Powerplay Powerplay is dumb. Please make it die.

[the100thmonkey]

So the Hudsonites are expanding towards my home. Fair enough. I pledge to a rival power and go into the relatively-nearby-system to take part in the associated conflict zone. There's no other way to resist the expansion than to pledge. I don't want to, but wanting to play the game "my way" means that I have to play the game in a way I don't want to. The irony tastes only a little salty at this point. I suspect that some players will tell me that Powerplay doesn't matter and I can ignore it if I want to, but it does matter because it introduces new factors into the BGS, factors that influence the way that players behave in PP systems due to changes in the way that the BGS responds to player activity.

Anyway, on the way to repair and rearm after a good few scraps with my wing, I'm interdicted by a Federal Agent. It starts shooting at me so I deploy hardpoints and smoke it. This makes me wanted. OK, no problem (even though the NPC shot first and it's not a Fed system and is still, apparently, contested in PP.)

Later, a sysauth NPC spawns in the "security operations" zone, scans me, and starts shooting at me. What nonsense is this? I could kill the NPC, but that only leads to more of them spawning. What kind of stupid mechanic spawns police in a souped-up conflict zone? And why is it suddenly illegal to defend myself?

Explain to me how this "mechanic" makes any sense. Why do I have to pledge for some paper-thin character that I don't care a fig about in order to resist an "expansion" that does nothing but encourage players to show up and shoot stuff?

Please, set Powerplay on fire.

/rant.

 

[Han Yolo]

99.9% of the game-machanics/play-modes of ED are dumb. You would have to 'make it die' completely

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Agreed. Can't stand the mechanic myself. It's virtually ruined the game for me.

 

[Deleted member 38366]

Wasn't there a plan to implement a patch for one of the glaring holes in the whole PowerNonsene mechanics : permit unpledged Independents to cast their vote by running Missions in those Protest zones ?

I haven't read anything about it in a long time, however.
But I do clearly remember that missing Option for Independents was on the table - allow them to prevent an Expansion of any unwanted Power in any free System.

I'm just glad I'm >90LY away from this stuff - although I expect to have my Home System stolen from me any day and handed as a free gift package to some Player Faction never heard of

 

[Terry Bruge-Hiplo]

Wasn't there a plan to implement a patch for one of the glaring holes in the whole PowerNonsene mechanics : permit unpledged Independents to cast their vote by running Missions in those Protest zones ?

Not heard that one before - but I like the idea!

 

[Privata]

Powerplay is cool , for the reasons you just stated.
Hudsons security programe came to your sector and you did not want that so you joied the fight. that to me sounds like a good plot , feels very star wars like.
powerplay has issues , at times it feels strange but remeber its not a war , rather a battle to get infulance on a system. so even if hudson gets there all it will do is change elements of the BGS and favore federal systems responce. I do think powerplay needs a lot of work and more lore behind it , but its not a bad system at all.

A thing that a lot seem to look over , in powerplay what you are doing is not legal nor endorsed by the goverments , you are playing corsair for your faction

 

[EUS]

Here's my irk, unrelated to expansion, but something that really bothers me.
Ever since powerplay, stations in federation space sell imperial slaves on the market.

 

[the100thmonkey]

The basic game mode is far from dumb. The fact that Powerplay requires ridiculous financial incentives to make it work is the second most stupid thing about it, the first being how it impacts on the players that don't care for it.

Really? 50mcr a week if you are prepared to treat the game like a second job? 5mcr if you want to spend just your evenings grinding away... I've never done the grind; never will. The problem is that even if I don't pledge and use non-Powerplay mechanics to make the system less attractive, I still have to engage in a huge grind in order to flip the system. But if I'm flipping the system, why do I need Powerplay? It's not galactic politics; it's engaging with the BGS. Why does the game need such ridiculous mechanics to encourage players to interact with the BGS? RAWR.

 

[Crimson Kaim]

Sorry but our expansions are already secured. Which means that this system is basically federal since the start of our arrival so any force used against our agents is prohibited and rated as direct criminal act.
Political opponents that do not support democracy and individual freedom are, by law, to be hunted and eventually made to support the political fairness of the Federation. o7

Oh, watch this added oil light up the fire.

In all seriousness though, if a Power expands into a system, it is already "their" system even though it is still contested. But yea, this is PP. Weird mechanics with arbitrary ways to counter them. Just give all the players the powers so we can have power wars just of players without NPCs, this would be awesome

 

[Ben Ryder]

It's a shame you cant play the game the way you want to. But we'd all change things if we could to suit our personal wants. It's not just about individual needs, wants an desires. A lot of people enjoy power play and think other aspect of the game are dumb and should be set on fire. Roll with it and.

