I could actually agree with that.
Powerplay Powerplay "meeting" with FD
- Thread starter CMDR Sergeant Jezza
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I could actually agree with that.
Read the thread please, I have answered this question many times.
Here is a constructive idea in dungeons and dragons online the only other MMO that i,m active in we have a players council that is elected by the entire player base to represent the players because they are official elected they have legitimacy and work hand in hand with the developers.
Do you really think Fdev will take this group you propose seriously knowing full well that they represent so small a percentage of the player base. What is it that gives the so called veterans the right to talk for all but a small minority of our community? If something gets implemented into the live game due to the influence of this group and the majority of players are not happy with such change it,s going to be a mess.
I hope we the player base will be informed what is being proposed and get an opportunity to give feedback before you start pressuring the developers. there could be 100.000 players in this game don,t assume too much.
Do you really think Fdev will take this group you propose seriously knowing full well that they represent so small a percentage of the player base. What is it that gives the so called veterans the right to talk for all but a small minority of our community? If something gets implemented into the live game due to the influence of this group and the majority of players are not happy with such change it,s going to be a mess.
I hope we the player base will be informed what is being proposed and get an opportunity to give feedback before you start pressuring the developers. there could be 100.000 players in this game don,t assume too much.
Again, if we knew there were 10k BGS manipulators and 1k Powerplayers, it would make no sense to keep the current Power play implementation, it would be obvious it's not worth the hassle.
It depends on the original scope of Powerplay.By design it was supposed to be the top tier of the BGS, so if FD want that to happen then it should to fulfil its brief, but do it in an inclusive way.
there have been lots of ideas over the year and most have seemingly fallen on deaf ears and who knows what this supposed meeting is supposed to discuss. I just dont see the point in picking out people from reddit groups to discuss something that has pages and pages and pages of discussion already - even on this censored up forum. What more needs to be said? What ideas would not be something that has already been posted and re-posted a dozen times in here?
I'll summarize.
1. Expansion or else is - it's not sustainable and it doesn't reflect how nation-states / popularity / influence - whatever works. There is a quality aspect that is as important or even more important than quantity that simply is being ignored in powerplay.
2. It's too easy to manipulate the rules of powerplay to subvert a power in such a way that makes no logical sense that it would be allowed to function that way. Powers aren't supposed to be mindless organisms forced to spread willy nilly, they have "leaders" and there needs to be a better mechanism to simulate convincing that leader that such and such expansion is desired.
3. Grinding beyond trigger limits where those efforts dont matter needs to be dealt with in a way that eliminates the benefit to the player. It makes absolutely no sense why a power should reward someone for doing nothing.
4. powerplay needs to touch all aspects of the game in a similar way that engineers were shoehorned in to touch all aspects of gameplay. Most players are having to choose to play 80% of the game or space truck otherwise worthless material or combat grind for basically nothing but merits. Merits that are useless in any other aspect of the game.
5. The synthetically induced black box of undermining needs to go away. Underminers get bounties, that means the system authorities know who they are and the system authorities are under the thumb of the power so there is absolutely no reason why a power shouldn't have a breakdown of what powers are attacking a given system. Not knowing your enemies is a stupid arbitrary aspect of powerplay that has no justification in-universe.
6. Fix the bugs that have existed for 52+ weeks so that the descriptions of the various powers actually match what happens in the game.
There, no need for meetings, no need for drama.
I'll summarize.
1. Expansion or else is - it's not sustainable and it doesn't reflect how nation-states / popularity / influence - whatever works. There is a quality aspect that is as important or even more important than quantity that simply is being ignored in powerplay.
2. It's too easy to manipulate the rules of powerplay to subvert a power in such a way that makes no logical sense that it would be allowed to function that way. Powers aren't supposed to be mindless organisms forced to spread willy nilly, they have "leaders" and there needs to be a better mechanism to simulate convincing that leader that such and such expansion is desired.
3. Grinding beyond trigger limits where those efforts dont matter needs to be dealt with in a way that eliminates the benefit to the player. It makes absolutely no sense why a power should reward someone for doing nothing.
