Engineers Have FDEV nurfed the MEF drop rates?

Susanna · Nov 20, 2016

Another 6 large medium security bases scanned this evening and only one lot of 3 MEFs for the hassle. Have FDEV nurfed the MEF drop rates again?

I for one am fed up with this tonight. Not happy! Will you every stop making pointless time sinks!

And another thing, the data store doesn't warn that it's full... Add a warning that it's full, and I don't mean fleetingly in the information panel! Increase the damned storage as well!

Madrax573 · Nov 20, 2016

My data and mat storage was full last night.

I just got rid of all the items that I had loads of as they are obviously ridiculously easy to collect. Yes a warning is useful the moment the store become full but if it is a constant one then people will just ignore it and have the same problem.
A little bit of house keeping is all that is required. About 30s and it's all done.

as for the MEF's? I don't even know what that stands for so I probably haven't even looked for them sorry

JeffBea · Nov 20, 2016

Modified embedded firmware. Required for most of the higher level engineer mods.

racer1 · Nov 20, 2016

I was seeing normal drop rates last time I went looking a week or so ago. I thought the small and medium size with medium security was the best bet rather than large?

SimImperial · Nov 21, 2016

I have collected 24 MEF's today by scanning medium security bases per the list. I was having
good luck at every base until the last 3. None to be found. Now I started scanning the
Scientific bases which resulted in the same. no MEF's. I have 37 total and maybe that's the problem.
I noticed when I had 36 Classified Scan Databanks I had no luck at all finding more. After I
dropped a batch off I started seeing them everywhere.
If that is how it works and your luck or RNG factor is based on the current amount you have,
then that really sucks.

BostromNZ · Nov 21, 2016

JeffBea said:
Modified embedded firmware. Required for most of the higher level engineer mods.

It's needed for literally one mod - overcharged - which can be applied to six different weapon types.

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SimImperial said:
I have collected 24 MEF's today by scanning medium security bases per the list. I was having
good luck at every base until the last 3. None to be found. Now I started scanning the
Scientific bases which resulted in the same. no MEF's. I have 37 total and maybe that's the problem.
I noticed when I had 36 Classified Scan Databanks I had no luck at all finding more. After I
dropped a batch off I started seeing them everywhere.
If that is how it works and your luck or RNG factor is based on the current amount you have,
then that really sucks.

I have a feeling this is the case. The same thing happens with modular terminals, as soon as you have over 23 they just seem to stop spawning.

Susanna · Nov 21, 2016

BostromNZ said:
It's needed for literally one mod - overcharged - which can be applied to six different weapon types.

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I have a feeling this is the case. The same thing happens with modular terminals, as soon as you have over 23 they just seem to stop spawning.

Could be but I've only got 12... A friend I play with has 20 or so. Bit of a bummer if it's rigged to slow the drop rates as you gather them. Those very annoying Bast d a r ds!

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Madrax573 said:
My data and mat storage was full last night.

I just got rid of all the items that I had loads of as they are obviously ridiculously easy to collect. Yes a warning is useful the moment the store become full but if it is a constant one then people will just ignore it and have the same problem.
A little bit of house keeping is all that is required. About 30s and it's all done.

as for the MEF's? I don't even know what that stands for so I probably haven't even looked for them sorry

I'd like to see a counter display on the hud for how many materials and data you have in your stores. That would help.

Ydiss · Nov 21, 2016

Unfortunately, probability doesn't mean certainty. Its nature can mean you never see another MEF again, or 5 in a row. It's just unlikely.

Only seeing one after 6 attempts is very probable.

BigBANGtheory [VR] · Nov 21, 2016

We know this effect does exist with buying Rare commodities though it could also be related to CMDRs themselves extracting items from a series of sources and those then running dry from time to time. Then again it could be some simple RNG...

I must admit from a gameplay and UX perspective this kind of thing can get awfully frustrating, I don't mind things being harder but I do expect some kind of certainty or being able to influence the odds in you favour.

Eera · Nov 21, 2016

you are playing a grind game. what were you expect ?

Ydiss · Nov 21, 2016

BigBANGtheory said:
We know this effect does exist with buying Rare commodities though it could also be related to CMDRs themselves extracting items from a series of sources and those then running dry from time to time. Then again it could be some simple RNG...

