A Plea to Frontier

Zazzilas Arden

Zazzilas Arden
I would like to point out that this thread is about more than the AI, and thus does not belong in the megathread, in an effort to keep that thread on topic.

That being said.

It seems that a huge rift in the forums has been caused by the conflict of two groups: Those that grew complacent with the broken, buggy AI that literally used to roll over and let you kill them... and those that want the AI to work as intended and the game to be as advertised.

So many people have simply stopped playing for extended periods of time because of the absolutely broken AI before the 2.1 patch. The only thing that brought me and my wing mates back was the promise that the AI would be fixed. That we wouldn't be able to glance at an enemy ship and immediately dismiss it as a threat, no matter the rank or size, simply because there wasn't a real person in the cockpit.

Now here I am, witnessing a whole lot of people whipping up quite an extreme outcry at the fact that FDEV have improved the AI. Calling for a nerf. Wanting it to go back to the way it was before. Peaceful and easy going simply because the AI was too broken to shoot you back.

This causes me great amounts of grief. Genuine distress, even. I am so tired of being driven away.

Were there bugs that needed to be ironed out of the AI after the patch? Of course. It was fresh out of beta. However, the AI -does not- need to be nerfed back into incompetence.

So here is my plea to you, Frontier.
Please do not ruin the beautiful thing you have done.
Please fix the bugs with the new AI without nerfing them.
I neither payed for Space Trucker Simulator 2016 nor Fish in a Barrel Galleria.
I payed for Elite. Your greatest creation. Please uphold your legacy.
 
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CMNDRMK

C
Zazzilas Arden said:
It seems that a huge rift in the forums has been caused by the conflict of two groups: Those that grew complacent with the broken, buggy AI that literally used to roll over and let you kill them... and those that want the AI to work as intended and the game to be as advertised.

So many people have simply stopped playing for extended periods of time because of the absolutely broken AI before the 2.1 patch. The only thing that brought me and my wing mates back was the promise that the AI would be fixed. That we wouldn't be able to glance at an enemy ship and immediately dismiss it as a threat, no matter the rank or size, simply because there wasn't a real person in the cockpit.

Now here I am, witnessing a whole lot of people whipping up quite an extreme outcry at the fact that FDEV have improved the AI. Calling for a nerf. Wanting it to go back to the way it was before. Peaceful and easy going simply because the AI was too broken to shoot you back.

This causes me great amounts of grief. Genuine distress, even. I am so tired of being driven away.

Were there bugs that needed to be ironed out of the AI after the patch? Of course. It was fresh out of beta. However, the AI -does not- need to be nerfed back into incompetence.

So here is my plea to you, Frontier.
Please do not ruin the beautiful thing you have done.
Please fix the bugs with the new AI without nerfing them.
I neither payed for Space Trucker Simulator 2016 nor Fish in a Barrel Galleria.
I payed for Elite. Your greatest creation. Please uphold your legacy.
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+1

Left because the gameplay was so unsatisfying due to cakewalk AI.
Back for the got gud AI.
 

Ziljan

Ziljan
The sentiments that you express are echoed in my hopes and fears as well.


I support keeping the beauty of 2.1 AI intact for future generations! Think of the children! :D
 

Whiterose

Whiterose
Cmnd Fulsom said:
Well, the OP wasn't disingenuous in the painting they made of their opponent's at all. If I could grant negative rep I could. Dishonesty is never attractive sir and/or madam.
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What dishonesty? The OP is expressing an opinion, one that I happen to agree with. Don't confuse a superior AI to one that is bugged with super weapons or instakill, there are several issues going on here, and personally I like the more intelligent AI (although they are still dumb enough to shoot at me as I am entering the station...)
 

Cmnd Fulsom

C
Well, it's very nice that you agree with the OP, and understand, I don't necessarily disagree either. However, that does not change that the OP is clearly attempting to poison the well against the opposing view and that is extremely dishonest of them.
 

Whiterose

Whiterose
Cmnd Fulsom said:
Well, it's very nice that you agree with the OP, and understand, I don't necessarily disagree either. However, that does not change that the OP is clearly attempting to poison the well against the opposing view and that is extremely dishonest of them.
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That is how you have read it. I read it as a well balanced and thought out post. Dishonest to me implies untruth, which I don't see at all.
 

