Killing blow rewards

adrinker

A
As a newbie still in a sidewinder, i've spent hours in combat and I've come to realize that despite choosing a faction, I'm not actually fighting for a common goal. The only thing I can hope to do is get that final killing blow, which despite often hammering down an enemies hp, someone else gets the final blow. After fighting around 100 ships, i've had 2 killing blows, while still taking down lots of the shields/hp.

Are we supposed to just cherry pick the last 1%?

Lots of games that involve rewards from kills (credits/xp) have moved away from the 'killing blow' model. While combat is fun, I should be working with faction members and not against them.

I can see this as a temporary design right now, but is a contribution model intended so that during a big fray, you are rewarded for damage done and not just the final shot?

It would be nice to focus on the fight and not my credit stack.
 

adrinker

A
Bromley86 said:
Unfortunately yes. FD have stated that they like the competitive spirit that it encourages. As with everything, this may change.
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If there is anything that drives people away from combat, that will be it. It makes combat pretty worthless when you're competing with faction mates and not working together.

It's like playing a soccer match, and only focusing on how many times you have possession of the ball rather than working together to win.
 

Seonid

Seonid
adrinker said:
It makes combat pretty worthless when you're competing with faction mates and not working together.
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It won't be an issue if you are working together, such as in a Combat Bond.

Mike Evans said:
Although nothing is set in stone we like the idea of bounties being a last shot gets the prize as we want it to be adversarial and we want people to magpie each others kills ;)

Combat bonds however will be something that is split proportionally.
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OldSalt

O
Kill stealing, shoulder shooting and the 'last shot' rule are as old as MP flight and space sims. Its a bit like nature- you have your top predators at one end of the scale and your bottom feeders at the other- in this case you can guess who is who.

I try to avoid it but to be fair especially in a concentrated cobat zone like federal distress there have been plenty of times that I have targetted whatever is shooting at me (obviously !) and given it a wallop only to see lasers coming in from out of my view. It is highly likely that player had been working over the same enemy before I turned on it- his aim was the bounty but my immediate goal was not to get shot up. If I land the killing stroke a) it is off the back of someone elses work and b) they think I am a kill stealing toad.

Of course there will be those who will deliberately wait until they see an enemy ship in trouble and then step in on the off chance of easy credits (I've seen it done many times already) but if that is what they have to do to earn a crust rather them than me. The best fix is comms, in IL2 said pond life was rapidly called out for such behaviour and it did a lot to minimise it, minimise, not remove.
 

John Boy

J
I have mixed feelings on this. I have been the one to recieve the killing blow and felt like ive had it stolen from me as well. It only gets frustrating for me when I know im the only one who has been attacking my target as I have followed him away from the main group and we are alone when someone else snipes that last shot and I recieve no reward.
Not sure if its a good idea but implementing a system where the person with over 50, 60, or even 70 percent of the damage has a higher chance of getting the reward as long as they hit the target within 1 or 2ish seconds of it being destroyed. This might help thwart potential sniping which may become an issue upon release and the addition of many more PCs.
 

Calico Jack

C
Another good reason to love rail guns, your destiny is always in your hands.

If I hit it, it's mine.

If I wing it, and it limps away with 3% hull, it just wasn't meant to be.
 

PhanttoM

PhanttoM
The way I understand is that the devs want us to 'compete' for a bounty and I really love the general idea.
But right now if I wanted to 'killsteal', I would find it boring as watching paint dry if all I need to do is get the last hit.

I've used this example before;
If myself and another bounty hunter arrive in an area, and both see a target at the same time, there should be an incentive to rush towards the target, and compete with the other bounty hunter for the duration of the fight.

Right now the actual 'competition' is less than 5 seconds and can be as low as 1 second. :(
 

Steve_T

Steve_T
This problem is exacerbated when you only have the one (loaned) pulse laser. As it takes longer to take down a ship, other ships have more time to come in and steal the kill.

Once you have better weapons, the problem kind of evens itself out as you'll probably kill steal as much as your kills are stolen. :)
 

Mace71

Mace71
Bromley86 said:
Unfortunately yes. FD have stated that they like the competitive spirit that it encourages. As with everything, this may change.
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It better change! Its an awful system and I'm sick of never getting credits for kills I've spent time whittling, just to have some blowhard fly in and take MY kill. Its called kill stealing in flight Sims MP and a big no no.

All I want to do is make some money to try other ships, I've always been in the Sidewinder...
 

Memnoch

M
It doesn't look like it's going to change any time soon. I'm not sure if it would be viable to have to keep a track record of who shot at what and how much damage was done by whom and all of these data being totted up at the point of ship destruction and then doll out credits. Even if they did yuou might only earn 100 credits for instance.
 

Calico Jack

C
adrinker said:
While combat is fun, I should be working with faction members and not against them.
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I'm all for faction play, and team play, but as it stands I can't actually join the Navy.

Therefore, I'm not in the Navy, I'm a freelance contractor providing services for the Navy. I aim to provide excellent client focused service, and am sensitive to the wider needs of the business at all times, but beyond getting the job done, there is only so much work to go round. It doesn't pay to be too helpful to all the other contractors.
 

kael13

K
If there's one thing about this community, it seems like half of you are stuck in the 90s in terms of game-design. The last hit model, when fighting co-operatively for a faction, is bad design. The game shouldn't punish players for helping out. Making no progress is how you make players quit. Having the player believe they are making progress, no matter how minor, is important to keep them playing.
 

Alric

A
There are two key things with any mechanic: firstly, does it fit with the game style, the game world and what your character would be doing? And secondly, is it fun.. Does it make for decent gameplay?

This mechanic fails horribly on both counts.
 

Storagebod

S
So historically, it has varied between air-forces and even squadrons as to what a kill is; some accepted shared kills and some didn't. So even in RL, there is little agreement.

I would suggest that in the Elite universe that a shared kill should count but based on having done a significant proportion/amount of damage depending on size of ship. This actually has some interesting impacts; it potentially discourages many on one encounters where the ship is very small. So if 5 cobras take out another Cobra; they might not get the kill. They might still get the bounty.

Bounty should split between pilots according to the proportion of the damage done....
 

Fragnatix

F
We need kill sharing like WW2! In EVE Online, at least, in gang you get to share the kill you do (faction). Maybe if I still the kill of a player hes just gonna blow me away with is cobra just because I **** him off, but in my case i need more credit than him. Anyway, i think some balancing needs to be put in that area
 
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