No imagination from FD on new ship design!

[Ziljan]

I can see your point here and I agree to an extent.
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I think the viper mk IV will have as much a place in PvP as the MkIII or cobra or DBS, it will be competitive with the other 2M/2S hardpoint ships, but outclassed by ships that outclass it. As I said before, I don't necessarily think even a well piloted viper should be able to take out an average piloted FdL or FAS, there is something to be said for bringing in better equipment.

The current Viper/Cobra/DBS all barely have enough speed and agility to not be destroyed in a few seconds by larger ships. If the new Cobra/Viper have 10-15% more firepower, but lose just enough speed to make them easier targets, then they will be utterly destroyed by the same ships that their Mk III versions could just barely out-turn, or out-run.

The only way around this is if they get massive shield updates (like the courier), or loose a tiny bit of speed, but keep more momentum in the boosts. So that their average speed is roughly the same.

 

[Bacalao]

maybe that at frontier work also a 3d artist and some one to paint some tecture... come on not defend everytime a the DEVS that every months missed some aspect of the game related to the DDA

Come on, don't attack the DEVS every time they implement the DDA in a way or interpretation you don't like or in an order you don't approve of. I am sure they have a 3D artist and I have a lot of evidence that they are very good at their job, but it takes a lot of time to make, it's more than just a 3d model. The geometry, texturing, lighting, "painting" and so forth, not to mention the agreement of an actual design and function.
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I would love to have new station models, I wish they were more varied than occasionally having different lighting or paint, but I am rational enough to see the effort involved in creating that kind of detailed environment, one that will be met with regular, close scrutiny from players and to appreciate the parts of the game they are implementing. Given the choice between one new station model or 12 new ships....I'd go with the ships.

 

[Monk]

OMG!!! LOL so that was real xD

Business in the front, party in the back!

There are also variants...much like ships

There is the Skullet, a personal favorite...bald in the front...never ever letting the party die in the back

The buzzlet...buzz cut except for that hair growing out the neck...eek

The ever so popular among trashy children, rat tail

The truly hellish Bowlet (bowl cut with a mullet...someone must die for this)

and many more.

EDIT: Actually, back in College, it was a good way to pass the time to cruise town and spot different mullets. Mullet watching, as it were. Wal-mart worked as an effective bird feeder for attracting the beasts.

 

[Ziljan]

OMG!!! LOL so that was real xD

Yes, and every time I look at the Asp Scout, I see a skeazy guy in a pornstache/mullet trying to sexy 80s dance in red leather pants, while uttering the mullet motto, "business in the front, party in the back."

motto ninja'd !!!

 

[CMDR Kantos Kan]

Well the problem here is that FD balances ships based on a very limited set of criteria that doesn't include interactions between large and small ships in Open. So these may end up being Solo or PVE ships only. It would be amazing if FD finally created a small ship besides the Vulture that was finally balanced enough to compete in PVP in Open.

I mean who is going to want to play Open in a slow Cobra or Viper that can get out-turned by an Anaconda or Python? Or chased down by an FAS, Clipper, or FDL?

Are you sure they're making any attempt at balancing ships? I'm not so sure... There seems to be a lot that is done randomly...

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A mullet is a shameful hairdo from the 1980s that survives today in the American Deep South, and was clearly the inspiration for the Asp Scout design:

http://www.plagueofthemullet.com/images/Ernir2mullet1.jpg

That is real funny! Wish I could rep you more!

 

[Ziljan]

Are you sure they're making any attempt at balancing ships? I'm not so sure... There seems to be a lot that is done randomly...

It feels random because the balancing criteria is arbitrary and limited, and biased towards larger ships and imperials.

 

[AdriánGuth]

Business in the front, party in the back!

There are also variants...much like ships

There is the Skullet, a personal favorite...bald in the front...never ever letting the party die in the back

The buzzlet...buzz cut except for that hair growing out the neck...eek

The ever so popular among trashy children, rat tail

The truly hellish Bowlet (bowl cut with a mullet...someone must die for this)

and many more.

EDIT: Actually, back in College, it was a good way to pass the time to cruise town and spot different mullets. Mullet watching, as it were. Wal-mart worked as an effective bird feeder for attracting the beasts.

im blind now.....

 

[Bacalao]

Are you sure they're making any attempt at balancing ships? I'm not so sure... There seems to be a lot that is done randomly...

