The PIRACY Thread - new ideas for changes needed to make it more viable as a Role

Have you ever been Pirated by NPC and given Cargo and then let go on your way? - Yes
Have you been Pirated by a Player and given Cargo and then let go on your way? - Nope
Have you tried Piracy without trying to kill the Ship and picked up Cargo? - Yes
What Cargo do you hope to find and what is it's value? - Low Temp Diamonds
Have you tried Piracy in Multicrew? - Nope
If any of the above what Mode do you Pirate in: SOLO/GROUP/OPEN? - SOLO/group
Why did you try Piracy else would you like to? - I'ts suposed to be a good role!
Can you suggest how to improve this Role to become even more viable? - To make TRADE and Piracy more viable: Increase the base values of the itens. ( Low temp diamonds for exemple, should be selled for 200-300k each, not only 50k) - Seems like fdev are struck in that time when 10k are ALOT of money....
 
FD added Multicrew to those small Ships because they have the seats already. They just happen to be of a descent size to handle all the tools needed to Pirate Cargo. The extra pip for defence, speed and efficiency. At present this Role would suit friends but GUNNER would be Manifest Scanning & Defending much better than he can do alone whilst trying to get the Collector Limpet close to Cargo whilst under fire. More Players should give this a go as it will take much coordinating between Crew.
 
[*]Have you ever been Pirated by NPC and given Cargo and then let go on your way? -
-NO

[*]Have you been Pirated by a Player and given Cargo and then let go on your way? -
-NEVER

[*]Have you tried Piracy without trying to kill the Ship and picked up Cargo? -
-YES, i don't kill unarmed ships, disabling their FSD is enough, if its a armed cutter/conda attacking me then i wouldn't mind sending them to rebuy

[*]What Cargo do you hope to find and what is it's value? -
-Biowaste ( don't ask why)

[*]Have you tried Piracy in Multicrew? -
-YES

[*]If any of the above what Mode do you Pirate in: SOLO/GROUP/OPEN? -
-OPEN

[*]Why did you try Piracy else would you like to? -
-Roleplay and fun, sometimes i end up defending the ship i was looting.

[*]Can you suggest how to improve this Role to become even more viable? -
-Can't or else carebears would jump on this thread too, all i have to say, making open less punishing for traders is they way to encourage them to fly in open.
 
I think this is looking at things from the wrong angle - C&P is just going to increase fines, Sandro already said so. The most popular pirate I've yet seen in ED is that guy who did it in an unarmed sidey and would d'aaw people into giving him loot. I know that if I were to give piracy a try I wouldn't do it in anything bigger than a cobra; I'm not going to be able to scoop up 100t of stuff anyway, and if I look too intimidating the mark would probably think I'm a ganker and combat log to save himself.

I like my cutter but then with 6 collector limpets deployed I can get a 100 cargo scooped and probably more with no problem at all ..


Another thing I would like to see is raise the 100 limit in an instance.. Keep the 20 at stations where it is needed but raise it away from stations
 
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If they raised the limits I would pirate a full T9 for closer to 150 and a full cutter for closer to 200 which is reasonable for the amounts they carry
 
So my main problem besides the OPEN lack of proper C&P system is Max Active Collector Limpet numbers and Amount of Cargo dropped:

COLLECTOR LIMPETS:
Class|Max No. Now|Max No. Needed
1 | 1 | 5 |
3 | 2 | 10 |
5 | 3 | 15 |
7 | 4 | 20 |
http://elite-dangerous.wikia.com/wiki/Limpet_Controller/Collector

HATCH-BREAKERS:
These are just weird limit numbers but I can accept them http://elite-dangerous.wikia.com/wiki/Limpet_Controller/Hatch_Breaker
I propose instead to have 1 Hatch-Breaker open double what they presently drop.

Add the new C&P SYSTEM and we may go into OPEN for this interaction of encounters although Pirates will need to remain a potential threat else they'll be ignored. I think the new EMP Weapon which takes up all Hardpoint allocations would be a good addition. It would only be overcome however by Winged Gankers.
 
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Please copy/paste then complete the following Survey to help FD out here: -

  • Have you ever been Pirated by NPC and given Cargo and then let go on your way? -
  • Have you been Pirated by a Player and given Cargo and then let go on your way? -
  • Have you tried Piracy without trying to kill the Ship and picked up Cargo? -
  • What Cargo do you hope to find and what is it's value? -
  • Have you tried Piracy in Multicrew? -
  • If any of the above what Mode do you Pirate in: SOLO/GROUP/OPEN? -
  • Why did you try Piracy else would you like to? -
  • Can you suggest how to improve this Role to become even more viable? -

- Pirated by NPC: They have tried, and perished. I have never given up cargo.
- Pirated by PC: No, but I would rather self-destruct than give up cargo.
- Attempted to Pirate: No, but I have had plenty of ships dump their cargo in an effort to distract me from blowing them up. It hasn't worked.
- Hope to find: The bounty on my target's head. Cargo cleaned up afterwards is just a bonus.
- Tried in multi-pew: No, but I don't often multi-pew anyways.
- I play mostly in PG's, sometimes Solo, rarely in Open.
- To Try or Not: Honestly, at first glance, Piracy did seem like it might be fun. But I quickly came to realize that running around Wanted everywhere was a pain in the a.ah..you know. And the profit margins just weren't there to justify the risks and expenses. Combine that with a lack of any real Criminal Underground to support such a lifestyle and the appeal wore off before the initial download completed.

