Salomé has been killed.

[Elyssaen]

The event was clearly orchestrated to end as it did. Letting the puppies take a leading role makes that obvious. This exact scenario was discussed by the group I associate with. Anyone with half a brain could see it for what it was before the event which is why there were so many people in the discord arguing about the tactics.

I call fix and there is nothing that could convince me otherwise.

That wasn't an answer, but okay. Who do you think orchestrated it? Drew himself?

 

[Trafalgar Law]

How much opposition was there overall. The impression I got was that virtually everyone was pro-Salome and co. I saw very few other ships that looked like they were out to stop them. Did anyone even attack Raan Corsen or the other dude? I was at Tionisla at the about the right time but wasn't in the right instance (not that I would have been able to do much in my Courier anyway).

Not surprised at all by Salome's fate. The moment I heard that SDC had joined the defenders I was expecting it.

 

[Bio-Flame]

The truth is that despite the massive engagement of the wider community the Salome life/death thing was, at its core, a form of orchestrated PvP competition.

Which was won by experienced PvP-ers, as it was always likely to be.

I am sorry Truesilver, but here is where you are fundamentally wrong. I would think someone like you would know the difference between PvE and PvP.
What happened today was not PvP. PvP is not about killing NPCs, which was the griefer did - kill a NPC . That's called PvE in my book.
PvP is something a lot different*.
The fact that he's a PvPer doesn't make everything he does into PvP, sorry.



And seriously, I don't understand how come anyone can defend a player that has done what he has done in the past, massively griefing other players and being a **.
In the end, actions like that only make it so that E loses players and frightens away potencial customers, thus contribuiting to E remaining a niche game.
And without more players, meaning more $$$, E will never be able to improve the game.
So in the end you're applauding a singler player whose actions are detrimental to the overall health of the game.


I mean, there's no doubt that he did what he did not for PvP, not for the challenge, not for the story and certainly not for the book nor the game but just because it was the best way to negatively affect the most amount of players.
That's called griefing and griefing is not something to be cherished. At least, not for me.
If he trully cared to kill her, he could have joined the opposing faction but he chose to grief the rest of the players.
It puzzles me that anyone would applaud those actions.



* Note: Before you try to say it, PvP is not about killing random players neither. That's not PvP, true PvP at least. PvP is about the challenge of facing other skilled players and winning. Sure, it's fun to kill random noobs or win against skilless players but that ceases to be fun rather fast. People who enjoy PvP for what it is, try to find challenge, competition.
Being a griefer is many things but it's not about competition.



** Note 2 - Another comon mistake people make is that true PvPers must be douchbags. That couldn't be further from the truth. While it's true that there are lot of players that kill other players, that's not what PvPers do, that's just ganking and griefing. While there are exceptions, as there are with any rule, the fact is that in most games the high level PvPers are mostly polite and cordial (after the matches are over, mind you!). So no, being a jerk comes from within and not from being a PvPer.

 

[Mötley Crüman]

It's more about the journey than the destination with these things. I've had a blast the last couple of days getting my RNGinered iCourier ready. I've met many new wing mates and seen a great cooperative spirit in the community.

One kind CMDR even donated me a ton of meta alloys to save me a long journey to Maia. Even that act of kindness led to adventure when we were randomly ambushed by an NPC FDL at the handover.

The strategy of the PAC was sound. There was simply no way the VIPs could be protected by simply killing their attackers. Some would always get through and target the VIPs at all costs. The tar pit of fast interdictors was the best of a bad bunch of options and reduced the likely hood of treachery (albeit not at the high levels).

The servers were a bit dodgy initially but I had no issues once the race for the bubble began. In short, thanks for a great couple of days Drew

 

[Ian Skippy]

What if ..................

Spoiler

Salome has a child somewhere, legitimate or otherwise

With Harry Potter.

 

[xondk]

And the high profile splashing of the event everywhere she might as well flew with a dodgy auto destruct button as her death was written when the bounty was placed.

I fully expect to get replies with 'salty' and such from some people, but I'm not.

I missed the event, and when I heard what happened, I was utterly and totally not surprised. SDC was involved this happened, well, yeah? and SDC gets attention which is what they seek.

Hearing then how the discord group and such was set up, all I can say is *facepalm* what did people actually expect to happen?

So yeah, not so much a splash as fully what is to be expected.

 

[Ian Skippy]

I am sorry Truesilver, but here is where you are fundamentally wrong. I would think someone like you would know the difference between PvE and PvP.
What happened today was not PvP. PvP is not about killing NPCs, which was the griefer did - kill a NPC . That's called PvE in my book.
PvP is something a lot different*.
The fact that he's a PvPer doesn't make everything he does into PvP, sorry.