4. powerplay needs to touch all aspects of the game in a similar way that engineers were shoehorned in to touch all aspects of gameplay. Most players are having to choose to play 80% of the game or space truck otherwise worthless material or combat grind for basically nothing but merits. Merits that are useless in any other aspect of the game.
5. The synthetically induced black box of undermining needs to go away. Underminers get bounties, that means the system authorities know who they are and the system authorities are under the thumb of the power so there is absolutely no reason why a power shouldn't have a breakdown of what powers are attacking a given system. Not knowing your enemies is a stupid arbitrary aspect of powerplay that has no justification in-universe.
6. Fix the bugs that have existed for 52+ weeks so that the descriptions of the various powers actually match what happens in the game.
There, no need for meetings, no need for drama.
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That they have dedicated enough time to PP that a normal person would expect an actual wage to come along with that?
What makes you think that those veterans have a different opinion than you to begin with? That they don't want PP to evolve in similar directions than the majority?
What makes you think that those veterans are disconnected from the majority? Do you think that they post a list of systems and then go back to their cave for the rest of the week, expecting everyone to follow their absolute orders? Do you have any shred of knowledge on the amount of communication they have with the players?
The majority of Mahon pledgers have indeed talked with Vectron on a much more direct level than just priorities.
The majority of Delaine supporters have indeed talked with McFergus on such a level as well.
The majority of Winters have indeed accepted Perse as their lord and savior through their own volition.
etc,etc.
Those people are not disconnected individuals who have a different mind set and try to force it to FD. They are players who have the same aspirations and hopes for PP just like any other player. They are also just as annoyed on the shortcomings of PP. The only difference is that instead of quitting, they kept on dedicating time on it exactly because they saw potential in it, instead of crying to FD that they failed, suck and summoned baby Satan with PP.
Most organized communities of PP are not dictatorships and have direct communication with their players.
These representatives do represent the majority of players that are actually engaged in PP for what PP is and not for Rating 5 and bonuses.
And in the end of the day, the meeting is not supposed to be about mechanics and future changes but about the approach FD takes towards PP and the seriousness they show when applying fixes, which is miniscule.
Just because Jezza thinks that it's about people trying to take over PP, it doesn't mean it's true.
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So have many people.
I don't even know where to begin answering that. I'm sure you can imagine many ways in which a power leader would want something drastically different from the majority of the playerbase...
Umm, actually a lot of them do just that. I don't know about other powers but when I was in Aisling, most people had no clue where any "orders" came from, mainly because the people writing them did it in secret so as to avoid accountability. You can still see this now, how they hide cowardly behind a "voice of the angels" reddit account.
Exactly!
You have my full support!
Aisling is not the definitive example of how PP communities work.
And no, I can't think of any leader who would want something different from their playerbase if both of them want the best for their power and understand what that "best" is under how the mechanics work. This is also largely irrelevant to your initial accusation that these "leaders" are trying to influence FD on what PP should be. You keep on moving from one goal post to another as it suits your argument.
Also, to get back into your Aisling argument, you are very well aware that Aisling has many communication platforms for any person to talk to the people that are behind that "voice of the angels" account. You are only showing your bitterness for your lack of access to that account. Heck, you don't even have to be from within the power for most organizers to discuss their thought process about the public stuff like preparations and/or expansions.
That's completely false. I disassociated from that particular group months before the account was created, and have since then left the power entirely - why would I want access to the account? You need to stop doing personal attacks and stay on topic which was specified in the OP.
Goose4291
Banned
Whilst this is all well and good, do you not agree with the point that any such discussion should be made available to the rest of the community outside of those having the discussion with Frontier, so as to avoid the sort of backroom nonsense accusations it could potentially generate?
I can't speak for other powers, but at Mahon we set up a Commander Spreadsheet reddit account; not to hide behind, but because if, for example, I wrote the thread detailing our strategy, and the strategy changed after I got hit by a bus, that strategy couldn't change.
By having a common account that the entire mod-team has access to, it is possible to post these strategy threads in a way where everyone can edit them on the fly.
"But why not have it in a spreadsheet that they can edit instead?"
