I suspect they are corporate FaceBook accountants actually.
Oculus update attempts to stop Vive users
- Thread starter Mark D
- Start date
![[HJ]-RedRaven](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/67/67389.jpg?1553527112){kind=avatar}
Exactly.
I just hope the VR ecosystem becomes more open and inclusive. The market is too small and niche to segment it yet.
When I finally get it, *prays* I'd like the Rift to be able to play any experience, and for Vive users to be free to do the same. Locking software down to one HMD or another will end up reducing competition, innovation and ultimately drive costs up for the end-user. IMO.
There's still no real clear killer app (even ED) to guide a consumer towards one or the other (X-Box vs PlayStation et al). For me, since I know ED works with the Vive and Rift, the industrial design, weight, and ATW sealed the deal for me. But if Elite only supported the Vive, I'd have ordered a Vive.
Have in mind that ATW only works well for rotation, not for trasnlation, unless you want to play sitting your whole life, ATW does not seal anything for me, reprojection in the vive does the same thing as ATW , but works better in room scale since it support translation.
what ever happens,no-one asked for a software shop.
Oculus backer backed a head mounted display.
a display without restrictions.
just imagine your monitor has restrictions like this,ridiculous right.
I see it as a clear mistake to walk this path for Oculus.
software should be protected on the software side,
using the Oculus as a software dongle is a big no no to me.
Oculus backer backed a head mounted display.
a display without restrictions.
just imagine your monitor has restrictions like this,ridiculous right.
I see it as a clear mistake to walk this path for Oculus.
software should be protected on the software side,
using the Oculus as a software dongle is a big no no to me.
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Geez, another one got it the wrong way around! What does Oculus block on their hardware? NOTHING. You can use Steam, you can use standalone products, you can write your own, NOTHING is blocked!
What is blocked is Oculus Home to Oculus Rift, THAT IS ALL! So if you have a Rift HMD you're tied to nothing!
Anyone else not understand this rather simple thing?!
I strongly suspect that this is more about "exclusivity" deals than anything else.
They, like region locks, are the most banal and self-defeating "money making" schemes in existence. All you do is alienate potential customers or force people into piracy to get what they want by denying them legitimate channels.
Vive owners should be able to buy and run every VR software application available and the reverse should be true for CV1 owners.
The ONLY exceptions would be where the applications are hardware specific (such as augmented reality which isn't supported by the CV1 *yet*).
And I am someone who has a CV1 on order.
The kind of greed and stupidity this kind of behaviour exhibits is truly mind-blowing, considering the price-point for the bottom rung of the VR ladder. You'd think on any sane planet, they'd be welcoming additional customers from their competitor with welcome arms!
The days where people buy one brand of hardware just to get the "must have" game are long over. I buy hardware on it's merits, not because it comes with the latest Pokemon.
They, like region locks, are the most banal and self-defeating "money making" schemes in existence. All you do is alienate potential customers or force people into piracy to get what they want by denying them legitimate channels.
Vive owners should be able to buy and run every VR software application available and the reverse should be true for CV1 owners.
The ONLY exceptions would be where the applications are hardware specific (such as augmented reality which isn't supported by the CV1 *yet*).
And I am someone who has a CV1 on order.
The kind of greed and stupidity this kind of behaviour exhibits is truly mind-blowing, considering the price-point for the bottom rung of the VR ladder. You'd think on any sane planet, they'd be welcoming additional customers from their competitor with welcome arms!
The days where people buy one brand of hardware just to get the "must have" game are long over. I buy hardware on it's merits, not because it comes with the latest Pokemon.
that's exactly what I wanted to hear.
and you seem sure on this.
I know you for some time and you always seem to know your stuff.
only hope Oculus makes a proper statement on this.
they must see what a stir has been made with the update.
I cant find the one statement yet so if someone finds it please post it.
