Under effective enemy fire and 2 pips to SYS? That's why shields dropped so fast (they are full sized shields, yeah?). Thermal attack also results from non engineer weapons.
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'Attack of the AI' III
- Thread starter Ian Phillips
- Start date
Under effective enemy fire and 2 pips to SYS? That's why shields dropped so fast (they are full sized shields, yeah?). Thermal attack also results from non engineer weapons.
There is the purple glow of Plasma accelerators before the Thermal attack warning, so normal weapons then
My Experience part 2.
After flying with my friends and us all agreeing to stop play while the Balancing issues where addressed and submitting a ticket. This is what has happened from the new patch.
I got a response from my Ticket, and refunded a token gesture, of which I am grateful. I have used them funds to go back into game.
I understood the need to "up my game", so I used 6 million and bought a reinforced hull.. 3x 0b Shield Boosters. Recognized the importance of being prepared and putting 4 pips in Shields, Boosting away and going High Wake.
Roll back a little, my Friend (New to the game) tried one trade run got interdicted but escaped on his first (and only) run. He barely escaped with his life.
We appreciate the following:
We are Hauling Imperial Slaves. 1 Jump 12.2 LY, with a 500LS Journey to the offloading target.
I am still part of powerplay and in "Hostile" territory.
My Journey. Loaded up my Lakon T7 and pre-prepared to jump into the system.
Left the station.
Jumped in, and was Interdicted! (So far for us its 100% of interdictions, we where going to try and do the runs 5 times to get a fair comparison)
I could not escape the interdiction (my skill being low?) - Attempted a submit when it was clear i was not going to win, (2 Blue on my side left) this failed.
4 pips went into shields - Set a high wake point, Boosted, Strafed. Shields held long enough for the warm up and my hull was reduced to 96% before i got the countdown.
I then turned around and went back.
Arrived at the station with no interdiction.
As I was going into the station, Powerplay elements kicked in and I was attacked, I lost my Shields almost instantly but made it to the landing pad, and was able to lose the haul.
Checked the local scanner and there where still the power play enemies outside. AGAINST my usual fair playing self, I logged out to main and logged back in. (This cleared my scanner of KOS)
Set to go back and try Hauling for a second time.
Left the station with no KOS and was leaving the entrance to the station (in the no fire Zone).
Got a message - (Power play again)
Immediately attacked by 2 ships in the No fire zone. Boosted out so i could fire my FSD. Got a message from control saying i had distanced myself enough.. Started The Warm up. And got Blown up... Returned to the station.
So Personally, I think this is still tough.
I appreciate perhaps Leaving Power Play May be a solution.. But its not really, I would quite like to continue to do that if I could but at this time I have little choice then to not play at all at this time, Same for my friends (Who are not Powerplay and have just as much issue as they are new to the game)
After flying with my friends and us all agreeing to stop play while the Balancing issues where addressed and submitting a ticket. This is what has happened from the new patch.
I got a response from my Ticket, and refunded a token gesture, of which I am grateful. I have used them funds to go back into game.
I understood the need to "up my game", so I used 6 million and bought a reinforced hull.. 3x 0b Shield Boosters. Recognized the importance of being prepared and putting 4 pips in Shields, Boosting away and going High Wake.
Roll back a little, my Friend (New to the game) tried one trade run got interdicted but escaped on his first (and only) run. He barely escaped with his life.
We appreciate the following:
We are Hauling Imperial Slaves. 1 Jump 12.2 LY, with a 500LS Journey to the offloading target.
I am still part of powerplay and in "Hostile" territory.
My Journey. Loaded up my Lakon T7 and pre-prepared to jump into the system.
Left the station.
Jumped in, and was Interdicted! (So far for us its 100% of interdictions, we where going to try and do the runs 5 times to get a fair comparison)
I could not escape the interdiction (my skill being low?) - Attempted a submit when it was clear i was not going to win, (2 Blue on my side left) this failed.
4 pips went into shields - Set a high wake point, Boosted, Strafed. Shields held long enough for the warm up and my hull was reduced to 96% before i got the countdown.
I then turned around and went back.
Arrived at the station with no interdiction.
As I was going into the station, Powerplay elements kicked in and I was attacked, I lost my Shields almost instantly but made it to the landing pad, and was able to lose the haul.
Checked the local scanner and there where still the power play enemies outside. AGAINST my usual fair playing self, I logged out to main and logged back in. (This cleared my scanner of KOS)
Set to go back and try Hauling for a second time.
Left the station with no KOS and was leaving the entrance to the station (in the no fire Zone).
