Fix Piracy

[Soon(TM)]

From the previous solution, to request certain amount of cargo dump COMMS, to a module that keeps them from moving after PP destruction, etc...give a little update to make PvE piracy reasonable again.

NPC comms has been requested since the DDF, check the archives, FD even posted HOW NPC comms would work..... They just never bothered to include it in the release.

I think this is a massively needed game mechanic, as well as being able to barter with mission givers....

It's not an elite game without the ability to barter with mission givers.

Boggles!!!!

 

[Battleship Kickass]

Personally I've been taking out power plant and whilst they reboot I start on drives. As soon as reboot finishes I finalise destruction of drives and am then free to syphon the hold as they don't reboot repair the drives only power plant . Saves having to trail the target losing cargo. In answer to above about avoiding ship destruction I use c1 multi cannons on the modules and pulses on the shield. Using the above most of my targets are left with about 10-15% hull unless I am careless. Using a python with over 100 ton cargo space I make between 4 and 5 mill from a t7 this way.

If that is true in regards to PP/drive NPC reboot requirements then that may be a possible workaround until a piracy update is done...in some cases anyway. If they immediately boost after reboot then it may not work, but thinking about it - blowing their PP, drive, then hammering on the drive until reboot it may work as long as there isn't an immediate boost. I'll test it, thanks for the post.

It is humorous to me anyone would be arguing against this needing a change...one kid even telling me I just need to "get gud"...that's cute. The best way to do pirate missions currently is shoot an NPC once and launch limpits with your engines turned off. That is low quality AI programming.

Again, I am not saying pirating is never possible. The change mentioned in the OP and the current NPC reaction is unreasonable and needs an update in one way or another.

 

[Ouberos]

I've been away for a couple of weeks due to boredom. Reading this thread makes me want to come back.
Maybe later tonight I'll see if I've still got it, see if the Jolly Roger can still pay its way.
I logged off in Yembo I think, perhaps I'll be setting course for a near by diamond rich system and go hunting for a juicy T7.

 

[boybob227]

Spoiler

I put the B rated modules on mainly because they've got a higher integrity in spite of their weight. Since it's only got the single 2D HRP, it helps having the tougher modules when there's a tough haul. Since the asp isn't the fastest ship, this one hits hard to compensate. It's a bit modified, but mostly low grade upgrades in the weapons (just to get the special effects) and grade 3 dirty drives.

From my experience, the only systems that will give mining NPCs Low temperature diamonds, every single time, are agriculture systems with at least one faction in boom. I'm not sure why it's those systems in particular, but it's been the case every time I move to a new hunting ground. High-population, agriculture, and boom combined means low temp diamonds.

I've noticed that ships that I've interdicted have been able to jump sooner than previously. It used to be the same cool down, but lately I've noticed that the ships I pull over have been hi-waking (to another system) before my FSD cool down is over. I'm not sure if it's intended or not, but I've noticed it as well. It actually seems to cut down on the time waiting for them to jump, since it lets me start my wake scan a few seconds earlier.

Hope that helps.

You'll be happy to know that after following an ASP scout through a couple systems, I finally caught him in an anarchy system and did exactly as you said. I only got 11 diamonds before I accidentally made his reactor go critical, but hey: I just got 11 tons of diamonds. Many thanks to you and your advice; now if you'll excuse me there's this one cheeky ASPx that I've been chasing for what feels like half the galaxy as I type this.

 

[Argus Leadhead]

You'll be happy to know that after following an ASP scout through a couple systems, I finally caught him in an anarchy system and did exactly as you said. I only got 11 diamonds before I accidentally made his reactor go critical, but hey: I just got 11 tons of diamonds. Many thanks to you and your advice; now if you'll excuse me there's this one cheeky ASPx that I've been chasing for what feels like half the galaxy as I type this.

That's awesome!

Better than my first attempt that I made. I think the first time I tried it, I only snagged around 5 tons because I was going too fast and the limpets kept smashing the cargo into my ship instead of loading it into the cargo scoop.

It only gets easier the more that you do it. I've found that type 7's seem to be the easiest targets personally.

Keep it up and you'll be rich in no time.

