FDev, you just upset a *lot* of people.

[Ziggy Stardust]

am i the only one who sees the legitimate concern of op?

you guys are out of control, you seem just blood thirsty.

inb4 the furious populace tries to lynch me:
1 - i have never used any exploit, of any type, in this game (unless board switching is an exploit)
2 - i do think the cheaters should be dealt with, and harshly, but JUSTLY

this is the gist of the issue. let's not forget that the existence of the exploit is frontier's fault in the first place and it is their duty to fix this in a transparent and appropriate way. just silently removing modules that 'look like cheat' is simply not good enough.

now i want to know what exactly is the criteria they follow to get rid of these cheats.

and i'm really starting to have an issue with the lynch mob mentality displayed in this thread (not necessarily directed at you, bomba, i just jumped in here, but the problem is statements like 'those who cheated' bear the inevitable question of 'who cheated', and if frontier doesn't come up with a convincing answer to that question then it's they who are cheating at the end.)

It's FD's responsibility there are no bugs in the game. It's the player's responsibility to not abuse a bug if it leads to a cheat.

Second, FD is not silently removing modules, those who are affected get a message, and there is an FD forum post about this, outlining their criteria complete with examples.

edit: oh right, quadruple ninja'd. Don't go get a coffee in the middle of a post.

 

[Djerk Ard]

now i want to know what exactly is the criteria they follow to get rid of these cheats.

The support post (now in Dangerous Discussion also) should make this pretty clear - if you used the exploit, you will lose all mods of that item on any ship or in storage.
Frontier had already said that they could identify the accounts that had used the exploit.

Personal opinion: The "lynch mob mentality" may be in your imagination.

 

[Luniticisi]

You should read the actual thread by FD then, as should the OP before starting this one.

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/358986-Community-Update-Engineer-Exploit-Action-Taken

Be a bit fair Ozric .. the OP posted this thread before FD posted theirs.

Edit .. I swear if FD don't crack down on these bleedin' ninja's I'm gonna rage quit!!!!!!!!!!!11

 

[PuffyEichhorst]

Good job, FD!

 

[MarkAusten]

am i the only one who sees the legitimate concern of op?

you guys are out of control, you seem just blood thirsty.

inb4 the furious populace tries to lynch me:
1 - i have never used any exploit, of any type, in this game (unless board switching is an exploit)
2 - i do think the cheaters should be dealt with, and harshly, but JUSTLY

this is the gist of the issue. let's not forget that the existence of the exploit is frontier's fault in the first place and it is their duty to fix this in a transparent and appropriate way. just silently removing modules that 'look like cheat' is simply not good enough.

now i want to know what exactly is the criteria they follow to get rid of these cheats.

and i'm really starting to have an issue with the lynch mob mentality displayed in this thread (not necessarily directed at you, bomba, i just jumped in here, but the problem is statements like 'those who cheated' bear the inevitable question of 'who cheated', and if frontier doesn't come up with a convincing answer to that question then it's they who are cheating at the end.)

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...er-Exploit-Action-Taken?p=5635839#post5635839

 

[Ozric]

The OP posted his message before the the FD comment was available. OP posted at 09:18, FD comment at 10:37.

Be a bit fair Ozric .. the OP posted this thread before FD posted theirs.

I know that, but making a post claiming that something has happened a certain way before knowing whether that is the case or not, is the reason we are where we are now.

 

[verminstar]

am i the only one who sees the legitimate concern of op?

you guys are out of control, you seem just blood thirsty.

inb4 the furious populace tries to lynch me:
1 - i have never used any exploit, of any type, in this game (unless board switching is an exploit)
2 - i do think the cheaters should be dealt with, and harshly, but JUSTLY

this is the gist of the issue. let's not forget that the existence of the exploit is frontier's fault in the first place and it is their duty to fix this in a transparent and appropriate way. just silently removing modules that 'look like cheat' is simply not good enough.

now i want to know what exactly is the criteria they follow to get rid of these cheats.

and i'm really starting to have an issue with the lynch mob mentality displayed in this thread (not necessarily directed at you, bomba, i just jumped in here, but the problem is statements like 'those who cheated' bear the inevitable question of 'who cheated', and if frontier doesn't come up with a convincing answer to that question then it's they who are cheating at the end.)

They already came up with a convincing answer and by and large, the community have expressed their gratitude with only a seemingly very small minority expressing any concerns. If theres an unhappy silent majority, then they should let themselves be heard surely.

As fer siloently removing mods...how was it silent? They announced it to just about everyone both ingame and on the forums. Im not seeing the silent bit whatsoever ^

 

[Luniticisi]

I know that, but making a post claiming that something has happened a certain way before knowing whether that is the case or not, is the reason we are where we are now.

I think we have all jumped the gun at one point or another.

 

[Sylow]

I'm not sure how the exploit worked, but I have one lvl4 dd roll that is better than the lvl5 range - I'm not sure if that counts. Also, I did make quite a few lvl1 rolls to rank up at the Engineers, but I never got anything extraordinary.

Do those affected get a separate message?

In any case, well done FDev!