Got a message - (Power play again)
Immediately attacked by 2 ships in the No fire zone. Boosted out so i could fire my FSD. Got a message from control saying i had distanced myself enough.. Started The Warm up. And got Blown up... Returned to the station.
So Personally, I think this is still tough.
I appreciate perhaps Leaving Power Play May be a solution.. But its not really, I would quite like to continue to do that if I could but at this time I have little choice then to not play at all at this time, Same for my friends (Who are not Powerplay and have just as much issue as they are new to the game)
I'm an Elite, but even in an instance by myself all the NPC's are a bit derpy. I'm not getting Deadly/Elite spawns, they're all Master/Dangerous or lesser and the Dangerous aren't even trying to fight any more. Feels like 2.0.
I have been really angry with the 2.1/1.6 upgrade, so much so that I emailed Frontier requesting a refund, as the game was now totally unplayable, so before I left the game I thought I would store my 'A' rated Python buy a Cobra III and try a few missions as some pilots suggested, but got bored with that as I could no longer trade. Then the latest update arrived at 10.00am this morning so after updating the game, I jumped back into my Python, and thought I would give this latest update a try before leaving the game completely. Well! it looks as though FD did it! I spent 2 hours trading and doing missions, got interdicted twice, I found 1 of the NPC's to be a little harder to kill than in the original game but not impossible, the other NPC managed to destroy my shields but I managed to run with just a few percent of hull damage, so it looks as though my game is fixed, it may not be for some of the hard combat pilots, but it's really good for me. So I have emailed FD to cancel my request for a refund, and I can now continue to play, what is one of the greatest games that I have ever had on my PC, and that's saying alot. Thanks Frontier good update, it seems you ARE listening to your customers.
For the hard core combat intensive players, who may not be happy with this AI, is there not a way that Frontier could fence off a particular section of the Galaxy, call it a Forbidden Zone like in Star Trek and as players enter a massive warning is displayed, and in this zone are NPC's with engineers mods that are extremely difficult to kill, (evidently there are areas similar to this in the game already), but you are really well rewarded if you manage to defeat them. It wouldn't be a place that I or newbie's would enter, unless I suddenly became an expert combat pilot, which is not likely, but it would give the combat players what they want? without effecting the rest of us who just want to trade, do missions, explore and relax.
For the hard core combat intensive players, who may not be happy with this AI, is there not a way that Frontier could fence off a particular section of the Galaxy, call it a Forbidden Zone like in Star Trek and as players enter a massive warning is displayed, and in this zone are NPC's with engineers mods that are extremely difficult to kill, (evidently there are areas similar to this in the game already), but you are really well rewarded if you manage to defeat them. It wouldn't be a place that I or newbie's would enter, unless I suddenly became an expert combat pilot, which is not likely, but it would give the combat players what they want? without effecting the rest of us who just want to trade, do missions, explore and relax.
Ian Phillips
Volunteer Moderator
OK. Then this is good feedback!
On an unrelated (mostly) note.
The AI is still fine for me!
However, i just came from playing Guild Wars 2, and came up against one of those 'group' missions to kill an enormous ******* spider.
Talk about overpowered and bugged!
First off, despite only a being lvl 20 monster, it had like 1,000,000,000hp.
(FYI, my weapon does ~230dps)
Then if it cocooned and 'ate' you, it fully regenerated it's health, and you died. This attack is not dodgable. Which is did to someone every 5 seconds. Lol
It also endlessly spawned exploding flowers that more or less insta-killed you, if you was nearby. It spawned these every 5 feet.
And to top it all off, it was invulnerable to most attacks.
There was about 15 of us going at it at one point, 3 of them around lvl 70 players. We all died, repeatedly.
It's probably still there now, killing anyone who even tries to leg it past. Lol
(It was on a main path between to POIs).
So next time you complain about AI, please remember those who fell (and are likely still falling)in Guild Wars 2, to the unkillable giant ******* spider! Lol
I'm convinced if every player on the map attacked it, it would still win. Lol
The AI is still fine for me!
However, i just came from playing Guild Wars 2, and came up against one of those 'group' missions to kill an enormous ******* spider.
Talk about overpowered and bugged!
First off, despite only a being lvl 20 monster, it had like 1,000,000,000hp.
(FYI, my weapon does ~230dps)
Then if it cocooned and 'ate' you, it fully regenerated it's health, and you died. This attack is not dodgable. Which is did to someone every 5 seconds. Lol
It also endlessly spawned exploding flowers that more or less insta-killed you, if you was nearby. It spawned these every 5 feet.
And to top it all off, it was invulnerable to most attacks.
There was about 15 of us going at it at one point, 3 of them around lvl 70 players. We all died, repeatedly.