 

[SadPandaa]

Holy crap, I didnt know NPC pirating was a thing until I read this yesterday and did some research. Refit a python last night and went through hell trying to figure out how to find these guys (was originally trying to scan them at a station) and then more hell trying to get good at interdicting. Once I figured it out though, my first successful attempt was on a T6 with 75 diamonds and I was able to take 45 before the cops showed up. This is by far the most fun I have had in this game, the tension is great when you pull the trigger and start the countdown for police intervention. My tactic was just to quickly knock out the powerplant and then it only took a few hits to knock out the drives, they didnt have time to reboot so it was just dead in the water while I sent out the limpits. Wish I had known that you can have more than one hatch breaker working at once.... probly would have gotten it all.

Anyone have any tips on interdicting? Im thinking it is a little more difficult in a python than an asp, and I couldnt find a 4A or 5A Interdictor quickly so I just went with a 4C that was available.

Anyway, anyone reading this thread that hasnt tried pirating.... Its freeking fun. And my first go at it with no experience got me 2mil from one ship. Once you find your target its only about 15 minutes of work before your cashing in at the black market. My python can hold about 120 cargo how I have it fitted so if I get a full hold its 5-6mil income from a single T7. Not bad at all[yesnod]

 

[IndigoWyrd]

I must be doing something completely wrong, or completely right...

I don't pirate - it's just not my thing. But...

I have targeted modules many times - Power Plants, Shield Generators, FDS's, Thrusters - and the results are always the same - Module at 80%, Hull at 0%, ship goes boom.

Which is fine, really - I either hunt bounties, assassinations, or CZ operations, and I need dead ships, not crippled ones.
But these activities do help me refine myself should I ever want to engage in piracy. So I just have to ask - how are you folk able to shoot out just a module without breaking the ship around it?

As for weapons - I've used cannons, lasers, missiles, multi-cannons, even Rail Guns, and the results still remain the same - Barely any damage to the module, ship blown apart.
And, yes, I do realize modules have certain positions, and I've tried coming at ships from directions that put the least amount of ship between me and the module.
Perhaps I'll have to record some video. Perhaps my guns are simply too strong - I dunno.

I'd love to be able to quick-disable ships - even as a bounty-hunter/mercenary soldier if I could cripple a ship or two while focusing on a target, then come back around to finish off hapless pilots struggling to reboot/repair their ships and put them out of their misery, my life would be so much easier - and less expensive.

 

[Argus Leadhead]

I must be doing something completely wrong, or completely right...

I don't pirate - it's just not my thing. But...

I have targeted modules many times - Power Plants, Shield Generators, FDS's, Thrusters - and the results are always the same - Module at 80%, Hull at 0%, ship goes boom.

Which is fine, really - I either hunt bounties, assassinations, or CZ operations, and I need dead ships, not crippled ones.
But these activities do help me refine myself should I ever want to engage in piracy. So I just have to ask - how are you folk able to shoot out just a module without breaking the ship around it?

As for weapons - I've used cannons, lasers, missiles, multi-cannons, even Rail Guns, and the results still remain the same - Barely any damage to the module, ship blown apart.
And, yes, I do realize modules have certain positions, and I've tried coming at ships from directions that put the least amount of ship between me and the module.
Perhaps I'll have to record some video. Perhaps my guns are simply too strong - I dunno.

I'd love to be able to quick-disable ships - even as a bounty-hunter/mercenary soldier if I could cripple a ship or two while focusing on a target, then come back around to finish off hapless pilots struggling to reboot/repair their ships and put them out of their misery, my life would be so much easier - and less expensive.

I think it's all about positioning. When I'm disabling a ship, I get really close to it (almost touching distance with gimbals) and just shoot. It also has a lot to do with whist angle you're shooting the module from as well as the penetration of whichever weapon you're using. If you're going for the power plant, you want to be shooting the top or bottom of your targets ship for best results. I've personally had the best luck using high yield cannons, but I've also been successful using pulse lasers and rail guns, even though you need lots of practice to hit the small target box with rails.

I'd say, just keep practicing and you'll find out what works. Even now, I still mess up every now and then and kill a ship instead of disabling it. If I pull it off right, my 4 small cannons will take a power plant down by around 40%+- with each volley but accidents do still happen.

 

[shadragon]

Full marks to Argus for clear and detailed responses.

Repped.

