Why I'm so looking forward to getting my "Space Legs"

[Boff'in]

Powerplay was a needed step in expanding and introducing the player to the politics, major factions more depth to the BGS.
As a gameplay mechanic - I don't indulge.
Every expansion has its usage for a certain player base or for the nuts and bolts of the game world itself.

For space legs.
I just want to park up my ship on a planet.
Get out of my seat and have a potter round inspecting nuts and bolts.

I grew up on wireframes, and static cockpit images. Just having a model to walk around and pretend I live on a spaceship will satisfy geeky needs from my childhood.
I don't know what my adult gamer self will want, but let's get the inner kid done first

 

[Patrick_68000]

I can not wait to do this with my wing

 

[NeilF]

Not irrelevant at all, as they need to sell seasons to continue developing the game. Or would you buy a season of fixing some bugs and expanding the BGS.

I certainly won't. It needshould to be something substantial to do that. Also when we get atmospheric planets with life. I would like to get out of my ship or SRV and walk around.

If season after season is simply a new marketing attention grab, then the game is gong to stay as thin as it has stayed over the past 12-18 months.

I suspect the game will get (more of) a reputation for unfinished or unfleshed out gameplay, and sales will suffer. A group of us have already fractured with some not buying horizons due to vapid/questionable development goals...

Given the lack of depth in the core game, the thought of first person truly worries me. Ie. Buckets of development for no real gameplay improvement.

 

[Whiteball]

But what exactly is this mythical content and gameplay people want instead?

Can it not be part of/enhanced by/in conjuction with being able to walk about?

 

[ROSS-128]

If season after season is simply a new marketing attention grab, then the game is gong to stay as thin as it has stayed over the past 12-18 months.

I suspect the game will get (more of) a reputation for unfinished or unfleshed out gameplay, and sales will suffer. A group of us have already fractured with some not buy horizons due to vapid/questionable development goals...

It's quite a bit more complicated than just "Legs or BGS, choose one!"

For one thing, calling a full stop on feature development in order to put all hands on deck for the BGS wouldn't go much better than putting all hands on deck for features and neglecting the BGS entirely. Similarly you can't do "full stop until all the bugs are squashed", partially because it's impossible to actually eliminate *all* the bugs.

By all means they certainly should develop the BGS. I would very much like to see them steal the real-time economy from X3 for example (except without the part where it's designed to grind to a halt unless the player intervenes to save it). But there is no reason that should stop them from delivering space legs. Especially since that and multicrew may open some paths to improvement in areas where so far FD has painted themselves into a corner.

 

[killminster]

I don't think we're going to get space legs for a while. I think the devs will want to flesh out the world/s that we will eventually be walking around in i.e atmospheres, basic to complex flora and fauna, settlements. The space legs and their attendant gameplay is an entire game in and of itself. I'd think they may have a season dedicated solely to it.

Having said that, the sort of walking gameplay I would love is something like the jetpack/glider combination that Firefall had, it was one of the most satisfying elements of that particular game. I spent many happy hours scaling the tallest most inaccessible peaks and jumping off of them or upgrading the jet boots so I could get to the ones I couldn't quite reach. I wouldn't mind if they ripped it off wholesale, it's something that could be greatly expanded on as well, for instance: dynamic flight/gliding model that changes depending on the thickness of the atmosphere, making a jump into to Valles Marineris on Mars a lot more tricky and demanding than gliding through the valleys of the Mithrim Montes mountains on Titan.

I'd like to be able to go on foot, assisted by jetpack and/or grappling hook to the places that are too challenging for the SRV and unsuitable to land in your ship and then be able to place a marker there to let people know I'd been there and see if anyone else would have the patience to figure out how it was done. Maybe for the really huge mountains you could pre-drop supply dumps along your intended path or have wing mates drop them for you.

I think if you're on foot they would probably add a survival element depending on the hostility of the environment. Earth like worlds and terraformed planets world be pretty easy but doing stuff on the surface of a planet like Venus would require supplies and planning to do an excursion that's anything longer than getting out of your ship or SRV for a few minutes to check out a wreck you spotted.

There's much to learn from what games like NMS and SC did/do right and what they fail at.

 

[Seboss]

Yet another thread illustrating how different people expectations can be. Some play ED casually and look forward to novel ways to enjoy the space life, a couple hours at a time. And on the other end of the spectrum others clamor for deeper and more complex systems to sink their teeth into for several dozen hours. Of course FDev can only do one of that, and preferably the one that is more likely to bring revenue from new and existing players alike on the short and long term. I wonder which one they'll go for.

 

[MaraJade]

Personally for me, I can't wait to walk around my ship and parts of station. That's one of the main reasons I purchased the game long ago. I also wish they would work on the whole trading aspect of the game and make it worth while. I would love to be able to source out items for trade and actually make some good credits from instead of the usual, Slaves from this station to this station then pick up some tea for the return trip. The biggest problem with trading for me has been ever station is the same, same price, same product. Nothing really changes. It makes it pointless to venture to far out.

