The Galaxy - Is its size now considered to be a barrier to gameplay by the Developers?

[jprelph]

This may have been covered but this is seriously going to affect PowerPlay because a lot of PowerPlay functions are weighted in one direction. Fortifying is going to have the time/risk cut significantly because you can go outward in your slow, badly armoured T9, then zip back in your taxi hauler after dropping the goods. Quicker and less risk. A 100ly trip that was taking 9 jumps out and 7 back suddenly gets 25% shorter with far less to worry about. It shrinks the entire PowerPlay area.

Similarly undermining distant systems for a snipe becomes easier - you can scoot out in your taxi - only pop into a few systems in enemy territory then call up your FDL with a 2ly jump range, rack up the merits and then pop back into your taxi and back the way you came. Less chance of being seen and significantly less time.

Fortunately I'm an early backer so I'll be using the "God-like powers" we were given to cast this idea back into the pit. We did get those powers, right...?

 

[Lobstris]

But would have complicated development for a low priority feature, this way we were able to slip it into 2.2 - otherwise it might have been further into the future. Besides delay impacts the point of the feature and that is to allow greater use of people's ships.

Michael

But by introducing a 'half-baked' feature you set a precedent for its use, which is then difficult to rescind later. Why not consider other options (actually, I'm sure other options were considered), such as increasing jump range on FSDs on all ships, that would preserve the balance in the game, would not be potentially as disruptive, and don't require contortions of fiction to justify? (I could see one drawback, and possible explanation for not tweaking FSDs, if longer ship ranges broke the route finder).

 

[Jypson]

I agree in the greater part with your sentiment sir.
FD said it listens to the 'community' but it what it hears is another matter. How the community 'talks' and how FD 'listens' I have no good idea. We have seen the responses though.
FD saving face is also an issue as you suggest, it's only natural but not professional.
Well their testing may have been easy, but we will become the testers soon enough and our responses will be measured (listened to?) - this last is an assumption.
How can we play the beta so as to send a message to ED that this solution is not welcome?

> How about we just honestly play the beta and see how it actually works instead of trying to concoct ways to push a preconceived notion beforehand?

 

[Hajile]

I agree in the greater part with your sentiment sir.
FD said it listens to the 'community' but it what it hears is another matter. How the community 'talks' and how FD 'listens' I have no good idea. We have seen the responses though.
FD saving face is also an issue as you suggest, it's only natural but not professional.
Well their testing may have been easy, but we will become the testers soon enough and our responses will be measured (listened to?) - this last is an assumption.
How can we play the beta so as to send a message to ED that this solution is not welcome?

I honestly am not sure why they have the beta system setup because we all raved about the insanity of the RNG and tons of balancing on the AI but as soon as 2.1 launched RNG was what it was -- they did NOT listen (they might have heard but chose to change nothing) and the AI... well everyone knows about that.

 

[Lobstris]

License is a thing, you can't 3DPrint your ship as you don't have a license to reproduce it, you can't make your own Crysler cause the project is covered by copyright and IP laws, Only Crysler factories can produce that card, not your mechanic who can well 3dprint parts to repair it but not the car itself

Did you actually read what I wrote? Everybody would be ignoring licenses left, right and centre. Certain 21st Century countries are already notorious on this planet for producing counterfeit goods based on other's products, ignoring IPR law when it's in their interests, or outright using espionage and cybercrime to obtain others IP. It's not as if in the year 3300, the superpowers wouldn't be constantly ripping off each other's best ideas would it? I for one look forward to my black-market Fulcrum-DeRacey Anacontra.

 

[Arubeto]

But would have complicated development for a low priority feature, this way we were able to slip it into 2.2 - otherwise it might have been further into the future. Besides delay impacts the point of the feature and that is to allow greater use of people's ships.

Michael

The amount of feedback and the intensity of the discussions indicate that ship transfer is not considered a low priority feature by many players. Is there any chance you might reconsider slipping it into the game in its currently planned form and postpone its release to put additional development time into it?

