#support3rdparty - Why we temporarily shut down our sites.

[I PORKCH0P I]

Comparing OPs to petulant kids is a bit over the top don't you think?
If you carefully read OP's post, this is a last ditch effort after 3 years of unannounced API changes, no documentation, no communication, being ignored, etc.etc.
It seems to me FDev is behaving like unprofessionals in this case; launching an API, then not documenting it, then change it unannounced, while saying



which is clearly not the case!
After 3 years of this, losing patience and going on strike is a fair option

#support3rdparty!

Word for word what I was about to write .
I hope fd responds in a positive way to this because not only do the 3rd party devs enhance the game for many people but there also seems to be a lot ill will bulding towards fd at the moment over several issues.

#support3rdparty

 

[CMDR Adelind]

exactly ... FDev doesn't care if you have these sites or not. Only ones you are hurting is the player base. If you don't want to do it then don't.

Fdev do care, because without community support they'd have to put more effort into making the game accessible enough to sell. It's not an beta anymore. They save an enormous amount of money by having the community design and pay for a big part of what should be in their game. If there were no EDDB etc, the forums would be filled with players complaining about not being able to find anything and quitting because 90% of their time is going from station to station looking for a shield.

 

[{SAS}Stalker]

It's just this event on the 29th which has been in preparation for a year. I'm all for communication between the 3rd partys and Frontier but this is a protest to try and sabotage this weekend's event and my concern is that they will never do another event because of it.

I can see that if the Frontier bashing continues, they'll stop communicating all together (see NMS) and in the worst case, stop E : D after 2.4.

If this event can't be run easily without 3rd party developers applications then perhaps the game isn't in a place where it should be holding such an event. Think about it, are you suggesting that game is being propped up by the 3rd party apps?

 

[Deleted member 115407]

The in-game tools are crap!

There are in-game tools? Hunh...

 

[Monk]

While I admire and respect some of the talented 3rd party devs that are part of he Elite community I simply can't get behind this 'strike' nonsense.

Frontier have been clear in the past on what their limits are regarding 3rd party tools and what will be available as a result. You guys and gals chose to make said tools knowing these restrictions, you guys and gals chose to maintain and update said tools despite the difficulties and you guys and gals knew full well how Frontier operate.

So, for you now to try and hijack Frontier, using the community in a very distasteful way, on this bank holiday/Salome event weekend is cheap and nasty as hell. I've actually lost a bit of respect for you guys, this just screams of you getting too big for your boots and extreme arrogance.

To those of you that think Elite is unplayable without these tools, you couldn't be more wrong and frankly I'm embarrassed on your behalf that you are so comfortable being used as pawns in an ego trip.

They could at least keep open a semblance of communication. A heads up that something is going to break or at least some acknowledgement that they impacted something and won't be able to get to it right away.

Just that little bit would go a really long way, I think.

 

[PrimetimeCasual]

I just started on a longer exploration trip. Without these sites that trip is not only very tedious, but also somewhat pointless.

I support your strike, even if that means I won't be able to play until Sunday.


As a professional developer, I sympathise with both sides actually, but the fact is - 3rd party tools like Coriolis, EDDB and EDSM have become an integral part of the Eliteangerous experience. They should be treated as such.

 

[Monk]

A thought just occurred to me, and this may be a result of the fibrous growth that connects my optic nerve to my colon and gives me a s___ty outlook, but hear me out here...

What IF this breakdown in communication is intentional, and the first step toward Frontier deciding to monetize the sort of data these various 3rd party sites have been providing freely, in form of a paid companion app for PC, Android and/or iPhone?

Given the sheer number of people who simply cannot seem to find a way to play without these, it certainly would make financial sense, as they'd HAVE to buy these apps to continue to do the things they've done all along.

Just speculating.

It is a really terrible and scummy way to go about it. I doubt that is the case.