Jabokai do you have the Cv1?
and thus speak from experience?
you know with Suckerberg Oculus lost a lot of trust.
the guy creeps me out.
Yes I have a CV1 and I play things on it through Oculus Home, I play ED and other stuff standalone (didn't bother getting the free Oculus Home key from FD), and I play things through Steam.
The only lockdown is locking Oculus Home to the Rift. I agree with others that I think this is a bad idea - I want VR HMDs to be peripherals, not platforms and I think it's poor form for Oculus to be doing this. BUT this only really affects non Oculus owners at present as they're the ones locked out of some things. I don't think this situation will last over time - HMDs will become peripherals. So although Oculus are being "bad guys" as far as the end user is concerned Oculus users have all the options!
The only lockdown is locking Oculus Home to the Rift. I agree with others that I think this is a bad idea - I want VR HMDs to be peripherals, not platforms and I think it's poor form for Oculus to be doing this. BUT this only really affects non Oculus owners at present as they're the ones locked out of some things. I don't think this situation will last over time - HMDs will become peripherals. So although Oculus are being "bad guys" as far as the end user is concerned Oculus users have all the options!
@Jabokai
that's the thing protectionism can bring platform behaviour to the P.C.
its all up to how the competitors will react.
its not unlikely they too will start protecting their market in a same manner.
and start demanding choices from software producers.
if that happens it would be like betrayal to Frontier Cos they were one of the first to support Oculus.
hence my sharp reaction,even its not there yet it seems just around the corner.
and if no one protest its likely to become fact.
that's the thing protectionism can bring platform behaviour to the P.C.
its all up to how the competitors will react.
its not unlikely they too will start protecting their market in a same manner.
and start demanding choices from software producers.
if that happens it would be like betrayal to Frontier Cos they were one of the first to support Oculus.
hence my sharp reaction,even its not there yet it seems just around the corner.
and if no one protest its likely to become fact.
Elite runs on both. DCS was first for Oculus but will run on both. PCars runs on both. Both Vireio and Vorpx are doing DX11 and will soon support both. If their is a schism in the future , like Playstation and Xbox, I see plenty of room for both. Wouldn't lose a lot of sleep over this one.
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Just as you, I'm actually pretty relaxed about it. I wouldn't use OH anyway - tried it using my DK2 on my last computer which conveniently self-destructed three days after (apparently it evolved consciousness and a sense of morality).
I wouldn't rely on readily available fixes once FB starts cracking down though. Be prepared to lose all your OH purchased games unless you're fine with becoming a facebook slave for life.
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Can you dial up the hyperbole a little, I'm afraid "slave" is a little weak these days.
I was wondering about this as well. I guess when suits are prodded and asked about their intentions, their automatic response is... piracy.
Facebook/Oculus has launched their first salvo in a DRM war. What will follows next will be the escalation as the hackers pick the DRM locks. Soon all your VR system will be doing is checking whether or not you are a valid user.
When the suits and the hackers start going at each other with full force, the real loser will be the honest customer cowering from the shrapnel, who just wanted to play a few games.
This is not tinfoil hattery. To see for yourself, download Wireshark and you'll see that the Oculus software is communicating with Facebook servers every few seconds, even when the Rift isn't being used. I suspect this is due to the service that starts at bootup and runs continuously in the background.
Data mining the users is Facebook's endgame. As far as Facebook are concerned, they are the product.
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Maybe, but why does it need to check for updates so frequently? Judging by Facebook's past behaviour, I think it's not unreasonable to assume that they really want a piece of software on as many desktops as possible that runs continuously and is in almost continuous communication with Facebook servers.
This isn't heresay, I've tried it myself, and I would encourage anyone to do the same by downloading the (free) Wireshark utility.
Slopey
Volunteer Moderator
And which information specifically is the update service sending to the Facebook servers?? This is all scaremongering nonsense.
