Alien archeology and other mysteries: Thread 9 - The Canonn

[Jmanis]

Okay, so for those who choose to, or can only play solo for whatever reason, having all the items (Casket, Urn, Relic, Tablet, Totem and Urn) in your ship's cargo hold, parked very close while scanning, does not result in any successful scans. I'd be genuinely interested to hear from MB as to whether this mission is fully achievable in solo, without having to resort to open or PG.

Pretty much this. Between that and the endless stream of adjudication errors, I don't even know if I can use any strategies to make any other obelisks light up before these error happens.

I'm starting to get to the end of logical paths to progress this via solo... I see while I was trying to see if I could activate a ruin with the cargo dumped outside the SRV, some people here have already tried it, with the same results as me (i.e nothing).

I've done the brute-forcing to get the 13, I've tried various homogenous and non-homogenous scanning combinations, varieties of 2 x cargo and 1 x cargo, scanning banks, scanning one from each bank, raising all towers, raising some towers, deactivating all towers, clearing only all surrounding pillars, clearing selective pillars to try and make patterns, alternating cargoes...

Quite literally it's getting to the stage where the only thing left for me to do is scan random obelisks with random items at random times, hope I don't get an adjudication error, and hope I just happen to stumble upon the right iteration of items/scans which literally numbers in the thousands when you consider factors like ordering of obelisks and the like.

 

[hayler]

Hi,

Map might need redrawn, I found a double activation at C16 where both sides were lit

 

[Jorki Rasalas]

If we look at all the hints we have, there could be quite a few.

- Guardians. They are presumably dead. Most likely killed by their own AI. Their bio weapons did not work on them. Unlike the Thargoids, their technology must have been inorganic.
- Thargoids. All versions of the previous lore have indicated two separate groups/species. It's not unlikely that this has carried over to ED. The Alien ships in the Pleiades could well be 'Other Thargoids'.
- AI. We know some human made AI have escaped and that the Guardians made advanced AI. Some may still be out there.
- Jasmina Halsey's 'real caretakers of our galaxy'/"the true architects of creation"/"the infinities of the cosmos". Not much on these guys, but they seem to be a few steps ahead of us on the evolution ladder.
- The lizard people from Andromeda. These are the fantasy monsters of Ricardo Bentonio. He has probably got it mixed up in some way, but there is always something in it when FD drops a hint like that.

In addition we have the lost humans. The beacons from the Dynasty expedition suggests that there might be at least one large unknown human faction out there.

Some of these may overlap and actually be the same thing or a result of each other. For example Ricardo Bentonio claims: 'The lizard people from Andromeda, that’s the Imperial Dynasty'.

The relic found on Mars also tells us that the Sol system has been known to sentient aliens prior to the human technological period. It could well be a Guardian relic of some kind. They seem to show up in far away places.

Finally. The axial tilt and the extremely close orbiting moon of the ruin planet suggests that it has been involved in a violent event. The moon also has a huge dent. The planet and the moon may have had a hard collision in the distant past. They could even originate from a different system. The same thing can be said for Merope 5C, that does not seem to belong where it is either.

I recall Jasmina describing the true architects as tiny, sommaybe they are the fireflies we see in the UAs?
I posted a while ago but nobody responded- what if Merope 5C is artificial? (perhaps an ark ship now covered in stellar dust) that might explain its importance in the UP transmissions & perhaps why the UAs point to Merope. With its proximity, strange look & orbit perhaps the moon of the Synuefe ruins is also an ark ship?

 

[BigBANGtheory [VR]]

Quite literally it's getting to the stage where the only thing left for me to do is scan random obelisks with random items at random times, hope I don't get an adjudication error, and hope I just happen to stumble upon the right iteration of items/scans which literally numbers in the thousands when you consider factors like ordering of obelisks and the like.

Have you tried to repeat your steps at different times i.e. the position/facing of the ruins in space is changing all the time thus time could be a variable?

 

[programad]

I'd be genuinely interested to hear from MB as to whether this mission is fully achievable in solo, without having to resort to open or PG.

I'm afraid of that answer. If he says we must complete in OPEN, we are screwed because of that kids killing everyone there for no reason.

 

[frostypaw]

If QA consider that fully working as intended it's time for new QA.

 

[Jorki Rasalas]

Someone in the spreadnaught mentioned classified Cam showing triangles rotating underneath the Beacons, maybe that is something to look at?

I suggested that back in October but it was shrugged off as a mechanism behind the rotation/elevation of the pillars. But it does look strangely specific to me

 

[Soon(TM)]

Well, you don't have too many options, currently. You scan all 15 obelisks... they become inactive... then what?

- Wait until they reset (FD have confirmed they do reset, but it takes hours/days?, no one's had the patience).
- Manually reset them (no one's found a way of doing this)
- Sit and try to stare the data out of the obelisks...
- Get in your ship, FSD away, come back. Start again.
- Re-log.