 

[Jex =TE=]

Just a question to all those supporting this action. Where exactly would you like this to sit in the priority. You know all the complaining that's been done about the development of Elite recently, you now all suddenly want that to be put on the back burner so that resources can be diverted to talking to some 3rd party developers? I would be interested to hear from the said developers (especially the OP) to see how high a priority they think this should take, over the development of the game?




If you don't play the game, then why are you still here?

that wasn't the question I asked and has nothing to do with anything - can't you answer what I asked you?

 

[Morbad]

There are in-game tools? Hunh...

There are, and they are mostly not very good, but they are usable...especially if you don't mind taking your own notes to supplement them.

 

[Winterwalker]

As cool as the 3rd person tools are, I can't see the action being very constructive, especially if the OP says the idea of the tools is to support Frontier, as well as the game.

Why not just stay in touch with Howard??

The OP mentions going through Zac but, if it's possible to organise a coordinated shutdown, and if people worried he doesn't appear on forums, did anyone actually PM Howard first?? Surely he'd know why the API doesn't beta, though if you ask me it's probably written during beta, once the build has been locked down, because at the end of the day it is a peripheral to the main game build.

So anyway, no doubt the thread has a life of it's own by now, but my 2c.

ps. sympathetic because obviously the 3rd parties want to give a good service but don't support the action really.

 

[DCLXVI your God]

I have mixed feelings about this whole topic. On the one hand I have to admit I use the tools I find them very helpful and in some cases indispensable. Having said that however, I also believe that third-party developers stop complaining and thank their lucky stars that they are being allowed to develop for a game they do not own in the first place. If Frontier wanted They could shut down All third-party development as an intrusion onto their IP. They do not owe third parties anything nor are they Beholden to Divulge any of their development schedules, processes, Or code for the benefit of third parties. In the case of third-Parties Developing during Software beta, that's just foolish. You should expect things to be broken. I imagine I'm not going to be popular for this post. But the truth is the truth. Frontier Developments Owes third parties nothing. Third-party developers Should stop Complaining and instead be thankful They are even be allowed to develop for platform That they have no rights to. You pays your money's you takes your chances. Now on the flip side (I wonder how many people will flame me before they read this part) Frontier developments should also realize That third parties Do enhance the experience of the game and in doing so add value and help to maintain customer support and Customer retention and in that respect Should be considered for in-house support.

FDev should thank the 3rd party developers for enhancing their game for free.

 

[pipo zelvelder]

be nice if they did, then these parasites would go scrape some other games data for "donations"

This is a very lame and immature reaction: Everyone in the world knows (or should know!) that the 3rd party tools (or parasites as you so childishly calls them) are made by volunteers and that the "donations" they recieve are always just a fraction of the money they voluntarily(!) spend on it. These are guys and gals that do this for fun, for a hobby, because they love to do this.

How dare you to call them parasites and suggest that they do this just to scrape money of others! You should truly be ashamed of yourself

 

[chen369]

I belive without these tools Elite Dangerous will be alot more isolated, just imagine trying to find a rare commodity or ship parts that you looking for.. but you've traveled 60+ LYs docking at every station trying to find it .
EDDB made the game what it needed it will really suck to see Elite Dangerous without it. Curious what will happen to people who do trade routes.

C'mon it's year 3303 we have Ships that travel more than the speed of light but we can't figure out a system that can't intercommunicate available parts/commodities between systems in game ?
let's be more realistic. we need some sort of DB where we can see what stations have and don't have available.

 

[eAbedul]

There are things in ED that are a real pain. I wonder if I would even bother to play engeneers witout those tools, or do missiones that requires to find good ... Corialis, Inara, EDDB, you have my support and I hope ED will make your life easier.

 

[digital-black]

#support3rdparty

You have my support! And I hope FDev realizes hope important you are to the vibrance and vitality to this game and takes steps to work with you.

All of these 3rd party tools are invaluable to the ED game experience... often providing functionality that is not inherent in the game [and would take some development time to replicate in game].