 

[xondk]

This is about PvE piracy obviously, PvP piracy has long been scrapped as an idea of any FD support.

Last time I logged in a change was finally added that when following a specific number of steps you could disable a ship completely and siphon all of their cargo (in a still annoying/unpolished way), even avoiding the fuzz if done properly. It had a certain amount of challenge involved and made contract piracy missions doable and fun.

Now NPC's are rebooting after a few seconds of module destruction and immediately boosting away...forget giving up the cargo, just kill me instead...top notch AI programming there.

I've seen players are now shooting NPC shields once so they attack then cutting their engines, launching their limpits and collectors, and just shield tanking while the NPC circles and attacks and slowly drains cargo. This is backwards progress for one of the career paths in the game.

From the previous solution, to request certain amount of cargo dump COMMS, to a module that keeps them from moving after PP destruction, etc...give a little update to make PvE piracy reasonable again.

I understand your frustration, but should npc's just sit around helpless? part of the update in 2.2.03 buffs trade ships, so you can actually disable them and keep disabling them without having to worry too much about destroying them, shouldn't you work for your cargo?

 

[SadPandaa]

I rarely get the powerplants down on combat ships, except clippers for some reason. As for weapons, I think cannons are by far the best thing for taking out modules. They will make it through most of the ship and still hit the module if you cant get a good angle. Cargo ships though seem very simple to disable in comparison, like 4 shots from a small cannon will take out the power plant. In CZ I may target the power plant but I mainly just zerg them with everything I've got so usually the hull goes boom first.

 

[[VR] Enexemander]

I rarely get the powerplants down on combat ships, except clippers for some reason. As for weapons, I think cannons are by far the best thing for taking out modules. They will make it through most of the ship and still hit the module if you cant get a good angle. Cargo ships though seem very simple to disable in comparison, like 4 shots from a small cannon will take out the power plant. In CZ I may target the power plant but I mainly just zerg them with everything I've got so usually the hull goes boom first.

Downing modules before hulls is a hit box issue most of the time. Power plant hitboxes are easiest to hit from either the top or bottom of the ship (depends on which one it is). Combat ships are more agile and will be turning to hit you back, so their power plant hitbox isn't going to be as exposed as say, a Type 7.

It's also about weapon type. Some are made for module sniping (Cannons, Railguns); others aren't. But yeah, if you're trying to knock out the PP on a hauler or something, it might just go ka-blooey before you get any work done on the module. They're pretty fragile.

I'm a super novice pirate. I'm looking to try it again sometime soon. I just wanted to say thanks to everyone who contributed tips and such in this thread. I appreciate it!

 

[Mengy]

Sure, I'll help you out.
This is the ship I fly exclusively for piracy: https://coriolis.io/outfit/asp/2pft...06r27.Iw18WQ==.IwBjo4uiwJmiIA==?bn=pirate asp


First of, if done right, piracy is one of the *most* profitable professions in the game. With my asp, I can rake in around 8 million an hour.

here's some simple steps to follow:

-Find a high-population Agriculture system with a "boom" state (this is very important)
-Fly around in super cruise looking for targets
-If a ship has both a refinery and mining lasers equipped, pull it over. They are basically guaranteed to have low temperature diamonds (sells for 45K-53K per ton on black market)
-DON'T SHOOT IT!!!
-Wait until the ship hi-wakes out, use your wake scanner and follow it.
-With any luck, they've gone to an anarchy/lawless system. If not, keep interdicting them and following through hyperspace until they're in lawless space. Even Low security is doable, as you've got around 4-5 minutes until the police show up.

Now the fun part:
-Strip the targets shields and lock on to their powerplant.
-Using the cannons, keep shooting it from above or below until it's at 0%. De-target the powerplant and damage their hull until it's low. Re-target the powerplant now.
-You can start launching hatch breakers at this point.
-Position yourself so you've got a clean shot at their powerplant for when they inevitably reboot it. They'll get a little distance, but as long as you're paying attention, you'll be able to bring it back to 0% before they move at all.

From this point, it's just a matter of keeping their P.P. at 0% and running your hatch breakers (2 at a time) and collectors (4 on passive at once) until your hold is full. Shouldn't take more than a few minutes. Once you've got what you want, either kill them or leave.