Incident

Incident
Cmnd Fulsom said:
Well, it's very nice that you agree with the OP, and understand, I don't necessarily disagree either. However, that does not change that the OP is clearly attempting to poison the well against the opposing view and that is extremely dishonest of them.
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The opposing view that pre - 2.1 AI was easy, you don't think so?

It was broken!
 
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askavir

askavir
I never left simply because I'm an armchair astronomer and I'm in love with ED's galaxy.

But I had given up combat gameplay for over a year now, it just lacked any kind of interest, NPCs were mentally challenged, it wasn't combat, there was no sense of danger, just clicking on NPCs and see them pop. Even interdictions I no longer even cared to turn around and pop the NPC, I just submited and went back to supercruise immediately. It wasn't a potentially exciting moment, just a speed bump in the road.

The 2.1 initial update changed all this, I was back doing things I had long stopped caring about, fighthing suddently felt like fighting, there was finally some agency in it, fight or flight, pick your fights, actually having to outmanouver the opponents, opponents that tried to dodge your fire, which tried to utmanouver you, gain vantage position, having to think about outfitting, study the battlefield, use the tools at your disposal, and finally, finally an actual risk of losing a fight.

Seeing it all go to waste because hopeless players threw a hissy fit and demand it to be reverted back to completely harmless AI and auto-win mode is just plain sad.
 
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Chaz

Chaz
askavir said:
The 2.1 initial update changed all this, I was back doing things I had long stopped caring about, fighthing suddently felt like fighting, there was finally some agency in it, fight or flight, pick your fights, actually having to outmanouver the opponents, opponents that tried to dodge your fire, which tried to utmanouver you, gain vantage position, having to think about outfitting, study the battlefield, use the tools at your disposal, and finally, finally an actual risk of losing a fight.
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Which is all well and good if you're flying a combat ship. Not so much if you're plying the space lanes in one of the Lakon T variants that are now just death traps. Flying one of them before was always a bit of a risky proposition, now it's just suicidal.
 

Zazzilas Arden

Zazzilas Arden
Cmnd Fulsom said:
Well, it's very nice that you agree with the OP, and understand, I don't necessarily disagree either. However, that does not change that the OP is clearly attempting to poison the well against the opposing view and that is extremely dishonest of them.
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Nothing I said was dishonest.
 
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Ziljan

Ziljan
Chaz said:
Which is all well and good if you're flying a combat ship. Not so much if you're plying the space lanes in one of the Lakon T variants that are now just death traps. Flying one of them before was always a bit of a risky proposition, now it's just suicidal.
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Please use the AI thread to discuss AI. We talking about the Soul of Elite here, and begging Frontier to not undo the magic that they've created with 2.1.

As for the Lakon traders. I have had good success with this build in the past week when running tasks for engineers, and for my minor faction:

http://coriolis.io/outfit/type_6_tr...45020127.Iw1-kA==.Aw1-kA==?bn=Blockade Runner
 

Zazzilas Arden

Zazzilas Arden
Chaz said:
Which is all well and good if you're flying a combat ship. Not so much if you're plying the space lanes in one of the Lakon T variants that are now just death traps. Flying one of them before was always a bit of a risky proposition, now it's just suicidal.
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Decent shields, chaff, and point defence. Upgrade hull for good measure. The days of stripping your trader down into defenselessness just to turn a higher profit are over.

I took out a Type-6 for a few trade runs just to see if I could. Fitted her appropriately. Had no issues. A few downed shields and minor hull damage, but nothing close to death.

This was the problem before. You could strip your ship down into a paper bag and hardly ever have a close call. It was sapping the very soul of what the Elite series has always represented.
 
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Richard Voorhees

R
Chaz said:
Which is all well and good if you're flying a combat ship. Not so much if you're plying the space lanes in one of the Lakon T variants that are now just death traps. Flying one of them before was always a bit of a risky proposition, now it's just suicidal.
Click to expand...

Apologies for being a little off-topic...but does this mean trading has been nerfed/balanced (call it what you will)?
 

Cmnd Fulsom

C
I am doing no such thing, OP's post was clearly intentionally misrepresenting the views of other people. It's a dishonest and cynical act, claiming it isn't equally so.
 
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