Conveying this games "Story" through nothing but text is unacceptable.

Because of the abysmal lack of variation in dialogue. That's how. Because NPC dialogue feels lazy and poorly thought out. Because they spam the same nonsense as they did last year. And the year before that. Because it feels like a joke.

So you tell me if they have. And tell me why there aren't more. You tell me why they can hire you to crank out a book. But can't get someone to bust out a couple new lines every 4 months. (Is that long enough?) Or god forbid just listen to the community and organize a dialogue submission contest.

I don't disagree that NPC dialogue is repetitive at this stage and that there is clearly only a limited set of phrases being cycled. But NPC dialogue is only one of many textual components in the game. It's probably on a list; a prioritised, time-dependent, does-this-add-more-than-that-to-the-game list. All text has to be QAd, translated, checked, inserted into dev releases and tested. It's not a case of populating a file called dumbNPC.txt and uploading it to an AWS server. Maybe it's on hold because of another feature, maybe it's on hold because the dialogue system is slated for replacement at some point in the future. Who knows? Game dev is a matter of working with priorities. Any 'little' feature might not take much time on its own, but it's time a dev isn't doing something else. That all adds up and a dev lead makes a call.

Player submitted dialogue saves no time as it would all need to be verified and checked for consistency by a QA team and leads to more IP complication than it's worth. Submitters try to drop in dialogue from their favourite films or TV shows. TL;DR the idea has been investigated and rejected already.

FMV dialogue? It takes weeks to do this to match the quality level seen elsewhere in the visuals, its simply not viable with a team the size of the one at FDev. They'd face the combined criticism of the videos themselves and 'why are you wasting time making video when you should be working on the game'.

FDev read out loud Galnet? And stick two fingers up to the community streamers and youtubers that have been doing this for years? I doubt it.

That's before you get to the consistency. What about mission text. What about in-game non-NPC description and dialogue, what about scannable artefacts. It's simply too big.

Perhaps outsource it? Have you any idea how much that costs?

Even with all this you'll get the same sarcastic responses as I've seen already on this thread. "There is a story?" In place of "I don't read GalNet" you'll have "I don't watch the videos, who wants cutscenes in an MMO?"

The priorities in the game are set. You can't please all of the people all of the time, so you aim to please the maximum number you can with the resources you have.

As for the book I'm writing. No one at Frontier has the time to do that, lots of people want books. Not everyone does. For less than the price of a shipkit you can have a story in the ED universe that expands on what GalNet has been telling you, coupled with in-game mysteries and actual content... and (hopefully) be entertained for several hours.

Like that shipkit you can buy it if you want to, or not. The choice is yours. The same goes with the story. You're not the hero, you're just a bystander. Get involved if you want, or don't bother. The story doesn't owe you anything, you're just some random person in a spaceship.

So far that book represents 243 days of writing effort and time and it will cost you the price of a few beers when it comes out. That is known in the trade as a schmucking bargain.

Cheers,

Drew.
 
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No, I'm pretty sure a small amount of players follow the GalNet "story". I'm pretty sure. Dream on if you think there are more nerds dreaming their imagination ingame than other players. Especially the XBox community gives a damn dime about the text based story and so will the Playstation group do. Totally different player base.

Probably not too many do as a percentage. I only really looked at them when i heard of something interesting through other channels.

Then i got EDDI. Now when i fire that up as i'm launching ED, EDDI reads out all new galnet articles. Its great, i get to listen to galnet news as the game loads. Then, when playing, if any new articles go live, i get to hear those as well.

I can highly recommened EDDI for this (as well as for other reasons).

Sure, would be nice to have something like that natively in game, but until such a time, i'm quite happy with EDDI as a stand in.
 