This method works for piracy missions as well, although sometimes they won't high wake and you'll have to work fast depending on the security level of the system that you're currently in.

As I stated, some ships pose more of a hassle than others. I've successfully pirated high ranking pythons in my asp, but since they're both tough and skilled, it's not worth it in my book as I'm usually limping back in a severely damaged ship despite getting the good. choose your fights or wing up for the harder targets.


I think that's about all I can say about it.

Add me in game if you want more pointers, my name's the same as on here.

This is an excellent post, thank you Argus!

I've not done any PvE piracy in over a year and a half but this thread has me thinking about trying it out again. I am curious though, why pick Agriculture systems in Boom state for pirating targets? Are they much more likely to have mining ships carrying LTD's for some odd reason?

 

[Jezzah]

Don't understand this change. I havent played the game since may this year. But if the PP is down ... it should remain down. Reboot anything else I guess but if your out of power and it's a melted heap then that's that your dead in the water.

I gave up on honest pvp piracy a long time ago so used to do a bit of PvE piracy. Not sure why FD want to make this harder for pirates. Not crying about it I'm sure I'll adjust when I do go back playing but there's never any love for piracy in these updates.

- - - Updated - - -

This is an excellent post, thank you Argus!

I've not done any PvE piracy in over a year and a half but this thread has me thinking about trying it out again. I am curious though, why pick Agriculture systems in Boom state for pirating targets? Are they much more likely to have mining ships carrying LTD's for some odd reason?

Rich .... boom....Lots of money to spend on LTDs

Agri generally has High population...more ships are spawned...better chance of getting a LTD ship.

 

[Dbrn47]

Again, you don't even need to fire a shot anymore. Hatch breakers go through shields now. Many times they don't even shoot at you because they aren't taking damage.

 

[IndigoWyrd]

I think it's all about positioning. When I'm disabling a ship, I get really close to it (almost touching distance with gimbals) and just shoot. It also has a lot to do with whist angle you're shooting the module from as well as the penetration of whichever weapon you're using. If you're going for the power plant, you want to be shooting the top or bottom of your targets ship for best results. I've personally had the best luck using high yield cannons, but I've also been successful using pulse lasers and rail guns, even though you need lots of practice to hit the small target box with rails.

I'd say, just keep practicing and you'll find out what works. Even now, I still mess up every now and then and kill a ship instead of disabling it. If I pull it off right, my 4 small cannons will take a power plant down by around 40%+- with each volley but accidents do still happen.

That might be part of the problem - I don't generally use small cannons - small weapons I typically use lasers to strip shields and get to the chewy parts on the inside. I use medium, large and huge weapons to chew up hulls and let the creamy insides out into space.

 

[SadPandaa]

I think what he is referring to is that he uses small cannons because you can get the power plant without doing too much damage to the hull, because pirates dont want their target to pop. Bigger cannons take the PP down much much faster, and do much more damage to the hull as well. In normal combat I generally set small hardpoints to lasers just as you do, except now that I am pirating I flip it and put lasers in all my large spots to drop shields as fast as possible and then in small hardpoints I use sniping weapons to take out modules without blowing them up. Really it is just the angle you are hitting them at to get good damage on the PP, and if your using gimbal you need to be fairly close to get an accurate enough shot to hit the module. With cannons there is not realy any splash damage, so if you miss the PP with the jitter of a gimbal then 100% of the damage hits the hull.

 

[GluttonyFang]

PvP piracy has long been scrapped as an idea of any FD support.

I chuckled with tears in my eyes <3

 

[Marra Morgan]

@Argus Leadhead - thanks very much for your advice in this thread!

My results have improved hugely! [up]

 

[Argus Leadhead]

This is an excellent post, thank you Argus!

I've not done any PvE piracy in over a year and a half but this thread has me thinking about trying it out again. I am curious though, why pick Agriculture systems in Boom state for pirating targets? Are they much more likely to have mining ships carrying LTD's for some odd reason?

I'm not 100% sure why it's agricultural systems that always spawn LTD's to be honest. The boom and population parts make sense, but all I can really come up with is that agri systems seem to have a higher demand for ice ring based commodities.

Then again, your guess may be as good as mine. From experience though, any mining ship in a system fitting the conditions of my original guide post will have low temp diamonds without fail.