Ships The Cutter really takes the wind out of my sails

[777Driver]

Thank you for the tip, truth is Ive been waiting for you to say to adapt.
I wasn't flying it like an eagle, I was flying it like a "warship" clipper the size of a planet. (That's no moon, but I can see why you'd think that)
if I was trying to fly it like an eagle I would have never left it's 6'.
this is supposed to be a successor to the clipper, a zoom and boom ship and I was trying desperately to fly it as such.
strapping turrets to it and flying in an elliptical orbit maintaining distance means flying the ship like well a fast freighter. While it might have the cargo space to justify that statement why then does the clipper not fly like a faster type 7?
the cutter does not pitch too well for a ship of its size, the corvette is not much smaller and turns considerably faster but moderately slower.
I want big tanky slow to turn ships bristling with turrets too but those ships are frankly going to have to be much larger. Battle cruiser class warships should turn like the cutter currently does if not worse. And I hope they are added and fly as such making us adapt to such a truly large and lumbering war machine. The corvette and cutter aren't those class of ships, the Panther clipper and hopefully battle cruisers are what we both want there.

They really lost the plot when they came up with the clippers maneuverability. This is is part of the reason why many are complaining about the Cutter, they are used to other ships with crazy handling. The clipper is a gigantic ship with the bridge situated far from the cg, yet it pitches like a fighter jet, it is ridiculous.

 

[MarcusKross]

They really lost the plot when they came up with the clippers maneuverability. This is is part of the reason why many are complaining about the Cutter, they are used to other ships with crazy handling. The clipper is a gigantic ship with the bridge situated far from the cg, yet it pitches like a fighter jet, it is ridiculous.

Here is something ridiculous.
Not having angular acceleration modeled

 

[askavir]

I don't think it was ever stated that the Cutter was a successor to the Clipper. Just because they have similar appearance doesn't means they have to be similar.

I see the Cutter mainly as another option for traders, and another multipurpose ship, not a dedicated battleship. And that's OK by me, traders could do with another option "above" the T9, not only with large cargo capacity but with improved survivability. There are plenty of combat-focused ships, the Cutter does not have to be another one. The Cutter is another option with its own set of advantages and disadvantages, that brings something new to the game.

If people want it to be like the Clipper, then just fly the Clipper.

 

[Phantasma]

The Cutter kicked the Type 9 in the gut, stole it's lunch money, and ganked it's flight model too.

The Corvette, while it's probably very lovely in combat, wont ever see any combat because the fight will be over by the time it's finished making all of those little 10LY jumps.

Falcon Delacy decided to force feed a Cobra and a Viper some pure lard with cake and pie, and thus the mkIV versions of both ships were born fat and useless.

The Type 6 watched too many action movies and decided that strapping some guns and huge engines onto itself was a good idea. It was not. Oh yeah and something something ASP.


I am not happy at all with the design decisions of these ships, though I will still buy a Cutter cuz I'm tired of that Tycoon rank looking at me funny.

Military warship? Yeah, I've got a bridge I'd like to sell you...

Best summary i read so far.
Please accept my rep.

As for me, i'll be playing the patience game.
Even if it takes the better part of a year like with the FdL, Frontier might look at their metrics in the distant future and realise that most of their 1.5 ships won't have been flown much.
That is my hope anyway because they seem unwilling to change anything now.

 

[ironhammer500]

Idk why every has so much hate for the Cutter, judging by the game play it has a very different style of combat, dare i say this style of combat is what turns people off? Just BnZ in an Air environment means you have stored energy in terms of height(Which its actually gravity that gives this potential energy) How ever in space combat the Boost is used to keep momentum which if your stored energy allowing for BnZ, this Cutter is good at BnZ, shame the combat in this game is not very good for it due to very little im terms of Alpha damage.


I loved the Cutter, it doesn't Drift as bad as some say, the pitch is slow yes but its not that bad...

