Alien archeology and other mysteries: Thread 9 - The Canonn

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I am not aware of whether we have pursued the discovery of CMDR falcon413 (different obelisk SETs):

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...9-The-Canonn?p=5004532&viewfull=1#post5004532

He discovered 5 "SETs" of obelisks. See map HERE

From my discovers today, i took items for the "correct" zones (discovered by CMDR Zenith Ddraiglas) in my SRV.
I was in GROUP-Mode scanning the clusters with the supposed "correct" items. Get only pattern data after scanning but with some delay i got only errormessages from Ram Tah.
In Cluster G i scanned G29, 32, 12 and 11. These are NOT obelisks of the, we called here, "default" SET (SET I)!
Also i scanned some Obelisks in Cluster C, but not that one whe called "default".
I believe the items you have to use to "unlock" the zones changes depending on the active SET of obelisks.

The zones depending on the discovers by CMDR Zenith i used also in my Map by Rabbit-HH.
I think this zones are only valid for Obelisk-SET I, we called them the "default" obelisks.

So we have to figure out whitch items has to use in which zone (cluster) for the obelisks out of the other sets, CMDR falcon413 uses Set I to Set V (roman numerals).
This is also the fact why we get positive scans with supposed uncorrect items in hold, i think!

e.g. for the "default" Obelisk (Set I) in Cluster G we need casket in hold.
But what did we need for a glowing obelisk out of Set II, Set III ... or Set V?
We have 5 items and the relic. Since now we have no "zone" for the totem. With the "theorie" of 5 differnet obelisk SETs, we would have a zone for the totem!

What i can't recognize on the map of CMDR falcon413 is, which side of the obelisk is glowing. For the "default" SET (SET I) this is known. For the other sets i/we have to figure it out.

As we see in the map of CMDR falcon413 in some SETs there is the same obelisk. But what about the glowing side? Is there the same side glowing in a different SET? Or would glow another side of the obelisk in a different SET?

Some ideas: Each obelisk has three sides. Obelisks that stand alone it would be possible that each side (three) would become glowing. At the obelisks that stands side by side i think only the two "outside" sides would be able to glow?

I've begun to change my drawings. First of all the overview, i extended the "Zone"-Text (lower left corner):


And the detailed clustermap (now it's draft because of the unknown glowing side in the SETs):


One question is coming up because of the same obelisks in differnet SETs. If we've figured out which item has to use in which SET, how do we know, if e.g obelisk A2 is glowing, which is the correct item?
And here i think there would be glow another side of the obelisk. But thats now a theorie, we have to proof ;-)

Also the Post of CMDR allocater supports the theory of changing activation-items for the zones with changing obelisk-SETS:
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...9-The-Canonn?p=5014178&viewfull=1#post5014178



What do you think about that?

Greetings CMDR Rabbid-HH.

I honestly didn't think my post would get much attention given how fast this whole thread is moving. I also haven't written any more updates here, but have kept on going with some independent research into the ruins. I've attempted to keep track of the active obelisks in the site and continue grouping them into sets. Since the post that you linked I have mapped one more set from Open play, totaling six sets now (I-VI), and I've attempted to map additional sets from Private Group with some degree of success.

Since I made the post I've been thinking that the active obelisk sets work as a function of how many people are in the instance. If correct, this means a problem in Open play. We really don't have any control over who joins an instance and who leaves, so it is possible that the Sets change while one is in the ruins scanning. Added to this are the server disconnects (adjudication errors, client crashes) which I'll get into in a little bit.

In light of these things, I was able to get into a Private Group with three other CMDRs (thanks to CMDR ObiJ3ff, CMDR ArcherAC3, and CMDR El Master PR) and have a bit more of a controlled environment to do research in, which included how we joined the group. The PG started out with just CMDR ObiJ3ff and CMDR ArcherAC3 in it, and as far as they could tell only Set I (default set) was active while they were there. They did not carry out any scans for the time being. A little after that I joined the server with them and we surveyed the site, and sure enough some different obelisks had activated with my arrival. All three of us could see the same "special" obelisks. I emphasize on that because it is important, and it somewhat differs from what other people have seen in Open play, but I might have an (incomplete) explanation for that. Once we finished surveying and mapping that new "special" group, we had CMDR El Master PR join us in the group, and surveyed once again the site. This is where things get both interesting and frustrating at the same time... When he joined us we observed the active obelisks change once more, so sure enough it appears that the sets change as people join up on the instance. I attempted to map this set, but unfortunately was interrupted by the end of Zone E due to a server disconnect (I missed just two obelisks from that new set). Now, when we had all rejoined in the group we started seeing some funky behavior that I honestly don't believe is intended. I had been disconnected due to an adjudication error, but when I rejoined I began seeing a different set of lit obelisks than the other CMDRs in the instance. In other words, we stopped seeing the same special obelisks. I would, for example, see obelisk A4 while the other commanders would see A2. It was weird. But even weirder than that was that in some Zones I would see more lit obelisks than there should be. Up to now all my observations point towards a fixed number of lit obelisks per Zone:

Zone A = 1
Zone B = 1
Zone C = 4
Zone D = 1
Zone E* = 3 (E=1; H=2 for those following the sub-divided map)
Zone F = 1
Zone G = 4

But when I got back into the private group I observed eight lit obelisks in Zone C. A very strange occurrence, but I believe it is a byproduct of the server disconnect error. You can see an image of Zone C here:

image

I say I think it's only a byproduct of the server error because it was the only time I saw more Obelisks in a specific area. I got disconnected a couple more times after that (as well as other CMDRs) and the number per zone kinda "normalized", but we kept on seeing different sets of lit obelisks.

Obviously it became impossible for me to continue mapping the set of lit obelisks due to these irregularities, so my map cuts short in that sense. We then switched to the second part of our research: Attempting to pinpoint specific data pieces to specific obelisks. I had joined Open play several times before and gotten an additional 8 pieces of data that I could not say where they came from due to the chaotic nature of Open. We began randomly scanning the obelisks in our private group until we settled on a more scientific approach (which could definitely be improved). We decided that three of us would remain in our ships, while a single CMDR would be on the ground scanning the lit obelisks. If there was a piece of data, we would be able to receive it on our ships. We had a requirement for the CMDR on the ground: One of the pieces had to be the "key" to the zone:

Zones A, D, F, G = Casket
Zone B, E* = Orb
Zone C = Tablet
Zone H* = Urn* (?)

The second piece in the SRV could be anything the CMDR wanted. In this way we would accomplish two things: Identify the specific obelisk a data piece would come from, and in case the SRV did not get a success message, we would know to discard the SRVs secondary cargo piece.

From this method we drew some initial conclusions:

  1. The pieces of data appear to depend only on the Zone, and not the Set of active obelisks. For example, we found Historic 12 and 13 in Zone G, independent on the set of obelisks at the time. I had found one of them in Solo Play (Hist 12; well documented by now) with Set I, while another one of our CMDRs got the same piece in the "special" set we were observing in the PG. To put it another way: A specific piece of data can be obtained from one of several obelisks located in a particular Zone
  2. Each zone indeed has a "key" item, regardless of the set being observed. The CMDR in the ground would not get any message from each zone unless his pair of items unlocked a piece of data (a success message). A notable exception to this rule appears to be Zone H, as other CMDRs have noticed and started to map. We began scanning Zone H under the assumption that the Urn was the key to it, but were surprised to find out that the CMDR on the ground (me), holding an Urn+Orb pair, received an error message. I quickly switched to Totem+Urn before scanning the second lit obelisk (E21) of the zone and another one of the CMDRs received Cultural 10. I got no error message this time, meaning that the Totem was the key to that region of Zone H. Other CMDRs in the thread have observed similar outcomes.
  3. Finally, it appears that even if the set of obelisks every CMDR observed was different, the data-bleed phenomenon would still work. In other words, it was possible that a CMDR scanning an obelisk that I saw as inactive would result in me getting a data piece from it. We still need to test this one further, as there was an occasion where it didn't appear to work, but it seems this was the case more often than not. I personally think this is another byproduct of the server disconnects.

Some Obelisk/Data Piece Findings:

Please keep in mind that there might be some errors in the following information. We attempted to keep track of the data pieces as best as we could. The first part of the table are some Data pieces that I received while in Open and didn't know where they came from at the time, but added a corresponding obelisk from another CMDR in my group getting the same piece of data while in this PG. The second part of the table are some pieces of data that the other CMDRs in the group received that either I didn't (because I was in the ground) or I already had.