 

[the100thmonkey]

Powerplay is cool , for the reasons you just stated.
Hudsons security programe came to your sector and you did not want that so you joied the fight. that to me sounds like a good plot , feels very star wars like.

I have no truck with being a warrior of convenience; I've done it several times before (outside of PP) and will do so again. What bothers me is how it affects what I do in the part of the game that actually matters.

powerplay has issues , at times it feels strange but remeber its not a war , rather a battle to get infulance on a system. so even if hudson gets there all it will do is change elements of the BGS and favore federal systems responce. I do think powerplay needs a lot of work and more lore behind it , but its not a bad system at all.

I'm quite comfortable with getting influence in a system - Communism Interstellar have flipped more than 30 systems to date. We know what we're doing. The issue is that Powerplay involves some of the stupidest gameplay in recorded history. Gameplay that involves police spawning into a warzone, or becoming wanted with the (independent) system authority (who, one would hope, would not seek out being "exploited" by a "Power") for defending yourself when you are shot at by an NPC that is not system authority. It wouldn't bother me if I'd shot a sysauth ship; it would make sense for me to be wanted, even if the police had shot first. However, it wasn't police. It was an agent of an invading faction!

A thing that a lot seem to look over , in powerplay what you are doing is not legal nor endorsed by the goverments , you are playing corsair for your faction

You may be comfortable with the game not making any sense in a crucial mechanic. I am not.

Given my history, I recognise that there is a certain irony in my posts on this, but massive financial incentives to participate in a poorly-conceived bodge with no coherent narrative as part of a system that just leads to absurd outcomes is the straw that breaks the camel's back (Really, a Federation "power" exploiting an Empire system? A pirate "lord" parading the families of an Empire faction's leaders in chains through the streets, all without even the slightest murmur of a massive military response from the hugely powerful Empire. Really? Really?)

It's nonsense. It's just well-paid nonsense for the grinders and the min-maxers and something I want no part of. The BGS mess-ups in 1.4 really made me reassess my commitment to the game; the only reason I'm still playing is the very real connections I've made with my fellow clan-mates. Then the imposition of the lowest common denominator garbage that is Powerplay comes along, and I'm just thinking of giving it up, uninstalling the game, and taking a long break.

 

[goemon]

Wasn't there a plan to implement a patch for one of the glaring holes in the whole PowerNonsene mechanics : permit unpledged Independents to cast their vote by running Missions in those Protest zones ?

I haven't read anything about it in a long time, however.
But I do clearly remember that missing Option for Independents was on the table - allow them to prevent an Expansion of any unwanted Power in any free System.

yes, this was mentioned by the devs some time ago. waiting for it, too!

 

[the100thmonkey]

Sorry but our expansions are already secured. Which means that this system is basically federal since the start of our arrival so any force used against our agents is prohibited and rated as direct criminal act.
Political opponents that do not support democracy and individual freedom are, by law, to be hunted and eventually made to support the political fairness of the Federation. o7

Oh, watch this added oil light up the fire.

In all seriousness though, if a Power expands into a system, it is already "their" system even though it is still contested. But yea, this is PP. Weird mechanics with arbitrary ways to counter them. Just give all the players the powers so we can have power wars just of players without NPCs, this would be awesome

Ignoring the flame-bait of the first part, I wholeheartedly agree with the second. Why do I need to pledge to resist an expansion? The fact that it is unwelcome is motivation enough. This is actually the crux of my problem with PP - It's testicular in appearance, and I feel no meaningful connection with the characters. I do, however, feel like defending my turf from those that want to exploit it, but I can't unless I cynically (in the canonical meaning of the term) "sign up" for figureheads whom I find to be universally unacceptable as human beings - there's a narrative issue when I can't find a good guy, and even the Federation loyalists (i.e. you Crimson ) were... Federation loyalists beforethe introduction of 2-dimensional political caricatures. I'm an adult; is it too much to expect to be treated like one? I don't want or need a silly Smurf princess or a comically evil bad guy with blond dreadlocks.

Above all else, I don't need lame outcomes of forced decisions to make a bad mechanic into a transparently absurd one.

I need some cheese with my whine.