 

[Mephane]

Michael, please, for all that is holy, at least don't explain instant ship transfer away with some lore about 3D printing. Just leave it unexplained, so we can fill in the blanks with imagining that it took some time to deliver, just like refueling or repairing the ship is instant even though obviously lore-wise it would take time.

 

[Hajile]

The amount of feedback and the intensity of the discussions indicate that ship transfer is not considered a low priority feature by many players. Is there any chance you might reconsider slipping it into the game in its currently planned form and postpone its release to put additional development time into it?

yes please. please this!!!

 

[Cosmos]

I agree in the greater part with your sentiment sir.
FD said it listens to the 'community' but it what it hears is another matter. How the community 'talks' and how FD 'listens' I have no good idea. We have seen the responses though.
FD saving face is also an issue as you suggest, it's only natural but not professional.
Well their testing may have been easy, but we will become the testers soon enough and our responses will be measured (listened to?) - this last is an assumption.
How can we play the beta so as to send a message to ED that this solution is not welcome?

They shouldn't worry about saving face because from what I saw re 2.2 patch much of the new content coming looks amazing. But its these shortcuts they make from time to time that undermine much of the great work they do in other areas. On this insta transfer issue they have it seriously wrong and need to reconsider. The vast majotity of people seem to be against how they want to implement it, and its actually us who are going to live with the result. Despite what Frontier say about making a game they want to play its nay on impossible to believe they spend all week putting in long hours to the game only to get back home and boot it up for the night or weekend.

Such is the importance of this feature, and the impact it will have, I'd prefer them to do it well or not at all. Incidentally, whilst everyone moans about grinds and so on folks still do it and play the game. I'm noticing that FD are falling into the same trap Blizzard did re making things more accessible and removing barriers to play. The real WoW killer was in fact Blizzard themselves, insta teleports, group finders and idiot proof raid finder eaze modes which trivilised much of the game background and removed players from the world environments. There is a reason WoW faultered in recent times (no idea how Legion is doing) and its because it forgot what it really was and what made it successful.. Hence the popular Nostalrius BC server popularity.

 

[jprelph]

The amount of feedback and the intensity of the discussions indicate that ship transfer is not considered a low priority feature by many players. Is there any chance you might reconsider slipping it into the game in its currently planned form and postpone its release to put additional development time into it?

I would strongly second that - seeing as a lot of people are vehemently opposed to the idea it seems a bit of community involvement may either get some alternatives that people are happier with or at least reassure people that there is a discussion even if the final decision is to implement it anyway.

 

[Lobstris]

Indeed, if we can assemble anything anywhere then all that would ever need to be hauled are raw materials. I think this ship manufacturing aboard ships is utterly ridiculous.

Yup. The only thing that would be left on the commodities board would be 'printer ink'.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

How does it break missions?

How does it break Mission. It's pretty obvious really. Basically mission restriction on cargo and combat become meaningless. Flying certain ships mean that there are consequences to what is available for you to do in missions. At the moment I am flying a Cobra mk4. This is my choice noting it will limit me on certain activities and missions. Now there will be no limit as I can instantly summon the big trade ship to do that lucrative mission. It trivialise' the whole mission system. It's an easy instant gratification button. It's a get rich quick button.

I remember the kaushpoos CG it was over a 100ly away from my home system, but after the trade CG, still managed to get back and get my Vulture, and I only play a few hours a week, but it felt like an achievement. Now it will be just easy.

 

[Parmo]

Sorry I just don't get why there is any form of economy that involves hauling any form of machinery or advanced technology around as a commodity if it can just be printed by any outpost or facility. Resorting to 'licensing' as an explanation is unsatisfactory, because the technology is so useful (and supposedly ubiquitous), everybody and their dog would be clamouring for licenses, or competitors would be filling the market with other licenses that make roughly the same thing (can't license a Hoover? I bet Dyson would sell you one!) or they would be pirated left right and centre.

Worms. Can. Of.

Alien Isolation's vibe worked because it kind of stuck to the '70s retro sci-fi feel of the film. Elite's fiction worked better sticking to its '80s roots.

And no counterfeiting is possible I presume?
And 3D printers can make 3D printers.
And it is easy, because of cheap fusion power, to create all the elements required from any locally available material?
So why all the mining? SRV mats searching?
Worms from Pandora's Box.

