General / Off-Topic German vice-chancellor Sigmar Gabriel says break-up of EU no longer 'unthinkable'

[Boomer Kay]

British landowners of Russian origine ?

My parents bought their house in Spain from Russian pre-owners (and it was a steal .. I'd love to see Trump vs. my Mother "dealmaking" .. my money's on her - she met Bill Clinton before, so dealing with US presidents is nothing new for her, dealing with my mom on the other hand .. ). Since we decided not to conquer the world, we got pretty decent at buying it. ;P


That's interesting, if it's true:

Currently, most English wines have a £7 – £12 pricetag, with sparkling wines likely to cost up to as much as £45. However, there are still several small vineyards around the country that continue to produce on a small scale, sourcing local markets and farm shops, where you can expect to pay as little as £6 for a bottle.

Artisan, locally sourced. Heard that before from me in regards to "work"? Moving away from industrial and production jobs, which can and will be automated and take up a "profession", not just "a job".
Those guys don't make wine to get rich, they make it out of dedication to the cause. Has the potential to become a really top notch product like that. Requires freedom of movement however. You don't learn making wine or olive oil or good cheese or playing the violin or dancing ballet in all parts of the world equally well.

 

[Adept]

There's supposed to be some decent wine production in Nappa Valley. It's decent for defrosting your car windows. [uhh] [big grin]

Sounds potent

 

[Miklos Atreides]

Turning back the wheel is not way into the future. So going back kicking the EU into a loose Trade partnership of 28 countries is not an answer at all.
I know there are too many believers that in good old times everything was better.

Germany was under heavy cirtics for their refugees handling in the past and started the upcoming egoistic nationalistic hype across Europe.
Not only Sigmar Gabriel is facing it even if his conclusion cannot get followed by me and clearly he will be no valuable competitor in upcoming german elections.

What's missing is the vision what Europe can be in 20 to 25 years more than a global trading club where profits are pesonalized and losses are socialized.
My vision is to get the EU in charge and control for and by European citizens. Today EU Commision and council are not under the influence of citizens they are
only related to politician parties and local interests of 28 countries. So only the low level comprise can be reached.

The other thing that is to go away is the fact that many decisions can only be made by commitment of all 28 members. This 100% solution is was good in the
beginning but it needs to turn around to a democratic approach.

The EU is clearly more future than 28 isolated countries and the british will see the downturns pretty soon after seperation has been kicked off, but it needs to evolve
and this is hindered by 28 Nations to play their game for their short minded profits.

Regards,
Miklos

 

[Boomer Kay]

What's missing is the vision what Europe can be in 20 to 25 years more than a global trading club where profits are pesonalized and losses are socialized.
My vision is to get the EU in charge and control for and by European citizens. Today EU Commision and council are not under the influence of citizens they are
only related to politician parties and local interests of 28 countries. So only the low level comprise can be reached.

I agree with the statement, but not with the conclusion.
Many people think of their "nation" as some unseparable object with a higher common value that needs to be lived in every single household.
You don't find the "cultural unity" in a country. You find it in much smaller scopes. Cities, Villages, Regions that have things in common.
The overarching structure does -not- have to define every little aspect of those regions. They're fine. Leave them alone.
Like a "country" identity, the EU should not strive for foul compromise in all areas, but
a) consent on what's important pain points for all members (read: consent, not "compromise" .. consent is actually achieved, if all 28 or how many do agree)
b) work harder on improving those
c) provide checks and balances against local power structures. Just because you know your Mayor for 35 years does not mean he doesn't embezzle some of that tax money. Power corrupts - even Hobbits.