Maybe the whole problem is the idea of "balance". Maybe they should look at the game, think "what would there be a market or spot for" and then given a set of fixed parameters (hull weighs this much per unit area and yields this much armor, internals take up this much space per class, etc) make the ship the best it can be instead of arbitrarily deciding that a 400T Clipper has half (or less) shields as a 400T Anaconda, or that the Anaconda gets double the armor per ton from hull than the FDS, or that a 400T ship can mass lock a 1000T ship. Or that mass lock factors are based on a fixed value assigned to a ship (at seemingly random) and aren't affected by the mass ratios of the two ships involved.

 

[AdriánGuth]

Yes, and every time I look at the Asp Scout, I see a skeazy guy in a pornstache/mullet trying to sexy 80s dance in red leather pants, while uttering the mullet motto, "business in the front, party in the back."

motto ninja'd !!!

i feel very VERY happy not have born in the USA.

 

[OxKing]

I had hoped the Keelback would been an new original design ship. Just to make this "Ships" update not so pointless.
I'm ok with the variants, as they are somewhat plausible for real acting ship manufacturers to build them like this.
In automobile reality there are Renault Kangoo and Mercedes Citan or Ford Galaxy and VW Sharan etc.. being the same model despite another manufacturer.
So yeah, it's kind of lazy by frontier, but not unthinkable of in the elite galaxy.
But i hope they will come with more unique stuff in the future. Especially because of the same cockpits / bridges.
As for an game you play entirely in the cockpit it should reflect when you buy a new ship.
But if they are putting the workforce they spare by doing this lazy approaches in stations for horizons instead i'm fine with it for now.
But i hope they will come back not even with original design ships but with original design paint jobs aswell, as they being equally lazy in the past for this sector too...

 

[Ziljan]

i feel very VERY happy not have born in the USA.

The west coast is like a different planet from the central and southern regions. The north east coast is fairly sane as well, though they are bit stuck in the past. But we still have hope for our southern brothers and sisters. They did make the Blues and New Orleans, so they def have their redeeming qualities.

 

[AdriánGuth]

Not science acurate imagination.

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The west coast is like a different planet from the central and southern regions. The north east coast is fairly sane as well, though they are bit stuck in the past. But we still have hope for our southern brothers and sisters. They did make the Blues and New Orleans, so they def have their redeeming qualities.

Very interesting indeed

 

[JosiahD]

I had hoped the Keelback would been an new original design ship. Just to make this "Ships" update not so pointless.
I'm ok with the variants, as they are somewhat plausible for real acting ship manufacturers to build them like this.
In automobile reality there are Renault Kangoo and Mercedes Citan or Ford Galaxy and VW Sharan etc.. being the same model despite another manufacturer.
So yeah, it's kind of lazy by frontier, but not unthinkable of in the elite galaxy.
But i hope they will come with more unique stuff in the future. Especially because of the same cockpits / bridges.
As for an game you play entirely in the cockpit it should reflect when you buy a new ship.
But if they are putting the workforce they spare by doing this lazy approaches in stations for horizons instead i'm fine with it for now.
But i hope they will come back not even with original design ships but with original design paint jobs aswell, as they being equally lazy in the past for this sector too...

A missed opportunity is the way I see it. The new ships are not bad as such (I do like the weapon placement on the Cobra Mk IV), but it's just that Frontier could have instead injected at least a couple of the other classic ships from the previous games (ie instead of reworking existing models of the Asp, Viper, Cobra and Type 6). The added diversity would have drawn much praise I think. It's the missed opportunity I find disappointing rather than the ships themselves.

 

[Dbrn47]

I also pretty much only fly small ships, and then I forced to jump into a Python or FAS to PVP. I really don't like large/med ships on principle. The fact that my FAS turns/tracks better than my Cobra, Viper, or iEagle is just a slap in the face.

Look, I've been through this whole song and dance with DB Explorer. The people defended that ship too, based on nothing but looks... until they flew it. Then they immediately took it back for a refund. Small lumbering ships tend to go unplayed except by diehards. The new Mk IVs are in line to be the next DBE. And that would be a waste of two beautiful small ships.

Yep, this is also a problem with the variation mentality. "Oh but Ziljan, it will fill niches", these niches are already filled. We have combat, trader, exploration and multi-role ships in the game already. These variants only serve to stack the redundancy while at the same time reusing assets with minor changes. This WILL have many ships go completely unused by a lot of people. In fact, since I'm at the point of flying pretty much anything I want to, there's no reason for me at all to try the variations. I'm way past the point of flying Cobras, Vipers and an Asp variant. I'm so happy newer players will be getting all this great content and all these options though.