 

[Tantalas Peldain]

Having only watched and listened to others fly this cutter, I can only say that it seems to be a show room ship, looks and sounds are great, but remember if this ship turns badly and over heats quickly and has power issues with the A class equipment then the stock version and in between must be terrible, not everyone will be able to max this thing out when they get it so its performance is gonna such even more and that is really not good needs fixing

 

[Zelos1983]

I absolutely love the cutter. Probably need to grind rank for it (seems to be hard now, almost no charity missions spawning). What will it need? I'm at Viscount level.

So far the only new ship I find interesting.

 

[Mc80]

Tried the A rated cutter myself. If it would get an a8 distributor and -1 second to turn rate it would be a great ship.

As for the corvette, its a great ship, even with the firepower it has. my only gripe is the short jump range and the easily breaking canopy.

 

[Yokoshima]

It is basically the same I suggested apart from the option 2 tweak. Ofcourse you can archieve changed values by changing other stats that influence the result (in this case, max shields) and I wouldn't mind this tweak as long as it has lower shields than it has now.
Option 1 isn't really tweaked as it is still in the +/- 20 m/s tolerance

So you would take (the somewhat modified) version of option 1 + 2, aye?

EDIT: Also it doesn't have the lowest amount of internals. Ofcourse if you just count the actual slots but add the ratings together with each rating being twice as effective than its one step lower rating. C8 for example has ALOT better shield gens than a C7.

Yep. A somewhat modified mix of 1 & 2 I would be fine with and I for would fully support. I don't mind loosing a little here and there if it means a viable (for PvE at least, since some say it is an awesome face tanking PvP ship) ship.
And the reason I bring up internal slots, rather than their size, is HRPs only go up to C5, with C 4 only being a little worse, and SCBs gain a lot of heat each class, but not a lot of shielding. The lower class ones (proved you are not boosting, using weapons, etc.) can be used w/out heat sinks safely. Now if the crafting system makes the size more important for combat roles, my whole opinion of the Cutter may very well change (aside from the pitch issue).

 

[kofeyh]

I absolutely love the cutter. Probably need to grind rank for it (seems to be hard now, almost no charity missions spawning). What will it need? I'm at Viscount level.

So far the only new ship I find interesting.

Having flown cutter I will be grinding forever to get it. I love it. Even with its low agility. I've gotten through so many scrapes in that thing, I need it in my life.

 

[Yokoshima]

I don't think it was ever stated that the Cutter was a successor to the Clipper. Just because they have similar appearance doesn't means they have to be similar.

I see the Cutter mainly as another option for traders, and another multipurpose ship, not a dedicated battleship. And that's OK by me, traders could do with another option "above" the T9, not only with large cargo capacity but with improved survivability. There are plenty of combat-focused ships, the Cutter does not have to be another one. The Cutter is another option with its own set of advantages and disadvantages, that brings something new to the game.

If people want it to be like the Clipper, then just fly the Clipper.

The issue here is it isn't just another ship. Its a faction's top player piloted warship. And its an insult to Empire loyalists. I'm all for traders having more ships, even faction ones. But not if it comes at the cost of one so important (from an RP perspective).
Imagine if Panther Clipper were released, and it had a cargo capacity on par with an Anaconda, jump range of a T-9, cost over 1.5 billion credits, but it was the undisputed top warship (for its class size). Pretty sure more than a few people would be upset

 

[Redan]

The ship doesn't need anything.

I'll be flying it when it hits live.

 

[Yokoshima]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6HXBNymRzg

That video was hard to watch. It took you a full minute to kill a DBX. Even flying backwards at full speed the eagle didn't die in one pass. And you had help. An I. courier would have cleared out that group much faster.

 

[ironhammer500]

The issue here is it isn't just another ship. Its a faction's top player piloted warship. And its an insult to Empire loyalists. I'm all for traders having more ships, even faction ones. But not if it comes at the cost of one so important (from an RP perspective).
Imagine if Panther Clipper were released, and it had a cargo capacity on par with an Anaconda, jump range of a T-9, cost over 1.5 billion credits, but it was the undisputed top warship (for its class size). Pretty sure more than a few people would be upset

The Devs have not confirmed this they may add even larger ships to both Fed and Imperial ranks. The Pitch is not a problem, if your trying to constantly turn with your target then your flying the Cutter wrong, it needs to heavily focus on using its boost with Fa off to drift turn and strafe its target this is how i managed to deal with it, the Class 7 PD isnt an issue when u do strafe runs past a target as your guns recharge while your turning.