Many software packages check for updates quite frequently - I know any that my company write do so, on a reasonably regular basis - it's not tinfoil hattery, it's just practical. And seeing as Oculus are owned by FB who have a massive server infrastructure, where would you suggest they host the update servers?
*sigh*
If you're that paranoid about Facebook, Steam, or heaven forbid Google - why even own a computer?? And best not ever go outside with CCTV, spy satellites and RFID tracking your every move!!!
This whole thing about Facebook being the boogyman and taking your first 3 unborn children is so tedious. Either use it, or don't.
Anyway - all this chat is off-topic, so lets give it a rest. The topic is about access to Oculus Home for Vive users, not Facebook data policies.
Many software packages check for updates quite frequently - I know any that my company write do so, on a reasonably regular basis - it's not tinfoil hattery, it's just practical. And seeing as Oculus are owned by FB who have a massive server infrastructure, where would you suggest they host the update servers?
*sigh*
If you're that paranoid about Facebook, Steam, or heaven forbid Google - why even own a computer?? And best not ever go outside with CCTV, spy satellites and RFID tracking your every move!!!
This whole thing about Facebook being the boogyman and taking your first 3 unborn children is so tedious. Either use it, or don't.
Anyway - all this chat is off-topic, so lets give it a rest. The topic is about access to Oculus Home for Vive users, not Facebook data policies.
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Can you dial up the hyperbole a little, I'm afraid "slave" is a little weak these days.
Whilst it's hyperbolic, this is not a good situation:
- if you buy software on Oculus Home, then it will *only* work on hardware that Oculus certify.
- at the current moment, that appears to be only Oculus hardware, and there is no sign of that changing. Revive shows that supporting other APIs is clearly not a huge *technical* problem.
- Oculus are quite prepared to use DRM to enforce that restriction.
So if you buy a game on Oculus home, then if you want to play that game on future hardware, then that hardware needs to be Oculus. It's "Vendor lock-in", something I wouldn't have expected Carmack to be involved in. (another recent example of this anti-consumer technique is NVIDIA g-sync)
![[VR] Mad Mike](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/27/27910.jpg?1553527108){kind=avatar}
if this is still the situation in 6 months time i will begin to agree with you, but for now i am prepared to give oculus the benefit of the doubt and hope that at the moment the sticking point is with valve/HTC and getting DECENT support officially built in complete with ATW, which is vital for proper official support.
Apparently oculus were getting complaints from vive users that their games were not running smoothly on the recommended hardware specs (GTX970) and asking for refunds.... which fair play apparently oculus HAVE given refunds to vive users..... but that is not right, oculus should not be expected to support people using a hack.
For official support VIVE needs ATW support in oculus home titles, and imo until this happens the only company it is hurting is oculus, and the only company who is benefiting is valve, because they are so big they do not need oculus store on their vive. Valve must we wetting themselves right now. IF you choose to believe Palmer Lucky, as soon as valve help them get the vive fully supported, like Oculus helped valve with the rift, then the VIVE will get access to oculus home.
Also lets not forget Playful in all of this mess...... With the revive hack in place they had zero chance of actually SELLING their game Lucky's Tale to any VIVE users as they were all stealing it!!!
Apparently oculus were getting complaints from vive users that their games were not running smoothly on the recommended hardware specs (GTX970) and asking for refunds.... which fair play apparently oculus HAVE given refunds to vive users..... but that is not right, oculus should not be expected to support people using a hack.
For official support VIVE needs ATW support in oculus home titles, and imo until this happens the only company it is hurting is oculus, and the only company who is benefiting is valve, because they are so big they do not need oculus store on their vive. Valve must we wetting themselves right now. IF you choose to believe Palmer Lucky, as soon as valve help them get the vive fully supported, like Oculus helped valve with the rift, then the VIVE will get access to oculus home.
Also lets not forget Playful in all of this mess...... With the revive hack in place they had zero chance of actually SELLING their game Lucky's Tale to any VIVE users as they were all stealing it!!!
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