Discuss the AI here!

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

Unfortunately this is true.
NPC balance was an issue during beta as it was fairly obvious they were going to be overpowered for a lot of players (especially rookies).

Hardcore didn't dictate anything. FD has always promised NPC AI will get harder. "Rookies" aren't no subject here. More like "web browser sim players". Look, there's have been huge misunderstanding what ED is since last year. People farming NPCs was always a warning sign that this won't end well when FD will rein in on NPC AI. It has been *always* in design. Of course, not few second insta death - it is still a bug...but harder, more agressive AI is what will be a norm. You will have to find another way around galaxy.

This discussion will go in circles till FD will give more info and will start to do balancing and bug fixing. Before that this is just useless speculation. FD has rarely caved to any group moaning. They follow their own path. They want you to play game, sure, but they want to add danger too.

 

[Commandr Sam]

Why can't you have a combat rating that comes from a simulator like CQC? That way, there is no doubt about your skill level.

And pirates should be well behaved. If you are interdicted by a pirate who is above your rating (that should rarely happen) then you should stop, listen to his demands and either give him what he wants or open fire and challenge him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TijL_oUz50k

Why should a priate with a higher combat rating not attack you? The rank of pirates you attract should be depenedant on the value of cargo you are carrying and the sector you are in.

I agree most priates should be able to be bought off with cargo tho, there are still too many npc pirates that shoot with out demding cargo. I guess this will improve when we can have some proper comms with npcs.

 

[yodajedifishmaster]

There are lots of reasons that people choose solo and if there is one thing we can be sure of its that solo isn't going anywhere.




I have taken a look at your ship and reworked it a bit. I guess it is a multi role ship where you want to smuggle, do missions and some PvE combat and explore. I have kept most of it the same but upped the defense a bit but used the same budget.

http://coriolis.io/outfit/asp/25A5A...4054c2i0m2t242f.Iw18WQ==.CwBjEYxAmW+85oksNIg=


In my opinion it is better to re-outfit to your role, the Asp isn't brilliant at combat but a good combat fit can make it viable.

thank you i wish i could rep you again! even in my heated discussion with people here they gave me another build as well - it wasnt for what i wanted (pure trade he said) but it was generous i hope i remembered to give him rep too. its nice to see.

 

[Freyar]

They want you to play game, sure, but they want to add danger too.

You can add danger, just not as sudden as this. They also have got to stop thinking grinding for two years to finally get to an FDL or Anaconda is fun.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

You can add danger, just not as sudden as this. They also have got to stop thinking grinding for two years to finally get to an FDL or Anaconda is fun.

They don't, because they clearly don't think grinding is right way to play game. But if you still want to grind, they can't stop you. Just be aware that it is not something ship progression, or unlock you achieve. This game is specially designed to carter moment-by-moment gameplay. If that's all grind to you, nothing really gonna help you.

As for danger - it is not sudden. It was telegraphed for months it will come. As for bugs and insta deaths - yeah, they will get a fix.

 

[milligna]

Love the updates, only quibble is would love some more variety for tactics with higher-ranked NPCs. Go crazy and experimental, give us some unpredictable behaviors for 'em!

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

Love the updates, only quibble is would love some more variety for tactics with higher-ranked NPCs. Go crazy and experimental, give us some unpredictable behaviors for 'em!

I hope SJA isn't scared of this, because that's exactly what I want her to do. More unpredictability.

 

[yodajedifishmaster]

Love the updates, only quibble is would love some more variety for tactics with higher-ranked NPCs. Go crazy and experimental, give us some unpredictable behaviors for 'em!

wasnt that what sja said she wanted to do? i think thats planned. or wanted to happen.

also from a lore point of view thats entirely logical. the best are the ones who invent and get combat moves named after them. so they do innovative and unexpected things.

 

[smiths121]

Well back in a Sidewinder ( playing iron man mode had oodles of insurance). Again own stupidity.

I thin the casual player may have an advantage. Statistically there appears to be only a few hours before I do something dumb, I do not need to do, which is making iron man mode a tad frustrating. Would have got away with it - of it was not for that meddling 2.1 update. My stupidity is the baddie all along!