MY PIECES OF DATA
C13 Language 11/21
G27 Historical 13/21
E6 Technology 11/20
?? Biological 8/19
C42 Language 13/21
E19 Cultural 8/20
?? Historical 9/21
B2 Technology 9/20
?? Language 10/21
E17 Biological 11/19
E15 Technology 13
E18 Cultural 7
A1 Historical 16
E22 Cultural 11/20
C22 Language 9/21
OTHER CMDRs
G28 Historic 14
F8 Historic 16
C39 Language 11
D3 Historic 10
G13 Historic 12
G27 Historic 13
B2 Technology 9
E21 Culture 10

That's all the info I've got for now. I'll most likely get back online later today to try and do some more research into the ruins. As it stands right now I've got 28 data pieces, but would like to somehow obtain the remaining 8 that have been identified. I also want to try and recreate some of our methodology and see how repeatable it is. I'll continue keeping track of the lit obelisk sets as best as I can, and I'll post an updated map later on (my current version needs a bit of cleanup). I hope this post can help a bit in the current research and that we can all figure out what the heck is going on with these ruins.

Until then, fly safe. o7

-CMDR Falcon413


Edit Forgot to reply about the side of the obelisks. To be honest I haven't been keeping track of that small detail. At first I didn't think the lit side mattered, but now I am not sure. It might actually be an important detail, but I haven't kept track of it.
 
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Refresher, will grab the rising screenshot eventually. I'm kind of frustrated atm. Everyone is trying so hard to milk the remaining data out of the current site when they should be looking for the others (2 more). All I know is that it has something to do with the engineer Bill Turner. For all we know we're at the end point to whatever puzzle FD intended for us to solve. Of course the whole thing was circumvented.
http://i.imgur.com/PZ29ojA.png

Well now, I believe this finally proves that the moon is not actually tidally locked.

 
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The mystery can not be solved in a solo? It's true? I started without reading the current progress, for that would try to understand myself. And stuck in the 13 messages...

Me too. I have just sent a request to Mobius group because playing at open is impossible... Today I played solo but decided that maybe I will try open. Map didn't even fully loaded and I was already damaged, and rocket was flying at me. :D. Luckily, I managed to exit, so I was no fun for griefer. Approx ~25 HP left. :D
 
The problem isn't as much about knowing what combo to use (though that would be quite beneficial since that way we would only need a player in a ship to say that they got some particular data and we would know exactly what combbo to use in an srv to get the data) but rather the problem is knowing what kind of data is in what obelisk and how to unlock new obelisks.

That's true. We still don't know how to reliably activate new obelisks and the ones that randomly activate seem to have some randomness as to what entry they contain. I have updated my post. I think the combo key is:

Ca
Ur
Ta
Or
To
Re

See:

s86K3cd.png


Old version:

O1QCVQs.png
 
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I was looking at the trailer of The Guardians and this is what I noticed :


I believe there is no such formation of obelisks in the ruins we have discovered. Look at the map below:


So there is definitely another set of ruins then?

What you see there is the Ruins Version 1 as they looked before patch 2.2.03 was published. By that time, the obelisks were located differenty. I can send you a screenshot later if you need proof.
 
Me too. I have just sent a request to Mobius group because playing at open is impossible... Today I played solo but decided that maybe I will try open. Map didn't even fully loaded and I was already damaged, and rocket was flying at me. :D. Luckily, I managed to exit, so I was no fun for griefer. Approx ~25 HP left. :D
And what is the mechanism of the process? Additional pilots are allowed to activate more than solo obelisks? Or enough to be in the group, but one? Interfere with different players to each other by activating the same obelisk?
 
I was looking at the trailer of The Guardians and this is what I noticed :


I believe there is no such formation of obelisks in the ruins we have discovered. Look at the map below:


So there is definitely another set of ruins then?

What you see there is the Ruins Version 1 as they looked before patch 2.2.03 was published. By that time, the obelisks were located differenty. I can send you a screenshot later if you need proof.

What Glastinghouse said. If you look at CMDR Josh Hawkin's livestream video you'll hear the guys talking about how the layout has all changed:

[video=youtube;j6eiSto80aU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6eiSto80aU[/video]
 
And what is the mechanism of the process? Additional pilots are allowed to activate more than solo obelisks? Or enough to be in the group, but one? Interfere with different players to each other by activating the same obelisk?

