FAS vs FDL turn rates and ramming tested

MJC

MJC
Hello Cmdr's,

I did a side by side test of Federal Assault Ship and Fer de Lance which you can see in the short video. Results were expected - much better pitch for FAS. Yaw I wont even mention. Better mass lock factor. Same or better speed. More practical hardpoints. More power. Apart from shields and smaller profile FDL has nothing really going for it.

You can draw your own conclusions. I have already seen Imperial Cmdr's in Neche flying FAS. Oh, dear me... ;)

[video=youtube;0j7YcXng6lg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0j7YcXng6lg[/video]
 

Marshall...

Marshall...
Thanks for posting. Could you also do a comparison using the Gunship? I would be interested in seeing the ramming damage... Or the damage 7 rails could do!
 
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Kyokushin

Kyokushin
Rank, money, doesnt matter. You can grind money or rank. Important things are a overall punch (firepower/speed/strength) and rebuy cost.
Combat fitted FAS have the same rebuy cost and have more pros than FDL.
I am going to get FAS to collection.
 
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Evil

Evil
The turn rates are so good on the FAS and turning means firing first or more, you can't purchase that or upgrade it on any ship, priceless. :D
 

Kyokushin

Kyokushin
And FAS have 1 km/h better speed in combat build, and boost more frequently, and in overall FAS can masslock FDL and FDL cant 'run'. FAS will always get FDL because is slighty faster.

Anything i need are paintjobs for... FAS.

king is dead long live the king

FAS give everything good from a Clipper + fixed guns :)
 
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tawittle

tawittle
In general the 2 medium/2 large setup is easier to use, but if you put 4 multi-cannons and a huge PA on the FDL it does way more hull damage than the FAS. The FDL has better hardpoint placement too, the mediums on the FAS are placed quite poorly (although the ship turns fast to help compensate).

The FDL is still good because you can have 850 MJ of shields (4 boosters) on it and it does insane hull dps. Even with 3 boosters you only have 350 MJ of shields on the FAS!

It's useful to have 1 FAS in a wing so you have a ship that can chase down and masslock FDLs, but they're made of paper. FAS is much easier to kill than a FDL because its so easy to get their shields down, plus it's easier to hit the FAS compared to the FDL. The FAS may have more armor, but the FDL has higher resistances (one of its perks is increased resistance to small/medium weapons), and a much sleeker, harder to hit profile. Overall I'd say the FDL can honestly take more of a hull beating, never mind the shields.

Overall I think the balance is pretty good: its balanced so its useful to have clippers, FDLs, and FASs in your group, before the balance of clipper stacking was kinda annoying)
 
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Kyokushin

Kyokushin
Mate, if you get 850 MJ to FDL you will not get even single shot, and cellbank because there is NO POWER.
Shield capacity is not important. On combat FAS you will get around 420 MJ, on combat FDL around 580 MJ, because you need to get cellbanks.
And FAS have BIGGER shields at all, because you can get better cellbank and you have one slot more.

For 4 C PA you also need a POWER and 4 cPA means basic 450 shields on FDL without anythinkg... and 4c multi? yes, good for hull, but not for shields....
... and 4 C PA - most useless weapon. You can hit only NPC python/conda by it. Forget about it in PvP.
 
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MJC

MJC
Liqua said:
For the FAS you need an appropriate Federation faction rating.

Do you need something for an FDL ? (Not bought one - no where near enough cash yet so honestly don't know)
Click to expand...

No, you dont need rank for FDL. Just about 63milion. For me cash is not the problem (done my grind in gamma and 1.0) - now I just pew pew and want to enjoy it. After Cobra FDL felt like a brick - a fast and powerful brick. Looking to FAS now as I want to enjoy my flying as much as people in eagle and vulture do.
BTW what ship are you flying Liqua ?
 

tawittle

tawittle
Kyokushin said:
Mate, if you get 850 MJ to FDL you will not get even single shot, and cellbank because there is NO POWER.
Shield capacity is not important. On combat FAS you will get around 420 MJ, on combat FDL around 580 MJ, because you need to get cellbanks.
And FAS have BIGGER shields at all, because you can get better cellbank and you have one slot more.

For 4 C PA you also need a POWER and 4 cPA means basic 450 shields on FDL without anythinkg... and 4c multi? yes, good for hull, but not for shields....
... and 4 C PA - most useless weapon. You can hit only NPC python/conda by it. Forget about it in PvP.
Click to expand...

Shield capacity is very important. The longer your shields stay up, the longer you go without taking damage. If you bring the FDL into pvp you definitely want at least 3 shield boosters if not 4. There are lots of ways to manage the power on the FDL. You need to have everything bound to a power plant priority, and believe me its probably the only ship that will make you wish there were more than 5 states. I don't think you are very good at power management....I have it set up so i can either have 850 MJ shields + 4 multicannons+SCB or 850 MJ shields + 2 multicannons + PA or 750 MJ + 4 multicannons + PA, I toggle the PA and a SB to move between those 3 states. I'm sure you could get even better power setups if you go A life support and turn it off during combat, and use B shield cell banks instead of A.