I use your tools all the time... as they greatly impact the efficiency and effectiveness of my game play, which makes for a more satisfying experience. Without your tools... I'm sure much of my time spent playing would be far less rewarding.
So I thank you!

These tools offer immeasurable quality of life benefits to the game, providing information that SHOULD be at every commander's fingertips. They are assets and should be treated as such as they provide functionality that the game does not.

I hope FDev is listening... because it's clear developing a functional API is far less work for FDev than it would be to implement all the functionality provided by these 3rd party tools... so this should be a no brainer.

Again kudos for all the great tools out there... and hopefully you can keep up the good work!
Cheers!

 

[tunrip]

Please support 3rd party tool makers

To me, I find Elite: Dangerous in a very odd position.

The other game I play most is Destiny on PS4. Destiny has a supported API which is used by 3rd party developers and by Bungie themselves for supporting mobile and web apps. Destiny has several million players, and I appreciate Bungie's resources are greater...

But you know what? E: D has one heck of a lot more 3rd party tools, calculators, assistants, information pages, stats pages, everything. With a game like E: D, these tools are exponentially more useful.

I don't remember how I played Elite 2: Frontier. I don't remember now whether I had pages of notes... More... Scouring magazines for hints and tips. I mean, except that one time I did my science homework based on all the planet information in our solar system, anyway

In current times, Else(Heart.Break) I made pages of notes on. With Elite: Dangerous, there is simply TOO MUCH to make notes on reasonably. I tried it once with engineers. Trying to make notes of all the things I needed... What a nightmare! And as for market prices? Are you crazy? I have never even figured out how that "trade routes" map thing is supposed to work. I can't even imagine doing that in-game... So you know what? I *wouldn't* do that in-game. To someone still kind of getting started in E: D, it's a mass of complex systems that are all a bit mysterious and enigmatic.

I would love to see E: D's in-game tools massively expand, and I would love to see the out-of-game experience expand too. When I'm not playing the game, I'd love to be planning my next ship, or how I'll spend my time, or looking at pilot stats. But I can't.

FDev, the 3rd party tools and websites are a wonderful wonderful addition to your game. Please reach out and help people build upon these. You might not like or approve of these tools, but I 100% assure you that these help bring people to your game, and they help keep them playing it.

FDev, thank you for reading and considering these opinions, and thank you for making a brilliant game.

3rd party toolmakers and website owners and maintainers - thank you for helping to expand the Elite: Dangerous experience and making a good game great.

Everyone else... Hi, and thanks for reading

 

[Saxon Kili]

eddb is my go-to tool. It makes the game more playable for me. Thanks third party tool makers. I appreciate your hard work. I hope your relationship with Frontier improves and communications flow better.

 

[Monk]

As cool as the 3rd person tools are, I can't see the action being very constructive, especially if the OP says the idea of the tools is to support Frontier, as well as the game.

Why not just stay in touch with Howard??

The OP mentions going through Zac but, if it's possible to organise a coordinated shutdown, and if people worried he doesn't appear on forums, did anyone actually PM Howard first?? Surely he'd know why the API doesn't beta, though if you ask me it's probably written during beta, once the build has been locked down, because at the end of the day it is a peripheral to the main game build.

So anyway, no doubt the thread has a life of it's own by now, but my 2c.

Strikes are rarely constructive as they are not meant to be. Strikes are about getting attention, and I think it is working.

Frontier started communicating with them and let it drop and, it seems, have 'left the phone off the hook'

Frontier at least owes them something along the lines of, "we do not have the resources to maintain an open dialogue with you. Good luck"

 

[Jex =TE=]

Who uses pen a paper?

Real men commit everything to memory.

I tie knots in a piece of string myself....

 

[mephisto9466]

o7

Now for all of you that have no idea how to find things, message me in game. I'll teach you the old harder way of doing things.