The reality of the situation... 2.2

[Anuset]

Probably due to different ways to enjoy games I guess.


No one should ever strife to be a hypocrite. Everyone is, but no one should strife to be

Exactly. I won't begrudge you your enjoyment. All I'm asking is don't begrudge mine. It's not as if I'm arguing for some tactic that is harming others game play, such as griefing.

Oh but the forums have brought me to it. It's my reward for having my game play diminished and having no say in the matter. I wasn't going to let this one slide by.

Edit:
For the moderators, yes I indeed have "badgered" in some of my replies. Guilty, I will take my warning. Though I do hope that it extends to others who troll this thread. I will not be held solely accountable when others are similarly allowed to troll and badger. Let's be fair here...

 

[StiTch]

Well if it was a matter of a few credits or anything reasonable then yes. Your argument is accurate. However we've gone from say 4-5m per hundred tons (ish) to less than one million. We're both arguing the same point and you're coming to a different conclusion which is why I don't understand how you're getting there. You're correct, it isn't a rewarding gameplay mechanic anymore while others like passenger missions continue on the same high pay.

As for being ashamed, it's more about the guy below you than you. You're able to hold a conversation about topics. The guy below though pretty much just resorts to name calling and blaming when he doesn't have the slightest clue why people are off. These are the reasons why I am a hypocrite and will shove the biowaste right back where it's deserved.

So back to reading comprehension, never once was the use of logging out used. I. Fact if you shopped around the systems you could easily fill your hold without resorting to logging off. As far as your snide comment about slaves, if standard trade is so profitable then why nerf long distance trading.

If you truly gave a crap about the balance of the game you'd be arguing that passenger missions are overpaid. But it's new and you're a fan boy so we're going to over look that.

In the end we need to stop crying foul and yelling to nerf things. Sooner or later you're going to be on the receiving end. The difference would be, I wouldn't be joining the rest in taking pleasure in your lack of gameplay.

Okay sugar cup, if you want to pull the sass cannon out because you didn't like the suggestion you might actually not be right here then go ahead but I have 100% original Sarcasm branded "Sass mortars".

Anyway.

I have a better idea of why people are, uh, effed off than you and I can assure you that my forum balance discussions extend well beyond trying to support 40 mill/hour skilless cash cows. However I did not resort to name calling or anything derogatory other than the implication that you're trying to defend something that is unbalanced. Sorry, it's that simple. On the other hand you managed to pull out fan boy. So...I guess you were honest about being a hypocrite.

If you want to trade, then trade. There was no "dig" about slaves or standard trading, I haven't got a foggy where you got that from. I trade slaves on occasion. I didn't on the other hand say it was excessively profitable, although it's certainly there. Trade cutter can earn 3 mill/run easy on slaves for a one/two jump route. That's profitable if you ask me.

Braben himself said he's against cheap cash farming methods. Sothis was a cash farming method. It simply was, sorry. I personally would have opted for a more targeted approach to the nerf, and would have agreed with a well constructed argument here - I could support a well constructed point about it being unnecessary across the board, or being an important source of income for lower end players with smaller ships.

Unfortunately your argument was "well Sothis was good gameplay that they took away from us (which it wasn't), now the profit has gone down on long distance hauling so it's no longer fun". You can get as indignant and angry as you want, that's a pretty shoddy pitch for the "balancing" you're so fond of

 

[Anuset]

Okay sugar cup, if you want to pull the sass cannon out because you didn't like the suggestion you might actually not be right here then go ahead but I have 100% original Sarcasm branded "Sass mortars".

Anyway.

I have a better idea of why people are, uh, effed off than you and I can assure you that my forum balance discussions extend well beyond trying to support 40 mill/hour skilless cash cows. However I did not resort to name calling or anything derogatory other than the implication that you're trying to defend something that is unbalanced. Sorry, it's that simple. On the other hand you managed to pull out fan boy. So...I guess you were honest about being a hypocrite.

If you want to trade, then trade. There was no "dig" about slaves or standard trading, I haven't got a foggy where you got that from. I trade slaves on occasion. I didn't on the other hand say it was excessively profitable, although it's certainly there. Trade cutter can earn 3 mill/run easy on slaves for a one/two jump route. That's profitable if you ask me.

Braben himself said he's against cheap cash farming methods. Sothis was a cash farming method. It simply was, sorry. I personally would have opted for a more targeted approach to the nerf, and would have agreed with a well constructed argument here - I could support a well constructed point about it being unnecessary across the board, or being an important source of income for lower end players with smaller ships.

Unfortunately your argument was "well Sothis was good gameplay that they took away from us (which it wasn't), now the profit has gone down on long distance hauling so it's no longer fun". You can get as indignant and angry as you want, that's a pretty shoddy pitch for the "balancing" you're so fond of

Your argument is invalid as you point out, one is as profitable as another. So in the end it comes down to one is better than the other in your (and Braben's eyes). Hence the nerf then was not needed as they were on par with each other. You're contradicting yourself.

