs around that much in GBP... I'm not entirely sure on conversion rates, but it should be pretty close.

 

[Agrar Therenus]

The Elite: Dangerous fanboys need to tone it down a bit.

I love both games, and I can't see either business model having any problems. Star Citizen is a massively more expensive project; and those people who yell 'scam' don't even know what the word 'scam' means. It is in development-- games take YEARS to make, least of all a game as amazingly complex and deep as Star Citizen (and no that's not me saying it's more deep that Elite-- in some ways ED is deeper). The ED fanboys need to go and watch the multi-crew module video, and understand that IS the core game, albeit limited to a test zone.

Both games are very different. It is very understandable why ED asks for the price of a full game for Horizons-- money for development has to come from somewhere, and I see that as simply paying an MMO sub fee upfront (indeed rather less than the asking price of WoW, and you'll get a lot more for your money with ED).
Star Citizen is much more glitzy, with it's very advanced graphics and approach to releasing the 'complete' game at once -- that requires more time and even more money upfront. No-one HAS to buy expensive ships on the store - it won't make your game any more complete - it is just a way to pledge more money OPTIONALLY to increase the budget of the game. Are any of you modern-thinking enough to understand the costs of game development these days? Star Citizen will have a single-player campaign as well.

The fact of the matter you can't dispute is you CAN buy the 'complete' (as in with FPS, walking around, multi-crews) Star Citizen game for £30 or so; so it makes sense to have a pledge store to compensate for that lower entry fee cost.

Anyone who knows anything about games understand that a game like SC requires many millions to make. By that token anyone looking at ED appreciates it's quite impressive the game produced for the very low cost, but it's still obvious why SC costs so much more-- crafted content requires more attention because you have to make the assets; whereas ED is almost entirely generated so it's more a case of coding the generation-- that's cheaper.

I am committed to both games equally, because they don't compete in my eyes-- they are both very different games.

Crafted universes are as good as generated ones, both have their advantages and disadvantages. You'd be happier if you learnt to like both games.

 

[Verz]

I bought the game sometime ago and just received my hard copy too (for the shelf/collection purposes) oh...I also bought it on xbox. If a hard copy is released for Xbox. I'll probably get that too. This game has brought me more entertainment and joy like no other. I've met a lot of great people, the community online is one of the best I have ever seen. I will continue supporting Frontier with Elite. I have no problems paying 40 pounds for a year. I could always go down the pub and blow even more money than that for headache in the morning.

Now....I need a paint pack for the SquEagle...

 

[Bran Tse Mallory]

But isn't it already that much right now? Last I checked the basic package for the game costs around that much in GBP... I'm not entirely sure on conversion rates, but it should be pretty close.

£23.40 is the cheapest package at the moment or a £7.80 monthly subscription. I'm not paying for a game that is not complete nor do I pay subscriptions for beta access

I could buy it now but as it's not a game I was hyped about I can leave it until I have the need for another game. Right now between work and Elite there really isn't time for anything else... Except of course time with the wife!

 

[Mephane]

Ive got nothing against ED's price model at all.

But thought id pick at one point from the OP

"Frontier says hey we have Season 2 where you will be able to:
· Land on planet, with all the varied game play (SRV, etc)
· Have Co-Pilots / Multi Crew ships
· Loot and crafting
· Character Creator (Which is looking sweet and a surprise)
· Ships count going to 30+ with more to come and more SRV types as well."

Isnt all that built into SC anyway, and you can buy the base game for just £30, so if you're comparing SC with Horizons price model - SC wins in terms of value for money?

Think of it this way: your potential higher value/money ratio is subsidized by people who spend hundreds or thousand of bucks on spaceships. If it weren't for that, they couldn't aim at completing all those features for the initial release.

That said, this value/money ratio is purely quantitative here, based on the number of bullet points in a list of various features. It doesn't even tell you anything about the quality of the execution.