And seriously, I don't understand how come anyone can defend a player that has done what he has done in the past, massively griefing other players and being a **.
In the end, actions like that only make it so that E loses players and frightens away potencial customers, thus contribuiting to E remaining a niche game.
And without more players, meaning more $$$, E will never be able to improve the game.
So in the end you're applauding a singler player whose actions are detrimental to the overall health of the game.


I mean, there's no doubt he did what he did not for PvP, not for the challenge, not for the story and certainly not for the book nor the game but just because it was the best way to negatively affect te most amount of players.
If he trully cared to kill her he could have joined the opposing faction but he chose another path.
In my world, that's called griefing and griefing is not something to be cherished. At least, not for me.
It puzzles me that anyone would applaud those actions.



* Note: Before you try to say it, PvP is not about killing random players neither. That's not PvP, true PvP at least. PvP is about the challenge of facing other skilled players and winning. Sure, it's fun to kill random noobs or win against skilless players but that ceases to be fun rather fast. People who enjoy PvP for what it is, try to find challenge, competition.
Being a griefer is many things but it's not about competition.



** Note 2 - Another comon mistake people make is that true PvPers must be douchbags. That couldn't be further from the truth. While it's true that there a lot of s that kill other players, that's not what true PvPers do. While there are exceptions, as there are with any rule, the fact is that in most games the high level PvPers are mostly polite and cordial (after the matches are over, mind you!). So no, being a comes from within and not from being a PvPer.

The target was a player. The actor was a player. The act was killing, versus the target. That is the literal definition of player versus player.

- - - Updated - - -

I'm really not sure about this given the turn of events tonight though. I'm now convinced that far more people wanted Salome dead than alive, despite what they may have said.

Or alternatively: The 'defenders' mostly chickened out because they saw a random threat from a random dude on discord/reddit, and the attackers just went ahead and did what they wanted to do. Which is how things usually go around here.

 

[Javert]

How much opposition was there overall. The impression I got was that virtually everyone was pro-Salome and co. I saw very few other ships that looked like they were out to stop them. Did anyone even attack Raan Corsen or the other dude? I was at Tionisla at the about the right time but wasn't in the right instance (not that I would have been able to do much in my Courier anyway).

Not surprised at all by Salome's fate. The moment I heard that SDC had joined the defenders I was expecting it.

Information is still coming out and still a bit sketchy.

However we do know that the Code also interdicted Salome and her hull was definitely way down by the time she was betrayed.

Rumours is that the eventual kill was done at a time the other wing mates had some kind of glitch - but not fully confirmed.

The only video I've seen of the actual kill so far conveniently left out all the previous moments.

 

[xondk]

The target was a player. The actor was a player. The act was killing, versus the target. That is the literal definition of player versus player.

- - - Updated - - -



Or alternatively: The 'defenders' mostly chickened out because they saw a random threat from a random dude on discord/reddit, and the attackers just went ahead and did what they wanted to do. Which is how things usually go around here.

For all intended purpose it was an in game event, only difference was players controlled the relevant NPC's, just saying, prior to this, and post this, they only exist as characters/npc's in the Elite world.

 

[Truesilver]

I am sorry Truesilver, but there is were you are fundamentally wrong. I would think someone who seems very intelligent like you do would know the difference between PvE and PvP.
What happened today was not PvP. PvP is not about killing NPCs, which the griefer did do. That's PvE.
PvP is something a lot different*.



I don't understand how come anyone can defend a player that has done what he has done in the past (...)

Hi there,

(And thank you very much for the compliment!)

All I meant by my words ...

The truth is that despite the massive engagement of the wider community the Salome life/death thing was, at its core, a form of orchestrated PvP competition.

Which was won by experienced PvP-ers, as it was always likely to be.

... was that an event based around one mechanic: "Can you or can't you kill this player-controlled ship" is a form of PvP competition, and it was unsurprising that success went to an experienced PvP-er (and his group).

(I think that the Salome character was indeed player-controlled.)

I wasn't commenting on the ethics of Cmdr Harry Potter's actions, in this event or at any other time.

o7

 

[Jukelo]

I am sorry Truesilver, but here is where you are fundamentally wrong. I would think someone like you would know the difference between PvE and PvP.
What happened today was not PvP. PvP is not about killing NPCs, which was the griefer did - kill a NPC . That's called PvE in my book.
PvP is something a lot different*.
The fact that he's a PvPer doesn't make everything he does into PvP, sorry.



And seriously, I don't understand how come anyone can defend a player that has done what he has done in the past, massively griefing other players and being a **.
In the end, actions like that only make it so that E loses players and frightens away potencial customers, thus contribuiting to E remaining a niche game.
And without more players, meaning more $$$, E will never be able to improve the game.
So in the end you're applauding a singler player whose actions are detrimental to the overall health of the game.