Well and truly over the AI changes now - bugged mission system is the thing that needs more immediate attention. Serioulsy 1:5-1:3 is not gonna help the nubie player - gonna help them far less than learning about threat levels by trying that is for sure.

Simon

 

[Seonid]

my gut feeling is that hardcore = long time combat only focused player with hundreds of millions or billions and a secret massive cargo capacity ship they can use on a safish route to recoup millions per run if their rebuy ever bothers them so they can die endlessly in glorious fun battles.

So not me then, despite not having any problems. Good to know. I certainly can't be a "combat only focussed" player with a combat rank of Master...

 

[Boomer Kay]

or have a general purpose ship that can do a bit of everything (these are the second most important since like the original game, they trade the places the traders cannot or will not go, whereas the traders supply and keep going the safe systems economies).

Well, you had the third or 4th opinion now that your loadout is not really good and tips how to improve it.
You keep defending and blaming everything around for it to not work well and whatnot.
Time to rethink your approach I'd say.

The relevance of games is to adapt and overcome. That has very little to do with hardcore or something. It's just "playing the game". Try the cheesy methods to avoid interdiction, they work even better than the intricate ones. But that's basically what sets games apart from tv.

 

[Chris1965]

New AI ridiculous 10M insurance in 72 Hours cant even kill a diamondback with a maxed viper 4 with plasma and beams stashed my Python as its just target fodder and were the hell did the AIs get these new Hyper Velocity Pulse/Plasma/Thermal weapons from they go through A sjields and your canopy in seconds im staying of until its resolved and if its not maybe i will switch to an alternative

 

[relayer]

I will add a bit to the debate here...

I agree with the position that the new AI isn't really that bad; it's the overpowered modules they all seem to have. Vultures firing dual PAs quickly and repeatedly with no cooldown on a ship notorious for heat management problems. NPC Anacondas flying like Vipers. Being matched repeatedly with ships/weapons that are "just a tad better" than your own ship (that is, only being interdicted by these NPCs and not the range of ships encountered before the patch).

I've seen all this myself and in videos on YouTube.

I don't mind a fair fight or even the random Anaconda, Vulture or FAS. I like the new AI and would enjoy the odd mixup with them, but having ships that defy all the ingame "rules" or ship/weapons parameters that players are subject to (heat, physics, speed, etc) is what I think is the real problem.

 

[scorpionarachnid]

I like the new AI....BUT the game play is against you, with these restrictive delay timings on various systems we are doomed!

I've lost two ships so far and been crippled twice to hull 32% This has cost me over 11,000,000cr, I made just over 1.2Mcr in an hour. The AI is harder, but the bounties are halved! At this rate I'll be in a sidewinder soon.

My Story
I accidently hit a NCP police in a high res site, I went "wanted" for 400cr, but then because there were a few "condas" I could not escape (23 disruption factor etc.) Tried to hold off my shields from dying but time "delay" too great lost shields, boosted away, only to find missiles hitting my engines/FSD nocked it off line " left dead in space for a few second (CRITICLE seconds), with 6 police hitting the crap out of me I was lost..

This happen again to me in a similar situation (canon shot "slow shot" hit these crazy police rolling all over the place. Again could not escape, lost ship. No2.

The problem: 1) We can't escape when we need to, BUT CAN'T due to old delays; timings as "23 dis factor"(not balanced), shield boost delay too long for new weapons ripping down shields in 3 sec. (not balanced) (This has nothing to do with multiple cells)!

All old time delays on critical systems need to be looked at and balanced to cope with new AI and more importantly with new weapons.

2) My crime was to shoot a cop once! (400cr) response 7 cops immediately turned their guns on me (not balanced) you would think I killed 10 police!

GAME mechanics not balanced. Profit down by half ;enhanced AI pirates up 3x (not balanced). Cannot survive at this rate. PS KEEP AI as it is; just make it survivable with the game mechanics. We need to escape and have the game mechanics to do so. Easy fix!

3) Why not have a EASY, NORMAL or HARD setting like most games.

