Shield Regeneration Lasers

[Winterwalker]

I realise that the game needs to evolve and new features need to be added. I always think of Elite as being a little bit special, though. There is that line and I'd love to see Elite lean towards a more serious tone. To be a little bit different, perhaps. I'm not sure how to word it. There's a difference between stretching scientific reality and things being "gamey".

Yes ^This feature wouldn't be my very first choice.

To be fair the pic does say it's an "experimental" modification, and I sure don't mind FD adding the functionality. If this is something very rare, needing high Military Rank, and if your support ship suffers some fairly serious drawbacks from using it, I could buy it. If a standard component/upgrade then I'm not quite so sure.

I feel that I'd rather see support ships providing reloads and limpet hull repairs, or being able to fit a combined KWS and Cargo Scanner, Discovery plus Surface Scanner (combining functions to free up a module slot, combining prospector and collector controller for miners etc.) as these feel a bit more grounded in a science fiction reality, that's a bit easier to grasp. This "feels" quite fantasy, on first sight. Like I say, I could buy it if handled right but it's on the edge for me.

 

[CMDR Corlas]

Personally, I use "scientific" in this context as kind of a shorthand for "plausible within the game world". I don't as much care if a game is true to the real world, but I want it to be true to its own. I see Elite as existing in a pretty scientific world, so that is how I describe it. So any miscommunications there are entirely my fault.

I'm generally always positive and optimistic about things, especially on here. I think it's a bit silly to dismiss someone who's unhappy with a potential design direction as a "whiner". I doubt anyone wants a forum of yes men.

Fundamentally, adding instant (note, I mean instant traveling, aka lasers) healing of others, in my eyes, is a pretty major shift in gameplay. And while I know others disagree, it's not one I like. I've played combat healer roles in MMO's for years, and it was refreshing to see a game where distance insta-healing wasn't even an option. For many reasons, that I am trying not to go into because I am sure people are sick of it, I think it made this a better game. But it's changing now, and so it goes, whatever.

I think it's ok that I'm not happy about everything in-game. If someone thinks I should be ignored for not 100% constant joy, I guess that's their right too, but it seems pretty silly.

It is interesting to see the talk of "all the whiners" though. The main reason why I was initially so vocal was because I felt like I was the only one unhappy, and it was "all the cheers" that was shocking.

 

[Aewarin Jameson]

This "feels" quite fantasy, on first sight.

And you think travelling at 2000c (aka Hutton Orbital) isn't fantasy ?

(Granted there are some theories that suggest it might be possible, but then again, it might not)

 

[Khelder]

Of all the things said in this thread this is what bothers me most..

based on the (limited) information we currently have, the modification doesn't appear to create a new "role", but merely modifies an existing weapon to add the new functionality ..

the "healer" tag being added as a derogatory term to devalue the work done by FD is unfair imo..

I can't speak for everyone here. But I don't see how this could be anything but trying to introduce a healer-style role (or function) into the game. Why else would you bother upgrading your weapons so that you can repair the shields wing mates? I have no problem with engineers and modifying weapons (or whatever) to accomplish different things. But looking at this particular example, it looks very much like they are trying to bring a very traditional "role" into the game.

I can understand healers/clerics/paladins/whatevers in fantasy roleplaying games. They fit in that genre. I just can't see the fit in a cut-throat space simulator/game. It would be kind of like adding a special tank mod to World of Tanks (I don't play the game but I certainly hope this isn't true) that would repair/buff other tanks by shooting at them. Sure, it could work from a gameplay point of view. But from the general theme of the game, it just doesn't make sense.

Just my opinion, of course.

 

[Insomnia]

That's fair enough. Different people will want different things. As for the comparisons...

The bits I saw of other space sims FPS shooter play, the first thing that came to my mind was CoD. It takes everything absolutely massive and bold and beautiful about the huge universe and takes it all back down to shooting at each other in corridors with automatic weapons. I can't really say what ED would be like because they haven't even taken first steps in that direction - that I'm aware of.

I did play a little bit of WoW - not a great deal. I remember an awful lot of "Go to this place and kill X of these things." Go to the place. Keep clicking until you've killed X things. Every now and then a Level 80 whatever would just come along and kill me because... LOLZ? I don't want to pick on ED in that way though, but I didn't bring WoW into it.

I played WoW for 3 years, PvE server, semi-hardcore and casual raider. Never PvP though. No, you didn't brought it up.

I also played Counter Strike for a few months. When I saw Star Citizens FPS module in action I didn't think CoD or CS. But when I think about ED's FPS feature, I'm thinking Ethan Carter, Alien Isolation etc... Very slow moving with in realistic environments.

