Engineers So What is the Point ?

The basic idea of being able to upgrade and customize your ship is a really exiting one, It makes me remember that scene in Star Wars when Han Solo declares that he has made some special modifications to the Millenium Falcon, and that is somethng that at heart really interests me....

....But, Given that the shoddy multiplayer trader/prirate/ bounty hunter gameplay mechanics pretty much ensure that no meaningfull PvP ever happens, (i've now started to combat log from the Griefers who attack without any game reason) so for me, there is really little point in all the grind to improve modules.... as they are simply not going to enhance my game at all.....
 
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Woohoo This gonna be a good one!

What i'm saying is that without first fixing the the multiplayer roleplay mechanics to allow for meaningfull PvP interactions, then I see no reason to grind for hours to improve a few modules.....

Or let me explain it this way.... As a bounty hunter, I should see good reason to want to maximise the potential of my ship and increase my ability to take down pirates.... BUT as the game has so far completely failed to realise any meaningfull or interesting Pirate V Bounty Hunter mechanic.... why bother with engineers....
 
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Then don't grind. Just play. If you're bothered about a type of player, try a private group or solo and just enjoy the universe and improved NPC. Do occasional Engineer bits as you enjoy whatever you liked before, in a new sparkly, better rendered, better mission generated 2.1 environment.
 
Then don't grind. Just play. If you're bothered about a type of player, try a private group or solo and just enjoy the universe and improved NPC. Do occasional Engineer bits as you enjoy whatever you liked before, in a new sparkly, better rendered, better mission generated 2.1 environment.

You completely missed the point..... Its not that I don't mind having to grind a bit, I just need a reason to do it....

Simply upgrading ones ship is not enough..... Need a reason to need a better/customised ship.....
 
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What i'm saying is that without first fixing the the multiplayer roleplay mechanics to allow for meaningfull PvP interactions, then I see no reason to grind for hours to improve a few modules.....

I don't really want to state the obvious here, so I won't.

Also have you actually tried it? I'm up to level 3 with the Farseer eng, and it's not been grind-y at all. Even the trip to Maia for the meta-alloys was worth it as I picked up a load of exploration data along the way, and a few quite profitable, erm, "delivery" missions ...
 
Effort/reward is the worst with the engineers. Alot of effort done for a really minor reward. Though I haven't tested out anything yet I assume Multicannons will be the new pulse laser meta as they can now deal thermic damage as well without any proper tradeoff.

Low EPS resulting in incredible high DPE and now the added DPS makes this the non-plus-ultra weapon. But considering the utterly boring grind (as it stands now) which is required for this is making me just want to uninstall Elite.

Want a Corvette? Grind charity missions
Want access to founders world? Grind a rank
Want a good ship? Grind low-cap-cr missions or go PP
Want to influence something in powerplay? Grind NPCs or cargo for merits
Want to explore something? Grind systems
Want credits? Choose a grind career

Definition of grind: A repetetive/monotone task that is low rewarding and has to be done over and over again due to the lack of high-reward alternatives.
 
Though I haven't tested out anything yet I assume... blah blah blah...


That's about enough out of you.

Low EPS resulting in incredible high DPE and now the added DPS makes this the non-plus-ultra weapon.

What the hell does this even mean? Do you even enjoy flying spaceships?
What the hell is meta? Give up all these insane acronyms and you might have fun.
 
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Effort/reward is the worst with the engineers. Alot of effort done for a really minor reward. Though I haven't tested out anything yet I assume Multicannons will be the new pulse laser meta as they can now deal thermic damage as well without any proper tradeoff.

Low EPS resulting in incredible high DPE and now the added DPS makes this the non-plus-ultra weapon. But considering the utterly boring grind (as it stands now) which is required for this is making me just want to uninstall Elite.

