Update on Alpha 3.0

Dr Wookie

Dr Wookie
jabokai said:
In some ways yes, but as they focus on certain features, narrowing choice, it's clear from the unsilent minorities that the game is simply becoming a "please the majority" effort rather than a game for all (unlike one of the selling points from the Kickstarter - "play the game your way").

Of course you cannot please all the people all the time but in a medium such as games it's one of the easiest where you can allow people to experience it their way, as much as possible, and this is going the opposite way. Very little choice on some of the issues that are coming up time and again - 3rd person view (not even an option in solo player), people cannot turn off the engine vibration even though it's making them feel sick, people still want some kind of PvE option, people want guilds, people would like X Y Z... etc.

They've touted the group facility as a way for people to play in private groups and yet the only option on group creation is whether crimes are counted against other players or AI and whether bountied players get kicked out to the All group. Why not boost this system and have options for game changing features above (e.g. 3rd person, PvE, guilds) at group creation as well - let people truly play their way? And have personal options for the things that have no effect on gameplay. That's one thing I am irritated about - it's nothing less than spiteful to argue against options that won't affect your game at all. Arguing against things that do change the nature of the game seems perfectly reasonable of course.

I still intend to play the game but in many ways the choices made are edging me into a position where it's likely it'll be a pick up and drop game. I'm not angry about that (apologies if my words make it seem so), just a little disappointed. :p
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I would still like to believe that FD are making the game that THEY want to play, rather than trying to appease everyone. Things like third person view, guilds etc. oppose design decisions made when creating the game; to some extent I think you should play other games for those features.

On the other hand, maybe this more simple grouping system is only intended for initial release, and several years down the line people could be grouped by game-changing preference. When their choices don't affect my experience, it would be churlish to argue against them :).
 

Cmdr Eagleboy

Cmdr Eagleboy
I don't think for FD polls have any impact as good, strong arguments for or against feature. Iron man mode was discussed to death (pun intended), and mostly arguments made sense why decision was to make it separate mode.
 

jabokai

jabokai
Pecisk said:
I don't think for FD polls have any impact as good, strong arguments for or against feature. Iron man mode was discussed to death (pun intended), and mostly arguments made sense why decision was to make it separate mode.
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It was Frontier that polled opinion on that, I assume they did it for a reason (probably as result of seeing valid arguments). Same with the PvE option poll.
 

Slawkenbergius

Slawkenbergius
jabokai said:
Fact is that the groups system could be utilised to make more people happy - isn't that a good thing?
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Yeah, I'd like to see it used that way personally. Kind of like how private servers can be set to allow mods, but the public one is vanilla and no sprinkles. I hope Frontier can be convinced of the merit of that. They shouldn't be pestered into it though, which is how it feels with the 3rd person view thing, for example.
 

noodle

noodle
Pecisk said:
Also let's remember - you can't really tell will you enjoy it before trying it. Sometimes our biases gets best of us. Previous experience can ruin lot of interesting perspective.
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Absolutely. I think people are jumping to an awful lot of conclusions about what the finished game is going to be like, and whether it'll be enjoyable. I appreciate the desire for people to have their voices heard while there's still a chance of influencing the direction of the game, but ultimately I'll not me making any judgements until I'm actually playing the finished product.
 

jabokai

jabokai
Slawkenbergius said:
Yeah, I'd like to see it used that way personally. Kind of like how private servers can be set to allow mods, but the public one is vanilla and no sprinkles. I hope Frontier can be convinced of the merit of that. They shouldn't be pestered into it though, which is how it feels with the 3rd person view thing, for example.
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Yep, that kind of server format was what I was thinking for the private groups.

As for the pestering, I think there are a couple of things going on there - people not knowing there has been a discussion about it and starting new threads (fair enough, you can't search for everything to see if it's been said and "3rd" wouldn't show up anyway) and people who really want something repeating their views to get more more exposure to the idea (I'm guilty of that one myself. :p)
 

jabokai

jabokai
Slawkenbergius said:
Whereas I try quite hard not to repeat myself, or say the same thing over and over, or make the same point several times.
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That's a respectable aim of course.

With the same discussions appearing in multiple threads, and with nobody reading every thread (somebody tell me if you do) I tend to assume it's okay - it's kind of like a room of people always coming and going, rather than a 1 to 1, so going over the same stuff is almost inevitable.
 

Amorelia

A
Pecisk said:
In nutshell, developers are not obliged in anyway whatsoever to provide alpha access to anyone. Fact that we can even take active part in testing (which otherway would be done by outsorcing) is privilege. .
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I have no desire for Alpha. I just think it's a ripoff, don't mind saying so, and don't care who disagrees.

The KS tiers were really attractive. Who wouldn't opt for the chance to influence the design of ED if they can afford the time and money?

But now .... if anyone can show me how to get paid for the privilege of doing my job, show me where to sign them up!
 

[VR] Mad Mike

[VR] Mad Mike
If you were forced to buy it it would be a rip off. You are not however so it is no more a rip off than any other product you look at and decide is not good value for you.
 

Amorelia

A
Mad Mike said:
If you were forced to buy it it would be a rip off. You are not however so it is no more a rip off than any other product you look at and decide is not good value for you.
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There's many things I don't buy because I decide they're a ripoff. This is different to saying I feel ripped off (which I would if I had bought them).
 

Calebe

C
People who pledged for alpha access thought it was worthwhile and something they wanted to experience and enjoy. It was there choice. So basically your saying people who willingly paid for it got ripped off, would disagree with you. In fact I am disagreeing with you. I don't feel ripped off, I knew that alpha access would be buggy (phase one was really bug free for the most part), and phase 2 is very playable but at times crashes often. It was what we expected, in fact there were posts saying. This is more like it, we are finally testing things as it does break. People were actually happy about it and posting bug reports left and right.

Ripped off? Maybe it would be for you, so speak for yourself. For me I am enjoying it and not feeling anything but excitement looking forward to alpha 3.0 like the majority of us are.

As for the play it your way I always took it to mean play it in any style you want as an individual. You choose what you want to do, nothing is decided for you in advance. Do what you want, when you want and how you want. Not how we want, or others want, or how FD even wants you to play. If the game supports it, you can do it, if they don't and you have a work around feel free to do it your way. So want a guild organize it outside of the game. Again play it your way but not forced on the rest or supported by people's money against it.

All money raised should be used to better the game for everyone. Not for guild support that will not help people not in a guild. No guild content or special gear. Nothing should be added to the game that anyone person can not have access to playing the game as a lone wolf. In other words, no special content requiring groups to work for it. No items unavailable unless worked on as a group, unless you can get npc's to make it happen. So again a lone wolf has the same exact options as everyone else. If that ever goes by the way side and groups required the play it your way goes out the window. No one wants that I hope.

Calebe
 

Memnoch

M
I agree with everything you wrote, Calebe. I have never once thought myself short changed, cheated or ripped off in any way. I backed this game because it is a game franchise I have enjoyed since I was as kid, and it is part of my soul as a gamer! I have always enjoyed playing sand box games where I get to do what I want within a framework of rules and in my mind this is the grand daddy of them all.
 

Amorelia

A
Calebe said:
Ripped off? Maybe it would be for you, so speak for yourself. For me I am enjoying it and not feeling anything but excitement looking forward to alpha 3.0 like the majority of us are.
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I only ever speak for myself, but thanks for the permission :)

To buy ED Alpha at full-retail today is akin to buying a hot stock. Caveat emptor. I don't listen to the crowd with stock-picks either. I make my own value judgment, as should anyone.
 
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