 

[AdriánGuth]

Have you played ANY other space game and seen the amount of variety and imagination that goes into ship design? Stop applying your real life logic to science fiction. War Thunder is designed based on real history so they can't really go far without becoming unrealistic. Elite is science fiction, the only realism in it is the fact that it's in the Milky Way, the possibilities are endless here but they don't want to go there and you are derisively dismissing arguments against this lukewarm design philosophy.

I'm glad so many people here are perfectly happy where this is going, you're only holding things back for the sake of "realism" in an unrealistic game.

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Yes, they are. You are also here though. Go solve world hunger if you don't like complaints and discussions about video games.

Cute, tell more about your discontent


BTW....its a space sim. with some game contect.

 

[Bacalao]

Have you played ANY other space game and seen the amount of variety and imagination that goes into ship design? Stop applying your real life logic to science fiction. War Thunder is designed based on real history so they can't really go far without becoming unrealistic. Elite is science fiction, the only realism in it is the fact that it's in the Milky Way, the possibilities are endless here but they don't want to go there and you are derisively dismissing arguments against this lukewarm design philosophy.

I'm glad so many people here are perfectly happy where this is going, you're only holding things back for the sake of "realism" in an unrealistic game.

The word "realism" gets thrown around when what is meant is "believability". Give me a reason why the ships should look like they came out of Willy Wonka's factory and I'll jump on your bandwagon, until then I'll take my ships looking like an engineer designed them, not a cartoonist sipping coffee with a candy maker.

 

[Indy Original]

I don't want to be too harsh on the design team, but I'm disappointed at the lack of innovation as well. For an update that is literally called 'Ships', I was expecting more genuinely new ships than just the Corvette.. it's not that I object to variants of existing ships per se, but when five of the six ships being released are essentially variants, that's a bit much.

At the very least, I thought that the Keelback would be a unique design, because it has a unique name... as it is, it would make more sense to just call it the Type-6 Mk II. In fact, why isn't it called the Type-6 Keelback? Just calling it the Keelback alone makes it sound like a completely different ship, when it really isn't...

Likewise with the Cutter - it is not actually meant to be a variant of the Clipper, so there was no reason for it to look so similar at all. If instead they had made it resemble the Interdictor, like the Corvette resembles the Farragut, that would have been great; but instead it might as well just be a Clipper Mk II, in terms of appearance at least.

And as for the Asp Scout? I'll be honest, I love the Asp's classic design, but the question that keeps nagging at the back of my mind is, do we really need it? We already have the Asp Explorer, a good ship that is ideal for exploration; and the Diamondback Explorer, also ideal for exploration; and the Diamondback Scout, which is ideal for exploration as well; not to mention the Adder, which makes for a good explorer too; and the Cobra Mk III, which can explore with the best of them; and even the Lakon Type-6, for explorers who like to be a little different. And to this lineup of similarly-priced ships, we are now going to add the similarly-priced Asp Scout, are we?

...Why?

Call me crazy, but I think it would have been better for Frontier to add a bunch of new ships in 1.5, and save variants like these for next year. After all, the focus next year will be on Horizons, and the players who paid for it; so if these exact same ships had been released next year as a surprise free update for ALL players, I'm sure they would have been very well received, and no one would have been complaining that they were just variants because no one would have been expecting them anyway. But, as it is? Well... unless there's a lot of stuff that they are not telling us, it looks like 1.5 might barely even be an update at all...

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Myself I fully intend to get a Keelback. Love the sound of this ship and the look of it.

 

[Bacalao]

After all, the focus next year will be on Horizons, and the players who paid for it; so if these exact same ships had been released next year as a surprise free update for ALL players, I'm sure they would have been very well received, and no one would have been complaining that they were just variants because no one would have been expecting them anyway.

The naiveté is adorable.

 

[Dbrn47]

The word "realism" gets thrown around when what is meant is "believability". Give me a reason why the ships should look like they came out of Willy Wonka's factory and I'll jump on your bandwagon, until then I'll take my ships looking like an engineer designed them, not a cartoonist sipping coffee with a candy maker.

Stop with the hyperbole, no one is asking for whacky out of this universe designs.

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Cute, tell more about your discontent


BTW....its a space sim. with some game contect.

I'm glad you find trolling fun.