Strafing and using that drift to constantly be on the move and zoom past your target, now i only really faces large ships like a Annie or Python the more agile ships will give even a Conda a hard time.

Beam turrets or Gimbled Large beams on the top make the Cutter pretty dangerous, now only if they add class 3 Multis.

 

[Yokoshima]

The Devs have not confirmed this they may add even larger ships to both Fed and Imperial ranks. The Pitch is not a problem, if your trying to constantly turn with your target then your flying the Cutter wrong, it needs to heavily focus on using its boost with Fa off to drift turn and strafe its target this is how i managed to deal with it, the Class 7 PD isnt an issue when u do strafe runs past a target as your guns recharge while your turning.

Well they said the Corvette was to ne the largest player piloted ship, so I assumed that would carry onto its counter part. But you are right. That could change. Honestly if the devs came out and changed its description to match a trading ship and said the "real Cutter" is still inc., and the Feds were getting a trading ship, I think people would care a lot less.

 

[ironhammer500]

Well they said the Corvette was to ne the largest player piloted ship, so I assumed that would carry onto its counter part. But you are right. That could change. Honestly if the devs came out and changed its description to match a trading ship and said the "real Cutter" is still inc., and the Feds were getting a trading ship, I think people would care a lot less.

But its not a Trading ship it is indeed a warship, just this warship is not a Turn and burn style fighter like a Viper or the Corvette, it a Boom and Zoom style fighter, so using high alpha weapons like the frag cannons or cannons makes sense as you fire everything and boost away to reload.

 

[InMemoriamSirocco]

I'd just really really like to know who among the devs honestly thought that "boom and zoom" was a viable tactic in this game's combat, and who went even a step further and thought that this kind of tactic would be perfect for a small capital ship.

And I would like to know what he or she was smoking when they had the idea. I want some of that crazy stuff, too!

 

[Yokoshima]

But its not a Trading ship it is indeed a warship, just this warship is not a Turn and burn style fighter like a Viper or the Corvette, it a Boom and Zoom style fighter, so using high alpha weapons like the frag cannons or cannons makes sense as you fire everything and boost away to reload.

Frag canons, even at 90, run out really fast in PvE. And the synth system doesn't help with that. Cannons are good at PP sniping, but garbage against shields. Its C7 DP drastically reduces its alpha capabilities, and the game is built around dogfighting. "hit and run" just doesn't work. At least not well. Take the Cutter and the Corvette. The Corvette can keep out of the firing Arc of a few ships (Conda, Cutter, FGS, etc.) and fire the equivalent of ~ 90% of the time with 4 pips to WEP. The Cutter can only attack less than half the time, and must place itself in the firing arc of the opponent almost 100% of the time to achieve this meager feat. Honestly if you want a "hit and run" ship the FDL does a much better job. Very fast, and agile enough to dogfight or use PAs on its run.

 

[777Driver]

That video was hard to watch. It took you a full minute to kill a DBX. Even flying backwards at full speed the eagle didn't die in one pass. And you had help. An I. courier would have cleared out that group much faster.

The video was not about demonstrating weapon capability. It was a freighter build with a D rated dist, the beams were medium, even the multi cannons weren't maxed. That was the whole point of the video when I originally posted it, even the thrusters were D-rated, the ship was nowhere near a normal combat build, it also had 700 tonnes of cargo onboard...

 

[ironhammer500]

The video was not about demonstrating weapon capability. It was a freighter build with D a rated dist, the beams were medium, even the multi cannons weren't maxed. That was the whole point of the video when I originally posted it, even the thrusters were D-rated, the ship was nowhere near a normal combat build, it also had 700 tonnes of cargo onboard...

but but its not the all i want to pwn everything Imperial ship. It must be buff to be exactly the same stats as the Corvette! But it must still be good at jumping with tons of cargo and have the best Boost and top speed of all 3 ships.