I think you will see space legs once Star Citizen is actually realized. Until then, there really isn't any competitions so FD can just keep plugging away. The big draw or draw back to FD will be walking around, I that will be the counter to SC. Just my thoughts, but I really hope it does come soon.(tm)

 

[NeilF]

But what exactly is this mythical content and gameplay people want instead?

Can it not be part of/enhanced by/in conjuction with being able to walk about?

Layers of logical interesting gameplay elements that can feed off each other and be used to make something more than the sum of their parts if you will.

From a post I did some time ago:-

Consider if rather than a development project to introduce some new RND grind mechanics which ultimately then means you can boost certain stats (make your beam laser 25% more powerful), if all that effort had instead gone into some mechanics to move the game "forwards". eg:-

1) NPC wingmen in some missions/tasks, which you could give basic commands to. eg: Attack this! Defend that!
2) Imagine if we had more involved combat orientated missions/tasks such as convoy protection/attack. (see 1)
3) Imagine if we had blockade mechanics, such that under condition X or Y, a station could be blockaded resulting in ships exiting SC further out at specific area, leaving a long flight to the station. Imagine that blockade being enforced/broken. Imagine the price increase of goods inside the station maybe making running the blockade appealing? (see 2)
4) Imagine more dynamic economic models in stations/systems. If food etc isn't suppled, people start starving, and food prices go mad! People start leaving the system however they can! (see 3)
5) Being asked to fly a fighter (think CQC) for a security roll on a station/platform/capital ship (see 1, 2 & 3).​

Let's consider now, the Thargoids appearing. What does having a 25% more powerful beam laser add to that?

Because if we instead had the deeper more varied and interesting mechanics already in place, I can imagine if the Thargoids appeared, being given missions to try and attack them with a wing of other NPCs, or defending an important convoy from them. Seeing systems near Thargoid attacks going into turmoil, and maybe some stations being blockaded. Maybe it's critical food is supplied, or people are flown out of these station. Or being asked to fly a fighter to help defend a capital ship or station from Thargoids.

Consider also with just that list above, how those mechanics might also be used for Community Goals, or Powerplay related tasks!


Or we could have that development time spent to allow us to increase our beam laser damage by 25% and the like...

In short the gameplay (& background sim) has remained all but paper thin since the release in 2014, and there seems little inclination to make it more involved and deeper... If first person is introduced before such attempts are made, I see no reason why first person won't be similarly "thin".

 

[ROSS-128]

Layers of logical interesting gameplay elements that can feed off each other and be used to make something more than the sum of their parts if you will.

From a post I did some time ago:-




In short the gameplay (& background sim) has remained all but paper thin since the release in 2014, and there seems little inclination to make it more involved and deeper... If first person is introduced before such attempts are made, I see no reason why first person won't be similarly "thin".

As far as blockades go, I think to actually implement a blockade you'd need a piece of tech that we've yet to see in Elite: Dangerous. An FTL denial field that makes frame-shifting within a large area impossible, and forces FSDs passing through into realspace. Basically, an artificial way to imitate the gravity well of a neutron star or similarly massive object. To blockade a point of interest you'd set up the FTL denial field around it, increasing the time anyone approaching would have to spend in realspace and thus giving your forces time to intercept them.

A blockading force would need a sensor network to alert them to incoming craft, and enough manpower that they can cover the perimeter of the field. A blockade runner would need a cool silent running build, really good thrusters, and a lot of luck (since the way FSD drops work in this game means their point of arrival will be a random point on the perimeter, regardless of how they approach).

 

[Dillontheman]

As far as blockades go, I think to actually implement a blockade you'd need a piece of tech that we've yet to see in Elite: Dangerous. An FTL denial field that makes frame-shifting within a large area impossible, and forces FSDs passing through into realspace. Basically, an artificial way to imitate the gravity well of a neutron star or similarly massive object. To blockade a point of interest you'd set up the FTL denial field around it, increasing the time anyone approaching would have to spend in realspace and thus giving your forces time to intercept them.

A blockading force would need a sensor network to alert them to incoming craft, and enough manpower that they can cover the perimeter of the field. A blockade runner would need a cool silent running build, really good thrusters, and a lot of luck (since the way FSD drops work in this game means their point of arrival will be a random point on the perimeter, regardless of how they approach).

We already have FSD interdictors that can be fitted on ships. Could just have a large interdictor module thatpulls incoming jumpers to the blockade checkpoint upon arrival in the system

 

[NeilF]

As far as blockades go, I think to actually implement a blockade you'd need a piece of tech that we've yet to see in Elite: Dangerous. An FTL denial field that makes frame-shifting within a large area impossible, and forces FSDs passing through into realspace. Basically, an artificial way to imitate the gravity well of a neutron star or similarly massive object. To blockade a point of interest you'd set up the FTL denial field around it, increasing the time anyone approaching would have to spend in realspace and thus giving your forces time to intercept them.

A blockading force would need a sensor network to alert them to incoming craft, and enough manpower that they can cover the perimeter of the field. A blockade runner would need a cool silent running build, really good thrusters, and a lot of luck (since the way FSD drops work in this game means their point of arrival will be a random point on the perimeter, regardless of how they approach).