Want a Corvette? Grind charity missions
Want access to founders world? Grind a rank
Want a good ship? Grind low-cap-cr missions or go PP
Want to influence something in powerplay? Grind NPCs or cargo for merits
Want to explore something? Grind systems
Want credits? Choose a grind career

Definition of grind: A repetetive/monotone task that is low rewarding and has to be done over and over again due to the lack of high-reward alternatives.

You are critcising the game over a model of gameplay utilised by the gameplayer. It is not encouraged by the game. In fact, they've said they wished that players would explore missions, places and roles a lot more, and not just grind to get a "Corvette". If you approach Elite with an ideology you must "beat" X, then you'll get bored.

It's applying the model for a book-ended game (an RPG where there is an end goal to work to prepare for) with an open-ended immersion world, where you do what you enjoy over a long duration, with development drops to expand and improve the world naturally (while repairing problems that have popped up from feedback). You grind in this world, you suffer really. This is a long term game, a Corvette should really be the result of a couple of years doing different things, accruing money and reputation as you fight, explore, and trade. People rush to get a Corvette (some Robigo'd their days to do it) and end up with a Corvette, but still in an open world. There's no end-game.

Each to how they play, but applying the wrong gameplay to the wrong game will frustrate. Adapt how you play and the game will either be enriched, or you will know its the wrong game for you.
 
Each to how they play, but applying the wrong gameplay to the wrong game will frustrate. Adapt how you play and the game will either be enriched, or you will know its the wrong game for you.

Which is very much my point, for over twenty years we discussed Elite IV and the consensus always seemed to be that it would be much more of a multiplayer role playing adventure in space than the previous games....
And yet they have failed to implement any mechanics that lead to any form of role play based PvP, whilst insisting on adding yet more pointless grindy gameplay.

Its not so much the grind of some of the mechanics that is the problem, but the sheer lack of any reason to do it.....
 
...they've said they wished that players would explore missions, places and roles a lot more...

They really need to stop just 'wishing' and give players a reason to do those things...

The fact that so many of these threads exist indicates that (the vocal "just go and play" minority aside) there is a significant population which is not satisfied by constant delaying tactics and arbitrary hurdles in the road to "playing their way"
 
So. If I understand it right, you want a meaningful PvP, but when someone attacks you, you log.

Well, I for one think that Elite is exactly what it tries to be. It's a sandbox with people in it. They do what they want. Period.
 
What i'm saying is that without first fixing the the multiplayer roleplay mechanics to allow for meaningfull PvP interactions, then I see no reason to grind for hours to improve a few modules.....

Or let me explain it this way.... As a bounty hunter, I should see good reason to want to maximise the potential of my ship and increase my ability to take down pirates.... BUT as the game has so far completely failed to realise any meaningfull or interesting Pirate V Bounty Hunter mechanic.... why bother with engineers....

What is the point of collecting loot and schematics in The Witcher 3 and then bring these to a blacksmith?

;)
 
You completely missed the point..... Its not that I don't mind having to grind a bit, I just need a reason to do it....

Simply upgrading ones ship is not enough..... Need a reason to need a better/customised ship.....

THere are a lot of possible reasons.

You might want better weapons.
You might want better shields.
You might want lighter gear.
You might want sturdier gear.
You might want faster engines.
You might want longer ranged FSDs.
You might want FSDs that take less time to jump.
You might want gear that uses less power.
You might want gear that generates less heat.
Any combination of the above, plus the ones I forgot to mention.

Many of them actually help you a lot to escape those engagements that you speak of without needing to pull the cable.

And there's also seconday reasons, I am hoarding materials dropping into USS and noticing how much more fun and varied they are now. Also using equipments that I rarely used before, and some never had (like the wake scanner).

If none of that matters to you, then simply don't use the engineer's services. Its not bad to not like or use a particular feature of a game. I for instance don't like SRV base raids, so I simply don't do them.
 
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The basic idea of being able to upgrade and customize your ship is a really exiting one, It makes me remember that scene in Star Wars when Han Solo declares that he has made some special modifications to the Millenium Falcon, and that is somethng that at heart really interests me....

