An investigation into Frontier's actions on Combat Logging

[Karunamon]

You just basically proved my point, you'd rather combat log and break the TOS in OPEN and ruin others fun because you don't like the idea of pvp and gankers even when that said mechanic is legitimate part of the gameplay.

''I don't see any benefits in exploration because it's clearly a toxic activity''

It is both possible to think that CLing is a cheat that should result in the perpetrators being banned, and taking a great deal of joy in seeing some of you and yours' abuse of the player base thrown back in your face.

 

[Sole Hunter]

No, it's not that at all. There are many many problems with Elite, at the moment. Placeholder mechanics, missing features, things not working as intended.
Doing what you guys did so your issue could be solved first, was just plain childish and immature. And that is what people are mad about.
No one actually thinks that combat logging isn't an issue. It is one of many, and probably a lot lower on peoples lists.

You SDC think you run the community. News flash, you don't. You are part of a larger whole, and your needs do not need to come first all the time.

I never made any mention of SDC in the last few statements I made, I was discussing combat logging as a whole nor did I made any mention that we run the community so I don't understand why you are trying to start drama or stir the pot when clearly this is irrelevant to the original post.

We are not mad nor angry we are simply disapointed in the level of unprofessionalism Fdev displayed with how they handled combat logging report tickets, we felt it was necessary to bring it up to light and address it.

 

[Stryka Choon]

You just basically proved my point, you'd rather combat log and break the TOS in OPEN and ruin others fun because you don't like the idea of pvp and gankers even when that said mechanic is legitimate part of the gameplay.

''I don't see any benefits in exploration because it's clearly a toxic activity therefore i will cheat''

Much as I find this thread amusing in a slightly bizarre way, you REALLY need to get a life and some perspective! It's a game, dude, and if people don't want to play with you the way you want them to, that's their prerogative.

 

[Sole Hunter]

Much as I find this thread amusing in a slightly bizarre way, you REALLY need to get a life and some perspective! It's a game, dude, and if people don't want to play with you the way you want them to, that's their prerogative.

I have a life but thanks for caring about my well being, I appreciate the gesture.

 

[Ozram]

I never made any mention of SDC in the last few statements I made, I was discussing combat logging as a whole nor did I made any mention that we run the community.

We are not mad nor angry we are simply disapointed in the level of unprofessionalism Fdev displayed with how they handled combat logging report tickets, we felt it was necessary to bring it up this issue to light and address it.

Nonsense. You are all having a collective tantrum for being denied the opportunity to generate some salt. I think this is where some of us in the community are beginning to so the attraction in doing it. Driving away a toxic group of players would be a QOL improvement and public service IMO. SDC and the mentality it represents is a far greater detriment to the game than all CL's combined.

 

[Sole Hunter]

It is both possible to think that CLing is a cheat that should result in the perpetrators being banned, and taking a great deal of joy in seeing some of you and yours' abuse of the player base thrown back in your face.

I'm 100% willing to accept the consequences to my actions unlike some players here. However, I never combat logged nor do I plan to start tomorrow because I disagree with said ''x'' activity.

Cheating is unacceptable.

 

[NeilF]

You just basically proved my point, you'd rather combat log and break the TOS in OPEN and ruin others fun because you don't like the idea of pvp and gankers even when that said mechanic is legitimate part of the gameplay.

''I don't see any benefits in exploration because it's clearly a toxic activity therefore i will cheat''

Well, we'd have to agree to disagree what's good for the game then...

You seem to be suggesting that individuals (potentially even in groups) interdicting other CMDRs (who are most likely not even kitted out for a PvP fight) simply to destroy them for no other reason than they enjoy the premise of causing another player aggravation and grief, is a good feature of the game. I'd suggest this "pointless" toxic activity, when combined with a woefullying lacking crime and punishment system is not a good situation for the game to be in.

I fully accept that where CMDRs are using it to duck out of other areas of the game (eg: duck piracy) is far from ideal. And I've encountered it myself. HOWEVER, I'm more than happy to wait for combat logging to be sorted AFTER the more important outstanding issue in the game are addressed.


I'd suggest if combat logging was addressed at the moment, it would:-
a) Simply make more players resign from OPEN, due to the toxic activity of a monitory of players.
b) Waste a lot of FD's time, due to the toxic activity of a monitory of players.


Are we concerned about the well being of a toxic minority at the moment when other issues are surely more important?

 

[Sole Hunter]

Nonsense. You are all having a collective tantrum for being denied the opportunity to generate some salt. I think this is where some of us in the community are beginning to so the attraction in doing it. Driving away a toxic group of players would be a QOL improvement and public service IMO. SDC and the mentality it represents is a far greater detriment to the game than all CL's combined.