It's probably still there now, killing anyone who even tries to leg it past. Lol
(It was on a main path between to POIs).
So next time you complain about AI, please remember those who fell (and are likely still falling)in Guild Wars 2, to the unkillable giant ******* spider! Lol
I'm convinced if every player on the map attacked it, it would still win. Lol
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It's good for my bank account, but its hardly sporting.
Anymore? AI code is not changed. So if there's someone just slacking, report his backside to MoM.
I couldn't get video because of a really weird CPU usage issue I am getting with Elite right now. But I had a heap of Dangerous Clippers just "running" at about 210m/s instead of fighting. They'd occasionally do a flip and turn back at me but not fire much if at all.
Something really screwy going on.
I was pretty annoyed by AI "improve" since 2.1, because with a Python, I was a lot interdicted doing trading missions, and much more vulnerable to attacks. Almost dead each time, but survived. I had to go back to the vulture, but for trading, mining and so on, that's not suitable. Today , I got my Python for the mining Cg, and after jumping out the res, I got interdicted by a ship that put me to 12% in no time, escaped, and was interdicted 30s after, and finished for 2.8 mil assurance.
Not all the players are overboosted fighters, nor having time with IRL, work, etc... to spend hours getting out dev traps.
Hope that it will really get better, because I play Elite for fun, not for enjoying getting killed easily as a bug...
Not all the players are overboosted fighters, nor having time with IRL, work, etc... to spend hours getting out dev traps.
Hope that it will really get better, because I play Elite for fun, not for enjoying getting killed easily as a bug...
I very much like the new AI.
It makes me think about wether to attack and not just shoot away.
The AI itself is not the problem, though i think. At least not the behaviour itself.
Perhaps i will embarras myself with the statement, it seems as if they use all of the agility of their ships to the fullest.
So for some it may be difficult to outturn them without using flight assist off or a better gaming setup or pip managment.
If three mediocre real players would attack you in Eagles which are fully kitted and you are flying, say in an Anaconda, you could get into some trouble, so this happens now with NPC's, too and it can be frustrating. But it always should have been that way, imo.
The new AI made me change my loadout on my Battleconda and embrace turrets, more. It was way too easy to outturn much more agile ships, before and i completely love the new way of fighting and of danger.
The amount of NPC'S with engineered loadouts had been ridicoulos, before and i am happy that that got toned down. That just didn't feel good.
Well, i fly open in a group so i have many moments where the AI can't overwhelm and potentially frustrate me as often because with a single wingman it instantly gets to be so much more fun and the odds change quickly.
I can only recommend that. Of course, some will not do that. To them i can only say, keep adapting and practising ( consider a HOTAS, if you have spare money. My X-55 is holding up for over 1000hrs, now) and pick your fights carefully.
But the times where you can Farm NPC's with a slow turning big ship and just ignore or outturn small fighters are over and i love that so much.
They still make mistakes, enough as humans do.
Train your pip managment and be patient.
But it's clear that becoming Elite in combat will be a hard way to walk, if you start the game as a newcomer, now.
For all the hesitating ones, find a (private) group or friends in open. It surely changed my view on the game. It changed from "i don't want to play, anymore" to 600hrs of more gameplay time on my clock.
Fly safe 07
Edit: just read the previous post. I didn't get that behaviour, until now and mostly flew in more or less combat ready ships. I think they should perhaps tone down the interdictions in general with the new AI and most of all stop the NPC griefing. There way too many murderers out there. But i feel you, that sounds very frustrating, indeed.
It makes me think about wether to attack and not just shoot away.
The AI itself is not the problem, though i think. At least not the behaviour itself.
Perhaps i will embarras myself with the statement, it seems as if they use all of the agility of their ships to the fullest.
So for some it may be difficult to outturn them without using flight assist off or a better gaming setup or pip managment.
If three mediocre real players would attack you in Eagles which are fully kitted and you are flying, say in an Anaconda, you could get into some trouble, so this happens now with NPC's, too and it can be frustrating. But it always should have been that way, imo.
The new AI made me change my loadout on my Battleconda and embrace turrets, more. It was way too easy to outturn much more agile ships, before and i completely love the new way of fighting and of danger.
The amount of NPC'S with engineered loadouts had been ridicoulos, before and i am happy that that got toned down. That just didn't feel good.
Well, i fly open in a group so i have many moments where the AI can't overwhelm and potentially frustrate me as often because with a single wingman it instantly gets to be so much more fun and the odds change quickly.
I can only recommend that. Of course, some will not do that. To them i can only say, keep adapting and practising ( consider a HOTAS, if you have spare money. My X-55 is holding up for over 1000hrs, now) and pick your fights carefully.