 

[Miklos Atreides]

I agree with the statement, but not with the conclusion.
Many people think of their "nation" as some unseparable object with a higher common value that needs to be lived in every single household.
You don't find the "cultural unity" in a country. You find it in much smaller scopes. Cities, Villages, Regions that have things in common.
The overarching structure does -not- have to define every little aspect of those regions. They're fine. Leave them alone.
Like a "country" identity, the EU should not strive for foul compromise in all areas, but
a) consent on what's important pain points for all members (read: consent, not "compromise" .. consent is actually achieved, if all 28 or how many do agree)
b) work harder on improving those
c) provide checks and balances against local power structures. Just because you know your Mayor for 35 years does not mean he doesn't embezzle some of that tax money. Power corrupts - even Hobbits.

I get your point, but I never said anything about micromanagement of the central government. In a unified EU you can't get rid of locality, but we need control over our European representants.
Central things are to be managed central like defense, foreign affairs, finance... Not definition of the ark a cuke or banana may have. This would be a process not coming true in 3 weeks its a thing of decade(s).
There is a big need to mitigate the differences in the region of economical strength. Something Germans do not like to hear, because it will cost their money. But to form a sustainable union we (all europeans) will
have to overcome the one or the other obstacle.

Regards,
Miklos

 

[Yaffle]

Sometimes it's funny how people don't notice how used they're to the EU. Wait til the UK discovers they have no wine on their own. And the bottle of cheap wine is already 10 bucks over there and they could have the good stuff for that price at pretty much any supermarket on the continent.

We do have wine. There's crappy British wine made from imported grape juice, and there's really, really good English wine. We even win awards - http://www.independent.co.uk/extras...apel-down-camel-valley-nyetimber-9100166.html and can out sparkling wine the Champagne region.

 

[Gortron]

We do have wine. There's crappy British wine made from imported grape juice, and there's really, really good English wine. We even win awards - http://www.independent.co.uk/extras...apel-down-camel-valley-nyetimber-9100166.html and can out sparkling wine the Champagne region.

I really need to try some English wine, it but mostly seems to be white and a tend to prefer red. I normally buy Australian and the odd Spanish one.

 

[Ian Skippy]

"Because Germany is the biggest beneficiary of the European community – economically and politically." Very nice for Germany, but not sustainable if the rest of Europe is circling the plughole, economically speaking.

Maybe because Germany has got their crap together, whereas other countries dont. If France wants to 'soften their plight', how about they stop mucking about. The economy of France has been smoldering for a long time, and its not Germany's fault, its their own. Same goes for Italy, Greece, and to a lesser extent Portugal and Spain (the latter two have some valid excuses). But no, blame Germany, 'the elite', 'brussels' and other vague terms that only signal a lacking ability to take responsibility for their own failure. For shame.

- - - Updated - - -

We do have wine. There's crappy British wine made from imported grape juice, and there's really, really good English wine. We even win awards - http://www.independent.co.uk/extras...apel-down-camel-valley-nyetimber-9100166.html and can out sparkling wine the Champagne region.

Then again, I think there are probably loads of swamps and deserts that produce better sparkling wine than the Champagne region. You wouldnt believe how much garbage comes from there: since the global demand is so high and the region is so small grapes are being grown where otherwise no sane person would bother, just to put Champage on the label.

 

[Boomer Kay]

Then again, I think there are probably loads of swamps and deserts that produce better sparkling wine than the Champagne region. You wouldnt believe how much garbage comes from there: since the global demand is so high and the region is so small grapes are being grown where otherwise no sane person would bother, just to put Champage on the label.

Don't tell them the secret of Europe.. most countries don't export their best stuff, or it has a shelf life far too short for global trading.
Spanish oranges in Spain blow away anything you'll get here at the most expensive organic store. And are cheap.
Oysters fresh from the Atlantic coast in France, fried little fish in a tavern in the industrial area in Athens, lamb chops in Bulgaria, every village with its own brewery in Bavaria, nice blood pudding for breakfast in Manchester and the best curry ever in London.

Freedom of movement is the biggest thing about the EU. Just have to overcome that angst and illusion that potatoes are the best thing ever.

(Eh, forgot NL. Just smuggling some Vla and weed back to ze homeland at 120km/h :/ )