Point me where I was seeking salt, my posts have been nothing but serious in this thread. If SDC was such a detriment you seriously think fdev would waste their time to comment in the last 140 pages and address this issue?

Clearly, they don't feel the same way as you do because if this was the case we wouldn't be here after 2 years of game development.

 

[DaylightM]

I never made any mention of SDC in the last few statements i made, I was discussing combat logging as a whole nor did I made any mention that we run the community.

We are not mad nor angry we are simply disapointed in the level of unprofessionalism they displayed with how they handled combat logging report tickets, we felt it was necessary to bring it up this issue to light and address it.

anybody would think (from the way you are going on) that FDEV tested the game using child labour or that they are starting to wind down the service or selling illicit "products" eg breaking bad style

No they didnt do any of those things no doubt that the support cmdr looked at the massive block of reports submitted by "the usual suspects" checked through them for repeat offenders and then filed them in box 13

this is a game if you dont enjoy playing anymore then you have 2 choices...

this wasnt crime of the century so please stop acting like it was

 

[Vacendak]

I'm finding it absolutely hilarious that there's a high ranking [according to his forum sig anyway] CMDR of a particular group that unabashedly prides itself on preying on noobs and infiltrating PVE-only PGs for the sole purpose of showing us all how big their E-peens are and ruining someones fun [of course this is what they call "emergent game play'" like were all too thick to see what it for what it really is], is in here crying about people ruining his fun. I love it, you just can't make this stuff up! Amazing how quick the tables turn when the shoe is on the other foot...

 

[Asp Explorer]

Cheating is unacceptable.

What are Sun "3 PhD's" Dae's thoughts on the matter?

 

[Sole Hunter]

I'm finding it absolutely hilarious that there's a high ranking [according to his forum sig anyway] CMDR of a particular group that unabashedly prides itself on preying on noobs and infiltrating PVE-only PGs for the sole purpose of showing us all how big their E-peens are and ruining someones fun [of course this is what they call "emergent game play'" like were all too thick to see what it for what it really is], is in here crying about people ruining his fun. I love it, you just can't make this stuff up! Amazing how quick the tables turn when the shoe is on the other foot...

Killing other cmdrs is a legitimate gameplay mechanic and it is part of the game.

 

[JerryLove]

What if there was a group for the best-of-the-best PvPers, no noobs allowed, who all had known decent PC's, good stable connections, and promised to not log on each other

Indeed. If combat logging is hurting their enjoyment of open so much: perhaps they should leave open.

Not to mention those who quit because of the cheaters, frontier is losing potential loyal customers because those clowns think combat logging is not ''harming'' them.

Speak for yourself - they ruin other people's enjoyment, and eventually this poor reputation will catch up with FD. Word of mouth spreads.

I did speak for myself. Thank you. Used words like "I" and "me" and everything.

As for FD's reputation: That's an economic choice too.

Spend resources on your complaints about logging, or improve the core game?
Literally expel paying players, or risk maybe losing future sales to the smaller group of complainers.

yeah! let's not waste the police resources because robbers don't harm you.

Robbers by definition harm me.

Did someone rob you? What did you used to have that was taken from you by force? (actually: robbing is quite legal in ED... it's the robbers that are complaining about CLing).

It's their job to investigate, AS PER STATED in the TOS. I will gladly keep filling tickets against you if you keep combat logging until you are moved into solo where you no longer ruin others fun.

And it's their livlihood to decide the best use of their resources: Investigating report after report from people complaining how others play so they can deliberately kick-off customers; or not spend any money on that and maybe lose a couple of future sales from people who are still here 2 years in despite combat logging.

Good for you that they don't hurt your enjoyment and you should be praised for being concerned about costs to FD; although your in depth economic analysis might be just slightly coloured by your gaming ethics.
What about players who are concerned about this issue not purchasing future expansions, or paints or anything else? What about the games reputation in the future? I guess these don't matter to you because you're ok with logging.
Let's be clear - FD have said logging was against the rules and set up a procedure to investigate incidents of logging. I'm sure they factored it in to their business plan . . . except now, we have seen it might just be nothing more than a brush under the carpet. How much does pretence and lying cost a company?
Can players who exercise and expect non cheating gameplay demand a refund?

Actually no, they cannot. Read your EULA.

Your other claims are addressed above.

You just basically proved my point, you'd rather combat log and break the TOS in OPEN and ruin others fun because you don't like the idea of pvp and gankers even when that said mechanic is legitimate part of the gameplay.