I mean, there's no doubt he did what he did not for PvP, not for the challenge, not for the story and certainly not for the book nor the game but just because it was the best way to negatively affect te most amount of players.
If he trully cared to kill her he could have joined the opposing faction but he chose another path.
In my world, that's called griefing and griefing is not something to be cherished. At least, not for me.
It puzzles me that anyone would applaud those actions.



* Note: Before you try to say it, PvP is not about killing random players neither. That's not PvP, true PvP at least. PvP is about the challenge of facing other skilled players and winning. Sure, it's fun to kill random noobs or win against skilless players but that ceases to be fun rather fast. People who enjoy PvP for what it is, try to find challenge, competition.
Being a griefer is many things but it's not about competition.



** Note 2 - Another comon mistake people make is that true PvPers must be douchbags. That couldn't be further from the truth. While it's true that there a lot of s that kill other players, that's not what true PvPers do. While there are exceptions, as there are with any rule, the fact is that in most games the high level PvPers are mostly polite and cordial (after the matches are over, mind you!). So no, being a comes from within and not from being a PvPer.

You're trying to inject way too much meaning into a simple expression which carries its own meaning with it. Player vs Player means just that. PvP is not an occupation, PvP is not a badge of honor (or if you're playing in a certain group, not a badge of shame), PvP is just the description of an IG interaction.
The simple truth is that Harry needs no defending, no excuses. An event was setup whereby people were encouraged to engage in a manhunt, and Harry took part in that event and won by going full Trump while the rest of the community watched in disbelief.

 

[Martian Successor]

I see this as a proof of concept. I agree it could have been handled better (remember that this was all done by players, probably none of which had any idea how to coordinate large groups or do event PR) but I had more fun in a couple of hours today than I think I've ever had in ED. If FDev were to allocate resources and had one of these say once a month, coordinated and communicated by FDev employees, I bet it would be a big success.

Would be cool, for sure. Or better yet, FD could work towards making it possible for player organised CGs and events using in-game tools to create such events as the PvP league tournaments for example.

If CQC were to be one day integrated into the main game as a kind of Galaxy's greatest sport, player organised tournaments would be a well spring of virtually inexhaustible self sustained player created multiplayer content. Racing tournaments would be the next logical step and etc.

 

[Bio-Flame]

Of course that PvP is not a badge.
But what I said still stands: most high lvl PvPers are polite and cordial, after the matches are over at least.

Killing extremely lower lvl players, killing unarmed players, ganking, etc....that's not PvPing, that's griefing.
Arguments can be made left and right but at the end of the day, we both know I am right here. Pvp is not about griefing and what was done today IS griefing.

 

[CMDR Zadian Lichtfrost]

…
... was that an event based around one mechanic: "Can you or can't you kill this player-controlled ship" is a form of PvP competition, and it was unsurprising that success went to an experienced PvP-er (and his group).
…

If it was a competition it was staged.

I'm still laughing about PAC and their incredibly wise decision to choose SDC as their bodyguards.

I have to admit: Well played SDC, well played.

 

[Sonof Hibachi]

Dear SDC,

Please stop ruining my game by blowing up space ships.

Yours Sincerely,

Nigel Frottage.

(in game name, CMDR DarkLordDestroyerLethalHardcase)

 

[ShadowWolf Kell]

The simple truth is that Harry needs no defending, no excuses. An event was setup whereby people were encouraged to engage in a manhunt, and Harry took part in that event and won by going full Trump.

Drew actually wanted this kind of scenario and encouraged it.

 

[Enderby]

Why is Drew running the show?

 

[DaveB]

Predictable. Totally true to form. And the best argument ever for FD never supporting clans or fleets or anything remotely similar in-game.

 

[Zieman]

Why is Drew running the show?

It's his book in writing.

 

[xondk]

Of course that PvP is not a badge.
But what I said still stands: most high lvl PvPers are polite and cordial, after the matches are over at least.

Killing extremely lower lvl players, killing unarmed players, ganking, etc....that's not PvPing, that's griefing.
Arguments can be made left and right but at the end of the day, we both know I am right here. Pvp is not about griefing and what was done today IS griefing.

Basically yeah. PvP is about 'combat' between two people, not really much combat when someone simply flattens a low level/small ship player. But unfortunately people have argued in the past that since they were attacking another 'player' then it is PvP.
You are going to find that group of people saying such, will never agree with what is and isn't PvP, because in their mind, if it involves another player, it "is"

Where in my mind it is kinda like saying that if you put an MMA professional and baby in a ring you'd get a 'fight'. There are people that simply want to step on others, but crucially, do not want to admit doing so, and personally I'd have a lot more respect for people that said, "I simply wanted to kill him because I felt like killing him"