 

[relayer]

I for one ("Dangerous") have been interdicted by nothing but Elite NPCs since the 2.1 launch (about 20 interdictions in total, so unlikely to be just RNG).

I agree. I did some testing the last 2 days, changing ships and observing. At first I thought I was imagining things or ascribing something sinister in the new AI; then I started swapping ships (5 in all) to test.

Each time I'd move up in a class of ship, the NPCs would be matched to that ship level (or slightly higher ship level). When I dropped into the DBX, ships my size or larger would spawn. Switch to Python - same thing; matching my class of ship & with god-weapons. Switch to Anaconda - same thing again. Switch to Asp - you guessed it. Vulture? Nothing but Elite FASs.

Anecdotal evidence? Maybe, maybe. However, there's enough "coincidences" to make me leary and cut down my playtime (on a holiday yet) until this issue is resolved.

*remember, I am not against the new AI at all - I think it could be good/fun to play, but this "custom tailoring" to your own ship along with the obviously-borked "insta-Elite NPCs with Engineer top-tier superweapons" has made me decide to wait until Tuesday morning & the next patch(s)

 

[plungarios]

My two pence worth. I started playing Elite in '84 and was delighted when this version was launched. It was a long time waiting. I am what I suppose one would describe as a newbie and I am comfortable with that.

I am not however not at all comfortable with the update and will be leaving. For me the game has become almost unplayable and certainly not entertaining anymore. The npcs have mods that we don't and the interdiction rate is ludicrous and seems to lack any logic whatsoever. I could go on but won't.

I will not enter into discussion as I don't think anything productive would come of it. I am very sad to be leaving having waited so long for this sequel but I play for fun not grief.

Plungarious

 

[StevieG]

Delta Squadron teamspeak is jam packed with commanders loving the update and the new AI. We do abit of PvP, PvE, races, exploration and we like to help players out of solo/group into open to experience the full flavor of Elite Dangerous. You dont have to be a PvP player to enjoy open. Feel free to come fly with us if you are struggling or need advice.

 

[Seonid]

3) Why not have a WEAK, NORMAL or HARD setting like most games.

Remind me again how that works in a multi player game?

 

[slartybartfast]

I have died 3 time in the last 4 hours, killed by NPC's one in 5 secs by one ship against my top o the range cobra without ramming.
It's a bit scary if not dangerous out there.
I LOVE IT.

 

[yodajedifishmaster]

Well, you had the third or 4th opinion now that your loadout is not really good and tips how to improve it.
You keep defending and blaming everything around for it to not work well and whatnot.
Time to rethink your approach I'd say.

The relevance of games is to adapt and overcome. That has very little to do with hardcore or something. It's just "playing the game". Try the cheesy methods to avoid interdiction, they work even better than the intricate ones. But that's basically what sets games apart from tv.

first define cheesy. if you mean submit then immediately boost boost high/low wake i dont think thats viable unless you are in a much faster ship and your opponent is unmodded.

second i have already repped and thanked the people who have given alternate configs to try. i hve two from coriolis links and an offer from ellegon. but im not playing until we find out from frontier:

are the autoPAC/chainrails a bug or working as intended in those videos of 3 second kills from full shields and hull;
if a bug im waiting for it to be fixed. i cant afford to lose any ships to an unescapable unwinnable fight. im not rich like all the people who are sneering at me. when the patch is out i can risk coming on and playing and trying the alternative loadouts i was offered. no loadout is going to help against the instakill weapons in any ship regardless of what you think. i cant believe that you have not believed video evidence. fine think me a liar but i think in my crap loadout as you say that i may be the ONLY commander to have survived being hit by these weapons so far. if you dont count that as skill or down to my ship well go find one of the npcs. get some meta alloys or relics or rares and zoom around an anarchy system and eventually it WILL happen. if it doesnt after a few hours exit game and restart and maybe you will get the correct server or whatever.

if it ISNT a bug then im off. games deciding you are going to die are not games and if i want roulette of any kind theres a casino real life near me i can go to. you would not accept me deciding right here and now to take all your money and materials and your ships and putting you in a sidewinder regardless of what you are supposed to be able to do to stop me or avoid me doing so. neither should i with a game.