- So how to make it better:

1. Ranking - The Pilot's Federation ranks our Trade, Combat and Exploration already. There's no reason they couldn't track Piracy as well. This then ties into:
2. Benefits - The ability to purchase Black Market goods from Black Market dealers. Access to hidden installations - both planetary and space-based, much in the same way certain Engineers are accessed, based on Ranking. Better payouts selling Black Market goods than standard rates would also be a huge plus.
3. Reputation - Visible to Players, has active effect on NPC's - the higher the Reputation the more likely NPC's are to drop cargo without a fight.
4. Response - As a criminal, responses should vary, especially from NPC's. Civilized Space isn't going to welcome a Pirate Lord (or Lady, or Whatever) with open arms. They would welcome one with bared arms. Expect hostile responses from even the lowliest system authorities, and expect flight control to say "Docking Request Denied: We don't want your kind here." NPC pirates are unlikely to try to rob you - but rather may offer up Criminal Tip Off missions instead. And as given in #2 above, with the loss of access to Civilized Space, comes the gain of Pirate installations. Law-abiding citizens can expect flight control here to be just as unwelcoming, no System Authority ships to come to their aid, and everyone will want what they're carrying.
5. Systems - Not star systems, that's covered in #2 (that sounds terrible, but work with me here), but rather mechanics that make Piracy feel more than just a pew-fest. We have exactly two items specifically designed for Piracy use - a Power Player reward missile that gums up Frame Shift Drives (though also useful for Bounty Hunters). Keeping your prey from running is vital. Hatchbreaker limpets help strong-arm something out of uncooperative prey. But these both still hinge on one very important thing - Running into your prey in Normal Space, and that means, in nearly all cases, winning an Interdiction. What we do not have is a means of luring prey into normal space without this. NPC's do - The Distress Call USS. Of course, it doesn't take but one or two visits to these to realize they're almost always a trap.
The ability to generate a false USS of our own - be it Distress Call, or better, a Trade Opportunity (I'll trade you your life and freedom for half of what's in your cargo hold is still a trade...) might serve to lure people - players or even NPC's in carefully laid pirate traps, making Piracy a truly viable and enjoyable occupation.
 
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The legitimacy of piracy? Forcing people to do what you want, and then complain that you only get 75% of the market price? But, that the trader was doing a mission and just got a xxx.- cr fine, as the items were unique, that ain't your problem eh. This ain't no leggings wearing Errol Flynn film.

Seriously piracy should be a part of the rush of open. You'd probably need an FSD inhibitor missile. Something that is only available in pirate stations. Makes the. FSD take longer to come back online.

Then we need a super easy direct chat system with text presets that translate directly into the other players language. Like the one that they have in the game War Thunder.

o7
 
The SOLUTION is obviously in OPEN and is to increase the gains for TRADERS in this particular Mode to therefore invite PLAYER PIRATES. So yes if something was special for this then it starts to become it's own creation. Mobius are not likely to change rules to allow Pirate PvP as they must be ready to shoot. So e.g.

LT DIAMONDS can be bought by Traders and then sold if they remained in OPEN during this period (well hell no Mode Switching should ever come into any exploit FD huh! Period - Full Stop! If need be then add these by Missions) - This will be a RARE.
PLUS move ALL RARES TRADING to be only available in OPEN in the same way - Hey, this is just the same as any other trading activity so do not complain for your SOLO/GROUP use also. These Rares should get the "special" treatment they deserve if you dare!
 
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OR as another method for a similar TRADERS GAIN - just make OPEN PvP never a REBUY unless both sides shot each other as an act of breaking Pirate Parlay. Point Defence shooting at Hatch-Breakers would NOT count due to it not striking the Pirate Ship.
 
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The SOLUTION is obviously in OPEN and is to increase the gains for TRADERS in this particular Mode to therefore invite PLAYER PIRATES. So yes if something was special for this then it starts to become it's own creation. Mobius are not likely to change rules to allow Pirate PvP as they must be ready to shoot. So e.g.

LT DIAMONDS can be bought by Traders and then sold if they remained in OPEN during this period (well hell no Mode Switching should ever come into any exploit FD huh! Period - Full Stop! If need be then add these by Missions) - This will be a RARE.
PLUS move ALL RARES TRADING to be only available in OPEN in the same way - Hey, this is just the same as any other trading activity so do not complain for your SOLO/GROUP use also. These Rares should get the "special" treatment they deserve if you dare!

I'd be wary of probably giving already the easier/highest earning trade loads more CRs.