....But, Given that the shoddy multiplayer trader/prirate/ bounty hunter gameplay mechanics pretty much ensure that no meaningfull PvP ever happens, (i've now started to combat log from the Griefers who attack without any game reason) so for me, there is really little point in all the grind to improve modules.... as they are simply not going to enhance my game at all.....

The wall you're going to hit here I'd suggest is, many players seem happy with these simplistic random mini-game mechanics. And when yet more are developed they seem fine with that.


We're 18months into this game, and now in 2.1 a huge development effort has been dedicated to The Engineers. Now this is made up of two elements, the ability to craft, and then a huge supporting structure to make you "work" to pay for the crafting.

Now that's all well and good, and let's assume the crafting itself is a valid use of the development time. ie: Are you happy development time is invested so you have have a 15% more powerful beam laser? Is that a good use of that time? Let's assume yes!

So let's instead look at the design and development effort at the surrounding mechanics. What we have, yet again, are FD dishing out a bucket of very simplistic time sponge mechanics. We're 18 months into the game, and a new element of gameplay (to use my favour current example) is to sit at a station or NAV beacon, point your ship at wakes, and press a button, over and over... Does this sound like a type of gameplay you would wish to see actively designed and developed? What does such gameplay bring to the game? Why is this sort of gameplay being added in favour of the huge list of seemingly far more interesting elements that could have instead have been done that seemingly would actually be propelling the gameplay forwards?

If you're someone who enjoys these types of mechanics great.

Personally I'm just getting more and more confused why we're:-
a) Getting yet more and more of these sort of mechanics added to ED?
b) More importantly, why we're getting them in favour of improvements and other gameplay developments that would surely actually move gameplay onto to a more interesting and logical levels.

Are you like me? Where I look at these new mechanics surrounding The Engineers and wonder why we're getting yet more of these simplistic time sponge repeat over and over mechanics, clearly at the expense of development time that could have been spent at trying to move the game forwards to something more involved, deeper, interesting and logical? Note: And these range of course from small improvements (eg: NPC pirate giving clear terms/demands before going jihad) to large ones (eg: NPC crew, exploration content, piracy reputation/bases, mining improvements, Wing missions, fighter escort for platforms/stations/capital ships, etc...)
 
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The wall you're going to hit here I'd suggest is, many players seem happy with these simplistic random mini-game mechanics.

We're 18months into this game, and now in 2.1 a huge development effort has been dedicated to The Engineers. Now this is made up of two elements, the ability to craft, and then a huge supporting structure to make you "work" to pay for the crafting.

Now that's all well and good, and let's assume the crafting is a valid use of the development time. ie: Are you happy development time is invested so you have have a 15% more powerful beam laser? Is that a good use of that time?

So let's instead look at the design and development effort at the surrounding mechanics. What we have, yet again, are FD dishing out a bucket of very simplistic time sponge mechanics. We're 18 months into the game, and a new element of gameplay (to use my favour current example) is to sit at a station or NAV beacon, point your ship at wakes, and press a button, over and over... Does this sound like a type of gameplay you would wish to see actively designed and developed? What does such gameplay bring to the game? Why is this sort of gameplay being added in favour of the huge list of seemingly far more interesting elements that could have instead have been done that seemingly would actually be propelling the gameplay forwards?

If you're someone who enjoys these types of mechanics great.

Personally I'm just getting more and more confused why we're:-
a) Getting yet more and more of these sort of mechanics added to ED?
b) More importantly, why we're getting them in favour of improvements and other gameplay developments/improvement that would surely actually move gameplay onto to a more interesting and logical levels?



How does it feel to spend so much time crafting a response... and not actually say anything?

point your ship at wakes, and press a button, over and over

It's sad you actually think this. It's sad you spend so much time on the forum, and so little enjoying the game.

Why don't you take off?
 
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