Then i got EDDI. Now when i fire that up as i'm launching ED, EDDI reads out all new galnet articles. Its great, i get to listen to galnet news as the game loads. Then, when playing, if any new articles go live, i get to hear those as well.

that's cool. Good to know. But this is where FDev totally fails. If an external "provider" sees the need to provide a tool that supports the game external story in a better way, FDev should have realised and reacted. They, at least, could simply integrate a new channel which pops up in your HUD (small window with a new anchor) that ready all the latest updates while your traveling. Travel time is such a waste of time in this game, a new channel with cool sounding voice (like the station voices) would add soooooooooo much to the game and would in a very simple and easy implementa"ble" way include the story ingame. I can't see why FDev is not doing that. Minimal costs, great effect.
 
that's cool. Good to know. But this is where FDev totally fails. If an external "provider" sees the need to provide a tool that supports the game external story in a better way, FDev should have realised and reacted. They, at least, could simply integrate a new channel which pops up in your HUD (small window with a new anchor) that ready all the latest updates while your traveling. Travel time is such a waste of time in this game, a new channel with cool sounding voice (like the station voices) would add soooooooooo much to the game and would in a very simple and easy implementa"ble" way include the story ingame. I can't see why FDev is not doing that. Minimal costs, great effect.

Oh, you're still here, and with the same "request". Goodie. So maybe, just maybe.. Elite is not about a heroic space pilot doing heroic stuff in a heroic universe. Maybe as people pointed out it would be quite pointless ot have "quests" and "missions" that are the same for everyone with super voice acted and cutscened goodness, because .. how would that work exactly? You'd end up with something like this:

[video=youtube;0bAFr3lEvgE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bAFr3lEvgE[/video]

And that is not a good thing in a game like Elite. Yeah the story might be hidden and sporadic, only appearing for those that active look for it. And yes, it might be added in mediums after the fact, but that is how the story evolves. Kinda hard to make cutscenes or missions for something that is not set in stone. Imagine if FD would set up a bunch of storylines for the Empire, and one the first day the FED players show up and flip systems, destroy targets, block destinations, rendering said event useless. (Like I don't know, the treasure hunt in Open?). Or do you mean that these missions should be completely separate from the galaxy, not influenced by anything, and just there because you personally feel the need to have Elite be a Wing Commander game?
 
As for the book I'm writing. No one at Frontier has the time to do that, lots of people want books. Not everyone does. For less than the price of a shipkit you can have a story in the ED universe that expands on what GalNet, coupled with in-game mysteries and actual content, has been telling you and (hopefully be entertained for several hours).

Like that shipkit you can buy it if you want to, or not. The choice is yours.

So far that book represents 243 days of writing effort and time. That is known in the trade as a ****ing bargain.

Cheers,

Drew.

Hi Drew,

I appreciate what you say, I just sit with the following dilemma though.

I'm not much of a book reader but I do enjoy a good story, and from the praise I hear regarding your books I can only concede that they must be good.

However I would like to experience the story "while playing" Elite, not "instead of" (can't read a book and fly a ship at the same time)

That is why I opt for audiobooks and podcasts, I actually went to your website a while back to purchase the audiobook for Reclamation but then got to the price (19.39GBP).

I appreciate that costs need to be recovered and that's the curse of doing business but in my currency (ZAR) 20 quid is actually quite a bit of cash, its literally the same price I paid for the game in the first place, Actually more so since our currency is currently tanking (ED=19.99GBP).

That is the unfortunate reason I have not yet been able to experience the world you have created and the characters you have brought to life.
 
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As a matter of fact, no I have not watched a sub-titled movie or anime. I either watch/read items in the original language or not at all - ever.

What?! Really? Hahahaha

I see you live in America and so maybe are American. This explains it.
 
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Hi Drew,

I appreciate what you say, I just sit with the following dilemma though.

I'm not much of a book reader but I do enjoy a good story, and from the praise I hear regarding your books I can only concede that they must be good.

However I would like to experience the story "while playing" Elite, not "instead of" (can't read a book and fly a ship at the same time)

That is why I opt for audiobooks and podcasts, I actually went to your website a while back to purchase the audiobook for Reclamation but then got to the price (19.39GBP).

I appreciate that costs need to be recovered and that's the curse of doing business but in my currency (ZAR) 20 quid is actually quite a bit of cash, its literally the same price I paid for the game in the first place, Actually more so since our currency is currently tanking (ED=19.99GBP).

That is the unfortunate reason I have not yet been able to experience the world you have created and the characters you have brought to life.

How much does it cost to go see a 90 minute movie in South Africa?
 
