I had to do a double-take to be sure I didn't write this whilst in a fugue state
I think I'm out too.
- Thread starter Arvel Yael
- Start date
I had to do a double-take to be sure I didn't write this whilst in a fugue state
fugue
They say you are never to old to learn something new. Today I learnt a new word and meaning, thank-you!
I'd Rep you if I could!
Unfortunately I can't retrospectively make a video. Your theory certainly has merit, but I don't think that's what happened. My controls for "drop chaff" and "silent running" are distinct and seperate, and I didn't change course after releasing my mines.
What I did notice is that of course, you can't FSD with hardpoints extended, though you have to have hardpoints extended to actually drop mines. Which makes me wonder why on earth people actually have mines, when to use them you have to actually stop trying to escape.
AFTER ACTION REPORT:
Being annoyed because I hadn't used my rift (and shiny new graphics card) all day, and mindful that I hadn't actually tested my ability to survive in a dedicated combat ship, I jumped into my Vulture, to resume a mission I'd accepted.
Having less than an hour before the mission expired, I was certain that I'd be interdicted, and a couple of hundred LS from the destination station, indeed I was.
Submitted to interdiction, being mindful of what Cynaqq told me about "you still need to follow the escape vector until you drop out", that's what I did, and I transitioned smoothly back into normal space. Select nearest target, it's an Imperial Courier. Pre 2.1, these ships were absolutely no threat to me, and the biggest pain in the ass about them to me was that their maneuverability meant that they took longer to kill than they should. That was pre 2.1 though.
Looked at the target details some more, pilot is a deadly npc.
I am not a deadly pilot. But I do have a Vulture with two frakking big beam lasers on it.
No time to think about running, in the time it took me to check who I was being harassed by, I've made my decision, put four pips into shields, and deployed my weapons. He realises the game's on, and starts firing. I deploy chaff, FA off, and spin nose down until I'm moving away from him, but facing him.
He's shooting at me and I'm kicking in the thrusters, figuring that most ships pitch and roll better than they yaw, I'm slipping round his side. Lasers start getting low on power, and since I'm about 45 degrees to his nose, I put four pips into weapons, and continue raking his shields.
He comes round and heads towards me, and as I put four pips into shields I have to use thrusters to avoid a head-on collision and the two ships pass each other belly to belly as he slips behind me.
I boost forwards, FA off, bring my nose to bear, start slipping sideways and launch chaff as I open fire again.
This whole scene was repeated over and over for about five minutes. His shields went down and I started biting into his hull. 20 seconds later, my shields went down too. The Vulture's maneuverability allowed me to rake him with laser fire, and recharge my shields on the run though, and they came back up after a short time.
So did his, but it wasn't long before they were down again. And then he started running.
I boosted after him, intent on finishing what he'd started, and practically turned his engines incandescent with laser fire. With 13% hull left, he jumped out. I was on 93% hull.
So, what did I think? Well, there was plenty of adrenaline. "I can afford to replace my Vulture" doesn't really enter your mind as yor arms are shaking and you're just concentrating on staying alive. The Rift was an absolute godsend, without it he would have passed out of my sight and I wouldn't have been able to see exactly where he was in relation to me.
Flight assist - was useful for getting the lasers on target while he was busy trying to ram me. Occasionally I did get the flight assist and the forwards/reverse thrust selector confuzzled, but since I was using both liberally at the time, I managed to get around it.
Pip Management - I don't know to what degree pips reinforce shields, but pip management was useful in allowing me to choose between punching and blocking. Back in the day, I used to put four pips to weapons and leave it there until I wanted to boost to the next target. Now things have changed.
The combat itself, I would describe as very hard. Very challenging. Much more challenging than any other fight I've had in ED. If a little Courier is able to fight like that, I will definitely need to be wary about picking my fights in future.
I wonder how much of the challenge came from the fact that the NPC was Deadly. Though I have to admit, I'm damned pleased with myself. Forcing a Deadly NPC to disengage with his hull on fire and his tail between his legs? Yeah I'm pleased with that. It was - and is - one hell of a challenge, and I can see how the AI would - will - continue to be a nightmare for all non-combat players until they get used to it or quit...