My suggestion would simply be a device that means ships exit super cruise much further away from the station in a specific area... and then have to fly in standard flight to the station.

Anyway, don't want to go off topic

 

[Boff'in]

Ships have been designed with their interiors in mind since the begining.

To think "we can walk" implies walking on planets and ergo must have NMS-esque eco systems in-place - you are mistaken.

You have to envision Horizons, but with First Person controlls.

i.e. we get the basic framework.

Walking round our ships.
Walking round our friends ships.
Repairing our own ship.
Will we repel boarders in zero, and slight gravities of the planets we land on.
Oooh yeah.....

Boarding other Peoples Ships.
Boarding derelicts.

"maybe" walking round airless planets, But access is denied to buildings.
But we can walk to other ships and board (with permision).

Will we see NPC passengers on our ship......maybe.
Will we have dialogue with voice acting and decision trees....doubt it.


Will we have to take to the air-ducts and flush out a creature....I hope so

Will we have robinson crusoe survival after we crash on a planet, doubt it.

Will we be allowed to planetfall planets with atmospheres later on in the season, yes - gas giants and dead worlds.
Nothing with Life.
The pilots federation will ban us from entering any planet with life forms (data required), due to our bungling around with the barnacles.

 

[OriginalBadBoy]

So Frontier, I would simply like to say please continue to flesh out this universe and make it even more fun to play, and if...by chance...that might include me walking through one of those badass eco rings I've flown past, and looking up and out into the cosmos, well ladies and gents, that would just be something.

You are going to be waiting quite a while. A couple of years I would have thought.

 

[dubsdj]

Space Legs worries the hell out of me as people seem to see it as some pancea of gameplay and depth. Consider how deep the existing gameplay is. Consider how the core elements introduced in 2014 have been moved forwards and how deep they now are.

Now add this to the notion of space legs. This creates two concerns for me:-
1) Space legs would come at the expense of time developing the core game. Clearly (at the moment) this time is urgently required. Time has been spent over the past year on all manner of things; Powerplay, CQC, giving us 25% more pewpew. None of which really have moved the gameplay or background sim forwards. We need development time spent on doing this... Or are we happy to spend years to come doing on the same depth of gameplay...
2) If the same thin mini-game mentality is put into space legs... What's the point.


When I see people get all excited about the notion of walking around their ships and station, and then you ask them why, and what they'll actually do... The answers are typically very thin in detail of what the actual interesting gameplay would be. And tends instead to be full of five-minute wonders like "looking out of windows" and the like.

EDIT: (below) I rest my case...

If you could walk around your ship and find a chair to sit on and use a computer which has the option to overlay your windows desktop in game that would be ace. Set your co-pilot to continue on the route while you fire up netflix (in game) and if anything bad happens your desktop is interrupted by a message saying "Get out of that chair and help!" Not very realistic to be watching Netflix in the year 3000 something but hey.

fat chance I know but I would love that.

 

[lysan]

Ships have been designed with their interiors in mind since the begining.

To think "we can walk" implies walking on planets and ergo must have NMS-esque eco systems in-place - you are mistaken.

You have to envision Horizons, but with First Person controlls.

i.e. we get the basic framework.

Walking round our ships.
Walking round our friends ships.
Repairing our own ship.
Will we repel boarders in zero, and slight gravities of the planets we land on.
Oooh yeah.....

Boarding other Peoples Ships.
Boarding derelicts.

"maybe" walking round airless planets, But access is denied to buildings.
But we can walk to other ships and board (with permision).

Will we see NPC passengers on our ship......maybe.
Will we have dialogue with voice acting and decision trees....doubt it.


Will we have to take to the air-ducts and flush out a creature....I hope so

Will we have robinson crusoe survival after we crash on a planet, doubt it.

Will we be allowed to planetfall planets with atmospheres later on in the season, yes - gas giants and dead worlds.
Nothing with Life.
The pilots federation will ban us from entering any planet with life forms (data required), due to our bungling around with the barnacles.

I think you are close, it will be simpel in the beginning, then they will add features on later. Walking in your ship will be first, leaving your ship on foot will maybe be included, then some areas in the stations will open and so on.

 

[Lightspeed]

2017 marks the 40th anniversary of Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy.

I see it coming together .... Passengers ..... Crew ............ all we will require is our towel and to stick a thumb up for a passing ship [up]

 

[Jason S]

Space legs could cause the most controversy yet and be the hardest of what they have done so far to do well.e

If space legs is also fleshing out the insides of all ships and having somewhat varied station interiors, I think it may prove rather hard for them to accomplish it well.

But we will wait and see.

I would also vote for cool atmosphere of a walk about rather than a shooter fest, but is that a path to boring play, maybe, maybe not?

 

[Ca$hback]

Safari outfit, boonie hat, Holland and Holland. Land on Catachan. Bag me a 3-eyed T-Rex I reckon.

 

[lysan]

Just one of the rings in the space ports would be a whole level in GTA.
They are massive...