It's the only practical option at the moment, until we find a better one.

So have FDev said it's ok to cheat and do it this way?

 

[chuci]

On the so called Data Bleed:
...
What do you think? Is someone out there eperiencing the same behaviour? Could this be "as intended" or some kind of bug?

I was seeing very similar behaviour last night in open. I was hovering around above the site as various CMDRs were going about doing their thing. I wasn't in a wing, don't know if all of them were winged or not and I had nothing relevant in my hold. I was seeing all of their failures (no successes either) and at least one CMDR said that he wasn't receiving the failures.

 

[John Stoutbeard]

I suggested that back in October but it was shrugged off as a mechanism behind the rotation/elevation of the pillars. But it does look strangely specific to me

It's hard to tell. But if someone spots a pattern, that it is by design then we will have progress. But it's hard to determine otherwise.

 

[DaggerSnake]

There are so many posts in here it's hard to keep track of who's tried what.

This is where I am

Obelisks will give one or two pattern data returns on scan with something in hold.

The relics are matched to the scan patterns. Need a pattern vs relic truth table. (and is it persistent and universal across instances?)

procedure : Scan obelisk A, get pattern X (or XY). Rest without Log out. Pick up item(s) matching pattern X (or XY) then scan again for decode.

The problem is you don't know the pattern until scanning and every instance will be different. SO right now it's pure luck.

The Obelisks patterns randomize when logging in and out. We need a reset that is not based on that

 

[John Stoutbeard]

So have FDev said it's ok to cheat and do it this way?

What cheat?
Relogging isn't a cheat it's required to make the game behave normally due to issues.

 

[Th3 0utKa5t]

I also tried with my ship right alongside and all items in hold - parked just far enough away to allow turret to deploy - no change - think it's too far.

thanks for testing this both of you, another thing to cross of the list, i still have a few things in mind but they are so outrageous i'll try them myself and let you know if it works.

 

[Jorki Rasalas]

I'm not sure it's any help, but a couple of the entries stand out as maybe being hints...

- "The glyphs seem to be able to be combine to describe complex concepts, but also communicate additional layers of meaning through the inclusion of movement. Each glyph is a symbol. They are more abstract than pictoral hieroglyphics, but it's possible to identify a simplistic reference to the shape of the thing being described - for example, the glyph for 'moon' incorporates the waxing and waning as it would have appeared from the Guardians' homeworld."

- "These glyphs actually evolved from a form of sign language that the Guardians developed when hunting".

Those may just be backstory, but the first one does seem to have an oddly specific piece of information about a symbol.

It does. Unfortunately we don't know how it would have looked form their home world, but assuming that it would be similar to Earth then we have a left- & right-facing crescent. This might relate to part of the smaller circle on the ruins, or it might be the two glyphs on the UP sonogram (though that already has a satisfactory explanation)

 

[danteuk]

On the so called Data Bleed:... What do you think? Is someone out there eperiencing the same behaviour? Could this be "as intended" or some kind of bug?

Being in a wing is not required.
I got 12 of the normal 13 by myself in my own PG then switched to 'mobious PVE' PG and just sat in my ship, parked ( with most of the relics in my hold ) for 20-30 mins - I got 3 more successful data scans and a few bad combination message.

The whole ruins site is a mess of bugs I believe or it's just such a complicated 'puzzle' that none of hundreds of cmdrs have managed to figure it out.
Bugs and/or bad/confusing design choices:
1) delayed / out of sequence inbox messages
2) obelisks in Solo don't reset ( at least not within a hour or so ) forcing cmdrs to have to either painfully leave the site and return ( painful due to no planet location bookmark feature ) or simply do a session reset ( disconnect and reconnect, much easier and quicker than leaving site and returning! )
3) cmdrs get result of scans from every other cmdrs at the site ( open and pg ) so if no relics in your ship hold you'll be spammed by ramtams wrong combination message, if you have all the artifacts in your hold you'll start getting position scan results ( even if the cmdr doing the scan had the wrong combo ) - so you can get free money with no effort!!
4) random disconnects and CTD ( personally I've been lucky and not had any of those, yet, but it seems plenty of other are less fortunate )
5) towers raise out of the ground, sometimes fully, sometimes only partially, sometimes the relic doesn't raise ( maybe intentional if in a open or PG ? certainly strange one cmdr can see the relic stuck underground and another in the same instance sees the relic on the tower - must be a bug ).
6) in pg or open, random obelisks can become active and can also become inactive again, even while you are trying to scan it!
7) doesn't seem possible to get more than 13 data scans in solo.

I suspect there are more issues but I can't remember them right now.