Oh, you're still here, and with the same "request". Goodie. So maybe, just maybe.. Elite is not about a heroic space pilot doing heroic stuff in a heroic universe.[/SPOILER]


Yes, and that's why you're going to loose your little tiny sweet game within the next couple of years. Big sweet hello face from Germany. The amount of players that is happily playing the vision of Braben is not big enough to keep this project going. Face it, it's going down within the next couple of 2 latest 3 years. I promise. Playsation sales will push it to a certain extent, but if development continues to go in the same direction ... bloody dead end. The fact that multicrew get's implemented arcade style shows that FDev get's aware of the "need" of the majority of the gamers buying this game. It's not what it was intended, but it saves the asss.s of the cash stream that is needed to keep this project going. There are more or less 2 big player bases ... 1. the nerds, 2. the more acrade action oriented. The nerds want simulation and they give a dime about spending 3 hours traveling, the rest is bored to death with traveling and the repetition and they don't want to create (or cant) head cinema own storyline imagine nice stuff thingy. You might belong to the 1st group, but this group is too small to keep this project going. Sorry for the news but Elite will definitely become even more acrade'ish.

I don't like arcade but I need more to stimulate me than getting the same stuff everytime I fire up this game. The repetition is almost cruelty. Nothing to do, depth = 0. Nothing really to achieve. Sorry, ... waste of time. Even a good and fair PvP fight system based on skills would already bring a lot of gameplay to me. But The Engineers totally killed that part of the game. Either you have another 100 to 200 hours of time and compete with the best, or you can't invest this amount of time and get grilled. It got better but the game was cool before The Engineers arrived. Skill ruled, not time investment and luck.
 
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FMV dialogue? It takes weeks to do this to match the quality level seen elsewhere in the visuals, its simply not viable with a team the size of the one at FDev.
Maybe the character creator now opens a path towards "talking heads" with some generic animations appropriate to the situation though; would require quite the overhaul to the HUD which appears to be dealing in static images only at this point, but one can dream :)

Images with limited animation accompanying text worked wonders in early games like Wing Commander even without the speech packs.
 
How much does it cost to go see a 90 minute movie in South Africa?

Just checked for the new Fast and Furious movie

Full Price - 67,00

Thats:
67 South African Rand equals
3.920 British Pound

our Secretary earns 292.53gbp a month as a reference
 
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Yes, and that's why you're going to loose your little tiny sweet game within the next couple of years. Big sweet hello face from Germany.

If the game fails, it's probably not going to be because of missing cutscenes, I'm fairly sure of that. Elite Dangerous has a lot of problems, but the lack of cutscenes ain't one.
 
Do you have access to Audible (Amazon's audiobook service) in your region? It is a lot cheaper in my region via that site.

The price stated was from audible, looks like our country doesn't have local deals with them (I do have steam in my local currency since last year)
 
If the game fails, it's probably not going to be because of missing cutscenes, I'm fairly sure of that. Elite Dangerous has a lot of problems, but the lack of cutscenes ain't one.

That's absolutely right and not what I'm saying. Cutscenes would be nice to have but we need meaningful gameplay.
 
Tldr... All of the thread, but to reply to the OP.

The games multiple story's and all of the ins and outs off them mean nothing to me as I cant even sign up for a local faction let alone the Empire.

If I felt my in game actions had meaning, the back drop might mean something to me. Sort of thing PP could-should have been but alas poor PP I knew him.....
 
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That's absolutely right and not what I'm saying. Cutscenes would be nice to have but we need meaningful gameplay.

It's Elite. It offers gameplay that Elite games offer. I'm not quite sure what people expect when coming into this game. It's not a story focused starfighter game, it's the clone of its own genre. And looking at the very dedicated people uncovering things far from the bubble, there is gameplay here, but apparently FDs approach is that you should look for it, instead of it being handed to you. I'm too lazy, so I just enjoy flying my ship in space and doing my own thing whenever it strikes my fancy. It's not a problem if others don't find this enough, but dealing in ultimates like this game will die if x and y is not implemented is a bit silly. Elite will live or die on its own merits being an Elilte game, not by trying to turn it into something it isn't.