 

[Kitster]

License is a thing, you can't 3DPrint your ship as you don't have a license to reproduce it, you can't make your own Crysler cause the project is covered by copyright and IP laws, Only Crysler factories can produce that car, not your mechanic who can well 3dprint parts to repair it but not the car itself

In a seedy dark corner of the bubble... An Industrial Station in an Anchary system:
"No Governer! What a thing to ask! I can't print that torrent copy of a Imperial Cutter. It'd be against the law that would. Not to mention offending me moral standings!! The cheek of it! Now move along you scoundrel before I call the coppers."

 

[Hajile]

I want to 3d print other peoples modules in my ship... because if it is a license issue then I know a guy who can get me one of those!

 

[Jypson]

How does it break Mission. It's pretty obvious really. Basically mission restriction on cargo and combat become meaningless. Flying certain ships mean that there are consequences to what is available for you to do in missions. At the moment I am flying a Cobra mk4. This is my choice noting it will limit me on certain activities and missions. Now there will be no limit as I can instantly summon the big trade ship to do that lucrative mission. It trivialise' the whole mission system. It's an easy instant gratification button. It's a get rich quick button.

I remember the kaushpoos CG it was over a 100ly away from my home system, but after the trade CG, still managed to get back and get my Vulture, and I only play a few hours a week, but it felt like an achievement. Now it will be just easy.

So it breaks missions...by allowing people to....play more missions? Come again?

 

[stephen_usher]

Or maybe you'll have more ships because you can actually make use of them.

Michael

Thank-you for talking to the community Michael.

Of course, this does change totally what was said time and again with great passion during the Kickstarter about wanting the player to identify with their ship and have an emotional bond with it. I suppose times change, and this ship sailed a long time ago, but this is quite sad.

 

[bitstorm]

and its actually us who are going to live with the result. Despite what Frontier say about making a game they want to play its nay on impossible to believe they spend all week putting in long hours to the game only to get back home and boot it up for the night or weekend.

But the jury's still out on whether it's an overall win.

Frontier says the gameplay it enables is worth it, while others are saying it messes up the gameplay.

We will see.

 

[Darth Ender]

But by introducing a 'half-baked' feature you set a precedent for its use, which is then difficult to rescind later. Why not consider other options (actually, I'm sure other options were considered), such as increasing jump range on FSDs on all ships, that would preserve the balance in the game, would not be potentially as disruptive, and don't require contortions of fiction to justify? (I could see one drawback, and possible explanation for not tweaking FSDs, if longer ship ranges broke the route finder).

All bandaids that dont fix the actual problem. Travel is currently boring. It's a means to get from A to B that does nothing outside of act as a limiting barrier to gameplay.

If some actual gameplay was introduced into travel. If travel was dependent on a skill the player could practice and hone, if there was some strategy to playing this well ....that would make the journey from A to B just as fun if not more fun than the activity at the destination. That is what would solve FD's problem with players being upset about having to travel so much - because travel offers no gameplay yet is a huge portion of the time spent in the game.

Circumventing that isn't the right way to do this.

Give me something engaging to do when I jump system to system. Something engaging to do when i'm in supercruise. That's how you fix travel being boring. Right now how does instant transfer to station from station help explorers? thousands of jumps with nothing in between to do? Hours and hours spent doing absolutely nothing but the same repetitive 30 second task to start the next jump and avoid running into a star with no gameplay. This doesn't solve anything for them. What about all the travel done between systems where you don't benefit from transferring? What about traveling to stations without a shipyard? This "fix" doesn't help any of those people with the same issue, extended periods of playing the game where there is no gameplay. You're watching the screen, or rather most likely doing other crap while the game is on.

All this "fix" will do is allow players to circumvent negative aspects to ship balance while incurring no additional negative impacts because in this game you get money for nothing (....and your chicks for free? i guess) .

 

[Aewarin Jameson]

So it breaks missions...by allowing people to....play more missions? Come again?

There are no consequences any more to your choices ... thanks for highlighting another way in which ED has trivialised itself