I think a clear bonus is required to push traders to areas in OPEN, be it a (dedicated OPEN) CG, or some other subtle mechanism, but I also think there's important issues around the liberation of cargo by pirates:-
1) The current/new hatch breaker mechanics are just appalling! IMHO you should have to get the victims shields down to 1 bar before you can target lock their hatch.
2) Security response is daft. You can be as nice a pirate as you like, but all too often the security services arrive before you've even started scooping your cargo up. Now keep in mind how slow this is... it's daft. Security response should be more random, AND, if you hit hull then maybe speed up?
3) You should be able to extract more cargo, and pick more cargo up more quickly. If you have lots of cargo space you should be able to fit a hatch break that can eject lots of cargo. And a hatch breaker should also base the amount of cargo it's ejecting on the amount of cargo in the victim. Note, my suggestion on bundling cargo (in my sig).
4) Give missions to pirates associated with the CG (or what ever it is) to steal cargo. ie: So they can get extra income (& fun) from that.
 
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Re. HATCH-BREAKER: If these were not seen as Missiles by the Target and therefore would NOT trigger you as WANTED in Secured Space then you would have used Stealth to sneak away their Cargo instead - they simply notice they are losing Cargo! It is for the Pirate if they wish to go Silent Running and all that and if they can scoop/collect it before they need to return fire (will then not get WANTED by then). It is simply then a Smuggling role if they are still CLEAN. Of course in Anarchy it does not matter one bit.

Re. COLLECTOR LIMPETS: These must not be so restricted to ONLY 1 for all Class 1s, 2 for Class 3s, 3 for Class 5s, and 4 for Class 7s BUT follow a similar mix of numbers as to HATCH-BREAKERS obviously! PLUS do not let them die - PLUS allow us to scoop them when they are powered OFF!

- - - Updated - - -

I'd be wary of probably giving already the easier/highest earning trade loads more CRs.
The above removes RARES TRADE from SOLO/GROUP and places these only into OPEN (inc. LTDiamonds). Thus Traders will be drawn into this Mode for it's rewards at the risk of PvP. We will probably be the exact same players switching roles anyways.
 
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Minonian

Banned
Please copy/paste then complete the following Survey to help FD out here: -

  • Have you ever been Pirated by NPC and given Cargo and then let go on your way? -
  • Have you been Pirated by a Player and given Cargo and then let go on your way? -
  • Have you tried Piracy without trying to kill the Ship and picked up Cargo? -
  • What Cargo do you hope to find and what is it's value? -
  • Have you tried Piracy in Multicrew? -
  • If any of the above what Mode do you Pirate in: SOLO/GROUP/OPEN? -
  • Why did you try Piracy else would you like to? -
  • Can you suggest how to improve this Role to become even more viable? -



(It's a BIG Role in this game and it even has Paint Jobs & Decals & Outposts!)

ps You can select Go Advanced and Select All then add Bullet Points for easier reading.

THANK YOU,
o7 XT

1. No, but i will always stop so i can shoot em to shards.
2. biowaste.
3. no
4. In light the first 3 answer there is no point to say anything about it.
5. no
6. answer 4
7. answer 4
8. At first, i tired piracy and smuggling in other games so my point? Take the code more seriously, some sort of policing / piracy license not a bad idea. Same goes to smuggling within crime ring. And my usual rant as far griefing not taken more seriously you can forget about piracy as a valid in game career, because? No one going to care about you are a "honest" pirate or just some bully wreaking havoc for fun. Fo that? griefers must be kept in line, and so as pirates. A counter force is necessary after all? The chase just as much part of the game, than the catch.
 
I think Players if going to OPEN to Trade RARES (if only place available) then they will "care" if a Pirate is indeed a Pirate and NOT a Psycho. They may initially think "oh ok Exit Main Menu just in case". They'd loose ALL RARES if they switched Mode. They would however have given themselves a clear chance of Instance if they immediately logged back in.
Therefore, any Player which uses the 15sec countdown should also take some penalty - either credits OR lose All Cargo!
i.e. a Hatch-Breaker would also have triggered a 15sec Countdown if Target Logs Off.

This scenario played out as no fire exchanged in Secured System:-
Pirate fires a HB at Target and does not get WANTED.
Target gets notice of Cargo Dropped! He carries on to run away! Nothing else is lost!
Pirate has time to collect all without Cops showing up!
 
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Minonian

Banned
I Disagree... 15 Sec against a PVE trader ship is enough to hatch break, or shoot to shards. That's a penalty, and risk enough.
 
The only way of solving that is NO REBUY in OPEN.
If it's a Pyscho: you risk losing Hull Damage to repair whilst being attacked within the Log OFF timer.
If it turns out to be a true Pirate (does not shoot at you): you must risk losing all Cargo if you Log OFF with the timer.
 
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It has to invite Traders but still provide any other Player to be seen as a potential Threat. You must be able to work with Pirates knowing you are still better off but lost some Cargo.
 

Minonian

Banned
And what about all in the other cases when you can lose your ship? Pretending piracy while you are a griefer, begin shoot down, by NPC, randomly lose your ship by some accident?
Not to mention, if you can lose all of your work is just empties open even more. Who wants to take a risk like this?
 
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