But the times where you can Farm NPC's with a slow turning big ship and just ignore or outturn small fighters are over and i love that so much.
They still make mistakes, enough as humans do.
Train your pip managment and be patient.
But it's clear that becoming Elite in combat will be a hard way to walk, if you start the game as a newcomer, now.
For all the hesitating ones, find a (private) group or friends in open. It surely changed my view on the game. It changed from "i don't want to play, anymore" to 600hrs of more gameplay time on my clock.
Fly safe 07
Edit: just read the previous post. I didn't get that behaviour, until now and mostly flew in more or less combat ready ships. I think they should perhaps tone down the interdictions in general with the new AI and most of all stop the NPC griefing. There way too many murderers out there. But i feel you, that sounds very frustrating, indeed.
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So...I get to be that awkward one to put down that the update doesn't really seem to have changed much about the fight experience from what I can see? 
Can tell there are mods missing but if anything they seem to be fighting harder. it's a good job that I like my enemy to give me a shot or two before I vapourise them... :3
Can tell there are mods missing but if anything they seem to be fighting harder. it's a good job that I like my enemy to give me a shot or two before I vapourise them... :3
Yesterday and today ive been fighting in a low intensity combat zone.
The combat zone yesterday was full of high rank shipped, master and above. As a result I had to be fully alert when engaged in combat.
Today post patch I noticed the combat zone had a sizeable number of competent and expert ranked ships rather than being stacked full of high ranked ships.
As a result it felt to me less of a threat and more like farming again.
I ended up deliberately avoiding the low ranked ships and waiting for the occasional deadly or elite to appear. They were more of a challenge, but because of the preponderance of low ranked ships I never really felt in danger of being torn to pieces by an alpha assault if my shields dropped.
It was better than 2.0 but didn't have the edge of either Beta or early 2.1 were you knew that there were some big fish out there that could trash you if you let your guard down.
I suspect that we will be in a situation now whereby those who liked combat will be disappointed, while the more casual players will still regard the game as too tough.
The combat zone yesterday was full of high rank shipped, master and above. As a result I had to be fully alert when engaged in combat.
Today post patch I noticed the combat zone had a sizeable number of competent and expert ranked ships rather than being stacked full of high ranked ships.
As a result it felt to me less of a threat and more like farming again.
I ended up deliberately avoiding the low ranked ships and waiting for the occasional deadly or elite to appear. They were more of a challenge, but because of the preponderance of low ranked ships I never really felt in danger of being torn to pieces by an alpha assault if my shields dropped.
It was better than 2.0 but didn't have the edge of either Beta or early 2.1 were you knew that there were some big fish out there that could trash you if you let your guard down.
I suspect that we will be in a situation now whereby those who liked combat will be disappointed, while the more casual players will still regard the game as too tough.
Welcome to the ED player base
In all seriousness middle ground where the game needs to be. There needs to be challenge, but you shouldn't need a four week training course to learn how to play the game without getting torched. For those after a serious fight experience...open play is your friend How does the High Intensity compare?
Not sure if i've missed this being discussed but this is how i see it and see it working properly.
High security systems spawn mostly lower ranked ships and have less interdictions in general, almost none.
Medium security spawn more medium ranked ships, a few more interdictions.
Low security and anarchic systems spawn medium and high ranked ships and have more pirate activity/interdictions.
The same can go for RES sites, so that newbs can go into a standard RES and have some fun, whilst the more experienced can go high or haz and get a challenge for more credits.
On top of all of this, throw in a little randomness for realism so that you still get the very odd high ranked NPC in a high sec system and vice versa.
This way FD can spread the difficulty across ships ranks so that they give a challenge for all levels of experience.
And in turn it will actually get us looking at systems on the Gal map and deciding whether we wanna take the short cut through the anarchic system and take a chance or go the long, safe way round through some more sedate systems.
Traders and explorers can exploit routes that are safe, n00bs can be happy and the experienced can get their fix outside of PVP too and enjoy an aspect that has been severely lacking in that camp.
High security systems spawn mostly lower ranked ships and have less interdictions in general, almost none.
Medium security spawn more medium ranked ships, a few more interdictions.
Low security and anarchic systems spawn medium and high ranked ships and have more pirate activity/interdictions.
The same can go for RES sites, so that newbs can go into a standard RES and have some fun, whilst the more experienced can go high or haz and get a challenge for more credits.
On top of all of this, throw in a little randomness for realism so that you still get the very odd high ranked NPC in a high sec system and vice versa.
This way FD can spread the difficulty across ships ranks so that they give a challenge for all levels of experience.