 

[Red Anders]

Exactly this^

^ Exactly the person I was thinking of when I wrote that

Take the light saber in Star Wars, its completely bonkers, however we say, well ok its a light saber thingy and we accept it. However jar jar binks was just an irritating creature and was not accepted at all (however could very well exist somewhere in the universe). You need to understand the target group you want to sell your idea too. In SW they completely lost directional sense. I just hope this is not the case with ED, that's all, and my only point here.

Just to reassure you, if we end up with B*nks then yeah I'm out. I have limits.

 

[Aewarin Jameson]

Oh BTW, DB did overrule his own devs when they designed the galaxy, if not we would have had a NMS universe, and I for one would not been playing that game.

Not sure what that means - "a NMS universe" ?

 

[CMDR Corlas]

And you think travelling at 2000c (aka Hutton Orbital) isn't fantasy ?

(Granted there are some theories that suggest it might be possible, but then again, it might not)

For me, yes. FTL travel and healing beams occupy two totally seperate fictional mindsets for me.

That's a huge part of why healbeams make me sad but limpets carrying a SCB to a targeted ship would be awesome.

 

[brumster]

Role-based gameplay is something that this game totally needs, IMO. At the moment, the suggestion from the ships and the potential loadouts is that there shoul be distinct roles - some have sturdy hulls, some have speed, some have manoeuvrability - but the rest of the game doesn't really support playing in different combat roles. Note I say combat roles - I know there's high-level roles of mining, combat, discovery and trade - but the 4 rarely interact, the only real valid gameplay interaction would be combat<->trade, in the case of piracy.

It would be nice to have massive multiplayer battles where ships - and players therefore - have clearly defined roles. Missile boats, close-range brawlers, support/repair/refit/reload vessels, anti-fighter escorts, fast spotters, etc. would be awesome. Unfortunately it just doesn't feel there's enough separation at the moment - everything feels overly balanced (general ship size notwithstanding of course - no-one expects a sidewinder to go toe-to-toe with an Anaconda, but how cool would it be to be able to strip out a sidewinder to a payload delivery device - one massive warhead and that's it - it's mission purely to break through to a capital ship and deliver that knock-out blow? Again, unfortunately, I don't see how this could ever really deliver good gameplay value in E with the current 32 instance limit.

In short - an interesting idea, one that will certainly play out in PvP (and maybe PvE when we see the finer details, although I somehow suspect it's use will be somewhat limited in that aspect)....

 

[lysan]

Not sure what that means - "a NMS universe" ?

A non realistic universe that only exist in fantasy land, where you can have -160 C and trees.

At least ED has a 1:1 simulation of the milky way (not feature complete) where you can actually learn something while you play.

 

[Mike Evans]

For me, yes. FTL travel and healing beams occupy two totally seperate fictional mindsets for me.

That's a huge part of why healbeams make me sad but limpets carrying a SCB to a targeted ship would be awesome.

I don't see how hard it is to imagine that in a universe where there are literal energy shields that can absorb and block all incoming energy by consuming from some other source of energy there couldn't be a directed beam from a third party that if tuned correctly (hence the need for a wing) could impart more energy to reconstruct said shield. It's not "healing" the ship, it's just recharging the shields in the same way a SCB can dump extra energy into a shield to recharge it. No shields and it's useless. Not in a wing, it's useless. Concentrating on aiming at a wing member, you're not able to attack anyone else. Get your fire groups confused, you've just attacked your wing mate.

 

[Eymerich]

I don't see how hard it is to imagine that in a universe where there are literal energy shields that can absorb and block all incoming energy by consuming from some other source of energy there couldn't be a directed beam from a third party that if tuned correctly (hence the need for a wing) could impart more energy to reconstruct said shield. It's not "healing" the ship, it's just recharging the shields in the same way a SCB can dump extra energy into a shield to recharge it. No shields and it's useless. Not in a wing, it's useless. Concentrating on aiming at a wing member, you're not able to attack anyone else. Get your fire groups confused, you've just attacked your wing mate.

Just a small consideration.

Reading your post, and I thanks for posting here, I assume this project (beam laser recharhing shields) is completly useless for solo player. Am I Wrong?

 

[Derath]

New wing meta
1x scb/hull tank Cutter w/healing beams
2x tank Corvettes with huge beams/multicannons

They will just shoot whose using the beams, lets be real here heal beams won't influence PvP at all unless they have an astranomical recharge lol, bursts already extremely high and large ships can already spam SCB's anyway :/

 

[Shadowdancer]

Get your fire groups confused, you've just attacked your wing mate.

There will be infinite entertainment from that, or "oh ****, I had that on the other ship!"