We do have it in a spreadsheet, but not everyone wants to go through yet another step to read it. It's bad enough that they HAVE to go outside of the game for a way to organize - the more layers, the fewer people willing to participate.
Sure, you may call it cowardly, but there are a lot of practical reasons as well.
Absolutely, there are legitimate reasons for doing it such as this one. But that is not always why that sort of thing is used.
It appears to me that the vast majority of people playing PP are happy that the guys who have REALLY taken the time to work out exactly how it all hangs together will do a decent job of representing them at this meeting. The idea that you can hold a public meeting over the internet is laughable, sorry, you only have to watch an FD twitch session covering players' questions to see that they've cherry picked the stuff they want to talk about, and having hundreds of people all shouting out at the same time is going to be chaos.
I suggest the OP volunteer themselves to FD, with or without like minded individuals, on the same basis as the group you are so vehement about - suggest to FD that you are competent players with valuable points to make, and offer to 'meet' to discuss your point of view.
It was suggested earlier that all FD need do is fix the bugs, and read through the forum looking at all the ideas posted - I wouldn't disagree with that, as a nice idea, but I doubt FD would want any employee to spend that much time sifting through the conglomeration of good ideas, poor ideas, and absolutely barking mad ideas that are on here. There is a desperate need for FD to get a grip, and it makes absolute sense that they be aided in this by a group of involved PP players - and I can't think of anyone who fits the definition of 'involved PP players' better than the guys running the Reddit groups.
I for one trust the Reddit leadership of my power to put forward a viewpoint that is designed to improve PP for all players, not just the Hudson players but all players....at least I trust them more than the alternatives.
Dave
I suggest the OP volunteer themselves to FD, with or without like minded individuals, on the same basis as the group you are so vehement about - suggest to FD that you are competent players with valuable points to make, and offer to 'meet' to discuss your point of view.
It was suggested earlier that all FD need do is fix the bugs, and read through the forum looking at all the ideas posted - I wouldn't disagree with that, as a nice idea, but I doubt FD would want any employee to spend that much time sifting through the conglomeration of good ideas, poor ideas, and absolutely barking mad ideas that are on here. There is a desperate need for FD to get a grip, and it makes absolute sense that they be aided in this by a group of involved PP players - and I can't think of anyone who fits the definition of 'involved PP players' better than the guys running the Reddit groups.
I for one trust the Reddit leadership of my power to put forward a viewpoint that is designed to improve PP for all players, not just the Hudson players but all players....at least I trust them more than the alternatives.
Dave
It'll still be there. "They just stopped recording and continued talking! Off with their heads!"
One thing that the conspiracy theorists in this thread need to answer is this: How is it that representatives from Hudson, Winters, Sirius, Archon, Aisling, ALD, Torval, Patreus and Mahon have managed to even sit down in the same room and have a level headed conversation without ripping each other's throats out? Either they are random people who don't know anything (in which case it'd be rather unlikely I'd be one of them), or they're people who are willing to set aside the in-game hostilities for the betterment of the current situation. The only one I don't know is Antal, because they keep insisting they have 502 leaders. They don't get to have 502 representatives at the meeting - they get to have one, but how they pick that one is up to them.
How do you think these backroom deals of non-hostilities this cycle came about? A lot of them were negotiated in this small group. Not because Vectron is Eternal and his Kindly Claw is helping, but because we all realize that from a mutual perspective, we're pretty much at the breaking point of what organized PowerPlay can handle.
Well, I didn't say that it necessarily had to be "public", as in "open". What I meant by that was that anyone who is a veteran of powerplay, as well as groups, should be allowed to attend. "Public" was just a quicker way of saying that really, sorry for the confusion.
I'd be happy if the organisers of this meeting were to do that, and if the transcript from the meeting was made public.
It IS available to everyone who isn't smug enough to expect everyone to give them an invitation calling them a highness.
Visit any of the communication platforms of the groups and you can discuss what people think for as much as you like. Heck, you can even change their mind or expand their view on something if you have legitimate arguments.
Just like in a democracy, you are expected to show up to vote, the ballot doesn't come over knocking at your door.
If that is supposed to be a little jab at me, it's not a very good one because I actually don't care.
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