 

[StiTch]

Your argument is invalid as you point out, one is as profitable as another. So in the end it comes down to one is better than the other in your (and Braben's eyes). Hence the nerf then was not needed as they were on par with each other. You're contradicting yourself.

I think you're going mad bro.

Where did I say they were as profitable as each other? You point that bit out for me. Go on. Paste it.

Oh sorry, it wasn't there, because I said quite specifically "I didn't on the other hand say it was excessively profitable, although it's certainly there."

Please drop the straw man argument, and for the second time please stop putting words in my mouth.

There are valid discussion points for increasing the profit of certain delivery missions while avoiding the return of Sothis. There aren't any here, and I dare say I have more genuinely relevant reasons than I picked up on reading in your OP.

I'd love you to prove me wrong but this whole thing just reeks of "you took my effortless credit manafacturing tool away, you're ruining the game forever!"

Bad troll is bad.

 

[Anuset]

I think you're going mad bro.

Where did I say they were as profitable as each other? You point that bit out for me. Go on. Paste it.

Oh sorry, it wasn't there, because I said quite specifically "I didn't on the other hand say it was excessively profitable, although it's certainly there."

Please drop the straw man argument, and for the second time please stop putting words in my mouth.

There are valid discussion points for increasing the profit of certain delivery missions while avoiding the return of Sothis. There aren't any here, and I dare say I have more genuinely relevant reasons than I picked up on reading in your OP.

I'd love you to prove me wrong but this whole thing just reeks of "you took my effortless credit manafacturing tool away, you're ruining the game forever!"

Bad troll is bad.

Your entire argument is that it's based on irrelevant game play. Please describe to me in detail the difference between A-B trading vs current state of passenger missions vs Sothis. Aside from the very base mechanic there is none. I'm also not sure where you're getting 40 mil per hour. Never saw it myself. Also never did Sothis. Yet Aditi trade missions paid 1/4th that and were similarly nerfed by an order of magnitude.

The fact that I have to explain this, again, is beyond comprehension.

 

[Marc_Hicks]

Heh, I had a FUN three hours in Elite last night!...
Spruced up my Cobra based on the Combat Cobra thread, added a passenger module, and set up to haul people and stuff along with strong defense as well. Made over 2 million in those three hrs and took out intedictors with ease. Also said "Greetings" to some CMDR spotted somewhere out there.

All in all, a FUN time!

~S~
wind

I've had a great couple of nights with E: D. Saw my first post 2.2 White Dwarf.....absolutely stunning, if slightly dangerous to get too close to. Went hunting for geological features, but instead got attacked-twice-by pirates less than 4km above the surface of a moon.....that was a bit hairy.

Tonight I took on an assassination mission, & my target-a pirate in an FdL, was able to get me down to 6% hull before I killed him (man, that was a nail-biter). Then I took 3 passenger missions.....2 with rich tourists who were averse to danger, & 1 Criminal Mastermind who was being pursued by people who wanted her dead.....and who was also secretive. So that was intersting. Found out the NPC sent to kill my passenger was trailing me, & when I dropped out at my destination, I found the place crawling with Alliance Security ships. Worse still, the potential assassin dropped out of Super Cruise almost right on top of me. I've never hit "Silent Running" in all my time playing the game .

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Your entire argument is that it's based on irrelevant game play. Please describe to me in detail the difference between A-B trading vs current state of passenger missions vs Sothis. Aside from the very base mechanic there is none. I'm also not sure where you're getting 40 mil per hour. Never saw it myself. Also never did Sothis. Yet Aditi trade missions paid 1/4th that and were similarly nerfed by an order of magnitude.

The fact that I have to explain this, again, is beyond comprehension.

The fact that we have to explain, again, that this is a BUG that is being INVESTIGATED, is beyond comprehension.

 

[StiTch]

Your entire argument is that it's based on irrelevant game play. Please describe to me in detail the difference between A-B trading vs current state of passenger missions vs Sothis. Aside from the very base mechanic there is none. I'm also not sure where you're getting 40 mil per hour. Never saw it myself. Also never did Sothis. Yet Aditi trade missions paid 1/4th that and were similarly nerfed by an order of magnitude.

The fact that I have to explain this, again, is beyond comprehension.

...I understand all of this and more. You don't have to explain it, you're just really really bad at explaining it and explaining your point.

The difference between A-B trading and Sothis? A-B trading implies understanding trade routes, being able to find the most profitable of them in turn, with the ability to learn the economy if you want to shun trade tools doing it all for you. You then go home with a pay packet you earned without mode switching.