It's true that the FAS has nearly twice the capacity in SCB, but FDL still has twice as strong shields. And while you may get to 430MJ with a prismatic shield, most people don't have that luxury and will get to a meager 350MJ with 3 boosters, far worse than the clipper, which is known to have weak shields.

4 multi cannons will shred hull, and do surprising shield damage. I don't think you've seen what 4 multicanonns can do to a ship's shields. If you can't hit players with the 4 PA, you probably need more practice/better setup. I can hit players with it fairly easily.
 
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MJC

MJC
tawittle said:
It's useful to have 1 FAS in a wing so you have a ship that can chase down and masslock FDLs, but they're made of paper. FAS is much easier to kill than a FDL because its so easy to get their shields down, plus it's easier to hit the FAS compared to the FDL. The FAS may have more armor, but the FDL has higher resistances (one of its perks is increased resistance to small/medium weapons), and a much sleeker, harder to hit profile. Overall I'd say the FDL can honestly take more of a hull beating, never mind the shields.

Overall I think the balance is pretty good: its balanced so its useful to have clippers, FDLs, and FASs in your group, before the balance of clipper stacking was kinda annoying)
Click to expand...

Well I heard a recent pvp report. 2 FDL vs 2 FAS. Although FAS shields went down they were impossible to kill. Hull can take ages to bring down. Also one of the FDL's was surprised by FAS ramming ability. Pulse lasers did nothing to FAS hull. As we cant blow up powerplant anymore it will take ages to kill it. Oh yes and it cant be mass locked by FDL so it can jump at any time.
With the new subsystem damage model a new possibility opens up : HULL tanking. Combined with silent running, and ramming potential this can be a deadly weapon. It will certainly add to variety in combat.

I do agree with you that 1 FAS is good to have in a mixed wing. We were discussing this last night.
 

Midnight Sun

M
ShadowWolf Kell said:
I expect the FAS will be getting the Python treatment before long. Calling it now.
Click to expand...

That would be a terrible mistake, because the FAS is the only upgrade from a Vulture for people who like dogfighting without any funny stuff like FAoff or flying backwards.

By all means make it harder to buy, maybe even make it less powerful, but please keep it nimble.
 

Starender

Starender
the FAS is good but the shield is so bad and you only have 4 utilitiy slots, if you grab 2 chaffs and 1 kws you have only 1 shield booster that's only 255 MJ of shield which is very bad

the FdL while having less maneuverability have a much better shield ratio and 6 utility slots, you can grab the same as above with 2 more shield boosters for above 600 MJ of shield, and the huge hardpoint is a big ship reaper


overhaul you're still safer in an FdL, but i agree it needs a little buff (a bit more agility/jump)
 

Kyokushin

Kyokushin
tawittle said:
Shield capacity is very important. The longer your shields stay up, the longer you go without taking damage. If you bring the FDL into pvp you definitely want at least 3 shield boosters if not 4. There are lots of ways to manage the power on the FDL. You need to have everything bound to a power plant priority, and believe me its probably the only ship that will make you wish there were more than 5 states. I don't think you are very good at power management....I have it set up so i can either have 850 MJ shields + 4 multicannons+SCB or 850 MJ shields + 2 multicannons + PA or 750 MJ + 4 multicannons + PA, I toggle the PA and a SB to move between those 3 states. I'm sure you could get even better power setups if you go A life support and turn it off during combat, and use B shield cell banks instead of A.

It's true that the FAS has nearly twice the capacity in SCB, but FDL still has twice as strong shields. And while you may get to 430MJ with a prismatic shield, most people don't have that luxury and will get to a meager 350MJ with 3 boosters, far worse than the clipper, which is known to have weak shields.

4 multi cannons will shred hull, and do surprising shield damage. I don't think you've seen what 4 multicanonns can do to a ship's shields. If you can't hit players with the 4 PA, you probably need more practice/better setup. I can hit players with it fairly easily.
Click to expand...

Sure. You can toggle it in a battle :) And you will die in meantime of toggling. 4 MC made a little scratch to shields, nothing else.
And try to aim from fixed. Gimballs in PvP just do not exists, because almost everyone have 2x chaffs and gimballs does about 25% less dmg.
Capacity is not important, imporant is overall MJ in shields capacity + cellbank, these both components. And a SCB build easy to manage during the battle. In FDL you have not many SCB slots and low class. In FAS you have more MJ at all. You just need to make a one SCB toggle, but it should be easy for You.
Even clipper have better shields than FDL if pilot know how manage it. If someone claim a Clipper have weak shields, he should just play more and more and more, until he withdraws these words :)
FDL have only one advantage over clipper, and this advantage have any other ship. Clipper cant use a fixed guns. FAS can.
 
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Kyokushin

Kyokushin
FAS is a gamechanger. We just need to deal with it (just bought one before they make it harder to get :D )

FDL owners club will hate it, FED's will love it, and poor will be clicking red button 'buy' over and over ;)
 
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