FDev responses:
1) we are aware of this happening and it is under investigation
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...ns-Mission-Late-or-invisible-message-delivery
2) The Obelisks should return to an active state after a certain about of time(but I'm unable to release that information.). This should be working as intended
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...ks-never-reset-in-solo-alone-in-private-group
3) we are aware of this happening and it is under in investigation. Thank you for reporting.
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/321437-ancient-data
4) we are aware of this happening and it is under investigation
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/321319-Crash-when-scanning-particular-obelisk-group
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/321273-Disconnect-at-Ancient-Ruins-Adjudication-Server
5) - couldn't find a bug log for this -
6) - couldn't find a bug log for this -
7) - FDev have not even confirmed or denied this! -

 

[Patau82]

Galactic News: Superpowers Respond to Strange Sightings

Following reports of mysterious spacecraft in human-inhabited space, the leaders of the galaxy's three superpowers have released official statements.

Emperor Arissa Lavigny-Duval, currently undertaking a tour of Imperial systems, exhibited reservation:

"To surmise that these encounters constitute proof of the existence of non-human intelligence would be rash in the extreme. We cannot rule out the possibility that these ships could be experimental human spacecraft, or even the product of an intricate hoax. I urge all Imperial citizens to remain calm, and not to leap to conclusions."

Federal President Zachary Hudson, meanwhile, struck a characteristically strident tone:

"I have reviewed the footage submitted by the galactic community. Granted, the evidence is not conclusive. But tell me this: Would you rather prepare for an attack that may not come, or be met by an attack you did not prepare for? We know nothing about the true nature or purpose of these vessels. It would be in our best interest to prepare for any eventuality."

By contrast, Alliance Prime Minister Edmund Mahon was diplomatic:

"Like the Emperor, I believe it would be premature to conclude that these are non-human spacecraft. But it is clear to me that these encounters warrant further investigation. We must gather further evidence, and keep an open mind. Knowledge, not ignorance. Proof, not speculation. That is the way forward."

https://community.elitedangerous.com/galnet/uid/5878a8919657ba11170de181

 

[Soon(TM)]

What cheat?
Relogging isn't a cheat it's required to make the game behave normally due to issues.

Ah ok, so FDev made this puzzle and intentionally put reset timers on them, but then said, "it's ok, because the players can just log out and back in again to continue doing the puzzle, we made it this way, because relogging is part of the game now, we know we have server issues and the puzzle won't work properly, so just relog"

I get it now, awesome.

/Sarcasm mode

 

[Jorki Rasalas]

Morning All (UK time)

I just can't keep up with the speed of this thread. I hate to do this, but I can't hold off from posting until I've caught up on the last 400 posts because if I did I would not get to post this... (I'm also the far side of Sag A* in game, so won't make it back to contribute to ruin efforts in game, but do have some observations and ideas for you all...)


#1. The damn ruin site layout has changed. WHY? I really hate to see this kind of discontinuity in the game FD, so I hope there is a damn good reason.

- perhaps the reason is that there was a mistake in the layout?
- perhaps there were bugs or something that FD couldn't trace, but perhaps there's another reason.

-- MENGY. Perhaps your methods were along the right lines, and perhaps this new layout has corrected the anomaly so that with the new layout, it is now pointing at something relevant???

-- (Please FD - if this is barking up the wrong tree, tell MENGY at least so that he doesn't waste any more valuable leisure-time man-hours than he already did. And if that is not an option, please tell us that you won't contact anyone, regardless of whether we are barking up the wrong tree or not. That said, contacting MENGY if it is a false avenue is pretty much the least you could do.)


#2A. Regarding the delayed messages and scan results at the site. Very disappointing FD. Can you do something to sort it out???
#2B. Regarding the mission reward of 100 MCr. Oh no, make that 101MCr. FD - can someone not add up or something? 21 + 21 + 20 + 20 + 19 = 101. This only serves to add to our frustration.


#3. Regarding the beacons/relics... There may well be a sequence of raising them in order to access the different sets of data. Could people be a bit more clear on the SCIENCE they are pursuing, please? Have the data sets at this site been with the beacons all undisturbed? All raised? Or an unknown combination of up and down?? This could be important, but we won't know it's important unless someone tests and reports...


That is all for now.

Yours Aye

Mark H

I wasn't convinced by Cdr Mengy's original map theory, seemed too suggestive of pareidolia; however I think there are sufficient indications in the messages decoded so far that it is highly likely there is simething about this ruins site that indicates where the other ruins are located. It might be the overall shape, it might be the glyphs on the base of the 3 sides of the beacons.

It might be worth a retry at Cdr Mengy's concept, or a completely fresh approach.

 

[Gypsy12]

Well...

With all my talk of Native American Indians last night...

Im gonna throw you a curveball...And I reckon the sneaky ol' Drew has been doing it too!!!

Here we go: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Star_Kachina

KAcHINA eh?

Other interesting titbits:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corona_Borealis
http://www.legendsofamerica.com/na-astronomyculture.html

 

[evaldo10]

I'm pretty certain you can't do this in solo. I should imagine you can do it in PG with a few players.

Open seems a bit chaotic with the instance mechanism.

I think the way forward is in PG.