And in turn it will actually get us looking at systems on the Gal map and deciding whether we wanna take the short cut through the anarchic system and take a chance or go the long, safe way round through some more sedate systems.
Traders and explorers can exploit routes that are safe, n00bs can be happy and the experienced can get their fix outside of PVP too and enjoy an aspect that has been severely lacking in that camp.
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Honestly the new AI is not an improvement.
1) Boosting the AIs DPS is not making it better or more importantly fun. Having a fight only to last 10sec because the AI has ripped you in half is NOT fun nor is it good gameplay as there is no gameplay in that experience.
2) ALL NPC encounters I have had in my Corvette goes like this:
- I start the attach.
- NPC turns and shoots.
- NPC gets close to me.
- NPC tries to get behind me.
- I counteract this.
- We are now deadlocked in a turn war.
- NPC boost away turns and shoots.
- NPC gets too close and tries to get behind me.
- Rinse and repeat.
There is absolutely no randomness to this "new and improved" AI when fighting in a big ship. I would go so far as to say the new AI is dumb or more to the point feels like fighting a machine.
The fact of the matter that the AI is now "harder" actually makes it less fun because it never does anything unexpected.
Prettly please FD give us a slider or something to adjust the AI. Then to players who never can get enough of a "hard" AI can have it as they want and the rest of us can enjoy the game again.
ED is not fun any longer for me.... Really makes me want my money back or more to the point I will not be supporting this game any longer!
1) Boosting the AIs DPS is not making it better or more importantly fun. Having a fight only to last 10sec because the AI has ripped you in half is NOT fun nor is it good gameplay as there is no gameplay in that experience.
2) ALL NPC encounters I have had in my Corvette goes like this:
- I start the attach.
- NPC turns and shoots.
- NPC gets close to me.
- NPC tries to get behind me.
- I counteract this.
- We are now deadlocked in a turn war.
- NPC boost away turns and shoots.
- NPC gets too close and tries to get behind me.
- Rinse and repeat.
There is absolutely no randomness to this "new and improved" AI when fighting in a big ship. I would go so far as to say the new AI is dumb or more to the point feels like fighting a machine.
The fact of the matter that the AI is now "harder" actually makes it less fun because it never does anything unexpected.
Prettly please FD give us a slider or something to adjust the AI. Then to players who never can get enough of a "hard" AI can have it as they want and the rest of us can enjoy the game again.
ED is not fun any longer for me.... Really makes me want my money back or more to the point I will not be supporting this game any longer!
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Corvette and anaconda's main attack and defence against more agile ships isn't out yet. Think.
My feedback as a VERY AVERAGE PvE combat fighter. I usually trade/explore but decided to see how the new AI was. here are my thoughts; as of 2.1.2 whatever - the new one as of fri 3rd june; -
1) 2.1 vanilla AI was insanely difficult for me as dangerous rank, casual player. I use a GAMEPAD, i CANNOT afford X52 or other sticks i have a wife and kids to feed maaaannn! So fomr my point of wiew as a a guy who wants to have FUN and challenege - it was not fun. I cant turn using my gamepad even with FA OFF as fast as i see you guys do using sticks. dunno why. Also using fixed weapons with gamepad is also VERY HARD. another issue as AI spam chaff.
2) 2.1.2 - a little easier. I would be happy with this level of AI if the following condiditons are fixed ; -
AI use same capacitor ranges as player
AI use same recharge as player - ive seen them recharge shields stupidly fast it was nuts. AND I have a BI WEAVE too but they were faster AND stayed up longer (oooerr missus)
AI have same weapons ammo as player
AI have same shield bank ammo as player
AI DONT spam PAs or insta kill us!
plzz fix these and the manouvering i can live with.
cheers,
GC
1) 2.1 vanilla AI was insanely difficult for me as dangerous rank, casual player. I use a GAMEPAD, i CANNOT afford X52 or other sticks i have a wife and kids to feed maaaannn! So fomr my point of wiew as a a guy who wants to have FUN and challenege - it was not fun. I cant turn using my gamepad even with FA OFF as fast as i see you guys do using sticks. dunno why. Also using fixed weapons with gamepad is also VERY HARD. another issue as AI spam chaff.
2) 2.1.2 - a little easier. I would be happy with this level of AI if the following condiditons are fixed ; -
AI use same capacitor ranges as player
AI use same recharge as player - ive seen them recharge shields stupidly fast it was nuts. AND I have a BI WEAVE too but they were faster AND stayed up longer (oooerr missus)
AI have same weapons ammo as player
AI have same shield bank ammo as player
AI DONT spam PAs or insta kill us!
plzz fix these and the manouvering i can live with.
cheers,
GC