(edit) I also find it hugely amusing that people are already crying wolf over something that they know nothing about but what's in a piece of concept art. But yeah, they're experts and know all the numbers, that it will be instant heal-to-full for everything and ruin the game. Elite is dying. From green beams.

 

[Mike Evans]

Just a small consideration.

Reading your post, and I thanks for posting here, I assume this project (beam laser recharhing shields) is completly useless for solo player. Am I Wrong?

It only works against wing members. If you're not in a wing regardless of the reason (solo or otherwise) it's not going to be able to recharge any shields. It still will be a perfectly functional weapon however.

 

[lysan]

I don't see how hard it is to imagine that in a universe where there are literal energy shields that can absorb and block all incoming energy by consuming from some other source of energy there couldn't be a directed beam from a third party that if tuned correctly (hence the need for a wing) could impart more energy to reconstruct said shield. It's not "healing" the ship, it's just recharging the shields in the same way a SCB can dump extra energy into a shield to recharge it. No shields and it's useless. Not in a wing, it's useless. Concentrating on aiming at a wing member, you're not able to attack anyone else. Get your fire groups confused, you've just attacked your wing mate.

Its absolutely plausible, even with today's knowledge. However so is Jar Jar Binks, I think its how its presented

In radiative far-field techniques, also called power beaming, power is transferred by beams of electromagnetic radiation, like microwaves or laser beams. These techniques can transport energy longer distances but must be aimed at the receiver.

(I'm not against this idea, I just ask annoying questions)

 

[Luniticisi]

I don't see how hard it is to imagine that in a universe where there are literal energy shields that can absorb and block all incoming energy by consuming from some other source of energy there couldn't be a directed beam from a third party that if tuned correctly (hence the need for a wing) could impart more energy to reconstruct said shield. It's not "healing" the ship, it's just recharging the shields in the same way a SCB can dump extra energy into a shield to recharge it. No shields and it's useless. Not in a wing, it's useless. Concentrating on aiming at a wing member, you're not able to attack anyone else. Get your fire groups confused, you've just attacked your wing mate.

So This weapon/healing laser IS multi-player only, just out of curiosity, how many of the upgrades (or percentage of them) are designed to only work if you're playing with a wing?

 

[Infidel Deity]

I don't see how hard it is to imagine that in a universe where there are literal energy shields that can absorb and block all incoming energy by consuming from some other source of energy there couldn't be a directed beam from a third party that if tuned correctly (hence the need for a wing) could impart more energy to reconstruct said shield. It's not "healing" the ship, it's just recharging the shields in the same way a SCB can dump extra energy into a shield to recharge it. No shields and it's useless. Not in a wing, it's useless. Concentrating on aiming at a wing member, you're not able to attack anyone else. Get your fire groups confused, you've just attacked your wing mate.

Exactly!

 

[Ian Skippy]

I can't speak for everyone here. But I don't see how this could be anything but trying to introduce a healer-style role (or function) into the game. Why else would you bother upgrading your weapons so that you can repair the shields wing mates? I have no problem with engineers and modifying weapons (or whatever) to accomplish different things. But looking at this particular example, it looks very much like they are trying to bring a very traditional "role" into the game.

I can understand healers/clerics/paladins/whatevers in fantasy roleplaying games. They fit in that genre. I just can't see the fit in a cut-throat space simulator/game. It would be kind of like adding a special tank mod to World of Tanks (I don't play the game but I certainly hope this isn't true) that would repair/buff other tanks by shooting at them. Sure, it could work from a gameplay point of view. But from the general theme of the game, it just doesn't make sense.

Just my opinion, of course.

You dont see how it could be anything but a healing role? I have a FSDi on my explonda ship, does that make me an 'interdictor role'? Will it unfairly punish 'wings with no FSDi'?Or does it just give my ship an extra function whenever I want to use it? And why doesn't providing support make sense, other than that they currently arent in yet? We already have many 'roles' in the game, some of them the staple of coop games in general (tank, stealth). Support 'role' is another one that is even suggested in some ships designs (FGS), but currently has no actual modules for it. Support roles, whether 'medic', 'repair' or whatever are also common in contemporary settings and sci-fi (so definitely not 'fantasy' specific), and there is absolutely nothing in ED lore that suggests navies have suddenly lost the notion of support vessels. Heck, what about 'passenger missions'? Isn't that 'clearly trying to include a new role'?

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

Just a small consideration.

Reading your post, and I thanks for posting here, I assume this project (beam laser recharhing shields) is completly useless for solo player. Am I Wrong?

You will have NPC wingmen piloting fighter ships you store in your belly afaik, it is coming in 2.2 I think.