Sothis was repetition incarnate. You spend half your time in the menu to pick up the same missions with the same biowaste etc., and then the rest of the time practising using your FSD button. The most challenging bit of Sothis was docking.

Now if you had brought up the gameplay value available to Robigo back when smuggling was a thing, then I would be on board with you. Or if you pushed your point with something more than "I hate this change, everyone that disagrees with me sucks".

I said no-where it is irrelevant. I am all for small-time missions and am eager to see matters rectified so that they can continue. Chill out a sec and stop raging at everything for the sake of it. That's my job, anyway.

 

[Marc_Hicks]

you really need to step back and calm down a bit, my comment on your ship was just light hearted. You really cant go off on one and then call others trolls at the same time... well you can, you just did I guess!.

There are some valid points along the way in this thread imo... The biggest issue with these missions were the mission stacking, which FD would do well to fix..

but the stupid thing is, the foundations for the fix are already in there.... we have unique items already in the game, and with limited supply of them. Just build the long range trade missions around the rares, and FD can still make them high paying, and even link the supply somewhat by making high rep with the faction trust you with a better supply of their in demand goods.

DB sold the game on the back of it having a consistent believable economy. He DID say there would be high paying gold rushes, but was clear that these would be very short lived, "gotta be in the right place at the right time" and would be exhausted quickly if hammered, thus encouraging people to keep them to themselves.

they were never advertised as being long term cash cows you could continually hit for months.

And mode switching to get mega millions by doing multiple copies of the same mission in 1 run, one of the devs flat out came out and said the missions were not balanced with a view to exploiting the mission board in this way (no link sorry)

now MAYBE the passenger missions are currently supidly over paying as well... i dunno, not done any yet, BUT at least there is risk associated with those, I have read multiple accounts of players taking on these high paying missions and then complaining when their 300 million anaconda gets blown up after a scan.

well if so, there you go, risk and reward!.


either way tho, the title of the thread should be "your" reality to the situation of 2.2 (which is subjective). Your title is claiming to be objective and it clearly isnt.

Yep, OP is becoming more troll like with every new post. Really has major anger management issues.

 

[Anuset]

...I understand all of this and more. You don't have to explain it, you're just really really bad at explaining it and explaining your point.

The difference between A-B trading and Sothis? A-B trading implies understanding trade routes, being able to find the most profitable of them in turn, with the ability to learn the economy if you want to shun trade tools doing it all for you. You then go home with a pay packet you earned without mode switching.

Sothis was repetition incarnate. You spend half your time in the menu to pick up the same missions with the same biowaste etc., and then the rest of the time practising using your FSD button. The most challenging bit of Sothis was docking.

Now if you had brought up the gameplay value available to Robigo back when smuggling was a thing, then I would be on board with you. Or if you pushed your point with something more than "I hate this change, everyone that disagrees with me sucks".

I said no-where it is irrelevant. I am all for small-time missions and am eager to see matters rectified so that they can continue. Chill out a sec and stop raging at everything for the sake of it. That's my job, anyway.

Nope, try again. You can pull up a website and it'll spit out a route for you. No different and a lot faster than hopping between systems. It's the same thing. The only difference is you're paid more (in the end time-time spent is the same) and have less dock-undock. There's LESS repition in that than there is A-B-A trading. You're delivering to different systems. Savvy?

Not once did I ever defend "mode switching" and have stated it wasn't needed. Stop and read my comments.

It should be a damn choice. It was, I WAS able to make the same amount on LR missions as I was A-B-A trading. I find it infuriating that when equal, one has to be paid out less than the other because "I don't like it."

Well i don't like PVP. I'm not here crying "get rid of PVP and open." But you're here saying what I find more enjoyable is irrelevant. I'm not trolling. You would appear to be.

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Yep, OP is becoming more troll like with every new post. Really has major anger management issues.

No, just irritated that people are allowed to troll me. When similarly stupid things are said I get dinged for it.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

my hope is once the current bugs wit hthe mission payouts are fixed a lot of people who are currently unhappy with the missions as they are right now... just maybe they will be happy (happier) again.

PS imo a game - any game not just ED - should never be balanced based on the use of out of game FAQs etc that give the answer away.

to many, this is a form of cheating, and as such will only use tools at their disposal in game.

I am not going to lie and say I have never used an out of game tool in ED.... but I DO TRY to minimise their use.... and as such would really not want FD to assume "everyone" uses them.

indeed imo that is part of the problem around why ED is so convoluted and does not explain itsself ingame... because i think FD just assume players will watch a few hrs of youtube videos to figure it out

its a bit of a seque AND with the new training missions (v cool if you aint tried them) is slightly less of an issue now..... but the problem is inherant in ED imo.

 

[Anuset]

my hope is once the current bugs wit hthe mission payouts are fixed a lot of people who are currently unhappy with the missions as they are right now... just maybe they will be happy (happier) again.