But in my Vulture at least, I'm surprised to be able to say that it is survivable. Just as I feel that the AI is going to be a nightmare for anyone not in a killing machine, I can see why the hardcore combat folks love it.
An interesting experience I think.
Being annoyed because I hadn't used my rift (and shiny new graphics card) all day, and mindful that I hadn't actually tested my ability to survive in a dedicated combat ship, I jumped into my Vulture, to resume a mission I'd accepted.
Having less than an hour before the mission expired, I was certain that I'd be interdicted, and a couple of hundred LS from the destination station, indeed I was.
Submitted to interdiction, being mindful of what Cynaqq told me about "you still need to follow the escape vector until you drop out", that's what I did, and I transitioned smoothly back into normal space. Select nearest target, it's an Imperial Courier. Pre 2.1, these ships were absolutely no threat to me, and the biggest pain in the ass about them to me was that their maneuverability meant that they took longer to kill than they should. That was pre 2.1 though.
Looked at the target details some more, pilot is a deadly npc.
I am not a deadly pilot. But I do have a Vulture with two frakking big beam lasers on it.
No time to think about running, in the time it took me to check who I was being harassed by, I've made my decision, put four pips into shields, and deployed my weapons. He realises the game's on, and starts firing. I deploy chaff, FA off, and spin nose down until I'm moving away from him, but facing him.
He's shooting at me and I'm kicking in the thrusters, figuring that most ships pitch and roll better than they yaw, I'm slipping round his side. Lasers start getting low on power, and since I'm about 45 degrees to his nose, I put four pips into weapons, and continue raking his shields.
He comes round and heads towards me, and as I put four pips into shields I have to use thrusters to avoid a head-on collision and the two ships pass each other belly to belly as he slips behind me.
I boost forwards, FA off, bring my nose to bear, start slipping sideways and launch chaff as I open fire again.
This whole scene was repeated over and over for about five minutes. His shields went down and I started biting into his hull. 20 seconds later, my shields went down too. The Vulture's maneuverability allowed me to rake him with laser fire, and recharge my shields on the run though, and they came back up after a short time.
So did his, but it wasn't long before they were down again. And then he started running.
I boosted after him, intent on finishing what he'd started, and practically turned his engines incandescent with laser fire. With 13% hull left, he jumped out. I was on 93% hull.
So, what did I think? Well, there was plenty of adrenaline. "I can afford to replace my Vulture" doesn't really enter your mind as yor arms are shaking and you're just concentrating on staying alive. The Rift was an absolute godsend, without it he would have passed out of my sight and I wouldn't have been able to see exactly where he was in relation to me.
Flight assist - was useful for getting the lasers on target while he was busy trying to ram me. Occasionally I did get the flight assist and the forwards/reverse thrust selector confuzzled, but since I was using both liberally at the time, I managed to get around it.
Pip Management - I don't know to what degree pips reinforce shields, but pip management was useful in allowing me to choose between punching and blocking. Back in the day, I used to put four pips to weapons and leave it there until I wanted to boost to the next target. Now things have changed.
The combat itself, I would describe as very hard. Very challenging. Much more challenging than any other fight I've had in ED. If a little Courier is able to fight like that, I will definitely need to be wary about picking my fights in future.
I wonder how much of the challenge came from the fact that the NPC was Deadly. Though I have to admit, I'm damned pleased with myself. Forcing a Deadly NPC to disengage with his hull on fire and his tail between his legs? Yeah I'm pleased with that. It was - and is - one hell of a challenge, and I can see how the AI would - will - continue to be a nightmare for all non-combat players until they get used to it or quit...
But in my Vulture at least, I'm surprised to be able to say that it is survivable. Just as I feel that the AI is going to be a nightmare for anyone not in a killing machine, I can see why the hardcore combat folks love it.
An interesting experience I think.
Good job! Thanks for sharing Arvel!
The way you tell what happened in the fight with the necessary details shows how well your understanding of the game is. You just need a few more run ins with 'deadly' opponents
Deadly NPCs are no joke, I get tired trying to off them in my FAS and not rarely, I get forced to retreat. There's no shame in that I guess, I don't like paying insurance.
