Because changes were made. If the sequence didn't matter, xdeath going out of order would have caused 0 changes. But he did and it did, my question and hypothesis is; why did that cause changes? And i think it's because there IS an order and it's telling us how to go back and forward instead of just forward.
Alien archeology and other mysteries: Thread 9 - The Canonn
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Because changes were made. If the sequence didn't matter, xdeath going out of order would have caused 0 changes. But he did and it did, my question and hypothesis is; why did that cause changes? And i think it's because there IS an order and it's telling us how to go back and forward instead of just forward.
Apologies to steam in on page 1237 asking if we have discussed something, but have we discussed the spectrographs?
Overlaying the spectrographs onto the ruins map looks like a neat match, does this .. umm .. do anything?
Apart from the fact that rotating the spectrograph allows you to line up the left sticky out bit and the bit that looks like a key and come up with a match, there is only the pyramid structure to the, lets call it "north", that seems to have a divisor sign overlaid on it.
Overlaying the spectrographs onto the ruins map looks like a neat match, does this .. umm .. do anything?
Apart from the fact that rotating the spectrograph allows you to line up the left sticky out bit and the bit that looks like a key and come up with a match, there is only the pyramid structure to the, lets call it "north", that seems to have a divisor sign overlaid on it.
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no if you look at the two images that were given. The relic beacon in the lower area where obelisk group D is in the current site was moved to the large platform on the current site...
What makes you think it caused the changes?
They could just as well be from some game artist deciding it looked better this way, or they needed a few more obelisks and so rearranged things.
I think that the ruins changing actually points to there being NO message in them.
All that time spent analyzing the first ruins, and now the "new improved" ruins...not much use at all.
Ok, now I see where you're coming from, if they wanted to change the ordering the site would change. I would have thought they would also have made it so that this site returned earlier parts of the lore as well if they really cared about ordering, but hey - who knows! I think the fact they just gave us 4 new locations undermines the ordering theory somewhat (unless only one of the four systems has ruins
, but that would cause space riots )Yes, FD wasted time and resources for aesthetics, makes much more sense.
Lets face it, FD haven't been unknown to screw things up, or have you doing out of game research and puzzle solving techniques.
Second picture was taken by myself less than 2 hours ago on a sunlit site and has had no retouching done.
More than 2 sections changed.
1. The top left section had one group of obelisks, now has 2.
2. The top right section had 2 triangular groups, now has none.
3. The lower left section had one entire set of obelisks removed.
4. The lower left section had one set of obelisks moved from one side of the triangular set to the other.
5. A new set of obelisks was added along the bottom wall.
You could say that #3 was split and placed at #1 and #5 but if we suspect that each set has a specific meaning (like # of moons or something) then that would be like saying take 48 moons and make 8 planets and 40 belts so I'd rather look at this like some aspect of the system (if this represents a system) was changed (removed) and 2 other features were added. What probably happened is that Frontier decided on a different system for the next ruins (assuming this ruins is a map to more ruins).
So, what could these things represent?
(queue mad ramblings..)
Assuming the ruins layout are a map, and given the guardians communicate using sign language and glyphs.. and presuming the layout of the ruins are intended to be viewed from above by a passing guardian ship, then we should perhaps be looking for what sections might represent if viewed as a glyph and looking for some numerical values relating to each.
Well, we have 2 circular sections, one larger than the other. This might be sun and planet, or planet and moon, or perhaps one is a representation of one of their cities - the data mentions shields covering entire cities and some of those additional structures might represent those. One of the data points mentions the glyph for a moon being a combination of the waxing and waning moon as viewed from their home planet, this would for a circle perhaps with a gap at 2 points.
So, the upper left section has 36 obelisks where once it contained 18. If we assume the large circular section is a sun, then this might indicate 36 satellites (planets and their moons etc).
The outer walls are interesting. The shorter walls each appear to have once contained, or have room for 5 large markers along their length. The top and bottom walls look like the might accommodate 10. The placement of the circular sections replacing these markers where necessary. This would mean 40 markers total, so perhaps they divide 360 degrees into 40 equal parts (each 9 degrees)? Or perhaps the corners themselves need to be included so it's 46 equal parts (each 8 degrees)?
Looking at the blurrier image of the current ruins gave me the impression that the ridge down the center was a pole sticking up from the ground with the large circular section on top. The wedge shaped section in the top left then looks like a ray of light shining from it. (Sun shining on 36 satellites?)
The small piece on the left hand side of that central ridge/pole might be for orienting this planet with the sun in this system (we're tidally locked, right?) or it could point at the 0 degrees marker (the left hand side 'corner' where 2 walls join).
The smaller circular piece looks like a miniature version of the larger might indicate the next ruins site, counting markers from the 0 degrees point might give us an angle. But, from what reference point? The sun in this system? In which direction?
Well.. this is probably all nonsense, but maybe it sparks an idea
Although we were thinking, here, many times what difference may new and old ruin layout makes and came to really not many conclusions I will try one more guess.
The only thing that should always be correct is position of location in grid. So the only universal thing that may be "coded" into place is its position in galaxy/planetary structure/grid. You can "calibrate" by including points when "semi constant things" like sun or moon are ascending or descending.
Things that have changed, obviously have no "position" meaning. But honestly they should have no meaning then at all (unless buggy placement). Suggestion was that they are pointing towards something now, but shouldn't be able to do that earlier too? Unless it simply never has any "positioning" meaning from very beginning.
The only thing that should always be correct is position of location in grid. So the only universal thing that may be "coded" into place is its position in galaxy/planetary structure/grid. You can "calibrate" by including points when "semi constant things" like sun or moon are ascending or descending.