Probably that is true. I read that you can get culture data only in open play. Among my 13 there is no single culture data. And also combinations that works for other players do not work for me, or relogin doesn't change any obelisk, so I assume they must be in open/group. I didn't play in open at the ruin, so I am not the best source of knowledge for you.
 
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In case it wasn't already confirmed by someone else, I have now fully confirmed that a scan with no accompanying failure message means that one of the artifacts you're holding is one of the correct relics. If you look at obelisk D9 on this, you can see that this is true. Hopefully this helps make this ordeal go faster.
 
I wish grievers to die a painful death. I relogged by mistake on live, and lost a lot for nothing.

- - - Updated - - -

Anyway, I have decided to go the long and methodic road for all of this. Using one of the map provided before, I pick one object, do a round of all the associated obelisks, then pick a secondary, do a round of all the obelists associated with either items, store the new intem in the ship and pick an other one... Time consuming, but I guess I'll get all the combinations that way?
 
In case it wasn't already confirmed by someone else, I have now fully confirmed that a scan with no accompanying failure message means that one of the artifacts you're holding is one of the correct relics. If you look at obelisk D9 on this, you can see that this is true. Hopefully this helps make this ordeal go faster.

Great you managed to complete a full line. This will make everything a bit easier I think.

Edit:
Does that mean the gathered ABCDE Data is completely random?
 
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Probably that is true. I read that you can get culture data only in open play. Among my 13 there is no single culture data. And also combinations that works for other players do not work for me, or relogin doesn't change any obelisk, so I assume they must be in open/group. I didn't play in open at the ruin, so I am not the best source of knowledge for you.
Completely the same situation. I'm sad. I spent a lot of hours to try to solve it myself. With my online I have no friends. For me, Elite has always been a game about loneliness. Now I have to throw solving this problem ... Why impose social interactions where they are completely out of place?
 
I wish grievers to die a painful death. I relogged by mistake on live, and lost a lot for nothing.

- - - Updated - - -

Anyway, I have decided to go the long and methodic road for all of this. Using one of the map provided before, I pick one object, do a round of all the associated obelisks, then pick a secondary, do a round of all the obelists associated with either items, store the new intem in the ship and pick an other one... Time consuming, but I guess I'll get all the combinations that way?

Theoretically yes.
Your contribution of results to this sheet would be very much appreciated. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1bLswiqR3BEPqtGpmw7AT__hor7c5B-daOyUV1cUP9EQ/edit?usp=sharing

I wish grievers to die a painful death. I relogged by mistake on live, and lost a lot for nothing.


- - - Updated - - -


Anyway, I have decided to go the long and methodic road for all of this. Using one of the map provided before, I pick one object, do a round of all the associated obelisks, then pick a secondary, do a round of all the obelists associated with either items, store the new intem in the ship and pick an other one... Time consuming, but I guess I'll get all the combinations that way?


I feel for you. Happened to me earlier tonight.
 
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I accidentally handed the mission in after 9 scans thinking it'd just give me credits for the scans so far and let me carry on with it. Does anyone know if this mission can be picked back up again? Or if you can just keep scanning and getting the credits
 
It's a little suspicious that the double item combos are always the second unlock:

Language9 tablet+tablet (first one of this site is Language8)
Culture8 totem+totem (first one of this site is Culture7)
Biology8 urn+urn (first one of this site is Biology7)

They wouldn't have been as lazy as assigning them in sequence, would they? That would mean we can know all combos right now. I need to check...

updated: Holy !!!! I think this could work. I only have 1 mismatch with reported combo and one unclear reported combo:

http://i.imgur.com/O1QCVQs.png

Looks good. Been working on cataloging all the combos on Reddit if you want to compare

https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDange...nlocking_the_ancient_ruin_scans_combinations/
 
I accidentally handed the mission in after 9 scans thinking it'd just give me credits for the scans so far and let me carry on with it. Does anyone know if this mission can be picked back up again? Or if you can just keep scanning and getting the credits

I believe if you dock somewhere else and change ship or something, you can go back and get it. Some1 posted that earlier today. Not sure if you HAVE to change the ship or just dock somewhere else tho.
As you are there, can you look at the stations logs and messages to see if there is something that could hint where other ruins might be found?
 
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