I never said anything of the kind. I don't play in open.

I have a life but thanks for caring about my well being, I appreciate the gesture.

You say that: But you are clearly spending considerable effort worrying about how others play and posting on it here and complaining to the company that makes the game they play in.

 

[Stigbob]

Nonsense. You are all having a collective tantrum for being denied the opportunity to generate some salt. I think this is where some of us in the community are beginning to so the attraction in doing it. Driving away a toxic group of players would be a QOL improvement and public service IMO. SDC and the mentality it represents is a far greater detriment to the game than all CL's combined.

That was exactly what we were thinking when we flipped Wolfberg (SDC's home system) and drove them right out of the BGS with their tail between their legs. All within the rules no exploiting or cheating required.

 

[Ozram]

Point me where I was seeking salt, my post have been nothing but serious in this thread. If SDC was such a detriment you think dev would waste their time to comment in the last 140 pages and address this issue?

Clearly, they don't feel the same way as you do because if this was the case we wouldn't be here after 2 years of game development.

In your defence (and admitting my own error) you are one of the better posters from SDC. I still believe this isn't about cheating (not for you guys especially) but rather an attempt to close a method which has been used to stifle your groups griefing antics.

 

[NeilF]

Killing other cmdrs is a legitimate gameplay mechanic and it is part of the game.

And as regards the pointless seal clubbing cases in question (interdicting and destroying someone for no in game reason/benefit)? It of course sounds so very noble and defendable when you explain why? - Because they enjoy upsetting other people...

Why are you so pushing so hard to defend such a toxic activity? Of course perfectly "genuine" gameplay can suffer (eg: real piracy), but in my experience it's few and far between.



Let's have a proper crime and punishment system introduced, then revisit this topic. Please let's not waste valuable time and effort worrying about seal clubbers. There's far far more important concerns.

 

[shadragon]

But forum pvp is the best pvp! [squeeeee]

Hey Brett,

The fact you are on this late (and on your own time) speaks volumes. You seldom see that on the other game forums I frequent.

Do be aware there are a lot of us out here who support Frontier regardless of the issues. We see there is much more positive than negative. We recognize there are problems, but know they take time to sort out and you guys and gals are on the case. I'll get ticked off on occasion about something or other, but there will always be respect because you show that to us, even in the face of outright ignorance.

Have a great weekend and a peaceful holiday season. Thanks for everything.

 

[JerryLove]

Found the CG in 17 Draconis.

Game went to a black screen about 20 minutes into the killing. I was forced to eventually kill the ED task.

Most of my crashes seem to occur in big furballs. I suspect that would look like combat logging (not that anyone would notice as I don't play in open).

I'm actually annoyed as I was on a killing streak (though wow there were a lot of 'vettes)

Not sure if I can continue. Don't want to suicide my conda and I am now wanted in this system (and there's no system to change ships in for 250ly)

 

[xdeath]

I never made any mention of SDC in the last few statements I made, I was discussing combat logging as a whole nor did I made any mention that we run the community so I don't understand why you are trying to start drama or stir the pot when clearly this is irrelevant to the original post.

We are not mad nor angry we are simply disapointed in the level of unprofessionalism Fdev displayed with how they handled combat logging report tickets, we felt it was necessary to bring it up to light and address it.

A mature, decently written response. Rather unexpected.
Fair enough.


It is assumed, because you advertised yourself as SDC and others in this thread(as well as OP) have as well, that this is an SDC matter.

What I, and others, have been saying is that that the Original Post has the potential to turn the community sour. In this case, it did. Many members of the community, myself included, are angry with FDev, angry with each other, and hate the SDC ten times more than they originally did(personally, I had no feelings towards your group either way, prior to this post). Posts like the OP can have far reaching and unexpected consequences.
Canonn Discord and ED Discord servers just had a weird, and hilarious, bit of drama over nothing, but some, if not all, of Canonns and Admin and Mod teams are banned from the ED Discord. Is this incident directly tied to this post and SDC? Absolutely not, but it is tied to the overall sour mood this community has taken. Which, in turn, is a result of the original post.
I'm no more blaming SDC than FDev in this case, but maybe you should have just left you experiment buried, at least for the time being.
I don't think solving Combat logging faster was worth the *h*tstorm that is following.
note: The issue of combat logging has not been solved. All you got was a response from FDev.

This is just my personal take on events, based on my observations before, during, and after the posting of the OP.

 

[Itaki]

I will personally report you as many time as possible if you combat log on me. I really could care less about your excuses... for all i know it could be all lies.

We see how FD gets right on those CL reports.