Also sometimes I get a feeling that people for better or worse want that Elite does everything at the same time and is awesome at it. That is a very optimistic thing to do, but sooner or later those people will have to realize that it ain't happening.
 
The games multiple story's and all of the ins and outs off them mean nothing to me as I cant even sign up for a local faction let alone the Empire.

If I felt my in game actions had meaning, the back drop might mean something to me.

It is true you cannot "sign up" to a faction in game, however you can have your own faction added to the game (though this process takes months) or join a group who have already done this. Once you have a faction to call your own you can influence it as you please, and your actions have meaning WRT the progress of the faction. This is the main reason I am still playing the game after ~1500 hours. I just wish Frontier would find more development time to expand on this as I feel that long term players need this connection to stay involved.
 
... Almost all games provide a story though, so when a game doesn't and instead invites a situation where the player is small and insignificant ... many players just don't seem to find that appealing these days. It might suggest that this isn't in fact the game for them. ... Personally I like the approach, but even I'm frustrated by not having even been hyperdicted yet so I don't feel 'involved' in that particular story line at all......<shrugs>

I see a complaint from OP. I don't see an actual suggestion in OP as to what FD should do.

Please provide.

Story is all well and good if you are interested in it. Blooming useless if you are not.
I love a great story but that doesn't mean I want it shoved down my throat. If I'm in the for 'story' then I open up the galnet and read it...
Fleshed out story is one thing but spending silly money/time on things like live actors to do green screen new casts....waste IMO.

Look at the one time they did a cutscene - the hyperdiction event - complaints how it was effectively a cutscene. However, it does work because nothing happens that makes any single CMDR the chosen one. It was worth the effort because it could be used multiple times.
...
Either you need cutscenes for everyone... and then what? Everyone is the chosen one? Or they are generic like the hyperdictions. How often can do in reality do things like the hyperdictions for everyone? How often are there going to be events that affect everyone under certain circumstances in a certain region that it makes sense for those people to see it?
...
Perhaps what is needed is for FD to create an in game video feed version of Galnet... if they can spare the time and resources for that.

But it's worth thinking about what it could be like and posting it in the forum. If the game stays like this, adding more "content" without changing the underlying mechanics and making it interesting, it's not gonna reach tier 5. The more action driven XBox community and now with the upcoming Playstation community won't stick to the game for very long.

...
FMV dialogue? It takes weeks to do this to match the quality level seen elsewhere in the visuals, its simply not viable with a team the size of the one at FDev. They'd face the combined criticism of the videos themselves and 'why are you wasting time making video when you should be working on the game'.
FDev read out loud Galnet? And stick two fingers up to the community streamers and youtubers that have been doing this for years? I doubt it.
That's before you get to the consistency. What about mission text. What about in-game non-NPC description and dialogue, what about scannable artefacts. It's simply too big.
Perhaps outsource it? Have you any idea how much that costs?
Even with all this you'll get the same sarcastic responses as I've seen already on this thread. "There is a story?" In place of "I don't read GalNet" you'll have "I don't watch the videos, who wants cutscenes in an MMO?"

OK, voiced radio messages would be awesome, full motion video cutscenes of the ongoing stories (theft of meta alloys, alien interdiction, guardian puzzle), would be frickin awesome but Fdev don't need to do that.

As far as spaceship pornography <short form censored> goes, we're set, holo me has the characters and voicing those few characters - well, I'm sure there are many starving actor students out there that would work for recognition and resume points. We're visual creatures, we respond with much more interest when there's something to look at (no offense Drew, I'll buy your book already :).

It could almost be presented in graphic novel format (with speech bubbles), and the interest levels would still rise a 1000%...

https://ernestoolivares.com/2013/01/11/we-are-90-visuals-beings/
 
OK, voiced radio messages would be awesome, full motion video cutscenes of the ongoing stories (theft of meta alloys, alien interdiction, guardian puzzle),...

No, there is no need for video anything.
It's Elite, a game from your perspective. If something is happening, but not to you, you don't know about it and you don't see it, unless you read it somewhere.

If no one has captured an alien on video, there is no video of it, find the alien yourself to see how it looks.

There are enough interactive movies out there.
 
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