 

[goemon]

Gameplay that involves police spawning into a warzone, or becoming wanted with the (independent) system authority (who, one would hope, would not seek out being "exploited" by a "Power") for defending yourself when you are shot at by an NPC that is not system authority. It wouldn't bother me if I'd shot a sysauth ship; it would make sense for me to be wanted, even if the police had shot first. However, it wasn't police. It was an agent of an invading faction!

/rp on

comrade!

many corrupt leaders of "independent" systems want to be exploited, for their personal wealth, they are corrupt!

and many freedom fighters have been criminalized.

as history teaches us.

wear your wanted tag with pride, and destroy those enemies of the people.

/rp off

 

[the100thmonkey]

RP-on:

Comrade Goemon,

Your commitment to the cause is clear. However, Communism Interstellar is already active in more than thirty systems. Despite our valiant efforts in bringing the light of communal ownership of the means of production, distribution and exchange to the proletariat, we are left toolless in the face of a clearly biased political system, seemingly coded into the very fabric of the universe.

The proletariat care not of the fashion choices of Denton Patreus. Nor do they care for the kind of 'transcendental exploitation' offered by all the so-called "Powers" - such machinations add nothing to their experiences of their reality, one that is scratched out of unforgiving rock and unyielding space. These figureheads are ephemera - chemically inert and socially painful.

On 21st century Earth, there was once the phenomenon called "reality TV shows." These shows -- similar to Galnet sensecasts -- were, while lacking in the technological sophistication of Antal's sims, every bit as vapid and senseless as the front page of the Galnet news feed.

/RP-off

Seriously.

 

[deMangler]

...but massive financial incentives to participate in a poorly-conceived bodge with no coherent narrative as part of a system that just leads to absurd outcomes is the straw that breaks the camel's back (Really, a Federation "power" exploiting an Empire system? A pirate "lord" parading the families of an Empire faction's leaders in chains through the streets, all without even the slightest murmur of a massive military response from the hugely powerful Empire. Really? Really?)

It's nonsense. It's just well-paid nonsense for the grinders and the min-maxers and something I want no part of. The BGS mess-ups in 1.4 really made me reassess my commitment to the game; the only reason I'm still playing is the very real connections I've made with my fellow clan-mates. Then the imposition of the lowest common denominator garbage that is Powerplay comes along, and I'm just thinking of giving it up, uninstalling the game, and taking a long break.

You. Are. Not. Alone.

Ignoring the flame-bait of the first part, I wholeheartedly agree with the second. Why do I need to pledge to resist an expansion? The fact that it is unwelcome is motivation enough. This is actually the crux of my problem with PP - It's testicular in appearance, and I feel no meaningful connection with the characters. I do, however, feel like defending my turf from those that want to exploit it, but I can't unless I cynically (in the canonical meaning of the term) "sign up" for figureheads whom I find to be universally unacceptable as human beings - there's a narrative issue when I can't find a good guy, and even the Federation loyalists (i.e. you Crimson ) were... Federation loyalists beforethe introduction of 2-dimensional political caricatures. I'm an adult; is it too much to expect to be treated like one? I don't want or need a silly Smurf princess or a comically evil bad guy with blond dreadlocks.

Above all else, I don't need lame outcomes of forced decisions to make a bad mechanic into a transparently absurd one.

I need some cheese with my whine.

I have a power coming closer to my home system, on the edge of the bubble and near some good systems. I heard there was an incoming "freedom fighter" feature that would enable me to fight against an encroaching power without pledging to any. I have stuck with my home system hoping that this feature is implemented before the power arrives otherwise I will simply abandon my system - as far as I am concerned as soon as a power turns up that is basically when the system turns into "I'm a reality hunger games celebrity pointless bake-off big brother x-factor show get me out of here"

 

[Antoniius]

The basic game mode is far from dumb. The fact that Powerplay requires ridiculous financial incentives to make it work is the second most stupid thing about it, the first being how it impacts on the players that don't care for it.

Really? 50mcr a week if you are prepared to treat the game like a second job? 5mcr if you want to spend just your evenings grinding away... I've never done the grind; never will. The problem is that even if I don't pledge and use non-Powerplay mechanics to make the system less attractive, I still have to engage in a huge grind in order to flip the system. But if I'm flipping the system, why do I need Powerplay? It's not galactic politics; it's engaging with the BGS. Why does the game need such ridiculous mechanics to encourage players to interact with the BGS? RAWR.