Things that have changed, obviously have no "position" meaning. But honestly they should have no meaning then at all (unless buggy placement). Suggestion was that they are pointing towards something now, but shouldn't be able to do that earlier too? Unless it simply never has any "positioning" meaning from very beginning.
Currently losing my mind on C 3 A.
Ithas a radius of just700km so I've started"small".
Everything looks like ruins to me now and this body has a strange rendering effect that has that terrain looking like farmed land.
and what are all those noiseson an atmosphereless body?
Ithas a radius of just700km so I've started"small".
Everything looks like ruins to me now and this body has a strange rendering effect that has that terrain looking like farmed land.
and what are all those noiseson an atmosphereless body?
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It would be really great if we could, I dunno ( hint incoming) get some sort of clarification (hint) on if we're over analyzing the ruins or not ( come on FD)
That's be so cool
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Having tested the ambient sound effect on two types of rocky worlds, I have found that there are some differences. I'll try to get a video up showing this. Basically c22-17 ab 3 a has a more ruiny sound then c22-17 ab 3 and the sounds coming fromt he planet make me fairly certain there is a site here, a couple times I swear I've heard the familiar ruins sound on this planet. Anyways, again I'll get a video showing the differences.
Is it just me or is this nigh on impossible to do with my Xbox cmdr as the texture features don't load properly until you're close to the surface, where on my PC they load a lot higher up.
Here's a thought.... everyone seems focused on planets now, but how about space. As compared to brute force searching of planetary surfaces, perhaps clues will be found in space such as a beacon/USS? I found one USS in the third system listed, but it had no clues. Perhaps though, FD seeded space with the chance that simply flying around may yield something. However.....
I also look at it this way...., reading all the posts in this thread and the "complex" ideas/logic of finding answers.... it seems the effort is waaaayyyy over analyzed. FD devs/planners in all reality/honesty likely have not made this puzzle that complex. Their project team though talented in building this game, likely do not have the thought/creative forethought (not a dig on FD, but rather a pragmatic view) to promote/employ all these creative ideas in the puzzle found here. Its entertaining read, and actually adds life to the game play/lore, but I think that is all it is. The key to solving this puzzle is to look at the existing game mechanics and approach from that angle.
Right now, a Galnet message went out with 4 systems where likely ruins will be found. Next, given game mechanics, perhaps the next clue will come from a USS in space somewhere within these systems (perhaps many), that will provide further clues. Or perhaps as others noted, a CMDR returning full system scans to Ram may provide something in a new notification/clue. Given game mechanics, perhaps the ruins are not even spawned yet until further clues are discovered which will "unlock" the ruins.
All in all, given the history of this challenge and where we are now, frankly there has been no complex aspect of discovery/unlock based on data/experience speculated in this thread. The only thing that has original finding was discovery of first ruins, which as FD noted was "unexpected." My guess is there would have been some Galnet or other path for finding that first Ruin, but it was found by reviewing the trailer and creative deduction of the guy who found it. Given the ruins were in the trailer which was created based on existing gameplay, the Ruins were in the game following that release build.
All in all, I believe that the path to discovery is based on following/leveraging existing game mechanics. Challenge is figuring out those mechanics to move the puzzle to the next step (likely spawn of the ruins themselves).
I also look at it this way...., reading all the posts in this thread and the "complex" ideas/logic of finding answers.... it seems the effort is waaaayyyy over analyzed. FD devs/planners in all reality/honesty likely have not made this puzzle that complex. Their project team though talented in building this game, likely do not have the thought/creative forethought (not a dig on FD, but rather a pragmatic view) to promote/employ all these creative ideas in the puzzle found here. Its entertaining read, and actually adds life to the game play/lore, but I think that is all it is. The key to solving this puzzle is to look at the existing game mechanics and approach from that angle.
Right now, a Galnet message went out with 4 systems where likely ruins will be found. Next, given game mechanics, perhaps the next clue will come from a USS in space somewhere within these systems (perhaps many), that will provide further clues. Or perhaps as others noted, a CMDR returning full system scans to Ram may provide something in a new notification/clue. Given game mechanics, perhaps the ruins are not even spawned yet until further clues are discovered which will "unlock" the ruins.
All in all, given the history of this challenge and where we are now, frankly there has been no complex aspect of discovery/unlock based on data/experience speculated in this thread. The only thing that has original finding was discovery of first ruins, which as FD noted was "unexpected." My guess is there would have been some Galnet or other path for finding that first Ruin, but it was found by reviewing the trailer and creative deduction of the guy who found it. Given the ruins were in the trailer which was created based on existing gameplay, the Ruins were in the game following that release build.
All in all, I believe that the path to discovery is based on following/leveraging existing game mechanics. Challenge is figuring out those mechanics to move the puzzle to the next step (likely spawn of the ruins themselves).
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I really don't think they would give even the most vague location if the ruins weren't already in existence. The space riots that would take place if they appeared in a eyeball searched location would be to much for FD damage control to squirrel away to the support forum
Normally if beacons are added for story they are persistent (relog to check), and appear when you are < 1000Ls away. I have seen no such beacons when scanning all of one of the 4 systems, I guess they could be in the other 3.
Some of the earlier puzzles around UA/UP seemed "complex", even the nonograms / beacon messages. You may be right, but we have high standards
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Normally if beacons are added for story they are persistent (relog to check), and appear when you are < 1000Ls away. I have seen no such beacons when scanning all of one of the 4 systems, I guess they could be in the other 3.
Some of the earlier puzzles around UA/UP seemed more complex, even the nonograms / beacon messages. You may be right, but we have high standards
There were some suspicious things in the obelisk audio that i think are yet to be resolved.
probably worth someone checking if that has changed, or if there are any possible clues to the new sites.
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