Agreed. While I would be thankful, especially after the discourse on these forums, I really have to wonder if it's even worth continuing with the game. Talk about a bad taste in my mouth.

Thank you... I think that's all most of us hope for is some balance!

 

[StiTch]

Nope, try again. You can pull up a website and it'll spit out a route for you. No different and a lot faster than hopping between systems. It's the same thing. The only difference is you're paid more (in the end time-time spent is the same) and have less dock-undock. There's LESS repition in that than there is A-B-A trading. You're delivering to different systems. Savvy?

Not once did I ever defend "mode switching" and have stated it wasn't needed. Stop and read my comments.

It should be a damn choice. It was, I WAS able to make the same amount on LR missions as I was A-B-A trading. I find it infuriating that when equal, one has to be paid out less than the other because "I don't like it."

Well i don't like PVP. I'm not here crying "get rid of PVP and open." But you're here saying what I find more enjoyable is irrelevant. I'm not trolling. You would appear to be.

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No, just irritated that people are allowed to troll me. When similarly stupid things are said I get dinged for it.

This thread officially just became playing chess with a pigeon.

Never mind.

 

[Jex =TE=]

Edit:
For the moderators, yes I indeed have "badgered" in some of my replies. Guilty, I will take my warning. Though I do hope that it extends to others who troll this thread. I will not be held solely accountable when others are similarly allowed to troll and badger. Let's be fair here...

This!!!

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Now if you had brought up the gameplay value available to Robigo back when smuggling was a thing, then I would be on board with you.

This - I wish they would bring back that gameplay as it sounded fun and challenging. Screw the credits earned, give me security forces to sneak by....

Splinter Dangerous!!

 

[StiTch]

This - I wish they would bring back that gameplay as it sounded fun and challenging. Screw the credits earned, give me security forces to sneak by....

Splinter Dangerous!!

Yeah I made a post about this a few days back, but killing smuggling was one of the worst things to happen in ED.

It had skill involved for the money, could be tense, involved risk, involved consideration about your loadout and there was community discussion on how best to sneak through systems and into stations unscanned...and the payout for what you did was pretty reasonable.

As you say though, the credits can do one. I miss the drama

 

[Anuset]

Yeah I made a post about this a few days back, but killing smuggling was one of the worst things to happen in ED.

It had skill involved for the money, could be tense, involved risk, involved consideration about your loadout and there was community discussion on how best to sneak through systems and into stations unscanned...and the payout for what you did was pretty reasonable.

As you say though, the credits can do one. I miss the drama

We can solve the whole thing right here. I'm game to have viable smuggling back. Not opposed at all.

I just dislike the lack of options and the push to the new content.

 

[StiTch]

We can solve the whole thing right here. I'm game to have viable smuggling back. Not opposed at all.

I just dislike the lack of options and the push to the new content.

Preach it. Now we have something constructive - smuggling offered a unique and worthwhile alternative to A->B trading in its old incarnation.

Now it doesn't, because scan penalties aren't stringent enough, the mission payouts are questionable, they're seldom available and you aren't placed under much pressure while you do have the missions.

 

[Brett C]

So, it's the start of the weekend and all, can we all get along here? Both sides of the party are reporting posts left and right, and many reports aren't from who you think it may be in this thread.

If you don't have something constructive to post with, refrain from posting it please. No need to be bonking each other on the head with internet blow-up hammers.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

damn i am meant to be going off now....

but, smuggling... i dunno if you have seen the harsh punishments for the new criminal paaenger smuggling missions? they pay well but mess up and you face near certain death.

perhaps this is something FD could look at for some really high paid smuggling missions.... or more ideally terrorist missions.

"smuggle" a bomb into a space station, or perhaps a bunch of "infected" slaves.

this could have a side effect of if after a certain time limit, enough of these missions were completed, it could then trigger a disease state which would then mean the system would be begging for meds etc.

but if you are caught doing these terrorist missions they would have to instantly put you at hostile and have a big effect on the reputation of the super power you are messing with too.

I am not, nor have i ever been against high paying missions.... I just want them to come with some downsides if you mess them up... actions and consequences.

@Brett
not even with this?
http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NTU3WDQ2Mw==/z/fq0AAOSwBLlVFYzr/$_35.JPG?set_id=880000500F

have a good weekend all.... even if you are on the "wrong" team

 

[Andovar]

...internet blow-up hammers.

Ok, where can I get one of these?? Seriously, much have!!! Does amazon sell them? I could have it here by tomorrow with amazon prime.

 

[RhymeRhyme]

Because they use those ships against you. If they didn't, then I wouldn't care. But they do, so I do care.

Before The Engineers, this was not a problem. But with Heat Propellers crushing you within 15 seconds, it's a problem. Not even a ship specific. A small heat meta ship can take you out in seconds. So, big ships are ok and getting them is ok.