On pips to shields, 4 pips to shields enables a debuff on the hits you receive, cutting their calculated damage less than half its total. In other words, your shelds are more than twice as sturdy as they are with 1-3 pips. 0-1-2 pips are almost identical, 3 pips are about 1.5 times 1 pips and 4 pips is almost 2.5 times your base shield strength.
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Cmdr Dubstep Dragon
Banned
OP you can really learn to handle the new AI.
I am a middle aged guy, not interested at all in PvP, so my combat skills are not stellar.
I also am a loner (even when I play in Open). I will never wing up.
Nevertheless I kill Elite NPC and when I am in a trader I escape them.
You can have bad luck of course, but don't let that ... and the whining on the forums .... mislead you.
The game is very playable. The new AI just made it much more exciting and.... dangerous.
But you can survive and improve and just have a lot of fun.
I am a middle aged guy, not interested at all in PvP, so my combat skills are not stellar.
I also am a loner (even when I play in Open). I will never wing up.
Nevertheless I kill Elite NPC and when I am in a trader I escape them.
You can have bad luck of course, but don't let that ... and the whining on the forums .... mislead you.
The game is very playable. The new AI just made it much more exciting and.... dangerous.
But you can survive and improve and just have a lot of fun.
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Some additional TIPS that may help decrease the number of Interdictions to begin with...
1. Don't stack too many missions (at least at first). 3 or 4 of different types if you really have to.
2. Sell Off Cargo Mats, they seem to attract trouble. If you are not working on a BluePrint sell of the ones in your cargo ASAP
3. Stay out of the shipping lanes. Don't fly directly toward a base/port as Pirates watch the Shipping Lanes. Do a "U" by dipping down below the orbit lines then coming back up as the destination starts to get above you.
4. Watch your comms. A Pirate will generally send you a message he is on your tail often before he even spawns. You can then watch for Contacts and try to avoid him or at least not be caught off guard.
I can't say categorically these works and they won't stop interdictions 100%. I practice them as do my wingmates and we haven't really noticed any difference between PRE and POST 2.1 interdiction wise.
1. Don't stack too many missions (at least at first). 3 or 4 of different types if you really have to.
2. Sell Off Cargo Mats, they seem to attract trouble. If you are not working on a BluePrint sell of the ones in your cargo ASAP
3. Stay out of the shipping lanes. Don't fly directly toward a base/port as Pirates watch the Shipping Lanes. Do a "U" by dipping down below the orbit lines then coming back up as the destination starts to get above you.
4. Watch your comms. A Pirate will generally send you a message he is on your tail often before he even spawns. You can then watch for Contacts and try to avoid him or at least not be caught off guard.
I can't say categorically these works and they won't stop interdictions 100%. I practice them as do my wingmates and we haven't really noticed any difference between PRE and POST 2.1 interdiction wise.
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It was with some bemusement that I watched the forums as I flew around in the center of the galaxy in my Asp, seemingly the game had changed beyond all recognition. "Yeah, it's for the better!" screamed the hardcore combat types, as the remainder of the forum grumbled and moaned.
I was in the same situation and thought exactly the same thing!
I was in the same situation and thought exactly the same thing!
I'm appalled but not necessarily surprised by the color of the comments you've been getting in reply. OP.
You're absolutely right: the "git gud" attitude among those who are happy with the changes is yet another reason--among many--that the Engineers update has been a disappointment. If Frontier was trying to fracture their community, they couldn't have done a better job than with 2.1.
You're absolutely right: the "git gud" attitude among those who are happy with the changes is yet another reason--among many--that the Engineers update has been a disappointment. If Frontier was trying to fracture their community, they couldn't have done a better job than with 2.1.
The git gud meta is fast getting boring and abused by both sides.
It is not as much about gitting gud, but about being able to adapt and rethink the old stale strategies that do not work anymore.
If a middle aged geezer like me can do it, then I am sure anybody can, unless you have a mind inflexible as a brick.