.
Getting one awesome G4 roll which beats most G5 rolls is rare but it happens and is completely legit. No exploit at all. Also all the rest you wrote says that you should be fine. If you are not, you will have an in-game message telling you that some engineering upgrades you had were removed.
.
On how the exploit worked, the rough draft: you started the roll for a G1 component, then left the engineering screen, entered the engineering screen again and started the roll for the same component on a higher grade. This "continued" the roll, but while it used up the grade 1 materials, it gave you the higher grade result.
.
So due to the combination of obscurity but also how easy it actually is to reproduce and the size of the playerbase, i am rather certain that there are a handful of people around who by accident and without even being aware of it created a component this way and got the "you exploited" in-game message now. But from what you describe, i consider it close to impossible for you to be affected and as others already said, while there might be one or another who by pure chance and without knowing used the exploit, it's much more likely that anybody who got the message but claims to be innocent actually just wants to save his reputation.
.

 

[A D]

Maybe FD should only take exploited mods, maybe should take all mods regardless? Can't really say, but better FD over-reacts so its clear that cheating is risky business. I'm just glad FD has put its foot down. Thanks FD.

P.S what was the exploit some ask? It was spamming blueprint button using G1 materials (e.g. sulphur) to artificially increase rank with engineer. Widely known now. Didn't use it, wouldn't use it and don't really care.

 

[MarkAusten]

I know that, but making a post claiming that something has happened a certain way before knowing whether that is the case or not, is the reason we are where we are now.

The OP felt that it was a legitimate concern and so he posted a message to that effect. That is perfectly acceptable. At that point FD had not commented and has a history of not commenting so I feel that he was justified.

Hindsight is a great thing.

As for us being bloodthirsty, heck yes!

 

[GreyAreaUK]

You should read the actual thread by FD then, as should the OP before starting this one.

In fairness it would be nice if they could drop a note in this forum, given that it seems to be the most widely read.

 

[Arius]

Clean player response...
[video=youtube;g7J9k0dMUxw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g7J9k0dMUxw[/video]

Exploiter response...
[video=youtube;sPbjPOgRtyA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPbjPOgRtyA[/video]

 

[Alex Ringess]

Bravo Frontier, well done !
It's a fair and measured punishment that cheaters deserved. They'd be perma ban if it had happened in another game.

The only thing I'd like to add is : but what drive ppl to cheat, in that particulary case ? The grind wall of RNG of course.
For me, cheating is unacceptable, but is also a signal of a misdesigned game mecanic. Here, this is the "RNG everywhere".
Think about it, Frontier, please.

 

[znôrt]

You should read the actual thread by FD then, as should the OP before starting this one.

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/358986-Community-Update-Engineer-Exploit-Action-Taken

thanks a lot, i hadn't seen that.

from their (a bit fuzzy) explanation i assume they have logged the actual use of the exploit and can identify at least the blueprint involved. removing all instances of that blueprint for that player seems fair in this situation.

so to @op: yeah, if a legitimate roll is removed in this way then i guess the players will have to suck it up. if that's not the case then ... hard evidence is required.

 

[MarkAusten]

Bravo Frontier, well done !
It's a fair and measured punishment that cheaters deserved. They'd be perma ban if it had happened in another game.

The only thing I'd like to add is : but what drive ppl to cheat, in that particulary case ? The grind wall of RNG of course.
For me, cheating is unacceptable, but is also a signal of a misdesigned game mecanic. Here, this is the "RNG everywhere".
Think about it, Frontier, please.

There are lot of people like me that do not find this to be the case. For me there is no grind and, if I understand the comments I have read, there are a lot of other players that feel the same.

So, no, please do not think again FD, it's pretty much perfect the way it is. Thank you.

 

[Ozric]

I think we have all jumped the gun at one point or another.

Maybe some more vehemently than others

The OP felt that it was a legitimate concern and so he posted a message to that effect. That is perfectly acceptable. At that point FD had not commented and has a history of not commenting so I feel that he was justified.

Hindsight is a great thing.

As for us being bloodthirsty, heck yes!

I'm all for posting concerns, I've certainly done that many times, but that's not what the OP was.

There are lot of people like me that do not find this to be the case. For me there is no grind and, if I understand the comments I have read, there are a lot of other players that feel the same.

So, no, please do not think again FD, it's pretty much perfect the way it is. Thank you.

Yep I agree, no grind for me and I understand why and like the implementation of the system.

 

[[VR] optimal_909]

.
Getting one awesome G4 roll which beats most G5 rolls is rare but it happens and is completely legit. No exploit at all. Also all the rest you wrote says that you should be fine. If you are not, you will have an in-game message telling you that some engineering upgrades you had were removed.
.
On how the exploit worked, the rough draft: you started the roll for a G1 component, then left the engineering screen, entered the engineering screen again and started the roll for the same component on a higher grade. This "continued" the roll, but while it used up the grade 1 materials, it gave you the higher grade result.
.
So due to the combination of obscurity but also how easy it actually is to reproduce and the size of the playerbase, i am rather certain that there are a handful of people around who by accident and without even being aware of it created a component this way and got the "you exploited" in-game message now. But from what you describe, i consider it close to impossible for you to be affected and as others already said, while there might be one or another who by pure chance and without knowing used the exploit, it's much more likely that anybody who got the message but claims to be innocent actually just wants to save his reputation.
.

Thanks, now I actually know how it worked.
I haven't noticed this while in-game and I paid attention on the mats used, so I guess I won't be affected.

 

[Rubbernuke]

Complete binary outrage / joy expressed at an FD decision?

Colour me shocked.

 

[VR Morgan Grimes]

Not affected in the least, good move FD, love to see the cheaters crying because they've been punished