While i have to generally agree with you, i have to deny the "grinding" part.
Keeping rank 5 (as was excellently shon in a post i red few days ago) does not require any hard grinding. You can attain that with 5-6 hours a week (lets say 1 h a day) or, if you are able to interdict (i am not), killing 30 ships a day. The point is that, even if not so grindy as it could seem, it is incredibly boring and totally loose from the gameplay. it is just a long mission, with no real sensible effect on the gameplay/lore.

 

[Crimson Kaim]

Ignoring the flame-bait of the first part, I wholeheartedly agree with the second. Why do I need to pledge to resist an expansion? The fact that it is unwelcome is motivation enough. This is actually the crux of my problem with PP - It's testicular in appearance, and I feel no meaningful connection with the characters. I do, however, feel like defending my turf from those that want to exploit it, but I can't unless I cynically (in the canonical meaning of the term) "sign up" for figureheads whom I find to be universally unacceptable as human beings - there's a narrative issue when I can't find a good guy, and even the Federation loyalists (i.e. you Crimson ) were... Federation loyalists beforethe introduction of 2-dimensional political caricatures. I'm an adult; is it too much to expect to be treated like one? I don't want or need a silly Smurf princess or a comically evil bad guy with blond dreadlocks.

Above all else, I don't need lame outcomes of forced decisions to make a bad mechanic into a transparently absurd one.

I need some cheese with my whine.

If player minor factions wouldn't be BGS-only and could actually contest the expansion of a power in PP, things would get interesting. Just think of how many minor factions would have chosen to resist an expansion attempt of a power ... and just imagine how many factions would even support the expansion. It wouldn't be as intense as EVE wars sicne systems are nothing of a benefit for anyone except for the NPC power so we could have "conflict zones" just consisting of players. Epic player battles in case the factions couldn't agree with eachother or if a power attempts to expand into a system.

However, as it is now, minor factions, though we were told so, have no chance getting into PP, not even influecing it via the BGS, the HAVE to allign with some power. And the current expansion procedure is as follows:

Prepare a system
"Buy" it with CC and expand into
Due to incredible low opposition (because minor faction have no influence on PP), the expansion will most likely happen.
Fortify until the system shakes off their pledge to the power but for that one would have to kick a complete power from PP into turmoil just to get one single system back independent.


If minor player groups would be actively supported clans and maybe with module store and credit income from stations and blah blah but most importantly having influence on PP, PP would get interesting and justify my 50m cr/week income because until now, I have been farming merits in PANCIENCES all the damn time, even though it hit 100% even before we started undermining. Yea, indirect 5th member due to bad PP mechanics :/

 

[Adept Geraden]

If player minor factions wouldn't be BGS-only and could actually contest the expansion of a power in PP, things would get interesting. Just think of how many minor factions would have chosen to resist an expansion attempt of a power ... and just imagine how many factions would even support the expansion. It wouldn't be as intense as EVE wars sicne systems are nothing of a benefit for anyone except for the NPC power so we could have "conflict zones" just consisting of players. Epic player battles in case the factions couldn't agree with eachother or if a power attempts to expand into a system.

However, as it is now, minor factions, though we were told so, have no chance getting into PP, not even influecing it via the BGS, the HAVE to allign with some power. And the current expansion procedure is as follows:

Prepare a system
"Buy" it with CC and expand into
Due to incredible low opposition (because minor faction have no influence on PP), the expansion will most likely happen.
Fortify until the system shakes off their pledge to the power but for that one would have to kick a complete power from PP into turmoil just to get one single system back independent.


If minor player groups would be actively supported clans and maybe with module store and credit income from stations and blah blah but most importantly having influence on PP, PP would get interesting and justify my 50m cr/week income because until now, I have been farming merits in PANCIENCES all the damn time, even though it hit 100% even before we started undermining. Yea, indirect 5th member due to bad PP mechanics :/

This.

Second option: ditch PP and fix the minor faction/BGS system.

We have 1.5 and 2.0 (Horizons) coming. Personally, I couldn't give a tinkers cuss about either. I just want the BGS/POMF (player owned minor factions) to actually work.

 

[Bigglesof206]

Forgive me if I misunderstand, but you appear to be saying that you and your clan mates have set up 30 systems to operate the way you want them to, to make that part of the BGS reflect your preferences if you like - and you believe the game mechanic that lets other people impose their style of operation on your chosen systems to be an unwelcome imposition?

That some parts of PP are kinda dumb is a given, although to be honest I'd say that large parts of the entire game lack anything resembling internal logic (no response to players murdering each other in the equivalent of the town centre, just for starters)....I think there's plenty to fix in that line, and to just point the finger at PP is to be somewhat disingenuous.