I am not better after 2.1 than I was before 2.1, I just rethought my strategies. I adapted to the new situation.
But you must want to do it. You must be able to see it as a challenge... and not blind yourself by hiding behind and whine about stupid words like "git gud".
There is a lot of good advise being given in many threads, including this one, and it is plain ignorant to wave that aside by referring to the so called "git gud attitude".
You are your own worst enemy that way. You should fear yourself, not the AI.
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5 minutes after I posted the thread, mods had to close it to delete the abusive posts
.
'Get mediocre' is my own personal mantra. Gud is simply unobtainable for me. haha
And, like someone else mentioned, I've been staying out of the shipping lanes, putting my destination in the far left side of the screen. Been keeping people off my six also while in supercruise, just in case. If you're inattentive then you'll miss the 7 second/75% throttle trick, but that can be good sometimes to ward off those near-destination interdictions. You'll end up overshooting and have to fly a circle back to line up again on target, messing up NPC's who might wanna interdict you. Fly casual!
+1 OP
Your situation highlight what a mistake 2.1 has been.
For many, it has just been too much too fast as a radical shift from what was normal in 2.0.
I respect what you've said in your op as a rationally stated example of what many other players are going through. I don't feel it's my place to advise you or tell you that you're wrong. You make valid and accurate descriptions for why you are where you are with ED. Your opinion is valid and is one that needs to be heard without criticism or advice from me or anyone else.
The abrupt paradigm shift introduced by FD was poorly conceived and should have been introduced in far less radical, incremental steps. Alienating many loyal players who are not combat fans is simply not a good decision by FD and is not some flaw in those who are now being lost to the community.
Very sad indeed. Not only was your play style given no respect by FD, but you then have to endure non- sense from the forum trolls as well.
Best regards to you OP, losing you as a player is most unfortunate.
Your situation highlight what a mistake 2.1 has been.
For many, it has just been too much too fast as a radical shift from what was normal in 2.0.
I respect what you've said in your op as a rationally stated example of what many other players are going through. I don't feel it's my place to advise you or tell you that you're wrong. You make valid and accurate descriptions for why you are where you are with ED. Your opinion is valid and is one that needs to be heard without criticism or advice from me or anyone else.
The abrupt paradigm shift introduced by FD was poorly conceived and should have been introduced in far less radical, incremental steps. Alienating many loyal players who are not combat fans is simply not a good decision by FD and is not some flaw in those who are now being lost to the community.
Very sad indeed. Not only was your play style given no respect by FD, but you then have to endure non- sense from the forum trolls as well.
Best regards to you OP, losing you as a player is most unfortunate.
Yet another commenter who totally disregards 4 pages of discussion and answers directly to the OP.
The OP said they'd cool down a little and try their hand again, probably improve their understanding and skill. They then went even further to try again almost immediately, heeded advice and successfully held their own in a combat situation.
I'd say the actual events of this thread are a lot less gloomy and doomy than your comment makes it out to be.
This exactly:
Not only that I really don't see the point in the advice that people are giving that you should submit to interdictions. Even before 2.1 as a smuggler I never submitted to interdictions. I still don't. I can either fly my way out of them or, if I get pulled down into normal space, outrun them and use defensive strategies.
At least that aspect of the game has never changed for me.
Yes; there are some pretty heavy NPC's to deal with but generally you have to have defensive strategies anyway.
Not only that I really don't see the point in the advice that people are giving that you should submit to interdictions. Even before 2.1 as a smuggler I never submitted to interdictions. I still don't. I can either fly my way out of them or, if I get pulled down into normal space, outrun them and use defensive strategies.
At least that aspect of the game has never changed for me.
Yes; there are some pretty heavy NPC's to deal with but generally you have to have defensive strategies anyway.
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I read the whole thing
A lot of knee-jerk responses to a knee-jerk OP. OP came around and sounds like he will enjoy the game once again, just needed some friendly tips, not fairwells. Help your fellow pilots and not just say goodbye Well the advantage to submitting is the short cool down to get the FSD back up. For many that is a big advantage.
I agree with op. I myself have stopped playing till they update game. No loss either way for me got the game on steam sale.