I must admit from a gameplay and UX perspective this kind of thing can get awfully frustrating, I don't mind things being harder but I do expect some kind of certainty or being able to influence the odds in you favour.

It's just probability. If MEFs have x% chance to be granted, where x is say 5, statistically you will get one for every 20 you get. But you're not guaranteed that.

You can play Blackjack using a strict strategy that gives you the very best odds of winning every hand (in most cases, that's around 49.5%). Statistically speaking, the house always wins. But probability allows the player to win 20 games in a row. Or lose 20 games in a row. Or any combination above or below.

The house still wins over time. And MEFs will drop 5% of the time. It's just human nature to question the validity of results when they get a winning or losing streak.

FD haven't nerfed MEFs drop rates because nothing in any of the notes suggests this and most players are experiencing the expected results.

A sample of 6 attempts isn't nearly enough statistical analysis to strongly suggest a change in the chance to drop.

Susanna · Nov 21, 2016

racer1 said:
I was seeing normal drop rates last time I went looking a week or so ago. I thought the small and medium size with medium security was the best bet rather than large?

Maybe the question should be what is the normal drop rates? I thought it was supposed to be about 2/3 bases scanned would drop MEF (at least 1) but I'm seeing way less than that - probably less than 1/10.

Thoughts? Is this base size dependent? I'd have thought the larger bases give more data items increasign the odds of getting MEF for each base scan?

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Ydiss said:
And MEFs will drop 5% of the time.
FD haven't nerfed MEFs drop rates because nothing in any of the notes suggests this and most players are experiencing the expected results.

A sample of 6 attempts isn't nearly enough statistical analysis to strongly suggest a change in the chance to drop.

That sample of 6 bases is from one evening only (last night), I've had several evenings with similar experience of 1 from 6 bases giving next to nothing - it seems to be a trend to me. Also a friend I play with scanned 8 bases in a row and got ziltch. Statistically possible but the odds are starting to look longer and longer that this is mere chance playing weed with us...

As for that 5% - is that an actual known number or a made up one? 1/20 seems long odds to me!

tomalus · Nov 21, 2016

Praise RNGesus

BigBANGtheory [VR] · Nov 21, 2016

Ydiss said:
A sample of 6 attempts isn't nearly enough statistical analysis to strongly suggest a change in the chance to drop.

...but its enough to start narcing players off though and that's the point, in fact I'd say if you aren't reaping some benefit by your third attempt you're playing with fire in situations where the player is putting a reasonable amount of time and effort in.

djadjok · Nov 21, 2016

Susanna said:
Another 6 large medium security bases scanned this evening and only one lot of 3 MEFs for the hassle. Have FDEV nurfed the MEF drop rates again?

I for one am fed up with this tonight. Not happy! Will you every stop making pointless time sinks!

And another thing, the data store doesn't warn that it's full... Add a warning that it's full, and I don't mean fleetingly in the information panel! Increase the damned storage as well!

No, I think not. MEF drop rates has not been changed. There are not so much contributors to the statistical spreadsheet to do calculations for "instant" mean values, so I cannot be certain. However just at the arrival of 2.1.05 (the last "reset") I've also scanned 6 large bases in a row without getting any MEFs. Than other 2 bases have dropped 1+2 seeds. So all looks normal. And I hope that it will not be changed in nearest future.
Check this - and contribute=)

Ydiss · Nov 21, 2016

Susanna said:
As for that 5% - is that an actual known number or a made up one? 1/20 seems long odds to me!

It was purely an example.

Von Shadow · Nov 21, 2016

I got 1 lot of MEF and 4 lots of CIF from 3 base runs tonight.... seems about right

BigBANGtheory [VR] · Nov 22, 2016

Von Shadow said:
I got 1 lot of MEF and 4 lots of CIF from 3 base runs tonight.... seems about right

how many do you have stored?

Von Shadow · Nov 22, 2016

BigBANGtheory said:
how many do you have stored?

MEF: 5
CIF: 12
MCF: 14
SLF: 31

BigBANGtheory [VR] · Nov 22, 2016

ok not many then, see if the MEF drop rate changes for you as you collect more i.e. 15+

I've just got one, but its taken me 7 large +++ sites with medium security to get there. Yes it could be RNG and mean average working against me I'm wondering if its because I have more MEF stored than you though and some anti-hoarding factor at play like the rare commodities.